Kawakami: Alex Smith is Good Just In Time to Play Somewhere Else

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
It's like having a very young and talented Sales Director take over a struggling company. You have tons of hope for the new guy that he can come in, turn things around and build a winning sales organization. However, over a period of 6 years, due to certain circumstances (some within his control, but many being organizational issues), the sales team fails to produce results. The company overall is struggling to maintain profitability and is running out of patience with the sales organization and their inability to consistently produce the kinds of revenue streams required. Effort isn't the question, but ability and results are.

In the real world, as unfair as it may seem, this Sales Director gets s**t-canned...not because he sucks (maybe he does, maybe he doesn't), but MOSTLY because the expectations just weren't meant regardless of fault. The ties are severed and a search begins to inject new life, new ideas, new talent and a new mentality to the sales organization. The new guy may or may not be better...that remains to be seen. But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

In the real world I've seen many people get canned for a whole lot less than this and lord knows they didn't last nearly 6 years.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

... and if that happens, then it happens. No one will cry tears for Alex after he goes. He was well paid to endure the crap we put him through, and he will leave with class. We may all cry tears over his replacement though, and the possible years of rebuilding struggle afterwards.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
It's like having a very young and talented Sales Director take over a struggling company. You have tons of hope for the new guy that he can come in, turn things around and build a winning sales organization. However, over a period of 6 years, due to certain circumstances (some within his control, but many being organizational issues), the sales team fails to produce results. The company overall is struggling to maintain profitability and is running out of patience with the sales organization and their inability to consistently produce the kinds of revenue streams required. Effort isn't the question, but ability and results are.

In the real world, as unfair as it may seem, this Sales Director gets s**t-canned...not because he sucks (maybe he does, maybe he doesn't), but MOSTLY because the expectations just weren't meant regardless of fault. The ties are severed and a search begins to inject new life, new ideas, new talent and a new mentality to the sales organization. The new guy may or may not be better...that remains to be seen. But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

In the real world I've seen many people get canned for a whole lot less than this and lord knows they didn't last nearly 6 years.

amen, brother.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
It's like having a very young and talented Sales Director take over a struggling company. You have tons of hope for the new guy that he can come in, turn things around and build a winning sales organization. However, over a period of 6 years, due to certain circumstances (some within his control, but many being organizational issues), the sales team fails to produce results. The company overall is struggling to maintain profitability and is running out of patience with the sales organization and their inability to consistently produce the kinds of revenue streams required. Effort isn't the question, but ability and results are.

In the real world, as unfair as it may seem, this Sales Director gets s**t-canned...not because he sucks (maybe he does, maybe he doesn't), but MOSTLY because the expectations just weren't meant regardless of fault. The ties are severed and a search begins to inject new life, new ideas, new talent and a new mentality to the sales organization. The new guy may or may not be better...that remains to be seen. But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

In the real world I've seen many people get canned for a whole lot less than this and lord knows they didn't last nearly 6 years.

Yeah,I mean I can't believe we had to deal with this for 6 years... Any other team Alex would have been released after year 3... Only here do we keep hanging on to false hope..

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

... and if that happens, then it happens. No one will cry tears for Alex after he goes. He was well paid to endure the crap we put him through, and he will leave with class. We may all cry tears over his replacement though, and the possible years of rebuilding struggle afterwards.

lol wut. we've been rebuilding for about 8 years now. that's what drafting A. Smith was all about.

***this has been your reality check--brought to you by 49erFaithful6***

If Alex goes somewhere where people actually KNOW how to coach a QB with talent, and has a good support structure, he will do well.

Look at Michael Vick, never passed above 56%, was away for 2 YEARS IN PRISON, and now look how well he's playing, because he has what I just mentioned. Yes, a QB is responsible for his play, and Alex has made plenty of mistakes, but you can only isolate the problems on offense to the QB when everything else or most everything around him is working. Alex has had nothing working around him, so to isolate him as the problem is fallacious. Could it be him? Sure, much of it has been, but more of it has been all the other parts not working. He was not handled correctly and neither has the chaos of the offense.

Until all the problems on offense are fixed, I don't think Alex will do great, and because of that, I'd be happy to see him succeed somewhere else (unless it's in the NFC West or the Cowboys).

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by VA9erfan:
I can't wait for some here to get what they ask for.....A. Smith to be gone. Let's hear YOUR plan for next year if / after he is cut loose.

Honestly, do you really think it's going to be impossible to find someone who:

~can do better than 18-30 as a starter?
~has a career passer rating of 71?
~has a career completion % of 56.9?
~has thrown 52 picks to 49 TDs?
~has 85 turnovers in 51 games played
~has never won more than 7 games in a season as a starter?

Is this all Alex's fault? Of course not; he's had to deal with things that few rookie/young QBs have had to...and I actually like Alex as a person and as a man. But there comes a point where Smith fans have to look at the player and see him for what he's done. And what he's done is not pretty.

Findng someone to do better than Smith will not be as difficult as you (and many others) make it seem. It's time to move on (both for him, and for the team).

I don't mean to pick on you, or this post, since I already responded to it, however, I just heard Clark Judge of CBS Sports interviewed on KNBR. Judge is a pretty good football guy who watches the NFL pretty closely. His opinion on the bolded part of you post is worth noting.

Rod Brooks asked him directly about the chances of getting Kevin Kolb next year, or if there was someone else that would be of that same level of player that could step in with the 49ers next year.

Judge replied at two levels; one, that the Eagles might be forced to trade Kolb if they give a lot of money to Michael Vick (which everyone believes they will), and two, that there isn't any other backup QB around the league now that would be anywhere close to Kolb quality.

So that comes back to a point I made in one of this ridiculously long string of Alex Smith/QB threads. Alex is as good or better than any FA they might get to replace him so making an attempt to keep him at least until a rookie can get ready.

The other option is one I don't want to consider because it involves meeting Philly's asking price of a #1 in 2011 and at least a #2 in 2012 for Kolb. (I have read Philly really is asking for two #1s.) If that were to happen, it would set this team back another 2 years at the least.

As you said, this team is not as close to the playoffs (except for making it as the NFC West winner) as some think. If they are forced to give up on Alex completely it means they will be forced to use their #1 pick on a QB. That means that pick better be darn good very soon because without a pass rusher to protect a weak secondary, this defense is going to give up a lot of points and will need a VERY good QB that can put enough points on the board to offset the defensive shortcomings.

As Judge said, if you have the #1 overall pick and you miss and that guy doesn't turn out to be the guy, it sets the team back a minimum of 5 years. It doesn't really matter that Smith couldn't have been managed worse, the time to pay for that mistake is now upon us.

So there you have it. The question is; are the 49ers willing to give up two #1 picks for Kevin Kolb, or do they use those picks on a rookie like Cam Newton and try to get by with some combination of Troy and Nate?

Tough choice.

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

... and if that happens, then it happens. No one will cry tears for Alex after he goes. He was well paid to endure the crap we put him through, and he will leave with class. We may all cry tears over his replacement though, and the possible years of rebuilding struggle afterwards.

Then again, we may not. We might end up with a combination of coach/QB that turns things around here. Just depends on how you want to look at things. Same-QB-different-year-and-coaching-staff with Alex, or a shot at something new entirely.

Come on guys! Dont give up on Alex yet. He was nominated as the FEDEX ground player of the week. That's got to be good enough for at least one more year in a Niners uniform...

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Come on guys! Dont give up on Alex yet. He was nominated as the FEDEX ground player of the week. That's got to be good enough for at least one more year in a Niners uniform...

I was thinking about a 10 year extension fully guaranteed. FEDEX awards should not be taken lightly.

Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
If Alex goes somewhere where people actually KNOW how to coach a QB with talent, and has a good support structure, he will do well.

Look at Michael Vick, never passed above 56%, was away for 2 YEARS IN PRISON, and now look how well he's playing, because he has what I just mentioned. Yes, a QB is responsible for his play, and Alex has made plenty of mistakes, but you can only isolate the problems on offense to the QB when everything else or most everything around him is working. Alex has had nothing working around him, so to isolate him as the problem is fallacious. Could it be him? Sure, much of it has been, but more of it has been all the other parts not working. He was not handled correctly and neither has the chaos of the offense.

Until all the problems on offense are fixed, I don't think Alex will do great, and because of that, I'd be happy to see him succeed somewhere else (unless it's in the NFC West or the Cowboys).

Even then he's still not accurate enough to be starter in the league. That's the main deficiency he has. He's not a very good throwing the ball. Something that would come in handy if your going to be a Qb.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But there comes a point where you have to move on, bring someone else in and give him a shot.

That's life, Alex fans.

... and if that happens, then it happens. No one will cry tears for Alex after he goes. He was well paid to endure the crap we put him through, and he will leave with class. We may all cry tears over his replacement though, and the possible years of rebuilding struggle afterwards.

lol wut. we've been rebuilding for about 8 years now. that's what drafting A. Smith was all about.

***this has been your reality check--brought to you by 49erFaithful6***

when you rebuild a team you dont get a new OC every year in fact 7 in 6 years name 1 team that has been rebuilt that has that many OC also first thing you get is an o line not a qb so you can protect him we didnt do any of that we still dont have a consistan tOC after 6 years and we just got our OL last year

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Come on guys! Dont give up on Alex yet. He was nominated as the FEDEX ground player of the week. That's got to be good enough for at least one more year in a Niners uniform...

I voted for Turner

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by VA9erfan:
I can't wait for some here to get what they ask for.....A. Smith to be gone. Let's hear YOUR plan for next year if / after he is cut loose.

Honestly, do you really think it's going to be impossible to find someone who:

~can do better than 18-30 as a starter?
~has a career passer rating of 71?
~has a career completion % of 56.9?
~has thrown 52 picks to 49 TDs?
~has 85 turnovers in 51 games played
~has never won more than 7 games in a season as a starter?

Is this all Alex's fault? Of course not; he's had to deal with things that few rookie/young QBs have had to...and I actually like Alex as a person and as a man. But there comes a point where Smith fans have to look at the player and see him for what he's done. And what he's done is not pretty.

Findng someone to do better than Smith will not be as difficult as you (and many others) make it seem. It's time to move on (both for him, and for the team).

I don't mean to pick on you, or this post, since I already responded to it, however, I just heard Clark Judge of CBS Sports interviewed on KNBR. Judge is a pretty good football guy who watches the NFL pretty closely. His opinion on the bolded part of you post is worth noting.

Rod Brooks asked him directly about the chances of getting Kevin Kolb next year, or if there was someone else that would be of that same level of player that could step in with the 49ers next year.

Judge replied at two levels; one, that the Eagles might be forced to trade Kolb if they give a lot of money to Michael Vick (which everyone believes they will), and two, that there isn't any other backup QB around the league now that would be anywhere close to Kolb quality.

So that comes back to a point I made in one of this ridiculously long string of Alex Smith/QB threads. Alex is as good or better than any FA they might get to replace him so making an attempt to keep him at least until a rookie can get ready.

The other option is one I don't want to consider because it involves meeting Philly's asking price of a #1 in 2011 and at least a #2 in 2012 for Kolb. (I have read Philly really is asking for two #1s.) If that were to happen, it would set this team back another 2 years at the least.

As you said, this team is not as close to the playoffs (except for making it as the NFC West winner) as some think. If they are forced to give up on Alex completely it means they will be forced to use their #1 pick on a QB. That means that pick better be darn good very soon because without a pass rusher to protect a weak secondary, this defense is going to give up a lot of points and will need a VERY good QB that can put enough points on the board to offset the defensive shortcomings.

As Judge said, if you have the #1 overall pick and you miss and that guy doesn't turn out to be the guy, it sets the team back a minimum of 5 years. It doesn't really matter that Smith couldn't have been managed worse, the time to pay for that mistake is now upon us.

So there you have it. The question is; are the 49ers willing to give up two #1 picks for Kevin Kolb, or do they use those picks on a rookie like Cam Newton and try to get by with some combination of Troy and Nate?

Tough choice.

Philly can ask for what they want, but nobody in their right mind will give them two 1st rounders for Kolb, and they know that...in fact, they won't even get one pure 1st rounder for him. I think something closer to what the Texans did for Schaub (swapping 1st round picks with ATL, and two 2nds over 2 years) will be closer to reality. So would I swap 1st rounders with Philly and give them, say, a 3rd rounder in the upcoming draft for Kolb? That I would consider.

I could get my young QB (Kolb) and still have a 1st rounder (albeit a late 1st) to address my secondary (CB Gibson from Miami?), and use the 2nd to shore up my d-line (NTs Powe/Jenkins or DEs Kerrigan/Acho?).

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by VA9erfan:
I can't wait for some here to get what they ask for.....A. Smith to be gone. Let's hear YOUR plan for next year if / after he is cut loose.

Honestly, do you really think it's going to be impossible to find someone who:

~can do better than 18-30 as a starter?
~has a career passer rating of 71?
~has a career completion % of 56.9?
~has thrown 52 picks to 49 TDs?
~has 85 turnovers in 51 games played
~has never won more than 7 games in a season as a starter?

Is this all Alex's fault? Of course not; he's had to deal with things that few rookie/young QBs have had to...and I actually like Alex as a person and as a man. But there comes a point where Smith fans have to look at the player and see him for what he's done. And what he's done is not pretty.

Findng someone to do better than Smith will not be as difficult as you (and many others) make it seem. It's time to move on (both for him, and for the team).

I don't mean to pick on you, or this post, since I already responded to it, however, I just heard Clark Judge of CBS Sports interviewed on KNBR. Judge is a pretty good football guy who watches the NFL pretty closely. His opinion on the bolded part of you post is worth noting.

Rod Brooks asked him directly about the chances of getting Kevin Kolb next year, or if there was someone else that would be of that same level of player that could step in with the 49ers next year.

Judge replied at two levels; one, that the Eagles might be forced to trade Kolb if they give a lot of money to Michael Vick (which everyone believes they will), and two, that there isn't any other backup QB around the league now that would be anywhere close to Kolb quality.

So that comes back to a point I made in one of this ridiculously long string of Alex Smith/QB threads. Alex is as good or better than any FA they might get to replace him so making an attempt to keep him at least until a rookie can get ready.

The other option is one I don't want to consider because it involves meeting Philly's asking price of a #1 in 2011 and at least a #2 in 2012 for Kolb. (I have read Philly really is asking for two #1s.) If that were to happen, it would set this team back another 2 years at the least.

As you said, this team is not as close to the playoffs (except for making it as the NFC West winner) as some think. If they are forced to give up on Alex completely it means they will be forced to use their #1 pick on a QB. That means that pick better be darn good very soon because without a pass rusher to protect a weak secondary, this defense is going to give up a lot of points and will need a VERY good QB that can put enough points on the board to offset the defensive shortcomings.

As Judge said, if you have the #1 overall pick and you miss and that guy doesn't turn out to be the guy, it sets the team back a minimum of 5 years. It doesn't really matter that Smith couldn't have been managed worse, the time to pay for that mistake is now upon us.

So there you have it. The question is; are the 49ers willing to give up two #1 picks for Kevin Kolb, or do they use those picks on a rookie like Cam Newton and try to get by with some combination of Troy and Nate?

Tough choice.

I like reading your posts, so don't get me wrong, but I think we can all agree two #1's for Kevin Kolb isn't a tough call. It would be downright stupid. We are talking about a guy who, in a good offense, has a career 78 QB rating and 6 total starts. And we are supposed to pay a king's ransom for him?

Fact is teams aren't in the habit of giving away QB talent, that's true. So it boils down to getting it in the draft or giving away the farm via trade. But if we do give away several drafts worth of picks, let's do it for an established passer. The Bears aquisition of Cutler is a fine example.