John Lynch - 49ers GM

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Well, assuming things go well, JL will be very close to restocking the entire shootin' match. A lot rides on what Az does but whether we get Bosa who is a DE or draft Allen who can play DE ,or drafts Q, who will Then require a 2nd tier DE be drafted probably in rd 2, we will have taken care of passrush. Next is OG/S depending on BPA. Then get the other with next pick. After that a CB, an OG and OT for the pipeline, and his job of a total rebuild will just about be complete.

In UDFA, AAF, kyle can find another WR

What amazes me is that JL detractors fail to Recognize that he has virtually rebuilt an entire team, like 43 different players. Why is that?

Granted, he has to nail this draft...but the first 3 or 4 players are going to be pretty straight forward. The only thing he can't do is let one of the 3 blue chippers somehow evade us. That is the only caveat.

Probably because the results haven't changed. 10 wins over the last two seasons combined.

Originally posted by captveg:
1st Round picks during Bill Walsh era (1979-1988):

1979 - None
1980 - Earl Cooper, Jim Stuckey
1981 - Ronnie Lott
1982 - None
1983 - None
1984 - Todd Shell
1985 - Jerry Rice
1986 - None
1987 - Harris Barton, Terrence Flagler
1988 - None

7 1st rounders in 10 years. 2 HOFs (Lott, Rice), 1 10-year starter (Barton), 2 role players for ~5 years (Cooper, Stuckey), 1 player with one mediocre sophomore season before busting (Shell), and 1 outright bust (Flagler).

Hitting on 1st round picks is best, but not the only way to build winners.

Also, TIL Jesse Sapolu was an 11th round pick.

Walsh was a great teacher developing talent. I have zero faith in Saleh and his coaching staff and Kyle while a proven coach has over extended himself IMO having to cover for his idot DC while running the entire offense and having to wear the HC hat.

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by captveg:
1st Round picks during Bill Walsh era (1979-1988):

1979 - None
1980 - Earl Cooper, Jim Stuckey
1981 - Ronnie Lott
1982 - None
1983 - None
1984 - Todd Shell
1985 - Jerry Rice
1986 - None
1987 - Harris Barton, Terrence Flagler
1988 - None

7 1st rounders in 10 years. 2 HOFs (Lott, Rice), 1 10-year starter (Barton), 2 role players for ~5 years (Cooper, Stuckey), 1 player with one mediocre sophomore season before busting (Shell), and 1 outright bust (Flagler).

Hitting on 1st round picks is best, but not the only way to build winners.

Also, TIL Jesse Sapolu was an 11th round pick.

Walsh was a great teacher developing talent. I have zero faith in Saleh and his coaching staff and Kyle while a proven coach has over extended himself IMO having to cover for his idot DC while running the entire offense and having to wear the HC hat.

Idot DC, eh?

Walsh didn't look like he was teaching his defense much after two seasons, either. Took an overhaul of the secondary and an increase in talent. The old adage of being able to scheme offense but flat out needing talent on defense is essentially true.

Also, in today's NFL even the best defenses are going to give up a ton of yards in the air. It's simply the way the rules have been tilted. Gotta get those sacks and turnovers.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by captveg:
1st Round picks during Bill Walsh era (1979-1988):

1979 - None
1980 - Earl Cooper, Jim Stuckey
1981 - Ronnie Lott
1982 - None
1983 - None
1984 - Todd Shell
1985 - Jerry Rice
1986 - None
1987 - Harris Barton, Terrence Flagler
1988 - None

7 1st rounders in 10 years. 2 HOFs (Lott, Rice), 1 10-year starter (Barton), 2 role players for ~5 years (Cooper, Stuckey), 1 player with one mediocre sophomore season before busting (Shell), and 1 outright bust (Flagler).

Hitting on 1st round picks is best, but not the only way to build winners.

Also, TIL Jesse Sapolu was an 11th round pick.

Walsh was a great teacher developing talent. I have zero faith in Saleh and his coaching staff and Kyle while a proven coach has over extended himself IMO having to cover for his idot DC while running the entire offense and having to wear the HC hat.

Idot DC, eh?

Walsh didn't look like he was teaching his defense much after two seasons, either. Took an overhaul of the secondary and an increase in talent. The old adage of being able to scheme offense but flat out needing talent on defense is essentially true.

Also, in today's NFL even the best defenses are going to give up a ton of yards in the air. It's simply the way the rules have been tilted. Gotta get those sacks and turnovers.

Is this an attempt to defend Saleh? His rotations have been awful...his defense has two seasons in a row forgotten how to tackle in the offseason. He calls the wrong plays at the wrong times...and he doesn't help them when he F's up like the Packers game last year when Foster was asked to cover two WR's one of which was D.Adams 5 yards from the end zone and this was not a one time issue. Then there are they young players that have regressed in his system. Lets also talk about the lack of those half time adjustments.

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by captveg:

1st Round picks during Bill Walsh era (1979-1988):

1979 - None
1980 - Earl Cooper, Jim Stuckey
1981 - Ronnie Lott
1982 - None
1983 - None
1984 - Todd Shell
1985 - Jerry Rice
1986 - None
1987 - Harris Barton, Terrence Flagler
1988 - None

7 1st rounders in 10 years. 2 HOFs (Lott, Rice), 1 10-year starter (Barton), 2 role players for ~5 years (Cooper, Stuckey), 1 player with one mediocre sophomore season before busting (Shell), and 1 outright bust (Flagler).

Hitting on 1st round picks is best, but not the only way to build winners.

Also, TIL Jesse Sapolu was an 11th round pick.

Walsh was a great teacher developing talent. I have zero faith in Saleh and his coaching staff and Kyle while a proven coach has over extended himself IMO having to cover for his idot DC while running the entire offense and having to wear the HC hat.

When you lose justin, Willis, bowman and you dont replace them or have an understudy waiting in the wings - its difficult to build a defense in one offseason cycle. Give Saleh bosa or Allen and I'm betting Paso's lunch money you'll see a better defense.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by captveg:
1st Round picks during Bill Walsh era (1979-1988):

1979 - None
1980 - Earl Cooper, Jim Stuckey
1981 - Ronnie Lott
1982 - None
1983 - None
1984 - Todd Shell
1985 - Jerry Rice
1986 - None
1987 - Harris Barton, Terrence Flagler
1988 - None

7 1st rounders in 10 years. 2 HOFs (Lott, Rice), 1 10-year starter (Barton), 2 role players for ~5 years (Cooper, Stuckey), 1 player with one mediocre sophomore season before busting (Shell), and 1 outright bust (Flagler).

Hitting on 1st round picks is best, but not the only way to build winners.

Also, TIL Jesse Sapolu was an 11th round pick.

Walsh was a great teacher developing talent. I have zero faith in Saleh and his coaching staff and Kyle while a proven coach has over extended himself IMO having to cover for his idot DC while running the entire offense and having to wear the HC hat.

When you lose justin, Willis, bowman and you dont replace them or have an understudy waiting in the wings - its difficult to build a defense in one offseason cycle. Give Saleh bosa or Allen and I'm betting Paso's lunch money you'll see a better defense.

I'll believe it when I see it...as of today he's left us with clear expectations of his Defense.

I feel like whatever we do, who ever we take in the 1st round.

Lynch is gonna say "We got our guy" "We got what we wanted"

Am i wrong or am i right?

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by captveg:
1st Round picks during Bill Walsh era (1979-1988):

1979 - None
1980 - Earl Cooper, Jim Stuckey
1981 - Ronnie Lott
1982 - None
1983 - None
1984 - Todd Shell
1985 - Jerry Rice
1986 - None
1987 - Harris Barton, Terrence Flagler
1988 - None

7 1st rounders in 10 years. 2 HOFs (Lott, Rice), 1 10-year starter (Barton), 2 role players for ~5 years (Cooper, Stuckey), 1 player with one mediocre sophomore season before busting (Shell), and 1 outright bust (Flagler).

Hitting on 1st round picks is best, but not the only way to build winners.

Also, TIL Jesse Sapolu was an 11th round pick.

Walsh was a great teacher developing talent. I have zero faith in Saleh and his coaching staff and Kyle while a proven coach has over extended himself IMO having to cover for his idot DC while running the entire offense and having to wear the HC hat.

Idot DC, eh?

Walsh didn't look like he was teaching his defense much after two seasons, either. Took an overhaul of the secondary and an increase in talent. The old adage of being able to scheme offense but flat out needing talent on defense is essentially true.

Also, in today's NFL even the best defenses are going to give up a ton of yards in the air. It's simply the way the rules have been tilted. Gotta get those sacks and turnovers.

Is this an attempt to defend Saleh? His rotations have been awful...his defense has two seasons in a row forgotten how to tackle in the offseason. He calls the wrong plays at the wrong times...and he doesn't help them when he F's up like the Packers game last year when Foster was asked to cover two WR's one of which was D.Adams 5 yards from the end zone and this was not a one time issue. Then there are they young players that have regressed in his system. Lets also talk about the lack of those half time adjustments.

I wasn't defending Saleh so much as I was saying defensive coaches have less value in today's NFL overall. Give me an idiot DC coach and world class defensive talent over a brilliant DC and mediocre/poor defensive talent that is "coached up" any day. Obviously having the brilliant DC and the awesome talent is ideal. But a brilliant OC can do more with less than a brilliant DC can.

Saleh? He's whatever. I don't see him as great or terrible, but rather middle of the road. The options out there to replace him are not exactly getting me excited, so I'll see what happens with another talent boost (and some assistant defensive coaching changes) in 2019.

Originally posted by KittleMeThis:
I feel like whatever we do, who ever we take in the 1st round.

Lynch is gonna say "We got our guy" "We got what we wanted"

Am i wrong or am i right?

Why would they ever say anything different? Every bust that has ever been drafted was that team's "guy".

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by KittleMeThis:

I feel like whatever we do, who ever we take in the 1st round.

Lynch is gonna say "We got our guy" "We got what we wanted"

Am i wrong or am i right?

Why would they ever say anything different? Every bust that has ever been drafted was that team's "guy".

Not only why but how could anybody do that. I just don't see any way you could say he wasn't somebody you wanted to draft and not generate a lot of negative press.

I also believe him, no way you say these next 15 guys On this draft board suck but let's go ahead and pick him. You pick the next best player on your board and by pass those guys even if it's a reach.

Originally posted by captveg:
Idot DC, eh?

Walsh didn't look like he was teaching his defense much after two seasons, either. Took an overhaul of the secondary and an increase in talent. The old adage of being able to scheme offense but flat out needing talent on defense is essentially true.

Also, in today's NFL even the best defenses are going to give up a ton of yards in the air. It's simply the way the rules have been tilted. Gotta get those sacks and turnovers.

Yup. Walsh was literally bringing in scrubs for those first two years. And then came 81 when drafted Lott and the bunch. Good times be had after that.

Originally posted by KittleSkittle:
How can you say he ignored the edge position when he traded for Dee Ford?

I LOVED the Ford move but up until year 5 the Chiefs didn't even know if he was good. He was alot like an Arik Armstead if Arik Armstead has a big year this year in that he flashed but was super injury prone and got off to a terrible start. In addition to that you still need 2 starting DE's and DE's are a premium position. Taking Bosa not only gives us 2 great starters at the most premium position that don't overlap (like QW would with Buck/Solly/Armstead) it also gives us insurance if Dee Ford turns out to be a flash in the pan and can't stay healthy.

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:

Well, assuming things go well, JL will be very close to restocking the entire shootin' match. A lot rides on what Az does but whether we get Bosa who is a DE or draft Allen who can play DE ,or drafts Q, who will Then require a 2nd tier DE be drafted probably in rd 2, we will have taken care of passrush. Next is OG/S depending on BPA. Then get the other with next pick. After that a CB, an OG and OT for the pipeline, and his job of a total rebuild will just about be complete.

In UDFA, AAF, kyle can find another WR

What amazes me is that JL detractors fail to Recognize that he has virtually rebuilt an entire team, like 43 different players. Why is that?

Granted, he has to nail this draft...but the first 3 or 4 players are going to be pretty straight forward. The only thing he can't do is let one of the 3 blue chippers somehow evade us. That is the only caveat.

Probably because the results haven't changed. 10 wins over the last two seasons combined.

I suppose, but there wasn't much you could blame him for in year one, year two you lost the franchise QB three games in, your major offensive acquisition in pre season and it only got worse from there. You can put some blame on him for the injuries I suppose but he addressed that by firing the conditioning coach. Has he made all good decisions? Nah...but his batting average is pretty good for a rookie GM. This year will be a big indicator of what we really have.

Originally posted by 49oz2superbowl:

Originally posted by KittleSkittle:

How can you say he ignored the edge position when he traded for Dee Ford?

I LOVED the Ford move but up until year 5 the Chiefs didn't even know if he was good. He was alot like an Arik Armstead if Arik Armstead has a big year this year in that he flashed but was super injury prone and got off to a terrible start. In addition to that you still need 2 starting DE's and DE's are a premium position. Taking Bosa not only gives us 2 great starters at the most premium position that don't overlap (like QW would with Buck/Solly/Armstead) it also gives us insurance if Dee Ford turns out to be a flash in the pan and can't stay healthy.

And you can't undervalue how much more likely Ford isn't a flash in the pan if he has a quality player on the opposite edge. How do you double team Buck, Ford and Bosa? One of those guys is seeing a steady diet of 1v1

Originally posted by PhillyNiner:

Originally posted by 49oz2superbowl:

Originally posted by KittleSkittle:
How can you say he ignored the edge position when he traded for Dee Ford?

I LOVED the Ford move but up until year 5 the Chiefs didn't even know if he was good. He was alot like an Arik Armstead if Arik Armstead has a big year this year in that he flashed but was super injury prone and got off to a terrible start. In addition to that you still need 2 starting DE's and DE's are a premium position. Taking Bosa not only gives us 2 great starters at the most premium position that don't overlap (like QW would with Buck/Solly/Armstead) it also gives us insurance if Dee Ford turns out to be a flash in the pan and can't stay healthy.

And you can't undervalue how much more likely Ford isn't a flash in the pan if he has a quality player on the opposite edge. How do you double team Buck, Ford and Bosa? One of those guys is seeing a steady diet of 1v1

Bingo.