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Kaepernick believes he can seriously challenge for starting job this year

Originally posted by aTx49er:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Steve Young said the same thing Montana did about being patient with the WCO. And so did Mariucci.

I know, which means it is not any new found knowledge. It is common knowledge to know that most QBs/offenses take about 3 years to mature. But it is also true that not all QB's require this. So it isn't true for every situation.

These people were talking about the WCO specifically for a reason. All three are former QBs. I think they know what they're talking about. Bill Walsh himself said that the WCO is a QB friendly system but takes longer for the QB to master than other offenses. If you look at all the good QBs that ran the WCO all had time to completely learn the offense before starting.

It doesn't matter what they were talking about. Troy Aikmen said the same thing when Norv signed on. It's the same for every offense but when a QB excels early, then it's because that QB wasn't in the WCO. But when another QB in the WCO excels early, it's because of something else.

So, because Troy Aikmen said it, it must be true for any offense, right?

The biggest factor is who the QB is and how he can individually adapt. Steve Young actually took longer than 3 years for it to click and realize he needs to throw receivers open and he said this himself. Learning the ENTIRE offense is about 3 years...but applying what you have learned, even if it is an install varies depending on the QB.

Former players make huge generalizations all the time. What Montana and Young said about the WCO was no different than what Troy Aikmen said about Norv's offense (3 years).

BS dude. The reason that Norv was brought in was because the Coryell system is easier to learn for QBs. Nolan thought Smith wasn't picking up the WCO quick enough and knew the Norv had success with Aikman. Aikman never said anything about Norv's offense. He said Norv will be good for Smith because he helped Aikman out alot in the beginning of his career. So the HOF HC/QB duo who put the WCO on the map just make huge generalizations when talking about the WCO?

Could you name a few QBs that excelled early in the WCO?

I raise you a BS because Aikman said it took him a few years to learn and start playing well. He said it at that time no different than Joe or Steve. Offenses these days aren't like they were in the 80's where it was simplistic. Nowdays, every offense has a fat playbook and complicated schemes...not just the WCO. We need to stop living in the past thinking only the WCO is the difficult one or the most difficult.

Same can be said about Martz' offense...

The only difference between offenses now and then is the emphasis on the pass. Offenses were not simple in the 80's. The pass friendly rules started changing in the 80's and teams adjusted. But schemes, formations, sets are basically the same.

Of course everyone has their own variations. Martz's offense is just a variation of the Coryell offense. Dan fout's was running the pass heavy Air Coryell back in the early 80's. Martz brought it back with the Rams and it was successful for a while.

And as far as Aikman and his thoughts on Norv and Alex read oldman9er's post so I don't have to cut and paste.

It is not variations they have added, it's complications to reading defenses, option routes, hot reads, post snap automatic built in audibles, and everything the WCO used to have with timing that other things those older digit systems didn't used to have. The main reason for the other offenses being more simple was the digit and relating a route to a number rather than having to relate words to routes/combinations. This and blocking scheme.

Like one Shannahan said this season and Fangio confirmed...no one runs the "WCO" anymore and everyone runs a version of it. All offenses are complicated. The only difference is how the coach installs it be it force-feed or incremental. Some QB's can handle force-feed and improvise on the fly and others require incremental.

Alex isn't a force-feed guy that can improvise while learning. If it isn't practiced to a tee and he doesn't understand exactly how it should pan out, he will hesitate to execute. I wonder who said that about Alex. The only guy who has been spot on about Alex has been Urban Myer.
Originally posted by Joecool:
It is not variations they have added, it's complications to reading defenses, option routes, hot reads, post snap automatic built in audibles, and everything the WCO used to have with timing that other things those older digit systems didn't used to have. The main reason for the other offenses being more simple was the digit and relating a route to a number rather than having to relate words to routes/combinations. This and blocking scheme.

Like one Shannahan said this season and Fangio confirmed...no one runs the "WCO" anymore and everyone runs a version of it. All offenses are complicated. The only difference is how the coach installs it be it force-feed or incremental. Some QB's can handle force-feed and improvise on the fly and others require incremental.

Alex isn't a force-feed guy that can improvise while learning. If it isn't practiced to a tee and he doesn't understand exactly how it should pan out, he will hesitate to execute. I wonder who said that about Alex. The only guy who has been spot on about Alex has been Urban Myer.

not true at all

when plays broke down this year he did a great job improvising

the only thing i think alex needs to work on is getting the ball out a bit quicker but that could easy be due to the WR not getting seperation
THANK GOD KAEPERNICK IS READY TO GO !

It was really tough this season with Smith setting NFL proficiency records, making dead accurate game changing throws downfield where only the receiver could get it, scrambling into the endzone from 25 yards out to win playoff games at the end, and getting us to the Superbowl if not for two dropped punts.

Man Smith Sucks.

We really need to get rid of that guy.

Man you guys are smart. I mean really really smart !

Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by Joecool:
It is not variations they have added, it's complications to reading defenses, option routes, hot reads, post snap automatic built in audibles, and everything the WCO used to have with timing that other things those older digit systems didn't used to have. The main reason for the other offenses being more simple was the digit and relating a route to a number rather than having to relate words to routes/combinations. This and blocking scheme.

Like one Shannahan said this season and Fangio confirmed...no one runs the "WCO" anymore and everyone runs a version of it. All offenses are complicated. The only difference is how the coach installs it be it force-feed or incremental. Some QB's can handle force-feed and improvise on the fly and others require incremental.

Alex isn't a force-feed guy that can improvise while learning. If it isn't practiced to a tee and he doesn't understand exactly how it should pan out, he will hesitate to execute. I wonder who said that about Alex. The only guy who has been spot on about Alex has been Urban Myer.

not true at all

when plays broke down this year he did a great job improvising

the only thing i think alex needs to work on is getting the ball out a bit quicker but that could easy be due to the WR not getting seperation

I hate to break it to you but most WR's on most routes, don't get much separation if the ball isn't thrown on time or even when it is.
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
THANK GOD KAEPERNICK IS READY TO GO !

It was really tough this season with Smith setting NFL proficiency records, making dead accurate game changing throws downfield where only the receiver could get it, scrambling into the endzone from 25 yards out to win playoff games at the end, and getting us to the Superbowl if not for two dropped punts.

Man Smith Sucks.

We really need to get rid of that guy.

Man you guys are smart. I mean really really smart !


Originally posted by NinerBuff:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
THANK GOD KAEPERNICK IS READY TO GO !

It was really tough this season with Smith setting NFL proficiency records, making dead accurate game changing throws downfield where only the receiver could get it, scrambling into the endzone from 25 yards out to win playoff games at the end, and getting us to the Superbowl if not for two dropped punts.

Man Smith Sucks.

We really need to get rid of that guy.

Man you guys are smart. I mean really really smart !




+1
Peter King says he wouldn't be surprised if Colin Kaepernick threw for over 3,000 yards - even if Alex
Good for him, we don't want some one who just interested in "holding a clipboard"
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
Steve Young said the same thing Montana did about being patient with the WCO. And so did Mariucci.

I know, which means it is not any new found knowledge. It is common knowledge to know that most QBs/offenses take about 3 years to mature. But it is also true that not all QB's require this. So it isn't true for every situation.

These people were talking about the WCO specifically for a reason. All three are former QBs. I think they know what they're talking about. Bill Walsh himself said that the WCO is a QB friendly system but takes longer for the QB to master than other offenses. If you look at all the good QBs that ran the WCO all had time to completely learn the offense before starting.

It doesn't matter what they were talking about. Troy Aikmen said the same thing when Norv signed on. It's the same for every offense but when a QB excels early, then it's because that QB wasn't in the WCO. But when another QB in the WCO excels early, it's because of something else.

So, because Troy Aikmen said it, it must be true for any offense, right?

The biggest factor is who the QB is and how he can individually adapt. Steve Young actually took longer than 3 years for it to click and realize he needs to throw receivers open and he said this himself. Learning the ENTIRE offense is about 3 years...but applying what you have learned, even if it is an install varies depending on the QB.

Former players make huge generalizations all the time. What Montana and Young said about the WCO was no different than what Troy Aikmen said about Norv's offense (3 years).

BS dude. The reason that Norv was brought in was because the Coryell system is easier to learn for QBs. Nolan thought Smith wasn't picking up the WCO quick enough and knew the Norv had success with Aikman. Aikman never said anything about Norv's offense. He said Norv will be good for Smith because he helped Aikman out alot in the beginning of his career. So the HOF HC/QB duo who put the WCO on the map just make huge generalizations when talking about the WCO?

Could you name a few QBs that excelled early in the WCO?

I raise you a BS because Aikman said it took him a few years to learn and start playing well. He said it at that time no different than Joe or Steve. Offenses these days aren't like they were in the 80's where it was simplistic. Nowdays, every offense has a fat playbook and complicated schemes...not just the WCO. We need to stop living in the past thinking only the WCO is the difficult one or the most difficult.

Same can be said about Martz' offense...

The only difference between offenses now and then is the emphasis on the pass. Offenses were not simple in the 80's. The pass friendly rules started changing in the 80's and teams adjusted. But schemes, formations, sets are basically the same.

Of course everyone has their own variations. Martz's offense is just a variation of the Coryell offense. Dan fout's was running the pass heavy Air Coryell back in the early 80's. Martz brought it back with the Rams and it was successful for a while.

And as far as Aikman and his thoughts on Norv and Alex read oldman9er's post so I don't have to cut and paste.

It is not variations they have added, it's complications to reading defenses, option routes, hot reads, post snap automatic built in audibles, and everything the WCO used to have with timing that other things those older digit systems didn't used to have. The main reason for the other offenses being more simple was the digit and relating a route to a number rather than having to relate words to routes/combinations. This and blocking scheme.

Like one Shannahan said this season and Fangio confirmed...no one runs the "WCO" anymore and everyone runs a version of it. All offenses are complicated. The only difference is how the coach installs it be it force-feed or incremental. Some QB's can handle force-feed and improvise on the fly and others require incremental.

Alex isn't a force-feed guy that can improvise while learning. If it isn't practiced to a tee and he doesn't understand exactly how it should pan out, he will hesitate to execute. I wonder who said that about Alex. The only guy who has been spot on about Alex has been Urban Myer.

You do know that variation is a synonym of version right? Did you even read my post? And what the is complications to reading defenses? That doesn't even makes sense.

And you never answered my question about naming a few QBs who excelled in the WCO early in their career without completely learning the offense first?
Not to be a spoil sport, but i think Coach H already recognized his best bet if alex goes down is Tolzien, who is Qb ready to play right now.. Hence, I think in a major deal, we offer Craps and Kap as a package for the #2 or #3 pick in the draft and bring in Blackmon. I believe this happens after we FA either Bowe, vince Jackson, colston, or maybe williams(steelers). If we don't secure our FA WR, then all bets are off. Hence, discussing Kap this or Kap that is kind of akin to dicussing how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. Sorry i am not in tune with this thread. I've read it, but i jsut don't see it. Kap appears to have tons of potential, but disguised it nicely the few times he was brot in to clean up last yr.For a team desperately in need, i can see kap go there. But we seem to be ok with #1 an #2,and kap is just a project....ready, aim, FIRE.
Originally posted by aTx49er:
You do know that variation is a synonym of version right? Did you even read my post? And what the is complications to reading defenses? That doesn't even makes sense.

And you never answered my question about naming a few QBs who excelled in the WCO early in their career without completely learning the offense first?

Alex isn't early in his career. Rich Gannon did fine. Veteran QB's come along quicker because they begin to understand the concepts.

Andy Dalton?

Like I said, it isn't just the WCO. How many QB's played well early in their career in any offense besides the Spread, which is basically what Newton and Tebow played in.
Kap's not starting next year.

2012 is the year of Scott Tolzien.
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
s**t just got real.

Originally posted by Overkill:
Kap's not starting next year.

2012 is the year of Scott Tolzien.

It will be very interesting to see what he does in the preseason.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by aTx49er:
You do know that variation is a synonym of version right? Did you even read my post? And what the is complications to reading defenses? That doesn't even makes sense.

And you never answered my question about naming a few QBs who excelled in the WCO early in their career without completely learning the offense first?

Alex isn't early in his career. Rich Gannon did fine. Veteran QB's come along quicker because they begin to understand the concepts.

Andy Dalton?

Like I said, it isn't just the WCO. How many QB's played well early in their career in any offense besides the Spread, which is basically what Newton and Tebow played in.

I never said anything about Alex. I was just responding to your post discrediting what Montana said about being patient with this offense running the WCO.

Rich Gannon was ok in his first year. (24/14 TD/INT 86.5 QBR) and he got better the next 3 years until injuries slow him down.

Andy Dalton had a great season for a rookie QB. (20/13 TD/INT 80.4 QBR). I'm actually more impressed with his season than I am with Newton's because he isn't anywhere near as physically talented as Newton.