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Originally posted by NCommand:
This. dtg, of these QB's, do you know who played in a pro-style offense? Who has the best pocket-feel (athleticism within the pocket), throws with anticipation, can process very quickly (pre-post snap), is very accurate, best foot work, bright/quick study (WCO), etc. I'm looking for the best WCO fit...which means the best fit could be in the 3rd or 4th rounds (like Kirk Cousins).

DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame Height: 6-4. Weight: 230
Mitch Trubisky*, QB, North Carolina Height: 6-3. Weight: 220
Pat Mahomes*, QB, Texas Tech Height: 6-3. Weight: 219
Deshaun Watson*, QB, Clemson Height: 6-2. Weight: 205
Davis Webb, QB, California Height: 6-4. Weight: 229
Brad Kaaya*, QB, Miami Height: 6-4. Weight: 209
Jerod Evans*, QB, Virginia Tech Height: 6-4. Weight: 235
Josh Dobbs, QB, Tennessee Height: 6-3. Weight: 216
Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss Height: 6-2. Weight: 215
Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
Alec Torgersen, QB, Pennsylvania Height: 6-2. Weight: 220
Antonio Pipkin, QB, Tiffin Height: 6-0. Weight: 225.
Seth Russell, QB, Baylor Height: 6-2. Weight: 203
Tyler Stewart, QB, Nevada Height: 6-4. Weight: 220
Taysom Hill, QB, BYU Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
Patrick Towles, QB, Boston College Height: 6-5. Weight: 253
C.J. Beathard, QB, Iowa Height: 6-2. Weight: 219
Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota Height: 6-4. Weight: 230
Sefo Liufau, QB, Colorado Height: 6-3. Weight: 216
Gunner Kiel, QB, Cincinnati Height: 6-4. Weight: 208
Greg Ward Jr., QB, Houston Height: 5-11. Weight: 185

Not really. I've watched quite a few in games but not to the extent of being able to reliably predict success. I like Trubisky's accuracy and calm demeanor and Watson impressed me with his grit in the Alabama game...really impressive leader in a huge game. When I watched Kizer he did not impress me but I didn't see his best games. I tend to watch Pac-12 games and he did not particularly play well against Stanford or USC.

Trubisky seems to have a better pocket presence than either Watson or Kizer but does he have escapability that would hold up in the NFL? Of all the QBs I've seen this year Darnold is the only one who made me think..."Wow, this guy has the knack!" But that was a couple of games...not enough to judge a QB, and he's not in the draft this year.
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Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Jcool:
sorry late to this one.

What is the Academy and it's relation to the 49ers with this comment ?

Jed and Paraag outsourced scouting.
  • Jcool
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 44,493
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Jcool:
sorry late to this one.

What is the Academy and it's relation to the 49ers with this comment ?

"In their scouting evaluations, the 49ers will create a separate competitiveness/toughness grade, to try and find players who love football the most."

http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/08/john-lynch-details-what-he-and-kyle-shanahans-first-big-project-will-be/

New 49ers GM John Lynch said the team will create an extra "competitiveness and toughness grade" in the hopes of finding prospects "who love football the most."

It is not a revolutionary concept, as it screams "coach speak" and is somewhat expected from a former player. We will never know how much this impacts the team's final decision, but you can surmise that the club will not draft players with questions around their passion for the game. The full interview is interesting, as Lynch adds the team's quarterback search could continue into 2018.

Source: KNBR
[ Edited by Jcool on Feb 8, 2017 at 8:56 AM ]
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 60,541
Originally posted by ComeOnDeberg:
Originally posted by WashDCNinerFan:
He was on KNBR and a,so did an interview with Florio on PFT. Just listened to them both back to back so the below could be a mix of the two:

He said that he interviewed a D.C. Candidate in San Diego - must have been last week. Made a joke that his wife had to run to Home Depot and get a grease board so JL would have that for the interview.

Indicated that he spent all day today looking at QB's; later said something that made me think that it was primarily looking at our current QB's today

Was asked about the tough SB loss and how that might affect Kyle. Had a great answer saying that Kyle will learn from it and be stronger (and use is as fuel). Also said good thing he learned those lessons on another team or something like that.

Some good stuff about the decision to take this job and how he knows he can be successful.

I continue to be more and more impressed with him. A very long way too go but I'm starting to think that folks that made fun of this hire and panned it may eat those words someday. what a great leader and spokesman for the franchise.

This guy has done more in the last week then Baalke has done with his entire stint in SF
i think deberg has said nothing wrong here
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Originally posted by NCommand:
This. dtg, of these QB's, do you know who played in a pro-style offense? Who has the best pocket-feel (athleticism within the pocket), throws with anticipation, can process very quickly (pre-post snap), is very accurate, best foot work, bright/quick study (WCO), etc. I'm looking for the best WCO fit...which means the best fit could be in the 3rd or 4th rounds (like Kirk Cousins).

DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame Height: 6-4. Weight: 230
Mitch Trubisky*, QB, North Carolina Height: 6-3. Weight: 220
Pat Mahomes*, QB, Texas Tech Height: 6-3. Weight: 219
Deshaun Watson*, QB, Clemson Height: 6-2. Weight: 205
Davis Webb, QB, California Height: 6-4. Weight: 229
Brad Kaaya*, QB, Miami Height: 6-4. Weight: 209
Jerod Evans*, QB, Virginia Tech Height: 6-4. Weight: 235
Josh Dobbs, QB, Tennessee Height: 6-3. Weight: 216
Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss Height: 6-2. Weight: 215
Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
Alec Torgersen, QB, Pennsylvania Height: 6-2. Weight: 220
Antonio Pipkin, QB, Tiffin Height: 6-0. Weight: 225.
Seth Russell, QB, Baylor Height: 6-2. Weight: 203
Tyler Stewart, QB, Nevada Height: 6-4. Weight: 220
Taysom Hill, QB, BYU Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
Patrick Towles, QB, Boston College Height: 6-5. Weight: 253
C.J. Beathard, QB, Iowa Height: 6-2. Weight: 219
Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota Height: 6-4. Weight: 230
Sefo Liufau, QB, Colorado Height: 6-3. Weight: 216
Gunner Kiel, QB, Cincinnati Height: 6-4. Weight: 208
Greg Ward Jr., QB, Houston Height: 5-11. Weight: 185

Not really. I've watched quite a few in games but not to the extent of being able to reliably predict success. I like Trubisky's accuracy and calm demeanor and Watson impressed me with his grit in the Alabama game...really impressive leader in a huge game. When I watched Kizer he did not impress me but I didn't see his best games. I tend to watch Pac-12 games and he did not particularly play well against Stanford or USC.

Trubisky seems to have a better pocket presence than either Watson or Kizer but does he have escapability that would hold up in the NFL? Of all the QBs I've seen this year Darnold is the only one who made me think..."Wow, this guy has the knack!" But that was a couple of games...not enough to judge a QB, and he's not in the draft this year.

It's fascinating to me...doing some quick (maybe inaccurate) research, none of the top 5 QB's ran a pro-style offense. The ones in the top 20 who did are:
6 Brad Kaaya, QB, Miami Height: 6-4. Weight: 209
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTbq4GWmfbk
7 Jerod Evans, QB, Virginia Tech Height: 6-4. Weight: 235
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH-XOFJIzfg
9 Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss Height: 6-2. Weight: 215
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brc8kIZXjvs
10 Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw3Rw-sLby8
17 C.J. Beathard, QB, Iowa Height: 6-2. Weight: 219
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQJnaf8DTKk
18 Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota Height: 6-4. Weight: 230 (Full WCO)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKhlonmclwE

The current free agent QB's Kyle would like to have are (both pro-style):
Kirk Cousins, Michigan State Height: 6-3. Weight: 214 (4th Round)
Jimmy Garoppolo, E. Illinois Height: 6-2 Weight: 226 (2nd Round)

Ironically, the best looking of the bunch in terms of picturing in Shanahan's offense are the last three on that list.

If Kyle agrees, that opens up the #2 pick for all sorts of options (Myles Garrett or big time trade back).
[ Edited by NCommand on Feb 8, 2017 at 9:03 AM ]
Originally posted by Jcool:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Jcool:
sorry late to this one.

What is the Academy and it's relation to the 49ers with this comment ?

"In their scouting evaluations, the 49ers will create a separate competitiveness/toughness grade, to try and find players who love football the most."

http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/08/john-lynch-details-what-he-and-kyle-shanahans-first-big-project-will-be/

New 49ers GM John Lynch said the team will create an extra "competitiveness and toughness grade" in the hopes of finding prospects "who love football the most."

It is not a revolutionary concept, as it screams "coach speak" and is somewhat expected from a former player. We will never know how much this impacts the team's final decision, but you can surmise that the club will not draft players with questions around their passion for the game. The full interview is interesting, as Lynch adds the team's quarterback search could continue into 2018.

Source: KNBR
ok, I just heard Lynch's interview on KNBR. He said the Falcons used it and Donta Freeman was the highest rated for that the last 3 years ?

sounds good
Originally posted by NCommand:
It's fascinating to me...doing some quick (maybe inaccurate) research, none of the top 5 QB's ran a pro-style offense. The ones in the top 20 who did are:
6 Brad Kaaya, QB, Miami Height: 6-4. Weight: 209
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTbq4GWmfbk
7 Jerod Evans, QB, Virginia Tech Height: 6-4. Weight: 235
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH-XOFJIzfg
9 Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss Height: 6-2. Weight: 215
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brc8kIZXjvs
10 Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw3Rw-sLby8
17 C.J. Beathard, QB, Iowa Height: 6-2. Weight: 219
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQJnaf8DTKk
18 Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota Height: 6-4. Weight: 230 (Full WCO)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKhlonmclwE

The current free agent QB's Kyle would like to have are (both pro-style):
Kirk Cousins, Michigan State Height: 6-3. Weight: 214 (4th Round)
Jimmy Garoppolo, E. Illinois Height: 6-2 Weight: 226 (2nd Round)

Ironically, the best looking of the bunch in terms of picturing in Shanahan's offense are the last three on that list.

If Kyle agrees, that opens up the #2 pick for all sorts of options (Myles Garrett or big time trade back).

That would be fantastic and I believe not out of the question. I just don't see any of this year's group as being head and shoulders above the rest. Even though I like Trubisky and Watson...are they better than Peterman or Evans? Hard to say. I do trust Shanahan to pick good QBs though. Imagine being able to trade back for another second allowing the team to pick up--ILB Foster or WR Williams/Davis in the first; DE/OLB Lawson/TJ Watt and WRs Samuel/Westbrook in the second. Finally...Mahomes in the third. That could greatly help at four positions of need--QB, OLB, ILB and WR.
Originally posted by Jcool:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Jcool:
sorry late to this one.

What is the Academy and it's relation to the 49ers with this comment ?

"In their scouting evaluations, the 49ers will create a separate competitiveness/toughness grade, to try and find players who love football the most."

http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/08/john-lynch-details-what-he-and-kyle-shanahans-first-big-project-will-be/

New 49ers GM John Lynch said the team will create an extra "competitiveness and toughness grade" in the hopes of finding prospects "who love football the most."

It is not a revolutionary concept, as it screams "coach speak" and is somewhat expected from a former player. We will never know how much this impacts the team's final decision, but you can surmise that the club will not draft players with questions around their passion for the game. The full interview is interesting, as Lynch adds the team's quarterback search could continue into 2018.

Source: KNBR

And they used a picture of Solomon Thomas next to the blurb on Rotoworld.

[ Edited by ChaunceyGardner on Feb 8, 2017 at 9:26 AM ]
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Originally posted by NCommand:
It's fascinating to me...doing some quick (maybe inaccurate) research, none of the top 5 QB's ran a pro-style offense. The ones in the top 20 who did are:
6 Brad Kaaya, QB, Miami Height: 6-4. Weight: 209
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTbq4GWmfbk
7 Jerod Evans, QB, Virginia Tech Height: 6-4. Weight: 235
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH-XOFJIzfg
9 Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss Height: 6-2. Weight: 215
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brc8kIZXjvs
10 Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw3Rw-sLby8
17 C.J. Beathard, QB, Iowa Height: 6-2. Weight: 219
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQJnaf8DTKk
18 Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota Height: 6-4. Weight: 230 (Full WCO)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKhlonmclwE

The current free agent QB's Kyle would like to have are (both pro-style):
Kirk Cousins, Michigan State Height: 6-3. Weight: 214 (4th Round)
Jimmy Garoppolo, E. Illinois Height: 6-2 Weight: 226 (2nd Round)

Ironically, the best looking of the bunch in terms of picturing in Shanahan's offense are the last three on that list.

If Kyle agrees, that opens up the #2 pick for all sorts of options (Myles Garrett or big time trade back).

That would be fantastic and I believe not out of the question. I just don't see any of this year's group as being head and shoulders above the rest. Even though I like Trubisky and Watson...are they better than Peterman or Evans? Hard to say. I do trust Shanahan to pick good QBs though. Imagine being able to trade back for another second allowing the team to pick up--ILB Foster or WR Williams/Davis in the first; DE/OLB Lawson/TJ Watt and WRs Samuel/Westbrook in the second. Finally...Mahomes in the third. That could greatly help at four positions of need--QB, OLB, ILB and WR.

Here's, literally, a breakdown of what Kyle wants too...all put together from his own words:

Kyle Shanahan's Check Box for QB's: http://www.csnbayarea.com/49ers/kyle-shanahans-focus-soon-shifts-quarterback-evaluations
  • Pure thrower (natural throwing motion; born to throw; effortless; to where he doesn't have to think about it ever)
  • Fearless (against the rush; in the pocket; no hesitation; lets it rip)
  • Smart enough (handle the whole offense-WCO; handle it all under pressure)
  • Keeps his eyes downfield
  • Tough and hangs in the pocket
  • How he carries himself (leadership; likable)
  • Passion and determination
  • Can get rid of the ball fast (quick)
  • Quick processer (can go fast in the pocket; can think fast and react)
  • Natural feel of the game (automatic; feel and react)

Watching his offense under Kirk/Ryan, hard to argue against any of these points. This is EXACTLY what he's looking for...but like he says, that guy has to 1) be in the draft and 2) we have to be in position to go get him. That takes luck.

But then again, while everyone else is looking for the athletic QB's, he's looking for pro-style.
.. AND below are the list of JON LYNCH TYPE OF PLAYERS AND CHARACTERS that he would build this team around and be proud..

RB - Tobi Gerhart (will be signed to be our FB and to bring the Mike Alstott type of runner while the young team is trying to know one another)

1) Jonathan Allen; DE - Alabama (over the history of the league, ALL great defenses starts with a great DL)

2) Haasan Reddick; ILB - Temple (just like Hardy Nickerson, Bowman can only hold this for so long, Haasan will be Lynch's Derek Brooks)

3) Davis Webb; QB - Cal (If both Watson and Truby doesn't impress, then why pick a QB w/the 2nd overall)

4) Zay Jones; WR - East Carolina (no guarantee that he's a 1, but WR can be found in every draft)

4) Fabian Mareau; CB - UCLA (simply the most physical CB in the draft, in year 4, he can also be a FS that playes like the Bucs' 47)

5) Donnel Pumphrey; RB - San Diego State (Lynch wanted McCaffrey to be his Warrick Dunn, but Donnel wont be that far behind)

5) Ejuan Price; OLB - Pitt - (Baalke measured the size of the player from the outside, while Lynch meassure the motor and the heart)

6) Bryan Cox, Jr; - DE - Florida (The best thing about Cox Jr is that his father would not allow him to fail even as a pass rusher only)

6) Zach Banner; OG - USC (how can you go wrong with a 6th rounder who possess his size)

7) Darreus Rogers; WR - USC (another one of those guys who plays w/something to prove

7) Barry Sanders, JR; Oklahoma State (Still shock from the stop n go that Barry put on him, Lynch draft Barry Jr to exorcise the GHOST)
Originally posted by ChaunceyGardner:
Originally posted by Jcool:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Jcool:
sorry late to this one.

What is the Academy and it's relation to the 49ers with this comment ?

"In their scouting evaluations, the 49ers will create a separate competitiveness/toughness grade, to try and find players who love football the most."

http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/08/john-lynch-details-what-he-and-kyle-shanahans-first-big-project-will-be/

New 49ers GM John Lynch said the team will create an extra "competitiveness and toughness grade" in the hopes of finding prospects "who love football the most."

It is not a revolutionary concept, as it screams "coach speak" and is somewhat expected from a former player. We will never know how much this impacts the team's final decision, but you can surmise that the club will not draft players with questions around their passion for the game. The full interview is interesting, as Lynch adds the team's quarterback search could continue into 2018.

Source: KNBR

And they used a picture of Solomon Thomas next to the blurb on Rotoworld.


What about a haircut grade?
Originally posted by ChaunceyGardner:
Originally posted by Jcool:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Jcool:
sorry late to this one.

What is the Academy and it's relation to the 49ers with this comment ?

"In their scouting evaluations, the 49ers will create a separate competitiveness/toughness grade, to try and find players who love football the most."

http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/08/john-lynch-details-what-he-and-kyle-shanahans-first-big-project-will-be/

New 49ers GM John Lynch said the team will create an extra "competitiveness and toughness grade" in the hopes of finding prospects "who love football the most."

It is not a revolutionary concept, as it screams "coach speak" and is somewhat expected from a former player. We will never know how much this impacts the team's final decision, but you can surmise that the club will not draft players with questions around their passion for the game. The full interview is interesting, as Lynch adds the team's quarterback search could continue into 2018.

Source: KNBR

And they used a picture of Solomon Thomas next to the blurb on Rotoworld.


A Jarryd Hayne impersonator?
John Lynch: "you can tell when a guy is full of it. I believe you can. You can talk straight because you've been there. And I'm not just making this up, I'm telling you 'Here's what we need to see, and don't just tell me with your words, because we need to see it.' Had one of those conversations today. I think it is a huge advantage. You can talk all you want, but show up on the first day of camp in shape and then you'll be speaking to me."
Aaron Lynch?
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Originally posted by NCommand:
It's fascinating to me...doing some quick (maybe inaccurate) research, none of the top 5 QB's ran a pro-style offense. The ones in the top 20 who did are:
6 Brad Kaaya, QB, Miami Height: 6-4. Weight: 209
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTbq4GWmfbk
7 Jerod Evans, QB, Virginia Tech Height: 6-4. Weight: 235
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH-XOFJIzfg
9 Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss Height: 6-2. Weight: 215
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brc8kIZXjvs
10 Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Height: 6-2. Weight: 225
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw3Rw-sLby8
17 C.J. Beathard, QB, Iowa Height: 6-2. Weight: 219
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQJnaf8DTKk
18 Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota Height: 6-4. Weight: 230 (Full WCO)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKhlonmclwE

The current free agent QB's Kyle would like to have are (both pro-style):
Kirk Cousins, Michigan State Height: 6-3. Weight: 214 (4th Round)
Jimmy Garoppolo, E. Illinois Height: 6-2 Weight: 226 (2nd Round)

Ironically, the best looking of the bunch in terms of picturing in Shanahan's offense are the last three on that list.

If Kyle agrees, that opens up the #2 pick for all sorts of options (Myles Garrett or big time trade back).

That would be fantastic and I believe not out of the question. I just don't see any of this year's group as being head and shoulders above the rest. Even though I like Trubisky and Watson...are they better than Peterman or Evans? Hard to say. I do trust Shanahan to pick good QBs though. Imagine being able to trade back for another second allowing the team to pick up--ILB Foster or WR Williams/Davis in the first; DE/OLB Lawson/TJ Watt and WRs Samuel/Westbrook in the second. Finally...Mahomes in the third. That could greatly help at four positions of need--QB, OLB, ILB and WR.

Here's, literally, a breakdown of what Kyle wants too...all put together from his own words:

Kyle Shanahan's Check Box for QB's: http://www.csnbayarea.com/49ers/kyle-shanahans-focus-soon-shifts-quarterback-evaluations
  • Pure thrower (natural throwing motion; born to throw; effortless; to where he doesn't have to think about it ever)
  • Fearless (against the rush; in the pocket; no hesitation; lets it rip)
  • Smart enough (handle the whole offense-WCO; handle it all under pressure)
  • Keeps his eyes downfield
  • Tough and hangs in the pocket
  • How he carries himself (leadership; likable)
  • Passion and determination
  • Can get rid of the ball fast (quick)
  • Quick processer (can go fast in the pocket; can think fast and react)
  • Natural feel of the game (automatic; feel and react)

Watching his offense under Kirk/Ryan, hard to argue against any of these points. This is EXACTLY what he's looking for...but like he says, that guy has to 1) be in the draft and 2) we have to be in position to go get him. That takes luck.

But then again, while everyone else is looking for the athletic QB's, he's looking for pro-style.

Im not so sure he doesn't want an athletic qb. They drafted rg3 second overall in Washington. Im pretty sure he had some say in that decision. Rg3 ran for over 800 yds that 2012 rookie season with 7 Tds. How much of that was designed or just natural ability I couldn't say. But I can say he looked damn good with Shanahan as his OC.

For the season, Griffin set records for highest passer rating by a rookie quarterback (102.4) and highest touchdown to interception ratio (4:1) (Both since broken by Dak Prescott). Aside from the week 15 game against the Cleveland Browns where he did not play, Griffin played a vital role in helping the Redskins finish the regular season on a 7-game winning streak after starting the season 3–6, leading the team to its first playoff appearance since the 2007 season.
[ Edited by JBrack on Feb 8, 2017 at 10:10 AM ]
Originally posted by Sourball:
John Lynch: "you can tell when a guy is full of it. I believe you can. You can talk straight because you've been there. And I'm not just making this up, I'm telling you 'Here's what we need to see, and don't just tell me with your words, because we need to see it.' Had one of those conversations today. I think it is a huge advantage. You can talk all you want, but show up on the first day of camp in shape and then you'll be speaking to me."
Aaron Lynch?

No joke when I heard the weight comment that was the first thing that I thought. He could have been using a general example but I don't think so.
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