ESPN Ranking NFL starting quarterbacks (Alex Smith #28)

Originally posted by Shaj:
As if that's such a ridiculous thing to do? The guy's got a higher recidivism rate than Ted Bundy. What's gotten three coaches fired is prognosticating that Smith's future is bright. The biggest predictor of future performance is past performance.

Those coaches got fired because they sucked a big fat hairy cock when it came to coaching. Don't try to pass that s**t on to Smith.

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Who cares about this opinion piece? You guys get too worked up over a list based only on opinion from a guy that probably only looks at the box scores of a game. Smith hasn't even been the biggest problem. With all the high draft picks that we have seen suck and get traded or cut, I would be forced to say player development has held this team back more than any one individual player. We will see how things pan out, right now offensive line play is a bigger concern than Clayton sharing an opinion based on a less than complete in depth look at the organization in general. While no one would argue that Smith has to play better, there are players on that list that played worse than Smith last year. Everyone has a right to their opinion, in my opinion he should be in the 15-20 range.

That's where I put him. 15 - 20. I think that's realistic right now. People looking at him 28 - 32 are remembering the past. And they aren't looking at how bad our O Line is. When you get hit on step 2 of a 3 step drop something is wrong... It's Alex's fault...

As if that's such a ridiculous thing to do? The guy's got a higher recidivism rate than Ted Bundy. What's gotten three coaches fired is prognosticating that Smith's future is bright. The biggest predictor of future performance is past performance.

15-20 seems like a fair judgement for Smith. He is average at best. He does well in garbage time or against crappy teams. I am hoping coaching pushes him to be about 15 or better, versus moving him into the 20's. There is only one constant over the last 6 years of crappy football (well, besides the Yorks).

Originally posted by HessianDud:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by HessianDud:
I think Campbell, Henne, and Hasselbeck are too high. Not sure I buy putting Josh Freeman into the elite category. In fact, I think the "elite" category is a little watered down.

I also question putting Eli and Flacco in elite as well.

Also, flatly stating Bradford is the "next elite" QB is a reach. He hit a wall as soon as opponents figured out what a small playbook he was given. He may turn out out to be elite but he didn't come close to justifying that claim last season.

I also question McCoy's ranking. He may benefit from having Shurmur as his HC in much the same way Bradford benefitted from him last year but that is all speculation.

yeah, lists like this are always kind of dumb. Based on last year alone, I'd take McCoy over McNabb. Based on their entire careers, of course you'd take McNabb over a guy who has 8 starts. How can you project that Bradford is the next great QB but that Colt McCoy is the best of the worst? I guess if you're looking just at "who will have the best season this year" its a all a crapshoot anyway.

The only "important" takeaway from this list is the bunching of elite QB's. I agree: Eli and Flacco, Freeman, Schaub, Romo are all second-tier. I just see no logic in a ranking that puts Tom Brady and Tony Romo in the same category. The only thing that makes Vick close to elite is his feet. I would say the elite QB's are, in order: Brady, Manning, Brees, Roethlisberger, Rodgers, Rivers, .... then Ryan and Vick on the bubble.

then, based on this list, all the guys from Eli to Cutler, Bradford excluded, would be the second-tier: QB's who have good numbers, who are generally winners, or who have great talent and haven't put it together yet.

I understand that a national writer has to write things that will get attention, and often too much detail will drive readers away. However, when things get so general as to include some of the names you mentioned in an elite group, it takes away the credibility of the piece in the minds of people who actually follow the game on a higher level.

For me, whether Smith is 28 or 22 is irrelevant. I want to see him perform at a higher level than either, and I expect he will this year as all signs are pointing up as compared to the past and in opposition to Clayton's flat arrow.

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Yeah the best way to measure a QB is his last 4/5 games which were against the NFC west. We can ignore everything else.

Who said anything about his last four or five games? You did, no one else. I was talking about the past two years. Man you sure are quick to jump at a chance to criticize, but you should really check yourself. You are guilty of doing the same thing you b***h about others doing only you are over the top negative. You would do well to try and find some objectivity on the subject, you act like people that have stronger faith than you are blinded by it, but someone can be just as blinded by hate.

Originally posted by Young2Rice:

Originally posted by pantstickle:

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Can't you lil jackals just wait till the games mean something before spewing yet MORE nonsense? Alex Smith is taking over you people's lives... how pathetic.

Why is this even still un-locked? Do the mods not know or care that threads like this perpetuate the hate between forum members? Or does excess post padding about the same hate bounce back benefits to the site?

Calling people jackals helps dispel the hate?

Don't forget calling people pathetic. And saying the Zone promotes hatred in the name of site hits. Thats blasphamouse.

Oldman will cry for warnings while calling other people whatever he pleases.

He just doesn't like what the article says because it goes against his minority position.

Hypocrisy at it's best.

Originally posted by SJniner7:

15-20 seems like a fair judgement for Smith. He is average at best. He does well in garbage time or against crappy teams. I am hoping coaching pushes him to be about 15 or better, versus moving him into the 20's. There is only one constant over the last 6 years of crappy football (well, besides the Yorks).

There is the constant rotation of less than stellar coaching as well.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Or that time when he threw for 300+ yards and 2 TDs against Seattle, despite two players dropping two perfect passes in the end zone, which ultimately cost us the game? Then it went from, "He hasn't even thrown for 300 yards before!" to "Stats don't mean anything! It's the W's! And since he didn't get the W he SUCKED that game and made us lose! He should have WILLED us to victory!" Alex is not a good QB, but when he has credit taken away from him even when he does do something good it's just ridiculous.

I'm not expecting the kid to have a great year, but even if he does manage to put up above average stats, the praise will all be passed off to others - Harbaugh, Gore, Vernon, Braylon, Crabtree, the defense, etc.

If he puts up above average stats at least you have an argument, but 2.5 games or whatever number of games you pull out in 52 starts is not a credible argument. Pretty much everyone has their moments. See Derek Anderson. He's been below average his whole career, but the last couple he's only been slightly below average (around 19th) so I'll end there.



Personally I'm ranking him 22nd. His good performances just haven't came in criticial situations. I understand that the West is garbage and we're technically still alive at 5-8 but I'm really not going to give him much credit for mopping up on a 3-10 team.

See the bolded. I would rate him in the low 20's as well.

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by jimmy49erfan:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by RichmondPete:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I find it somewhat humorous that Hasselbeck and Henne, despite both being statistically outplayed by Smith the past few years, are ahead on that list.

You shouldn't because the stats lie in this case.

Most logical fans if you held a vote would take Alex over Henne in a landslide.

Doubtful. Henne has a good short passing game and a nice deep ball. What he lacks is experience. Smith just doesnt have good short passing accuracy like Henne. He does have good accuracy deep when he goes there. Everything else is below average with Smith.

I watched him play four games last year and I saw none of the skills you cite. In fact, in two of those games he was replaced due to ineffectiveness. Miami would love to have an upgrade.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by jimmy49erfan:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by RichmondPete:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I find it somewhat humorous that Hasselbeck and Henne, despite both being statistically outplayed by Smith the past few years, are ahead on that list.

You shouldn't because the stats lie in this case.

Most logical fans if you held a vote would take Alex over Henne in a landslide.

Doubtful. Henne has a good short passing game and a nice deep ball. What he lacks is experience. Smith just doesnt have good short passing accuracy like Henne. He does have good accuracy deep when he goes there. Everything else is below average with Smith.

I watched him play four games last year and I saw none of the skills you cite. In fact, in two of those games he was replaced due to ineffectiveness. Miami would love to have an upgrade.

Gee whiz. I understand the disdain towards Alex, but making stuff up is unnecessary. Henne is terrible. Hasselbeck at this stage in his career is terrible. Alex is not good either. I am appalled that people are getting so angry about this topic. Some have suggested Hasselbeck and Henne should be a bit lower due to their recent ineffectiveness, only to be met with shrieks of horror and hostility.

Originally posted by 4T9errr:
The Miami fans that I know sure don't think that Henne is better.

They say they would love to have Alex in Miami and would welcome him with open arms...I don't blame them, Henne is horrible.

This is an enormous support to the notion that Henne should be lower. But nevermind that. There's no reason to fight over a few spots difference in a meaningless ESPN article by Clayton.

I dont have to make things up like a Smith supporter. I just go by what I see and Henne has a good short game and a nice deep ball. In Miami for every guy who dislikes Henne there 2 that like him and wish Sparano didnt play such a vanilla system. Should be a interesting this year for hot seat QBs imo.

Seems about right to me I would bump him up 3 more spots. Kolb, Henne, and Fitzpatrick should be behind Smith.

Originally posted by LambdaChi49:
I'm not saying Alex Smith is the better option. I'm saying Hasselbeck isn't a good option EITHER.

Though they both suck, Hasselbeck is a better player than Alex Smith regardless of what the numbers say. That is my point.

Originally posted by RichmondPete:

Originally posted by LambdaChi49:
I'm not saying Alex Smith is the better option. I'm saying Hasselbeck isn't a good option EITHER.

Though they both suck, Hasselbeck is a better player than Alex Smith regardless of what the numbers say. That is my point.

This is what I don't get. A QB has a bad year and he's automatically worse than Alex Smith. I don't recall when Alex has ever done anything other than to be viewed as a backup or worse QB in the NFL.

Originally posted by jimmy49erfan:

I dont have to make things up like a Smith supporter. I just go by what I see and Henne has a good short game and a nice deep ball. In Miami for every guy who dislikes Henne there 2 that like him and wish Sparano didnt play such a vanilla system. Should be a interesting this year for hot seat QBs imo.

Chad Henne is even worse than Smith, if you see him as a good qb, you need your eyes checked.

Originally posted by Joecool:
This is what I don't get. A QB has a bad year and he's automatically worse than Alex Smith. I don't recall when Alex has ever done anything other than to be viewed as a backup or worse QB in the NFL.

People are desperate to say that Alex Smith is better than someone.

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by RichmondPete:

Originally posted by LambdaChi49:
I'm not saying Alex Smith is the better option. I'm saying Hasselbeck isn't a good option EITHER.

Though they both suck, Hasselbeck is a better player than Alex Smith regardless of what the numbers say. That is my point.

This is what I don't get. A QB has a bad year and he's automatically worse than Alex Smith. I don't recall when Alex has ever done anything other than to be viewed as a backup or worse QB in the NFL.

i'm talking solely about Hasselbeck, not comparing him to anybody but:

he hasn't had just one bad year. His last good season was 2007. In fact, in 2006 he wasn't very good either. He's been injured--a lot--in the last five years, and tossed up a ton of picks. At his best he was a decent second-tier QB, but his best was quite awhile ago.