John Lynch - 49ers GM

Originally posted by PacTiger:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NinerGM:

I'm not reaching at all - I'm taking what Silver has said and directly saying in context what he stated. I think the Lynch "test" was easy because the leaks stopped when someone left, but that's just my opinion based on what I've been reading. The media is always going to report rumors. It's not possible to have a 100% information blackout in the NFL. Silver says this at 6:55 in the link you provided. The league is too small and someone is going to know something. The huge difference for me between a leak and a rumor is the exmaple I provided about how Kelly was fired.

I see. I define a leak differently...to me, any information heading out to the media, no matter the purpose or intent behind it, is a leak. Whether it's Jedaraag at the start of a HC/GM search to make us look more attractive or a water boy who overheard a conversation and wanted to get paid, it's all a leak to me. That's why these sources remain anonymous. Even the articles that are written by King are built on inside sources and information. It comes from somewhere. I'm just saying most of it is done with a purpose and intent.

The only way to know if the leaks are gone with baalke is if they actually stop from here on out. Just because lynch wasn't leaked doesn't mean whoever was leaking in the past is now gone. For all we know the leaks could have been from multiple people for multiple reasons. The only things we know for certain is that the leaks didn't originate from lynch or shanny.

Baalke has been gone a while...leaks still happening until Lynch put them both on test.

All I care about now is that they stop going forward. And that Jed and Paraag have made the correct hires and are bowing out...no longer meddling or assisting with hard stances on football decisions.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NinerGM:

I would disagree because as Silver points out, with the player trade example, the person leaking the information has an agenda for the leak. Right? My point in all of this, and as you point out in the next bolded section, we don't know who's doing the leaking. Your assertion is that it's Paraag and Jed, my assertion is that it was Baalke. Maybe it's somewhere in the middle. Even Silver says it may not be either and someone else may be leaking the information. Regardless, we don't know the source. However when someone goes on the record and says "x" you don't have to wonder about source.

Your claim is "the organization feeds" and that's not what Silver is saying for every rumor that comes out about a team.

I think you're reaching a bit here. The guy is telling you straight up he's being fed by the 49ers.

I think the Lynch test flat out confirmed WHO is leaking the most...sure a secretary here or there could leak too. It happens.

The funny thing is that media still knew there was a third secret candidate. So they aren't even THAT good at keeping info under wraps even when trying their best to control it...or perhaps they threw the media a bone and just noted they won't reveal who it is...but, "Shhhh."

Leaking and feeding the media is standard.

To think Baalke would create his own smear campaign minutes after being fired is laughable. Who else would it be? Has he run to the media to leak his story...set the record straight? Of course not.

The dude may have been the devil but he was Jed and Paraag's devil.

How the hell do you think any of the local or national reporters get their info? Through leaks. Of course the niners have been a bit excessive but it's just ridiculous when people act like this doesn't happen everywhere.

Originally posted by NinerGM:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by NinerGM:
I'm sorry bud but you've been reading too much WooLick because this just isn't true.

John didn't bring Paraag in, Terry Donahue did because he wanted to create a system of selecting good players because he states as a quote, he wasn't good at selecting players like Walsh was. The analytics was an attempt to help the team. John York didn't bring in Marathe. It was Donahue's idea.

Second a lot has changed on this team since 2006.

And the ACLs - I mean no mention of Baalke? Like not even a little here? That can't be right. Now I'm supposed to believe it was all Paraag telling Baalke to get ACL players and he wasn't the real GM?

So you're trying to tell me Paraag's moneyball tactics and meddling didn't clash with Bill Walsh, Jim Harbaugh and promoted several direct questions from John Lynch on his specific role and leaks? Call me skeptical but moneyball seems to be the foundation of our team since York took over.

As to Baalke and ACL's...just stating that tactic seemed to fit that moneyball mindset too. And he's an idiot for not only subscribing to it but sticking to it for so long. He absolutely deserved to be fired for a variety of reasons. Did he get promoted and stay as long as he did because he had a similar mindset of Jed/Paraag/Brian?

Probably...but I'm just speculating. After all, they are the true trigger men.

I'm saying DO what John Lynch said: do your homework but form you own opinion. I encourage everyone to do that. I'm simply saying, I know what I don't know. That's it. This was my first post. I RE-FUSE to be put into two camps of "he's innocent" or "he's evil incarnate with deity powers". You know me better than that bud, I think it's somewhere between that and there's a whole lot I don't know. There's so much I don't know that I can't CONCLUSIVELY SAY Paraag is the at fault and Gase and Lynch are now mouthpieces of the organization or what Kawakami called "Jedbots" simply because those two have their own opinion based on what they know (which is is way more than us).

Sure a "moneyball" mindeset might seem to like Baalke - but that's assuming you know that Baalke not only agreed with it but that (1) Paraag pushed it (2) Baalke liked it and pushed it and (3) coaches accepted without question. That's too much assumption for me especially when Peter King has gone on record to say, Baalke was unilateral in his decisions and barred coaches from attending the Combine. If anything the verdict isn't settled on something like that but I do know what I don't know.

When the hell did we hire Adam Gase?

Originally posted by ComeOnDeberg:
When the hell did we hire Adam Gase?

not hired, but Gase proved what was really going on in the FO

Originally posted by NCommand:

As far as media goes...IMHO...they are ALL working together and off each other. I see it daily in our news feed. One guy brings up a topic and five minutes later there are 8 articles on the same topic...good copy, bad cop. I'm skeptical even of my boys MB and MM. Why? I remember one of them explaining how they were restricted on what they could or couldn't report on as instructed by the team.

Its called news... Thats what reporters do, they report the news.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Money ball can mean many things and be used differently be various coaches/managers. For instance, I believe they have used value formulas for each position and units. They tried to keep the balance so they would not have to short one area by overpaying another. But when you have elite players, at any position it can skew your balance. Having Willis, J Smith, A Smith and Bowman on the defensive front meant that DBs had to be more reasonable.

Where I believed the system broke down is with the offense, paying three first round OL picks and several other high picks when the line could not pass block effectively was out of kilter. It meant the QB didn't have time to wait for the understaffed WRs to break free. Some coaches could have created an offense that would work under these circumstances, but obviously the niners did not have them.

A coach like Belichick doesn't need stars to create an effective defense or offense. Brady is the only consistent on the team over the years, which tells us how important a FQB is/will be. He has an advantage because when you are on top FAs want to join your team, so when he loses a key player he can fill the spot easily. The niners are not in that position so they will need to build back as best they can. I really hope they can bring in several QB for Shanahan to work with or we'll be back to square one in a couple of years.

True. Every team has analytics and run fibers of money ball across their company. The difference is in the influence and power and how much they are pushed.

Extremes like the A's and Cleveland exist. Other teams lean far less on it (sounds like Lynch leans more this direction).

When you're talking about a York-run company, a full analytics department and your #1 analytics guy as the EVP of Football Operations, it can lead one to question how much power and influence he actually has had this whole time. When he's BFF's with the CEO and a second family member to the Yorks, well...

Originally posted by JBrack:

Originally posted by NCommand:
As far as media goes...IMHO...they are ALL working together and off each other. I see it daily in our news feed. One guy brings up a topic and five minutes later there are 8 articles on the same topic...good copy, bad cop. I'm skeptical even of my boys MB and MM. Why? I remember one of them explaining how they were restricted on what they could or couldn't report on as instructed by the team.

Its called news... Thats what reporters do, they report the news.

Some better than others. Some report conjecture, others report things they know are happening. Huge difference. When a sourse says something off the record it becomes murky and that is the beginning of leaks.

Originally posted by Niners418:

How the hell do you think any of the local or national reporters get their info? Through leaks. Of course the niners have been a bit excessive but it's just ridiculous when people act like this doesn't happen everywhere.

Isn't that what I just said? People are acting like the leaks have stopped with Baalke out. As if he was the culprit. Just not true.

With any leak, always ask, who's going to benefit the most from it. That's probably the source.

Anyone who still needs convincing, go listen to the 20 minute Murph & Mac KNBR interview with Lynch. Youll be all in after hearing that.

He has some great, Bay Area centric stories. He was drafted in the 2nd round (66th overall) of the expansion Florida Marlins in the 1992 MLB draft. The 2nd ever draft pick in Marlins history. He was a mediocre QB at Stanford, so he had fully committed to playing baseball after he was drafted.

Bill Walsh took over as Stanford football coach, and called Lynch in to talk before he made any final decisions. He told Lynch "I think you should stay here and play football. I want to convert you to S, and I believe you have the abilities to become a Hall of Fame level NFL S." So he stayed with football.

Durinf his brief stint in the Marlins minor league system, he was roommates with a 17 year old Edgar Renteria, and was asked to look out for him.

Fun fact, for 49ers GM Scot McCloughan was also drafted in the 1992 MLB draft by the Toronto Blue Jays. Weird coincidence.

How did Steve Young feel about the Tomsula hiring? I want to know if his praise and optimism is legitimate or if he's just gushing us as a fan/former player.

Originally posted by NCommand:
True. Every team has analytics and run fibers of money ball across their company. The difference is in the influence and power and how much they are pushed.

Extremes like the A's and Cleveland exist. Other teams lean far less on it (sounds like Lynch leans more this direction).

When you're talking about a York-run company, a full analytics department and your #1 analytics guy as the EVP of Football Operations, it can lead one to question how much power and influence he actually has had this whole time. When he's BFF's with the CEO and a second family member to the Yorks, well...

Yes, I'm not a huge fan of analytics other than as a tool for managers to use. Lynch called it just that and I hope he uses his knowledge/intuition as much or more than analytics. The problems start when you have an analytics guy with an ear of the owner overruling or short circuiting the GM. If that happens it can become a very dysfunctional system. Paraag's power in the organization is still worrisome to me and I really want Lynch to have a chance without having Jed and Paraag looking over his shoulder every time he turns around.

Originally posted by Niners99:
Anyone who still needs convincing, go listen to the 20 minute Murph & Mac KNBR interview with Lynch. Youll be all in after hearing that.

He has some great, Bay Area centric stories. He was drafted in the 2nd round (66th overall) of the expansion Florida Marlins in the 1992 MLB draft. The 2nd ever draft pick in Marlins history. He was a mediocre QB at Stanford, so he had fully committed to playing baseball after he was drafted.

Bill Walsh took over as Stanford football coach, and called Lynch in to talk before he made any final decisions. He told Lynch "I think you should stay here and play football. I want to convert you to S, and I believe you have the abilities to become a Hall of Fame level NFL S." So he stayed with football.

Durinf his brief stint in the Marlins minor league system, he was roommates with a 17 year old Edgar Renteria, and was asked to look out for him.

Fun fact, for 49ers GM Scot McCloughan was also drafted in the 1992 MLB draft by the Toronto Blue Jays. Weird coincidence.

Cool stories, but I see no relevance how all that translates to him being the GM to rebuild the franchise. I'm not going all in because he has cool stories. Everyone has cool stories.

How hard is it to just pick guys off a draft board after googling a top 100 players list?

You guys make this job sound like its quantum physics sometimes.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Anyone who still needs convincing, go listen to the 20 minute Murph & Mac KNBR interview with Lynch. Youll be all in after hearing that.

He has some great, Bay Area centric stories. He was drafted in the 2nd round (66th overall) of the expansion Florida Marlins in the 1992 MLB draft. The 2nd ever draft pick in Marlins history. He was a mediocre QB at Stanford, so he had fully committed to playing baseball after he was drafted.

Bill Walsh took over as Stanford football coach, and called Lynch in to talk before he made any final decisions. He told Lynch "I think you should stay here and play football. I want to convert you to S, and I believe you have the abilities to become a Hall of Fame level NFL S." So he stayed with football.

Durinf his brief stint in the Marlins minor league system, he was roommates with a 17 year old Edgar Renteria, and was asked to look out for him.

Fun fact, for 49ers GM Scot McCloughan was also drafted in the 1992 MLB draft by the Toronto Blue Jays. Weird coincidence.

Cool stories, but I see no relevance how all that translates to him being the GM to rebuild the franchise. I'm not going all in because he has cool stories. Everyone has cool stories.

I never said the stories were the thing that would convince you.

Go listen to the interview.