Originally posted by tjd808185:Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:Originally posted by tjd808185:Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:Originally posted by tjd808185:Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:Originally posted by tjd808185:Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:Originally posted by tjd808185:Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Kiper said he has more of a shot at TE than QB in the NFL. He's crazy. Pryor has enough raw skills to be a great WCO QB over time, and if we don't get the guy we want in a few weeks, he should be a strong consideration should he declare for the supplemental draft.
Prior's got raw skill there's no denying that but everything I've seen about him tells me he has Vince Young's attitude.
He has horrible accuracy, he doesn't make pro reads, he whines that he's not being used like Cam or Robinson. He's going to be a train wreck in the NFL. He's not half the prospect Cam Newton is either.
I'm not saying stats are everything, but the kid had a 65% completion percentage last year (which is damn good for a pro-style offense), and he wasn't just dinking and dunking (top 20 in yards per completion as well). I can't speak for his attitude since I don't know enough about him, but to come out and say that his accuracy is "horrible" seems downright, well, inaccurate.
I'll take expert opinions over stats any day of the week. Stats can be deceiving. The NFL is a close competition league. Ohio State Big Ten Football is not. Yeah he put up a 65% completion ratio in a bunch of routes against sh*tty opponents. You look at his close games and he was nowhere near as consisant. Under 60% against Miami, Arkansas, Wisconsin, and Iowa. Against Oregon in last year's bowl game he completed 62% of his passes had 2 TD and a pick. Pretty good game, rivalring Cam's game against Oregon.
You say you haven't watched him play that much. I live in Ohio and I've seen just about every game of his. He struggles with progressions and just isn't accurate. If you can find an expert who disagrees with that fine, but I'm not backing down from that stance because he completed 75% of his passes in a 49-0 route over Indiana. Ohio State had a soft schedule last year facing 2 teams that finished in the top 25.
Reading comprehension is key. I never said I didn't WATCH him play that much, I said I couldn't speak about the attitude thing since I don't know enough him as an individual. That's different.
If you can quote "experts" that say his accuracy is "horrible," than your statement has credibility. I didn't bring this point up, though...you did, so the burden of proof is on you to find others that back up your statement. I didn't say he was accurate...I said your statement seemed inaccurate.
Now, if you can't find experts that agree with you, that's fine...it's then just an opinion based on your perspective...which is of course valid and acceptable on this board. But I'm sure you realize your opinion (along with mine) has nothing to do with his draft status or pro potential, especially if it's not corroborated by experts.
IMO, a 65% completion percentage as a junior and a record of 33-6 as a starting QB in the Big 10 is pretty impressive. Has he been perfect in all of his games? Is he always 65% accurate? No. But he has managed to put up some pretty impressive numbers overall and win a lot of games by making a lot of great plays both inside and outside the pocket. Combine that with his ungodly athletic ability, and I believe he's worth a look.
Now, the attitude thing is something different, as I mentioned earlier. If it's as bad as you say, than it (along with the "horrible" accuracy issues you claim he has) will come out during his evaluation and will cost him dearly in terms of draft status.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say Kiper projecting him to be a tight end over a quarterback has something to do with Pryor having poor quarterback skills.
Forgive me for connecting the dots on that one.
Guys like Young, Newton, Pryor are just too talented for most colleges to compete with. If you stack the line it leads to man coverages and blown assignments. If you don't they'll torch with their legs. That luxury ends once they hit the pros.
Dude, let's just be straight about this. You said his accuracy was horrible. I wasn't referring to nor did I question you about his OVERALL quarterbacking skills (which obviously are worthy of discussion). Did Kiper say, "due to Pryor's "horrible" accuracy, he should be a TE instead of a QB?" No, he didn't, and that's what you and I are talking about. A QB can be accurate in college and still not make a very good QB prospect, since there's so much more to playing the position than just that. I'm assuming Kiper is giving an overall evaluation/projection and not JUST pointing out one horrible flaw (accuracy) and dismissing his chances because of that one thing.
Why can't you just admit you exaggerated a little on how "horrible" his accuracy really is? It's not a big deal, we're all wrong sometimes.
This statement comes from a previous discussion about Pryor from Kiper. Right after his suspension came down.
When asked about what scouts needed to see from Pryor in his final season this is what he said. "Accuracy" "Throwing the football is the main thing" "He has to work on throwing the ball, he has to be precise with the football, and he has to do the things from a pure passing standpoint". He then went on to say he thought he was a better fit at tight end.
That statement right there pretty tells you what Kiper thinks of Pryor's accuracy. It needs alot of work.
Two things can be equally true. I don't entirely disagree with Kiper's assessment in terms of what Pryor needs to do in the passing department. I also don't think his accuracy is "horrible"...and Kiper doesn't describe it as such either.
He manages to complete a very high percentage of his passes in a pro-style offense and make plays through the air to win a ton of college football games (none of which is easy to do). AND, he struggles to consistently be precise with his footwork and his throwing mechanics in the pocket, which affects his precision (that's a negative). These are things he obviously needs to work on, and a good QB coach can help him in these areas.
IMO, I believe Kiper is saying that he believes Pryor doesn't possess the overall QB skills to be an NFL QB, but does have the athleticism/size/speed to play another position. He may end up being right, but then again, he also thought Jimmy Clausen was the 4th best player OVERALL in last year's draft, and thought David Carr was in no danger of being a bust as a #1 overall pick.
I disagree. Athletic quarterbacks have made dominating college football look very easy (Young, Tebow, Newton, Pryor), but as we all know that by itself doesn't translate into the pros.
I think Mel is seeing what alot of people see. An athletic freak whose game just doesn't project to the pros.
And I disagree with you. We actually DON'T know yet how this new breed of athletic freaks will translate as pro QBs. The only guy you listed who's had a shot at doing anything of note yet is Vince Young, and he's actually performed quite well in terms of winning games and overall production (was having his best year until things went south with his coach). It's the space between VY's ears that people have serious issues with, and not necessarily his skills/performance as a QB.
Tebow just finished his rookie year and Cam/Pryor haven't played a snap in the NFL, so it's not like you have a laundry list of examples to use when saying their games just "don't project to the pros."