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49ers vs. Crabtree (Contract - Who Won?)

49ers vs. Crabtree (Contract - Who Won?)

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by domesik:
Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by Giant9er:
Originally posted by kronik:
Originally posted by FILTHpigskin:
Come on guys... MadDog is always right.

Now, bow down and kiss the virtual ground he floats over.



Why does anyone care what this guy thinks? Most vets on the board already knows that he's a egotistic fraud. Most including myself have no respect for this guy and won't take him seriously. Just ignore him. If not, he may run to a mod and cry to have you banned.




Anybody that has been around here for any period of time on this site knows what Maddog is, a master of spin and a master of turning others info into his own. Just don't pay attention to him, I put him in the same category of poster as NolanHasAPlan(for those of you who remember that guy lol) he simply is a joke poster who cant actually believe what he is typing, he just wants a reaction and has to much time on his hands. What do you expect from a High School teacher who never made it in football? I would be cynical and hurt about my own failure too lol

The Lord of the Trolls has entered the house. NV, you are so predictable, it is...funny. What took you so long?

I think the fact that you engage those who you consider to be "trolls", while giving quick, two sentence responses to the posts that attempt to propogate intelligent discussion speaks volumes.

As a former mod, my opinion is that a valid argument could be made for your removal from the board under the High Maintenance user clause.

It isn't the fact that you disagree with people, it's the manner in which you do so. It isn't the opinions that you hold, it's the manner in which you express them. It isn't the fact that you get into heated arguments, it's the manner in which you stoke the flames.

You're toeing a very fine line.

Kronik and Nv and I have a long history. Kronik was embarrassed a long time ago when I pointed out in his Bryant Johnson Arnaz Battle thread that he made four factual errors, in order to support his position that Johnson should be kept and Battle dumped. After I did the research, and facted checked his errors, he still refused to change his thread until other posters jumped in and asked him to do so. He even admitted his error on the thread, but has held a grudge ever since.

He also tend to jump into controversial threads with nothing to add but an attack. He's been doing that for some time now, and has been warned by the mods.

As for NV, I have a lot more respect for him, since he understands the game pretty well. We simply disagree on vitually everything. He tends to also jump in and go for the character attack, which I don't understand. He can argue his points pretty well, but tends to avoid the topic and simply go the slander route.

You can see the example of both posters on this thread.

The problem is that you bring most if not all of this on yourself. You are that guy who in his mind is smarter than everyone else. Who is an authority on everything and who cannot stand to be questioned or be wrong. In thinking that you are smarter than everyone else you talk down to them and are incredibly codescending. When people call you out and actually provide concrete proof that goes against what you say, you either do not respond or have some "clever"rebuttal. I asked you after the Senior Bowl why your opinion of Raji had changed so dramatically. 2 weeks before the SB you dismissed any talk of Raji as a top 10 pick. Your exact words were that he was just not very good. Well after the SB all of the real experts were raving about Raji's play and how dominant he was, and low and behold your opinion of him changed. You claimed he was one of the best prospects to come out in a while at that position and would be a sure fire top 10 pick. Yet when I asked you twice what exactly he did to change your opinion, you couldn't provide an answer. You just provided some generic, regurgitated information on what he does well which went against what you initially said, all the while not addressing the issue of what exactly did he do at the SB to change your opinion so drastically in a matter of 2 weeks. I think in reading your posts and how you talk to others, it has become clear to me why you are a teacher. And sadly I don't believe it is to help the kids. Since you do feel you are smarter than everyone and an authority on everything and do not like to be questioned, what better place to exert your power than in a classroom with a bunch of kids. You can say whatever you want and no kid is ever going to dispute you or call BS on yours. It is a perfect enviroment for someone with an ego like yours. Now I am not saying you are not a knowledgeable football fan, but I just don't believe you are as knowledgeable as you think you are. And FAN being the operative word. You are not a professional draft guru, nor a professional cap guru and you are not professional beat writer guru. You are simply a fan.



And the response is.....

crickets.......crickets.......crickets.........

Can I have dinner and work on school stuff for a couple hours? I don't get paid to be on the board. Breath in, breath out.

OK, as I stated before, I am happy to take questions and concerns. The statement above was about Raji. In the middle of last season, I thought Raji was overrated by many, and saw him as a 17-20th overall selection in the draft, not a top 10 pick.

However, toward the end of the season, I was very impressed with his play. He was able to play both the NT and the undertackle. I still did not think he was top ten material, but someone I could see at about 15.

Raji really turned it on in the postseason, with an excellent bowl game, and a sensational Senior Bowl week. To me, he was probably the most dominating player during practice week, and really lit into Alex Mack and Max Unger. He was able to bull rush through players in the NT position, and blow past them at the undertackle. To me, the Senior Bowl is a time to prove that you are better than the rest of the guys who were college stars, and Raji was amazing.

One minor reason Eric Wood rose to become a first rounder was his play against Raji in the Senior Bowl game, when he effectively shut him out. However, Raji had proven himself as a stud during the one-on-one practice sessions, which is more valuable than the game.

So, on draft day, I was certainly not surprised Raji went in the top 10 picks.

P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

The biggest error I made in this contract dispute was not supporting management. If I chose the populist position, I would have been hailed and cheered. Chosing the road less travelled and having a nuanced response is not going to be popular with people who are out for blood. So, I was an easy target, especially since I supported Crabtree's claim that he should receive money outside the slot. Of course, then people claimed thaty I was supporting a $40 million payday, and other forms of lies, in order to discredit my position, and the snowball went down the hill.

When people began to attribute statements to me that were not true, I have asked them to show me those statements. Nobody has yet to take me up on that offer.

I am willing to admit error, but it is funny that very few on this board is willing to do the same. I'll throw everyone a bone: I believed this deal would not be for six years. OK, there you go. I believed this deal would be concluded before the regular season. Of course, the masses were angry that I said he would miss any time of training camp.

I'm not quite sure where the anger comes from. The people who are not usually inflamed know my track record is very tight in predictions. I did predict on draft day that Crabtree would be a difficult contract to sign, I predicted a holdout beyond the start of camp, and I said that an unusual contract would be needed to get the job done. And, all three are true. I never stated that he would receive DHB money, and I believed he would get the slotted amount in guaranteed money. Anybody can review my prior statements. They are not hiding anyplace. However, it is more convenient for some people to accuse me of making statements that I never did. There is not much I can do.

Every year, there is a raging discussion in the offseason. This year, it was Crabtree. The past two years it was Lelie and Battle (in which I was right on both accounts..just to be straight with the record). And, you can add this offseason as the third in a row for Battle. Last year, during the regular season, the big war was over whether Eric Heitmann was a Good Football player, and I was correct again. I have an excellent record in the draft, and am usually accurate in 49ers news.

So, when all is said and done, those who are angry with me with catch their breath, and everything will be fine again.

So, no stress, my friend.

P.S. Arguing against management in any contract dispute is never going to make you any friends. Think about the labor stoppage in any sport. 99.9% of the people are furious with the players and their supporters. This is no different.

A final note: I promise I will never be away from the board more than three consecutive hours again, so I won't offend others who are waiting for my response.

Hey, I can agree that there are irrational people on every board. However, you tend to focus on those select few and then proceed to group the whole board together as the same. In all fairness, you didn't change your tune about Raji until all of the experts came out and praised him during the week of SB. So it appeared that you based your new opinion of him based on that. It was a complete 180. You clearly did not consider him orverrated after SB week, on the contrary you found him to be quite special. I can go back an cut and paste your comments, but I am sure you are aware of what you said. But thank you for your response. And no you may not have dinner and work on stuff after a hard day of work.

P.S. If you are a fan of The Office, I can give you a comparison on your theory of the Crabtree/Parker vs. Niner managment contract dispute.

[ Edited by Hoovtrain on Oct 9, 2009 at 00:42:49 ]
  • mayo49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 22,051
NFL.com has the contact as a 6 year $40M ($17M guaranteed) and ESPN is also reporting that it max's out at $40M, so I guess he got his contract.

Quote:
Signing status of 2009 NFL Draft first-round picks
NFL.com

Pk Player Pos. Team Status Contract
1. Matthew Stafford QB Detroit Signed 6 years, $72 million ($41.7M guaranteed)
2. Jason Smith OT St. Louis Signed 5 years, $61.775 million ($33M guaranteed)
3. Tyson Jackson DE Kansas City Signed 5 years, $57 million ($31M guaranteed)
4. Aaron Curry LB Seattle Signed 6 years, $60 million ($34M guaranteed)
5. Mark Sanchez QB N.Y. Jets Signed 5 years, $60 million ($28M guaranteed)
6. Andre Smith OT Cincinnati Signed 4 years, $26 million ($21M guaranteed)
7. Darrius Heyward-Bey WR Oakland Signed 5 years, $38.25 million ($23.5M guaranteed)
8. Eugene Monroe OT Jacksonville Signed 5 years, $35.4 million ($19.2M guaranteed)
9. B.J. Raji DT Green Bay Signed 5 years, $28.5 million ($18M guaranteed)
10. Michael Crabtree WR San Francisco Signed 6 years, $40 million ($17M guaranteed)
11. Aaron Maybin DE Buffalo Signed 5 years, $25 million ($15M guaranteed)
12. Knowshon Moreno RB Denver Signed 5 years, $23 million ($13M guaranteed)
13. Brian Orakpo DE Washington Signed 5 years, $20 million ($12.1M guaranteed)
14. Malcolm Jenkins CB New Orleans Signed 5 years, up to $19 million ($11M guaranteed)
15. Brian Cushing LB Houston Signed 5 years, $18 million ($10.435M guaranteed)
16. Larry English DE San Diego Signed 5 years, $17.8 million ($9.9M guaranteed)
17. Josh Freeman QB Tampa Bay Signed 5 years, $36 million (10.25M guaranteed)
18. Robert Ayers LB Denver Signed 5 years, $15.5 million ($9.7M guaranteed)
19. Jeremy Maclin WR Philadelphia Signed 5 years, $15.5 million ($9.5M guaranteed)
20. Brandon Pettigrew TE Detroit Signed 5 years, $14.6 million ($9.4M guaranteed)
21. Alex Mack C Cleveland Signed 5 years, $15 million ($8.3M guaranteed)
22. Percy Harvin WR Minnesota Signed 5 years, $14.25 million ($8.4M guaranteed)
23. Michael Oher OT Baltimore Signed 5 years, $13 million ($7.82M guaranteed)
24. Peria Jerry DT Atlanta Signed 5 years, $13.25 million ($7.55M guaranteed)
25. Vontae Davis CB Miami Signed 5 years, $13.3 million ($7.35M guaranteed)
26. Clay Matthews LB Green Bay Signed 5 years, $13.2 million ($7.1M guaranteed)
27. Donald Brown RB Indianapolis Signed 5 years, $12.835 million ($6.845M guaranteed)
28. Eric Wood C Buffalo Signed 5 years, $13 million ($6.5M guaranteed)
29. Hakeem Nicks WR N.Y. Giants Signed 5 years, $12.54 million ($6M guaranteed)
30. Kenny Britt WR Tennessee Signed 5 years, $12.25 million ($6.5M guaranteed)
31. Chris "Beanie" Wells RB Arizona Signed 5 years, $11.8 million ($6.345M guaranteed)
32. Evander "Ziggy" Hood DT Pittsburgh Signed 5 years, $11.3 million ($6.1M guaranteed)

Contract figures compiled by NFL Network's Jason La Canfora, NFL.com's Steve Wyche and The Associated Press.

Quote:
ESPN.com news services

San Francisco fans will have to wait a little longer to see Michael Crabtree on the field as the wide receiver will not be activated for Sunday's game against the Atlanta Falcons and is expected to make his NFL debut after the 49ers bye week on Oct. 25 at Houston, a team source told ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter.

After a drawn-out negotiation process, the rookie signed a six-year contract early Wednesday for $32 million that could maximize to $40 million if he achieves every incentive in the deal, a source told ESPN.com's John Clayton.

The former Texas Tech star was the only draft pick who hadn't signed.

"Everybody came to a reachable agreement and it happened," Crabtree said Wednesday, sporting a red No. 15 practice jersey and charcoal gray sweats. "I'm just glad I'm past that part. I'm very humble right now, man, it's a very humbling experience. Just getting a chance to sit back and better myself as a person, as a player, as a teammate. ... I feel like going through that it made me look at the world in a different way, look at my teammates a different way. Hopefully it will work out for the best."

According to the source, Crabtree has a couple of scenarios that could void the sixth year of his contract. If he goes to a Pro Bowl during his first four years, along with playing 80 percent of the offensive snaps during a separate season in which the 49ers reach the playoffs, the source said the contract voids to five years. Another provision would be going to a Pro Bowl in the first four years along with going to a second Pro Bowl in five years.

Crabtree could provide the game-breaking receiving threat the 49ers have been lacking, assuming he can quickly learn the offense after missing all of training camp. The 10th pick overall, he also sat out offseason minicamps and organized team activities while recovering from a foot injury, but was a regular presence at the team's training facility.

Crabtree caught 97 passes for 1,165 yards and scored 19 touchdowns last year, his sophomore season at Texas Tech. He finished his college career with 231 receptions for 3,127 yards and 41 touchdowns.

ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter and the Associated Press contributed to this story.


[ Edited by mayo63 on Oct 9, 2009 at 05:07:44 ]
Originally posted by KRS-1:
SERIOUSLY TISSER ? SERIOUSLY ?

HOW CAN ANYONE DETERMINE A WINNER WITHOUT KNOWING THE ACTUAL DETAILS YET ?




Everyone is a winner when they have Crabs!!!! Or a loser... aww crap I'm so confused now.
Originally posted by TlSSER:

Feel free to start yet another thread please and don't forget to not give YOUR opinion when doing so like you always do.
Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by domesik:
Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:
Originally posted by Giant9er:
Originally posted by kronik:
Originally posted by FILTHpigskin:
Come on guys... MadDog is always right.

Now, bow down and kiss the virtual ground he floats over.



Why does anyone care what this guy thinks? Most vets on the board already knows that he's a egotistic fraud. Most including myself have no respect for this guy and won't take him seriously. Just ignore him. If not, he may run to a mod and cry to have you banned.




Anybody that has been around here for any period of time on this site knows what Maddog is, a master of spin and a master of turning others info into his own. Just don't pay attention to him, I put him in the same category of poster as NolanHasAPlan(for those of you who remember that guy lol) he simply is a joke poster who cant actually believe what he is typing, he just wants a reaction and has to much time on his hands. What do you expect from a High School teacher who never made it in football? I would be cynical and hurt about my own failure too lol

The Lord of the Trolls has entered the house. NV, you are so predictable, it is...funny. What took you so long?

I think the fact that you engage those who you consider to be "trolls", while giving quick, two sentence responses to the posts that attempt to propogate intelligent discussion speaks volumes.

As a former mod, my opinion is that a valid argument could be made for your removal from the board under the High Maintenance user clause.

It isn't the fact that you disagree with people, it's the manner in which you do so. It isn't the opinions that you hold, it's the manner in which you express them. It isn't the fact that you get into heated arguments, it's the manner in which you stoke the flames.

You're toeing a very fine line.

Kronik and Nv and I have a long history. Kronik was embarrassed a long time ago when I pointed out in his Bryant Johnson Arnaz Battle thread that he made four factual errors, in order to support his position that Johnson should be kept and Battle dumped. After I did the research, and facted checked his errors, he still refused to change his thread until other posters jumped in and asked him to do so. He even admitted his error on the thread, but has held a grudge ever since.

He also tend to jump into controversial threads with nothing to add but an attack. He's been doing that for some time now, and has been warned by the mods.

As for NV, I have a lot more respect for him, since he understands the game pretty well. We simply disagree on vitually everything. He tends to also jump in and go for the character attack, which I don't understand. He can argue his points pretty well, but tends to avoid the topic and simply go the slander route.

You can see the example of both posters on this thread.

The problem is that you bring most if not all of this on yourself. You are that guy who in his mind is smarter than everyone else. Who is an authority on everything and who cannot stand to be questioned or be wrong. In thinking that you are smarter than everyone else you talk down to them and are incredibly codescending. When people call you out and actually provide concrete proof that goes against what you say, you either do not respond or have some "clever"rebuttal. I asked you after the Senior Bowl why your opinion of Raji had changed so dramatically. 2 weeks before the SB you dismissed any talk of Raji as a top 10 pick. Your exact words were that he was just not very good. Well after the SB all of the real experts were raving about Raji's play and how dominant he was, and low and behold your opinion of him changed. You claimed he was one of the best prospects to come out in a while at that position and would be a sure fire top 10 pick. Yet when I asked you twice what exactly he did to change your opinion, you couldn't provide an answer. You just provided some generic, regurgitated information on what he does well which went against what you initially said, all the while not addressing the issue of what exactly did he do at the SB to change your opinion so drastically in a matter of 2 weeks. I think in reading your posts and how you talk to others, it has become clear to me why you are a teacher. And sadly I don't believe it is to help the kids. Since you do feel you are smarter than everyone and an authority on everything and do not like to be questioned, what better place to exert your power than in a classroom with a bunch of kids. You can say whatever you want and no kid is ever going to dispute you or call BS on yours. It is a perfect enviroment for someone with an ego like yours. Now I am not saying you are not a knowledgeable football fan, but I just don't believe you are as knowledgeable as you think you are. And FAN being the operative word. You are not a professional draft guru, nor a professional cap guru and you are not professional beat writer guru. You are simply a fan.



And the response is.....

crickets.......crickets.......crickets.........

Can I have dinner and work on school stuff for a couple hours? I don't get paid to be on the board. Breath in, breath out.

OK, as I stated before, I am happy to take questions and concerns. The statement above was about Raji. In the middle of last season, I thought Raji was overrated by many, and saw him as a 17-20th overall selection in the draft, not a top 10 pick.

However, toward the end of the season, I was very impressed with his play. He was able to play both the NT and the undertackle. I still did not think he was top ten material, but someone I could see at about 15.

Raji really turned it on in the postseason, with an excellent bowl game, and a sensational Senior Bowl week. To me, he was probably the most dominating player during practice week, and really lit into Alex Mack and Max Unger. He was able to bull rush through players in the NT position, and blow past them at the undertackle. To me, the Senior Bowl is a time to prove that you are better than the rest of the guys who were college stars, and Raji was amazing.

One minor reason Eric Wood rose to become a first rounder was his play against Raji in the Senior Bowl game, when he effectively shut him out. However, Raji had proven himself as a stud during the one-on-one practice sessions, which is more valuable than the game.

So, on draft day, I was certainly not surprised Raji went in the top 10 picks.

P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

The biggest error I made in this contract dispute was not supporting management. If I chose the populist position, I would have been hailed and cheered. Chosing the road less travelled and having a nuanced response is not going to be popular with people who are out for blood. So, I was an easy target, especially since I supported Crabtree's claim that he should receive money outside the slot. Of course, then people claimed thaty I was supporting a $40 million payday, and other forms of lies, in order to discredit my position, and the snowball went down the hill.

When people began to attribute statements to me that were not true, I have asked them to show me those statements. Nobody has yet to take me up on that offer.

I am willing to admit error, but it is funny that very few on this board is willing to do the same. I'll throw everyone a bone: I believed this deal would not be for six years. OK, there you go. I believed this deal would be concluded before the regular season. Of course, the masses were angry that I said he would miss any time of training camp.

I'm not quite sure where the anger comes from. The people who are not usually inflamed know my track record is very tight in predictions. I did predict on draft day that Crabtree would be a difficult contract to sign, I predicted a holdout beyond the start of camp, and I said that an unusual contract would be needed to get the job done. And, all three are true. I never stated that he would receive DHB money, and I believed he would get the slotted amount in guaranteed money. Anybody can review my prior statements. They are not hiding anyplace. However, it is more convenient for some people to accuse me of making statements that I never did. There is not much I can do.

Every year, there is a raging discussion in the offseason. This year, it was Crabtree. The past two years it was Lelie and Battle (in which I was right on both accounts..just to be straight with the record). And, you can add this offseason as the third in a row for Battle. Last year, during the regular season, the big war was over whether Eric Heitmann was a Good Football player, and I was correct again. I have an excellent record in the draft, and am usually accurate in 49ers news.

So, when all is said and done, those who are angry with me with catch their breath, and everything will be fine again.

So, no stress, my friend.

P.S. Arguing against management in any contract dispute is never going to make you any friends. Think about the labor stoppage in any sport. 99.9% of the people are furious with the players and their supporters. This is no different.

A final note: I promise I will never be away from the board more than three consecutive hours again, so I won't offend others who are waiting for my response.

Hey, I can agree that there are irrational people on every board. However, you tend to focus on those select few and then proceed to group the whole board together as the same. In all fairness, you didn't change your tune about Raji until all of the experts came out and praised him during the week of SB. So it appeared that you based your new opinion of him based on that. It was a complete 180. You clearly did not consider him orverrated after SB week, on the contrary you found him to be quite special. I can go back an cut and paste your comments, but I am sure you are aware of what you said. But thank you for your response. And no you may not have dinner and work on stuff after a hard day of work.

P.S. If you are a fan of The Office, I can give you a comparison on your theory of the Crabtree/Parker vs. Niner managment contract dispute.

I think if we looked back in time, I beat most of the experts on the Raji curve, especially after his bowl game against Vanderbilt. For me, at the end of the bowl game, he was the best DL in the draft. However, it was really a matter of degrees of likeability. I had not projected him as a top 10 pick at that point. And, surely I felt a lot stronger about his pro potential after Senior Bowl started, there is no doubt. And, I had him projected to the Raiders for some time at number seven right after the Senior Bowl. So, I think your assessment of my past statements goes back to earlier in the season, where I wasn't nearly as high on him, as I previously stated.

In fact, I believe I highlighted before the Senior Bowl some of the key matchups for the week, and stated that the Raji-Mack/Unger battles would be one of the keys to watch.

I think the window has closed to do a fact check on these posts.

P.S. Final note: I had projected DHB to be a top ten pick going into the 2008 season, due to his speed. However, due to his lack of productivity, I dropped him way down the first round board until the combine. In fact, very early in the 2008 season, I made the crazy statement that he could possibly be selected before Crabtree in the draft. I should have held on to my guns on that one, but backed down on the prediction, because it was so far way out there.

[ Edited by MadDog49er on Oct 9, 2009 at 07:49:23 ]
  • mayo49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 22,051
Mad, did you read my post? They say that the deal is worth a total of $40M. So, in essense you were right, there was a compromise on both sides.
  • Otter
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 22,936
who won? who cares
Originally posted by mayo63:
Mad, did you read my post? They say that the deal is worth a total of $40M. So, in essense you were right, there was a compromise on both sides.

I hate to beat a dead horse, but that's all fluff money. He would have to be a perennial pro-bowler who also has success in the playoffs every year to reach those incentives. He doesn't have easy to reach escalators as does Raji who only has to play 35 percent of the snaps in one given season. Crabs has got to make multiple pro-bowls and do it from the get go to see any of that money. It's a way of Parker and Crabtree to save face without really gaining anything they couldn't have gotten months ago. The guaranteed money is what's important, because it's the money Crabs is going to get no matter how well or poorly he produces. That money is well within the slot.
Originally posted by mayo63:
Mad, did you read my post? They say that the deal is worth a total of $40M. So, in essense you were right, there was a compromise on both sides.


Just to be clear, $8 Million of the $40 Million total contract can only be gained by reaching "Unlikely to be earned" incentives to be paid out only if Crabtree produces at a Pro-Bowl/All-Pro level.
Originally posted by MadDoh49er:
P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

You do know that that's an admission of inciting, right???

- 98
Originally posted by kidash:
Originally posted by MadDoh49er:
P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

You do know that that's an admission of inciting, right???

- 98

Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by kidash:
Originally posted by MadDoh49er:
P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

You do know that that's an admission of inciting, right???

- 98


just had to point it out...

- 98
Originally posted by kidash:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by kidash:
Originally posted by MadDoh49er:
P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

You do know that that's an admission of inciting, right???

- 98



just had to point it out...

- 98

I love the name change as well, at first i was like did somebody really create the username MadDoh49er
Originally posted by valrod33:
Originally posted by kidash:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by kidash:
Originally posted by MadDoh49er:
P.S. I think you overstate the "bring it upon yourself". Contract disputes bring out a lot of anger. I played into the anger with people who were losing their minds over the contract dispute, especially when accusing Crabtree and Parker of being bad guys. If anything, I was far from over the top compared to the masses who acted hysterically throughout this adventure. I do have a tendency to slide back and forth between fighting injustice in a militant way (by butchering others), or by mocking their irrationality. There were some people on the verge of jumping off the bridge, and I was there to push them.

You do know that that's an admission of inciting, right???

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just had to point it out...

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I love the name change as well, at first i was like did somebody really create the username MadDoh49er

I should have used AngryPuppy...

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