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Fitz over Willis for #1 nfc west player?

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:
This time next year, it'll be Bradford. book it. Dudes gonna be a nightmare for us for a very, very long time.

I agree he might eventually be the best player in the division, but probably not for 2 or 3 more years.
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships
no way. Willis is the best handsdown. Fitz can be contained, Willis is everywhere.
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships

You're right sometimes but Tampa kind of had the advantage of having Oakland's former coach.

You look at the last 2 years Indy, New Orleans, Green Bay in the Super Bowl. Offense matters. Green Bay kicked the sh*t out of Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh beat Arizona after their defense blow a considerable lead and Big Ben bailed them out.

The reality is this lead is shifting towards a qb league more and more by the day.
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships

You're right sometimes but Tampa kind of had the advantage of having Oakland's former coach.

You look at the last 2 years Indy, New Orleans, Green Bay in the Super Bowl. Offense matters. Green Bay kicked the sh*t out of Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh beat Arizona after their defense blow a considerable lead and Big Ben bailed them out.

The reality is this lead is shifting towards a qb league more and more by the day.

geen bay is a balanced team they have a great offense and one of the best D i mean they have one of the top pass rushers and one of the top corners and safteys in the nfl

i will give you the steelers arizona superbowl though becuse the steelers did blow a lead
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships

Yep....MAN LAW.......
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships

You're right sometimes but Tampa kind of had the advantage of having Oakland's former coach.

You look at the last 2 years Indy, New Orleans, Green Bay in the Super Bowl. Offense matters. Green Bay kicked the sh*t out of Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh beat Arizona after their defense blow a considerable lead and Big Ben bailed them out.

The reality is this lead is shifting towards a qb league more and more by the day.

geen bay is a balanced team they have a great offense and one of the best D i mean they have one of the top pass rushers and one of the top corners and safteys in the nfl

i will give you the steelers arizona superbowl though becuse the steelers did blow a lead

When an offense can make the opposing one sided that's always going to help a defense out. Green Bay allowed 4.7 yards per rush last year. That's 2nd worse in football. Teams couldn't exploit that because Green Bay finished 27th in rushing attempts.

It's like the Saints 2 years ago. You force teams into passing situations and have a good blitz and aggressive secondary you can mask some defensive deficiences. With the new rules making it a more and more qb friendly I think the formula to winning is a great qb and that's mandatory and the best defense to compliment that.

The days of Tampa and Baltimore winning it are gone.
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships

You're right sometimes but Tampa kind of had the advantage of having Oakland's former coach.

You look at the last 2 years Indy, New Orleans, Green Bay in the Super Bowl. Offense matters. Green Bay kicked the sh*t out of Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh beat Arizona after their defense blow a considerable lead and Big Ben bailed them out.

The reality is this lead is shifting towards a qb league more and more by the day.

geen bay is a balanced team they have a great offense and one of the best D i mean they have one of the top pass rushers and one of the top corners and safteys in the nfl

i will give you the steelers arizona superbowl though becuse the steelers did blow a lead

When an offense can make the opposing one sided that's always going to help a defense out. Green Bay allowed 4.7 yards per rush last year. That's 2nd worse in football. Teams couldn't exploit that because Green Bay finished 27th in rushing attempts.

It's like the Saints 2 years ago. You force teams into passing situations and have a good blitz and aggressive secondary you can mask some defensive deficiences. With the new rules making it a more and more qb friendly I think the formula to winning is a great qb and that's mandatory and the best defense to compliment that.

The days of Tampa and Baltimore winning it are gone.

so what were one of the best teams against the run along with the panthers (top 8) chicago buffalo houston


those all are teams top 10 against teh run more teams in the top 10 in run D didnt make the playoffs then who were


now in order top 10 teams that were worst against the pass

jaguars
houston
denver
dallas
washington
cleveland
detriot
arizona
san fran

none of them made the playofffs

again the point im trying to make is D wins championships and if you want to win you have to stop the pass we havent been able to do that in a long time
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Originally posted by 49erRider:
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Offense will always get the credit over defense.....offense wins games, defense wins championships.....

That cliche is over-used and entirely untrue. Defense rarely puts any points up and therefor rarely wins anything (yes, I know the statement suggests they keep opponents' points off the board, but without a good offense you will also have no points either). If you don't have offense, you won't put up enough points to win. Period.

The fact of the matter is it's rare to win championships with just one of the two. There are exceptions, like the Ravens in 2000, but they're not common.

It usually takes a good offense with a good, franchise QB to win championships. Need proof? Name a team that has numerous championships without a franchise QB or with a bad offense. Then, take your number (which should be 0 - remember I said numerous championships) and compare to the number of Super Bowls there have been.

I hate to say it but The Steelers is the example Im saying....they dont have a high powered offense but they seem to win.....how?....Polomalu and that D...

bucs vs raiders superbowl (i think 2003)

bucs had great D raiders had great O who won?


or better yet


patriots vs giants

some say patriots in that year best offensive team ever vs the giants who had a great D

who won


D wins championships

You're right sometimes but Tampa kind of had the advantage of having Oakland's former coach.

You look at the last 2 years Indy, New Orleans, Green Bay in the Super Bowl. Offense matters. Green Bay kicked the sh*t out of Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh beat Arizona after their defense blow a considerable lead and Big Ben bailed them out.

The reality is this lead is shifting towards a qb league more and more by the day.

geen bay is a balanced team they have a great offense and one of the best D i mean they have one of the top pass rushers and one of the top corners and safteys in the nfl

i will give you the steelers arizona superbowl though becuse the steelers did blow a lead

When an offense can make the opposing one sided that's always going to help a defense out. Green Bay allowed 4.7 yards per rush last year. That's 2nd worse in football. Teams couldn't exploit that because Green Bay finished 27th in rushing attempts.

It's like the Saints 2 years ago. You force teams into passing situations and have a good blitz and aggressive secondary you can mask some defensive deficiences. With the new rules making it a more and more qb friendly I think the formula to winning is a great qb and that's mandatory and the best defense to compliment that.

The days of Tampa and Baltimore winning it are gone.

so what were one of the best teams against the run along with the panthers (top 8) chicago buffalo houston


those all are teams top 10 against teh run more teams in the top 10 in run D didnt make the playoffs then who were


now in order top 10 teams that were worst against the pass

jaguars
houston
denver
dallas
washington
cleveland
detriot
arizona
san fran

none of them made the playofffs

again the point im trying to make is D wins championships and if you want to win you have to stop the pass we havent been able to do that in a long time

Defense doesn't win championships. Not by itself. The instances of that happening are very rare, and the new league rules are going to make even harder for it to occur. All we're trying to say is you need a great qb to go with a good defense.

I don't think anyone's disagreeing that you don't need a good defense.
They always favor Offense over D in rankings.
Fitz over Willis seems right. It's hard to compare - it comes down to who plays a position with greater impact in the game, and that is obviously the WR position.