There are 58 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

Finally, Reason to not always blame Raye

Originally posted by Jersey9er:
From the Dan Brown live talk today:

Question: After the punishing loss to the Falcons, the sky has fallen for many 49ers fans. As such, many fans have been calling for Hill's benching, Raye's firing, and Singletary's resignation. With the recent roster moves and Singletary's insistence that Crabtree play against the Texans, do you think the sky has fallen for the coaching staff as well?

Answer: Dan Brown: Ah, this is a variation of your previous question but I realized I didn't answer the coaching part of it: I think Jimmy Raye will be really under fire, considering the 30th ranked passing game is really, really awful. I think you might start hearing QB coach Mike Johnson mentioned as the heir apparent. That said, I think Jimmy is just doing what his boss tells him. Singletary WANTS a conservative, run-first team so he shouldn't escape blame, either, if things don't pick up.

Finally someone actually adressed this issue. We gotta put some of the blame on Sing too, and not always on Raye. In most of the games, the commentators even talk about Sing even saying, we have no plan B, we have to run the ball. But people still point the finger at Raye. I hope even tho some will still b***h about the man, they do understand that he only does and follows the gameplan that Sing wants. Sing said himself, he trusts Manusky and the defense, so he doesnt mess with them much. But with the offense, i bet he has more say than portrayed.

Finally lets' say as OC :
hostler = raye < martz = turner (or so)
nothing personal against raye, he just svcks :
from 30th to 16th to 30th yeah i can see the evolution (there's no debate about raye calling the offense sing wants and if it is do not forget then that he's worse at it than martz last year. Period.)
oops i forgot : we're n°1 ! in three and outs ...
Originally posted by darkknight49:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
regardless of whose idea it is, the stubbornness has to end.


dont really care either but its got to end...we're gonna end up losing to many close games playing like this
  • BobS
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,339
I really cannot blame Raye for the offense's struggles. Even if he isn't the world's most innovative genius, the offense severely lacks talent. Other than Davis and Gore,
there isn't much talent. Trying to get creative with that bunch will lead to more turnovers and negative plays. One would be hard pressed to find a QB with less ability than Hill. He is definitely bottom 5 talent and that's being generous, the more he plays the more his weaknesses are exploited. Pick a team with a worse QB situation, Cleveland maybe?
So the head coach is also responsible for our team's play??

Thanks for uncovering this mystery for us.

wtf is wrong with a conservative run first offense??

teams have won SB's with that kind of offense. niners just don't have the o-line to run that kind (heck or any kind) of offense.



also Singletary's already he wants a BALANCED offense that's built on the run game. he doesn't wanna run it every single down like some people here like to say.
Originally posted by BobS:
I really cannot blame Raye for the offense's struggles. Even if he isn't the world's most innovative genius, the offense severely lacks talent. Other than Davis and Gore,
there isn't much talent. Trying to get creative with that bunch will lead to more turnovers and negative plays. One would be hard pressed to find a QB with less ability than Hill. He is definitely bottom 5 talent and that's being generous, the more he plays the more his weaknesses are exploited. Pick a team with a worse QB situation, Cleveland maybe?

Are you kidding? i would love clevelands QB situation over ours.

Teams with worse QB situations:

Oakland, Tampa Bay, I would say St louis but i would love to have Bulger...thats pretty much it.
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
wtf is wrong with a conservative run first offense??

teams have won SB's with that kind of offense. niners just don't have the o-line to run that kind (heck or any kind) of offense.



also Singletary's already he wants a BALANCED offense that's built on the run game. he doesn't wanna run it every single down like some people here like to say.

Honestly nothing in my opinion, but i do think this. We have Hill, whether people like him or not. We have Raye, and Sing. Sing is the head coach, does anyone notice or remember when he said and i quote, when asked about his role with the offense and defense. He said, "I will leave the defense all to Manusky, i feel he has a solid grip on the defense." with the offense i was down with the BALANCED attack, but a quote that stands out in my mind for the entire season is this;

I dont know if anyone heard it, but right after Gore went down, a few minutes later, a female sports reporter asked, Well now that Gore is down, whats your plan B. He replied, there is no plan B, we have to run the ball, period. Even tho it was soo early on, it made me feel like no matter if we are up or down, sing wants to stay with what sing wants to stay with. I have never heard a Coach even say, i hope the game doesnt come down to where i have to put it on Hill's shoulders. now dont get me wrong, I know he isnt completely knocking Hill, but at the same time, no other coach has come out this year and said that about their QB. Even if they dont suck completely. Because if you have a QB that you believe in, then you dont say anything, but get in there and make it happen. It's like even when Hill sucked in this last game. Instead of Sing adressing questions about HIll's play, he just said, when he's running for his life out there. Well i just have a question for Sing, whats his answer when Hill isnt running for his life, has time, and still doesnt produce what he should. Then what does he have to say.

Thats why i feel that Sing has a little more say about some of the offensive game plan than he says.
You guys are quick to go after the 9ers conservative attack, but consider this, the 49ers are near the top of the league in sacks allowed - with a conservative attack - what do you think might happen if they try to open it up?
Originally posted by bzborow1:
You guys are quick to go after the 9ers conservative attack, but consider this, the 49ers are near the top of the league in sacks allowed - with a conservative attack - what do you think might happen if they try to open it up?

Honestly, since we are not the only team in the league with a horrible o-line and other teams QB's makes the plays when they present themselves, I say if they open it up then opposing defenses will respect our long game, and take eight men out the box, and open it up for Gore a little more, than a team just knowing the other team is gonna stack it all day against us, and try to work within the confides of that.

I mean look at 06, regardless of the line, who was at QB, the bad WR's, or any other reason, cause all that is irrelevant. Point im trying to make is when we did open it up, we had better offensive success. Especially in the running area. Our O-line isnt the worst in the league, maybe in the top 10 that suck, but not the worst. So i just say, when HIll does have time to throw, if he went down the field more often than not, it would help open our offense.
  • sports_guy212
  • Info N/A
I agree that Mike is at fault as well, but I think he is so set on a conservative ground and pound style because he feels it is best for the personnel we have. Either way it starts with the O line, pass or run and we have one of the worst lines in the NFL. With a line as weak as ours it is even more vital to have a quarterback that can make decisions quick and get rid of the ball...in other words NOT Shaun Hill.
Good idea SJniner7:

I'd say:

-Singletary/Raye 30% (for not even mentioned the QB or the WR's as keys to a victory and putting all the onus on a line that gave up 55 sacks last year = no confidence in the offense as a whole and play-calling is putting the o-line & QB in no-win situations based on predictability and an inability to game-plan properly or make in-game adjustments and play to a team's strengths)
-Hill 15% (Hill is still a new QB, is rarely allowed to audible, has no vote of confidence despite winning Singletary a coaching job, is playing under a new OC again, etc.)
-Defense 25% (weaknesses with no OLB pass rusher were exposed again and we're soft in coverage in the middle of the field and esp. covering RB's; inability to adjust often in games, at half-time and are often times out-coached)
-O-line 20% (includes RB's not allowed to bounce outside, a speed, edge RB and an oft-injured Gore and a line that had no changes even after being terrible last year or average, at best)
-WR/TE's 10% (not getting separation or being able to adjust to hot-reads or a QB who has to throw well-under 3 seconds)

I have been asking someone to objectively go back and count the number of times Hill had less then 3 seconds to pass b/c that right there is tied to the vanilla and predictable offensive calls, terrible o-line, WR's & TE's not adjusting and breaking off routes, RB & FB's not picking up blitzes, defenses out-smarting us, receivers dropping balls, Hill not finding the hot reads or open receiver quick enough, etc...
[ Edited by NCommand on Oct 19, 2009 at 4:55 PM ]
Originally posted by bzborow1:
You guys are quick to go after the 9ers conservative attack, but consider this, the 49ers are near the top of the league in sacks allowed - with a conservative attack - what do you think might happen if they try to open it up?

People might hve to respect the fact that we might burn them if they try to rush us. Which would then equal less sacks.
Originally posted by 49ers1fan1982:
Originally posted by bzborow1:
You guys are quick to go after the 9ers conservative attack, but consider this, the 49ers are near the top of the league in sacks allowed - with a conservative attack - what do you think might happen if they try to open it up?

People might hve to respect the fact that we might burn them if they try to rush us. Which would then equal less sacks.

ding ding ding -- we would be able to NOT be obvious in our playcalling! It would be like... a normal NFL team?!

ps -- i haven't done this yet today:

f**k JIMMY RAYE! he's terrible. his play calling is terrible. his gameplan is terrible. i almost gagged on water when I saw the San Francisco 49ers actually run an outside running play. I thought to myself... A TOSS?! WHATS THAT?! I was just so used to seeing our RBs run up the middle and collide with our O-Line.
Originally posted by chico49erfan:
Originally posted by 49ers1fan1982:
Originally posted by bzborow1:
You guys are quick to go after the 9ers conservative attack, but consider this, the 49ers are near the top of the league in sacks allowed - with a conservative attack - what do you think might happen if they try to open it up?

People might hve to respect the fact that we might burn them if they try to rush us. Which would then equal less sacks.

ding ding ding -- we would be able to NOT be obvious in our playcalling! It would be like... a normal NFL team?!

ps -- i haven't done this yet today:

f**k JIMMY RAYE! he's terrible. his play calling is terrible. his gameplan is terrible. i almost gagged on water when I saw the San Francisco 49ers actually run an outside running play. I thought to myself... A TOSS?! WHATS THAT?! I was just so used to seeing our RBs run up the middle and collide with our O-Line.

Search Podcast Draft Forum Commentary News Shop Home