2025 San Francisco Giants Season Thread

Originally posted by SFGiant49ers:
Not my argument or discussion above, but batting average isn't valuable at all anymore just because it's 2025?

I'll fully admit, I have no clue what the f*ck most of those advanced metrics mean, they look like a foreign language to me most of the time and I feel like baseball has wayyy wayyyyyyyyy too many ridiculous stats for every tiny little stupid thing.

If batting average isn't valuable at all in 2025, then why are people complaining about players like Bailey and a bunch of other players who are or were hitting under .200 for the longest time? If batting average isn't a metric of value, then why does anyone care at all how low of an average some of these players have?

I get that there are other metrics that are more valuable in baseball statistics, but to say batting average isn't valuable is kind of dumb IMO. Idk, maybe I'm just dumb I guess?

There are far better ways to judge offensive value than batting average. It wasnt JUST that Bailey's batting average was under the Mendoza line for much of the season. His on base percentage was pathetic. His OPS (on base plus slugging) was pathetic. His OPS+ (on base percentage that adjusts for park factor and league averages), was almost half of what is considered an average OPS+.

You arent dumb. There are just better ways to judge value these days. A perfect example of this is Luis Arraez. He has been on 3 teams in the last 4 years. Why? Because hitting .320 with low extra base hits, no speed, etc. isnt nearly as valuable as, say, someone who hits .240 with 30 homeruns and a high on base percentage. The latter example player's statisticts are far more conducive to winning than the .320 hitter who doesnt do much else.

Originally posted by SFGiant49ers:
Not my argument or discussion above, but batting average isn't valuable at all anymore just because it's 2025?

I'll fully admit, I have no clue what the f*ck most of those advanced metrics mean, they look like a foreign language to me most of the time and I feel like baseball has wayyy wayyyyyyyyy too many ridiculous stats for every tiny little stupid thing.

If batting average isn't valuable at all in 2025, then why are people complaining about players like Bailey and a bunch of other players who are or were hitting under .200 for the longest time? If batting average isn't a metric of value, then why does anyone care at all how low of an average some of these players have?

I get that there are other metrics that are more valuable in baseball statistics, but to say batting average isn't valuable is kind of dumb IMO. Idk, maybe I'm just dumb I guess?

Avg is still valuable, but players have just shifted to things like launch angle and are prioritizing power because thats what the metrics odds say is more valuable. Its like players taking way more 3's in the NBA now because statistically it increases scoring overall as long as you're over a certain %.

There used to be no place on an MLB roster for a player hitting under .220, but now teams deal with it for value in other areas.

Lets be honest, what is the average batting avg in MLB for catchers in 2025? I don't understand why Bailey hitting .217 is really that big of a deal. Id bet league average for catchers is in that relative range, and Bailey gives you a huge bonus defensively. Are we really going to find a better overall contributor than Bailey as the starting catcher? To me its a non-issue. We have bigger things to worry about.

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Adames on this team qualifies as a grear hitter. His average is low but part of that is because he started so poorly thins seasn and has been digging himself out of a hole all year. His fielding isn't grerat but it'sbetter than it has been. Playing next to Chapman allows hm to cheat more toward the middle.

Nearly everyone felt that it was a good off season signing.

i have always felt in FA, you pay for quality. don't pay for mediocre. mediocre you can find laying around, like Dom Smith. adames has been pretty darn mediocre to call a spade a spade.

I'm not saying he's Mookie Betts but be real. The Giants haven't had much luck signing the really big names. Devers would hav enever come here as a free agent. They had to trade for him. Given the overall quality of this team and their minor league system Adames is about as good as we'll get. If they hadn't signed him and wasted time trying to get some big name that would never come here then fans would be criticizing them for doing nothing. At least they tried to upgrade SS which was terrible last year.

Even if they were able to sign guys like Alonso or other big names there's no guarantee they would be productive playing at Oracle. The park wears on players as they see balls die on the warning track over and over. The Dodgers have had the highest rtor one of the highest payrolls for the last 10 years. They have collected some of the best talent in history on one team. They've won 1 real title. No guarantees in baseball.

Willy Adames has been offensively better than Mookie Betts has been in 2025.

More HRs but Betts started off really slow this year because of some injuries. He still has a higher BA. My point is ask 10 people and I'm pretty sure at lerast 9 would say Betts is a better player. A bigger name. The type of player that the Giants haven't been able to sign.

And Adames didnt get off to a really slow start? And we are still using batting average as a metric of value in 2025?

OPS: .701 to .684 favoring Adames
OPS+: 102 to 89 favoring Adames
oWAR: 2.4 to 1.6 favoring Adames
WPA: 0.5 to -1.3 favoring Adames

It isnt just homeruns. But point is, no one is saying Adames is as good as Mookie Betts. But as bad and/or disappointing as Adames has been with the bat this season, he has at the very least been on the same level as Betts. Advanced metrics say he has been better.

Great. Adames has the advantage this year in those metrics. Now take those metrics and go ask 30 GMs who they would prefer on their team.

Originally posted by SFGiant49ers:
Not my argument or discussion above, but batting average isn't valuable at all anymore just because it's 2025?

I'll fully admit, I have no clue what the f*ck most of those advanced metrics mean, they look like a foreign language to me most of the time and I feel like baseball has wayyy wayyyyyyyyy too many ridiculous stats for every tiny little stupid thing.

If batting average isn't valuable at all in 2025, then why are people complaining about players like Bailey and a bunch of other players who are or were hitting under .200 for the longest time? If batting average isn't a metric of value, then why does anyone care at all how low of an average some of these players have?

I get that there are other metrics that are more valuable in baseball statistics, but to say batting average isn't valuable is kind of dumb IMO. Idk, maybe I'm just dumb I guess?

Batting average is down league wide. I think the top hitting team hits .268. Much different than 15 years ago.

Giants are near the bottom of the league with a .232 avg

also near the bottom in slugging%… HRs

you don't need advanced metrics to tell they can't hit for s**t

Originally posted by DeepNinerValue:

Originally posted by SFGiant49ers:
Not my argument or discussion above, but batting average isn't valuable at all anymore just because it's 2025?

I'll fully admit, I have no clue what the f*ck most of those advanced metrics mean, they look like a foreign language to me most of the time and I feel like baseball has wayyy wayyyyyyyyy too many ridiculous stats for every tiny little stupid thing.

If batting average isn't valuable at all in 2025, then why are people complaining about players like Bailey and a bunch of other players who are or were hitting under .200 for the longest time? If batting average isn't a metric of value, then why does anyone care at all how low of an average some of these players have?

I get that there are other metrics that are more valuable in baseball statistics, but to say batting average isn't valuable is kind of dumb IMO. Idk, maybe I'm just dumb I guess?

Batting average is down league wide. I think the top hitting team hits .268. Much different than 15 years ago.

Giants are near the bottom of the league with a .232 avg

also near the bottom in slugging%

Stats are what they are but only one really matters. Won-loss record.

Originally posted by DeepNinerValue:
Batting average is down league wide. I think the top hitting team hits .268. Much different than 15 years ago.

Giants are near the bottom of the league with a .232 avg

also near the bottom in slugging%… HRs

you don't need advanced metrics to tell they can't hit for s**t

the problem is we hired guys to hit, like adames and lee. lee is a problem. he's completely average across the board. with his bat control and slap hit approach, he should be a much better contact hitter. right now he's a JAG i'm afraid. you can find guys like that on waivers. don't need to pay that dude 9 figures. 9 figures for .257

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by DeepNinerValue:
Batting average is down league wide. I think the top hitting team hits .268. Much different than 15 years ago.

Giants are near the bottom of the league with a .232 avg

also near the bottom in slugging%… HRs

you don't need advanced metrics to tell they can't hit for s**t

the problem is we hired guys to hit, like adames and lee. lee is a problem. he's completely average across the board. with his bat control and slap hit approach, he should be a much better contact hitter. right now he's a JAG i'm afraid. you can find guys like that on waivers. don't need to pay that dude 9 figures. 9 figures for .257

Lee is like the Aaron Rowand contract, just awful, probably worse actually… at least nadz had power every so often if he wasn't striking out, that contract is a reflections of the giants desperation, and Lee was a big reach, they just couldn't get any good hitters to sign here and they reached hard on lee

Here is the situation. Runners on 2nd and 3rd, two outs, obviously 1st base open and the pitcher is facing the guy who is 1-1 hitting over .300
What do you do, Melvin? I know what I would have done.

Lee is essentially a rookie. Its far too early to claim he is a bad contract. Give him time to adjust to the big leagues.

Bases loaded. No outs. Zero runs.

I can't figure out how a player like Devers who's a proven hitter can strike out 4 or 5 times in a game. At least put the ball in play. At one point Devers and Ramos had 7 SOs between them.

Originally posted by Niners99:
Lets be honest, what is the average batting avg in MLB for catchers in 2025? I don't understand why Bailey hitting .217 is really that big of a deal. Id bet league average for catchers is in that relative range, and Bailey gives you a huge bonus defensively. Are we really going to find a better overall contributor than Bailey as the starting catcher? To me its a non-issue. We have bigger things to worry about.

If you want us to be honest, you would understand that Bailey has been hitting under .180 for most of the season...which was when the majority of the complaining was from.

I hate triples alley

koss has swag, we need that

Great job Melvin

no urgency at all

butto gets 2 outs on 2 pitches and gives up 3 straight hits
Tie game and win gone for verlander

lol verlander regrets signing here