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"Steve Young never learned how to read defenses"

Originally posted by 49erRider:
LOL @ claiming a HALL OF FAME QB couldn't read defenses.

No amount of athleticism will carry you to a career as good as Steve Young's in modern football. Defenses are just too smart, and the only way to have success is to understand what they will be doing. If you can't read them, you will fail. You could have the strongest, most accurate arm in the history of mankind, run a 4.12 40-yard dash and still get shut down by any NFL defense if you don't read their schemes.

this!


that's just f**king ridiculous to even contemplate. Some people will say anything to get people to read their articles.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by Joecool:
To me, reading the defense is specifically to decide which receiver will most likely be open and where to primarily go with the ball. After that, it's the trained rep practice of going through your progressions which has nothing to do with the defense. You see the first few steps of the defensive movement upon snap and tell yourself what will be open. This is why you are trained to stare the Safety down on your drop. By your third step, you should now already have a good idea of who will be open and you step in that direction on your last step. If that isn't open, now is when you robotically go through your progressions down from that receiver to the next seeing which one is open enough to throw to.

The great QB's determine the defensive cover during the drop and already know who they will throw to at the end of their drop. What they go onto do further is move the defense by looking defenders away from the guy they want to throw to.

Once a QB scrambles, that does not happen. QB's are no longer reading the defense. They are looking for their open receivers regardless of what the defense is playing because at this point, the defense has already did its job and is also scrambling to keep broken routes covered.

Okay...so the catch 2 never happened...because you know he threw that blind, right?

What does that play have to do with reading defenses? It was no different than a designed hail mary. He can read defenses but the fact that his performance dropped in the playoffs against better defenses could also mean his "greatness" could be over rated. His stats came during regular season during an era where there were probably 2 or 3 good teams in the NFC and that was it. The West was a joke. The black and Blue division aside from GB was mostly a joke. DAL and possibly WASH were really the only other teams worth something. Even the 3rd team, whoever it was, ended up being one year wonders until GB took over.

Have you watched the play? He threads two defenders to hit a WR who isn't even there. Steve was constantly reading defenses and doing it at a high level. Was he as good as Montana at it? HELL NO. No one was, is, or probably ever will be. Reading D was what made Montana the QB that he was. He didn't have the greatest arm, he wasn't atheletic...it was his ability to see what the D was going to do and to be a leader.

So, if you're going to compare Steve to Joe..sure, his ability to read D wasn't as good and he relied more on his physical ability. But I'd still take Steve over all but 10 other QBs in NFL history without blinking an eye.
[ Edited by Jakemall on Aug 24, 2011 at 4:01 PM ]
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by Joecool:
To me, reading the defense is specifically to decide which receiver will most likely be open and where to primarily go with the ball. After that, it's the trained rep practice of going through your progressions which has nothing to do with the defense. You see the first few steps of the defensive movement upon snap and tell yourself what will be open. This is why you are trained to stare the Safety down on your drop. By your third step, you should now already have a good idea of who will be open and you step in that direction on your last step. If that isn't open, now is when you robotically go through your progressions down from that receiver to the next seeing which one is open enough to throw to.

The great QB's determine the defensive cover during the drop and already know who they will throw to at the end of their drop. What they go onto do further is move the defense by looking defenders away from the guy they want to throw to.

Once a QB scrambles, that does not happen. QB's are no longer reading the defense. They are looking for their open receivers regardless of what the defense is playing because at this point, the defense has already did its job and is also scrambling to keep broken routes covered.

Okay...so the catch 2 never happened...because you know he threw that blind, right?

What does that play have to do with reading defenses? It was no different than a designed hail mary. He can read defenses but the fact that his performance dropped in the playoffs against better defenses could also mean his "greatness" could be over rated. His stats came during regular season during an era where there were probably 2 or 3 good teams in the NFC and that was it. The West was a joke. The black and Blue division aside from GB was mostly a joke. DAL and possibly WASH were really the only other teams worth something. Even the 3rd team, whoever it was, ended up being one year wonders until GB took over.

Have you watched the play? He threads two defenders to hit a WR who isn't even there. Steve was constantly reading defenses and doing it at a high level. Was he as good as Montana at it? HELL NO. No one was, is, or probably ever will be. Reading D was what made Montana the QB that he was. He didn't have the greatest arm, he wasn't atheletic...it was his ability to see what the D was going to do and to be a leader.

So, if you're going to compare Steve to Joe..sure, his ability to read D wasn't as good and he relied more on his physical ability. But I'd still take Steve over all but 10 other QBs in NFL history without blinking an eye.

That ball was going to that spot no matter how many defenders would have been there. It was more of a luck play than anything. He was going to TO on the post no matter what the defense was playing. It was an accurate throw, it was a great throw, it was a great catch but it had NOTHING to do with any defensive read. What got Steve Young to one of the top QB's was his accuracy and intangibles. His ability to read defenses is over rated which is why he struggled against the better teams.
[ Edited by Joecool on Aug 24, 2011 at 4:40 PM ]
Claiming the Catch II occurred because Steve Young read the defense is just plain ignorant. Watch the interviews from that game and every Niners player knows they got a bit lucky and defense failed an assignment. I'm not a Steve Young hater but facts are facts.

In regards to Steve Young not being able to read defenses...His overrated ability to read defenses is about as overrated as discussing what an idiot radio guy has to say about it. Young certainly wasn't the best at reading defenses and he did rely on his instincts and athleticism and even at times to a fault (OH MY! A NINER PLAYER MAKES MISTAKES, BLASPHEMY!!) But talking about it is just plain pointless.

Steve Young was a great QB and had his faults. He also had many many strengths. What's the point of this conversation?
Originally posted by Joecool:
That ball was going to that spot no matter how many defenders would have been there. It was more of a luck play than anything. He was going to TO on the post no matter what the defense was playing. It was an accurate throw, it was a great throw, it was a great catch but it had NOTHING to do with any defensive read. What got Steve Young to one of the top QB's was his accuracy and intangibles.

His ability to read defenses is over rated which is why he struggled against the better teams.
Originally posted by elhebrewhammer:
Claiming the Catch II occurred because Steve Young read the defense is just plain ignorant. Watch the interviews from that game and every Niners player knows they got a bit lucky and defense failed an assignment. I'm not a Steve Young hater but facts are facts.

In regards to Steve Young not being able to read defenses...His overrated ability to read defenses is about as overrated as discussing what an idiot radio guy has to say about it. Young certainly wasn't the best at reading defenses and he did rely on his instincts and athleticism and even at times to a fault (OH MY! A NINER PLAYER MAKES MISTAKES, BLASPHEMY!!) But talking about it is just plain pointless.

Steve Young was a great QB and had his faults. He also had many many strengths. What's the point of this conversation?
Originally posted by Joecool:
That ball was going to that spot no matter how many defenders would have been there. It was more of a luck play than anything. He was going to TO on the post no matter what the defense was playing. It was an accurate throw, it was a great throw, it was a great catch but it had NOTHING to do with any defensive read. What got Steve Young to one of the top QB's was his accuracy and intangibles. His ability to read defenses is over rated which is why he struggled against the better teams.

Oh, yeah. He really struggled in that superbowl win. Some kind of crazy luck . . .
/


Just a lucky play?
Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
from Grant Napear on KHTK 1140 Sacramento....wow

also, "one of the worst hall of fame qb's at reading defenses, relied on his athleticism for his success"

i'm paraphrasing from what i just heard on the radio. does his statement have any validity to it?

Not intended to be a factual statement.


All-time leader in QB rating*. I don't think you could get a good QB rating without being able to read defenses, I really don't think you could a great QB rating without being able to read defenses, and I'm pretty sure it would be impossible to have a better QB rating than anyone else in the Hall of Fame without being able to read defenses.

*Aaron Rodgers and Phillip Rivers both currently posses higher career QB ratings than Young
Originally posted by WestCoastForever:
Oh, yeah. He really struggled in that superbowl win. Some kind of crazy luck . . .

Ironically, he slips on the play and uses...GASP...athleticism to over come it.

Stop being a homer and realize that the GB defense had as much to do with that play as Steve Young and Terrell Owens. I'm not hating on the guy at all and I think he's f**king awesome, but to think that Steve Young made that play happen because he was "reading the defense" and it was all the Niners doing, is just plain blind homerism. Young and Owens both made spectacular plays, but thank goodness it was also an awful defensive play as well.
Originally posted by Niners99:
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
one word about Napier, "Dip$h!t".

yeah, hes a total moron. even Kings fans up here are ashamed of him sometimes. its like they all acknowledge hes a moron, but love him as the Kings horribly biased announcer.

no we dont even love him as a horribly biased announcer, 70% absoutely hate the guy. I'd know, I'm one of them! I'm embarrassed that the joker even reps my team! He's an embarrassment and a moron, I wish we would have replaced him with one of the sonics announcers when they moved to OKC and lost their jobs.
How is this even a discussion, the guy had the best passer rating of all time until recently (probably will again), and held the single season passer rating record (112.8!) for over 10 years which is ridiculous.
[ Edited by KowboyKiller on Aug 24, 2011 at 11:08 PM ]
Originally posted by elhebrewhammer:
Originally posted by WestCoastForever:
Oh, yeah. He really struggled in that superbowl win. Some kind of crazy luck . . .

Ironically, he slips on the play and uses...GASP...athleticism to over come it.

Stop being a homer and realize that the GB defense had as much to do with that play as Steve Young and Terrell Owens. I'm not hating on the guy at all and I think he's f**king awesome, but to think that Steve Young made that play happen because he was "reading the defense" and it was all the Niners doing, is just plain blind homerism. Young and Owens both made spectacular plays, but thank goodness it was also an awful defensive play as well.

yeah, that was awesome when that happened in the superbowl....
Originally posted by HessianDud:
yeah, that was awesome when that happened in the superbowl....

Fair point, but I never mentioned the superbowl. I was talking about one play in the entire career of Steve Young, so I'm not sure what the point is. What does the play I was talking about have to do with the superbowl. I never even mentioned Steve Young "struggling." Basically the argument is....STEVE YOUNG WON THE SUPERBOWL SO EVERYTHING YOU SAY IS WRONG.

Trent Dilfer didn't struggle in the Superbowl when he won. Does that mean he should be in the same conversation as Steve Young who only won one superbowl as well. No....he shouldn't.

Honestly, I don't understand why someone can't critique an older player and say he had a weakness. What exactly is the problem?
Originally posted by elhebrewhammer:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
yeah, that was awesome when that happened in the superbowl....

Fair point, but I never mentioned the superbowl. I was talking about one play in the entire career of Steve Young, so I'm not sure what the point is. What does the play I was talking about have to do with the superbowl. I never even mentioned Steve Young "struggling." Basically the argument is....STEVE YOUNG WON THE SUPERBOWL SO EVERYTHING YOU SAY IS WRONG.

Trent Dilfer didn't struggle in the Superbowl when he won. Does that mean he should be in the same conversation as Steve Young who only won one superbowl as well. No....he shouldn't.

Honestly, I don't understand why someone can't critique an older player and say he had a weakness. What exactly is the problem?

you're seriously going to compare trent dilfer and steve young?
Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
from Grant Napear on KHTK 1140 Sacramento....wow

also, "one of the worst hall of fame qb's at reading defenses, relied on his athleticism for his success"

i'm paraphrasing from what i just heard on the radio. does his statement have any validity to it?

who is this grant napear f*ggot?
I remember when Steve first took over the starting role and some fools were saying he would not make it since he is left-handed. I am so glad he proved everyone wrong, certainly a top 5 QB of ALL-TIME !
LEFTY POWER