Week 8 2015: Thoughts after rewatching the game... | Page 3

Marvin49 · 2015-11-02T09:32:01-08:00

I have to admit...I'm usually pretty good at rewatching these games and coming away feeling better...but it's getting harder and harder. 1) Kap: Again (broken record) he didn't play well, but given the dysfunction around him (and possibly because of him...more on that later) it's impossible to put this all on him. Yeah, I see that some teammates want him benched. Not in that camp...yet.... Not seeing Torrey wide open is kinda damning tho. I guess my hesitation in benching Kap is that I don't really get what it would solve. He's either the guy going forward or he's not. Him being on the bench doesn't help make that argument one way or the other. All it would do is show how bad Gabbert is and actually make people long for Kap again. At least that's what I think will happen. Gabbert might play better for a bit...but Gabberts biggest weakness was that he because coimpletely non-functional under pressure...and now peeps want to put him behind THAT line? 2) Chryst: So this one is really about both Kap and Chryst...and the O in general. I know people hate Chryst and have hated him since the day one. I'm not going to defend him per se, but I think it should be pointed out that he's in a really rough spot. He's got a line that can't run or pass block, a QB who's completely shell-shocked, down his best WR who runs 4.8-4.9 on a good day, and yesterday was down to his 5th RB. How do you call an offense under those conditions? You simplify for the QB, but then the D just sits on the routes. I see him dialing up the same simply plays time after time hoping for a better result and ordinarily that would drive me nuts...but what are his other options? So many parts not functioning correctly...at some point the players need to make the damn plays. Now I'm not saying Chryst has been great...but I actually feel for the guy. What the hell is he supposed to do when his line can't block, his QB has become completely risk averse and terrified of his own shadow and he's down his best skill position players? Yikes. He thought he had it bad when Leaf was his QB. 3) O-Line: I don't know that I can say something here that I haven't already said in just about every other "Thoughts" thread. They suck. Plain and simple. They aren't getting better. They won't get better till different players are playing. 4) Mike Davis: I actually like the guy and he got no help. Still though...he needs to make SOME of those guys miss in the backfield. I realize it's a tall order with that line, but come on man...you gotta make someone miss. 5) Dawson: Good for the old man...still getting it done as a kicker AND had a 47 yard punt. 6) Vernon: Bye Vernon. Yer done. If he's not traded, he's gone in the offseason. Shadow of his former self. Doesn't even appear to try to break tackles. Goes out of bounds without much of a fight. Was never a great TE in the classic sense (mismatch nightmare, but never really filled the TE "find and open spot and be the QBs best friend" role) and now that his skillset is declining...he's next to useless. 7) Defense: Again played good enough to win. To bad the offense is so horrifically bad. No pressure again but outside of the breakdowns on the 71 yard Gurley run (this just in: he's good) they played fairly well against the run. What can I say...baby steps. 8) Tartt: Was nice to see him out there getting some experience. I don't think Bethea will be back so I think that injury is a blessing in disguise. This year is lost. Might as well get those young guys some playing time so they are more ready next year. That should be the theme of everything...get the young guys in there. Armstead. Thomas. Hell, how is Smelter doing in his rehab? Gotta get these guys in there with some playing time so they aren't rookies all over again next year. 9) Bush: I feel for the guy...but all I was thinking when he want down was "seriously"? I don't yet know the extent of it, but man...time to retire Reggie. 10) Draft: Looks like I'll be looking at draft eligible players pretty early this year.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:07 AM

#31

JoeBart324
Veteran
Posts: 965

Originally posted by thl408:
All the factors contributing to the anemic offense blend together. But the ones that leap out to me is Kap having tunnel vision, and the piss poor pass/run blocking. Let me know if you disagree with those two weaknesses I mentioned. So what does an OC do to account for these two weaknesses? He calls simple route combinations that are easier to defend.

What is it that you would like to see more of? Please don't say 'slants and screens'.

Seems every quick pass yesterday was batted down. Screen passes aren't working because it seems the o-line doesn't know how to chip or slightly slow down a defender so Kap has a guy in his face before the screen receiver turns around. Geep is indeed in a tough spot.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:09 AM

#32

Blindfury
Veteran
Posts: 5,663

Originally posted by thl408:
All the factors contributing to the anemic offense blend together. But the ones that leap out to me is Kap having tunnel vision, and the piss poor pass/run blocking. Let me know if you disagree with those two weaknesses I mentioned. So what does an OC do to account for these two weaknesses? He calls simple route combinations that are easier to defend.

What is it that you would like to see more of? Please don't say 'slants and screens'.

He is under constant pressure, that is textbook what happens to QBs..especially young ones. I'd like to see Devey and Pears replaced. I'd also see who on the team can play center. Stop running to the right side for one thing and call more blitz beaters. Have a better gameplan. You can't tell me Geep has done a good job and his hands are tired by personnel. He has never shown ability as a good OC...ever.

Address the Oline and guarantee you we'll see better play.

[ Edited by Blindfury on Nov 2, 2015 at 10:10 AM ]

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:11 AM

#33

bzborow1
Veteran
Posts: 3,524

Originally posted by Blindfury:
Originally posted by Black24Razor:
At this point what does Gabbert bring to the table with this O-Line? Any QB is going to get killed back there.

I think people forgot what Gabbert looked like against a better oline. They also forgot about the scouting report on him. He is not good under pressure. A trainwreck, really. So, you start Gabbert behind the Oline. How does this help the team in any way? We know Gabbert is not a starter. He simply is not. So the worst thing that can happen is he starts a few games, wins...and the staff keeps their jobs because the "problem" was Kaep all along. Then we see later that Gabbert isn't the guy, staff is fired mid season and plans to rebuild get pushed back.

The other scenario is Gabbert is complete trash or gets hurt and they have to trot out the guy with no confidence.

The best thing to do is replace Devey and Pears with anyone, leave Kaep in...lose games, evaluate, start from complete scratch next year after you do a complete house cleaning.

Nobody LIKES the idea of starting Gabbert, the issue is twofold. Kaepernick's contract has guarantees only for injury so to trot him out there if you've decided you're moving on is risky for the 49ers going forward. Also, considering how bad Kaepernick has been recently it seems reasonable to ask whether or not starting Gabbert can do something to kickstart what has been a dreadful offense. As far as QBs performance under pressure, Before criticizing Gabbert, have you looked at Kaepernick's numbers?

If you as a coach don't do something and bench the guy for those performances, what message is that sending the team about the acceptability of bad play?

[ Edited by bzborow1 on Nov 2, 2015 at 10:12 AM ]

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:11 AM

#34

Marvin49
Hall of Fame
Posts: 16,506

Originally posted by BuZzB05:
Hey Marvin..

We should saying.. You've fired! Why are you involved with Seahawks forums. You gave with Seahawks forums fans about discuss. They are better than us.

I don't speak whatever language this is.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:11 AM

#35

thl408
Moderator
Posts: 33,315

Originally posted by JoeBart324:

Originally posted by thl408:
All the factors contributing to the anemic offense blend together. But the ones that leap out to me is Kap having tunnel vision, and the piss poor pass/run blocking. Let me know if you disagree with those two weaknesses I mentioned. So what does an OC do to account for these two weaknesses? He calls simple route combinations that are easier to defend.

What is it that you would like to see more of? Please don't say 'slants and screens'.

Seems every quick pass yesterday was batted down. Screen passes aren't working because it seems the o-line doesn't know how to chip or slightly slow down a defender so Kap has a guy in his face before the screen receiver turns around. Geep is indeed in a tough spot.

Right on. That's what a good (or any) defense does. If an offense keeps calling 3 step drops, then the DL will adjust and get hands up into the passing lanes. About this STL game, I thought there were some instances where Kap had time on 5 step drops and didn't pull the trigger. Can't tell if no one is open or Kap needed to see more separation. I will report back on this.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:12 AM

#36

Blindfury
Veteran
Posts: 5,663

Originally posted by jogr49:
Trade what you are not going forward with. Including Kaep, VD, Boldin, etc. can the entire staff at bye week. Can Baalke. Hire consultants for football operation. Lets get some good talent at draft with all the picks. Look forward. QB? Lets get Glennon for this year and draft one in 2016.

You can't clear an entire staff in the middle of the season.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:16 AM

#37

sacniner
Member
Posts: 31,684

Originally posted by Blindfury:
He is under constant pressure, that is textbook what happens to QBs..especially young ones. I'd like to see Devey and Pears replaced. I'd also see who on the team can play center. Stop running to the right side for one thing and call more blitz beaters. Have a better gameplan. You can't tell me Geep has done a good job and his hands are tired by personnel. He has never shown ability as a good OC...ever.

Address the Oline and guarantee you we'll see better play.

There is no one to come in and turn the o line around. It is what it is. Geep didn't pick the players. He got f**ked. I mean, he may not be a worthy OC anyways, but impossible to tell.

Also, please check out the SD team he was the OC for

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:17 AM

#38

Jcool
Veteran
Posts: 44,532

Why do people keep coming up with excuses for the bad play? The 49ers are a bad team and bad teams play bad games. Want to know why we are bad? Tomsula was hired and was unable to attract quality assistants, which lead us to hiring guys who shouldn't be coordinators. We also lost A LOT of talent that our GM was unable to replace. Turns out all that young talent he was praised for drafting wasn't so talented. This team wont go 12-4 next year with a few new additions to the OL.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:18 AM

#39

thl408
Moderator
Posts: 33,315

Originally posted by Blindfury:

Originally posted by thl408:
All the factors contributing to the anemic offense blend together. But the ones that leap out to me is Kap having tunnel vision, and the piss poor pass/run blocking. Let me know if you disagree with those two weaknesses I mentioned. So what does an OC do to account for these two weaknesses? He calls simple route combinations that are easier to defend.

What is it that you would like to see more of? Please don't say 'slants and screens'.

He is under constant pressure, that is textbook what happens to QBs..especially young ones. I'd like to see Devey and Pears replaced. I'd also see who on the team can play center. Stop running to the right side for one thing and call more blitz beaters. Have a better gameplan. You can't tell me Geep has done a good job and his hands are tired by personnel. He has never shown ability as a good OC...ever.

Address the Oline and guarantee you we'll see better play.

I didn't say Geep has done a good job. Don't twist it around to form an imaginary argument. Please re-read my posts.

You say Geep deserves blame, then say the offense will be better with better OL play. I agree with you. So the problem is the OL isn't it? If that gets addressed, then Geep can call some better plays, and not this simple, easy-to-defend offense we are seeing. If you were to assign weight, what percentage would you assign blame? For me (this is for the entire season) imo:

OL: 40%
Kap: 40%
WR/TE/RB: 10%
Playcalling: 10%

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:21 AM

#40

sacniner
Member
Posts: 31,684

Originally posted by thl408:
I didn't say Geep has done a good job. Don't twist it around to form an imaginary argument. Please re-read my posts.

You say Geep deserves blame, then say the offense will be better with better OL play. I agree with you. So the problem is the OL isn't it? If that gets addressed, then Geep can call some better plays, and not this simple, easy-to-defend offense we are seeing. If you were to assign weight, what percentage would you assign blame? For me (this is for the entire season) imo:

OL: 40%
Kap: 40%
WR/TE/RB: 10%
Playcalling: 10%

Solid post, and yes this is a fair assessment. Although, i have a feeling many will assigning a much higher weight to the OL and/or playcalling.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:25 AM

#41

saj4423
Veteran
Posts: 2,053

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Blindfury:

Originally posted by thl408:
All the factors contributing to the anemic offense blend together. But the ones that leap out to me is Kap having tunnel vision, and the piss poor pass/run blocking. Let me know if you disagree with those two weaknesses I mentioned. So what does an OC do to account for these two weaknesses? He calls simple route combinations that are easier to defend.

What is it that you would like to see more of? Please don't say 'slants and screens'.

He is under constant pressure, that is textbook what happens to QBs..especially young ones. I'd like to see Devey and Pears replaced. I'd also see who on the team can play center. Stop running to the right side for one thing and call more blitz beaters. Have a better gameplan. You can't tell me Geep has done a good job and his hands are tired by personnel. He has never shown ability as a good OC...ever.

Address the Oline and guarantee you we'll see better play.

I didn't say Geep has done a good job. Don't twist it around to form an imaginary argument. Please re-read my posts.

You say Geep deserves blame, then say the offense will be better with better OL play. I agree with you. So the problem is the OL isn't it? If that gets addressed, then Geep can call some better plays, and not this simple, easy-to-defend offense we are seeing. If you were to assign weight, what percentage would you assign blame? For me (this is for the entire season) imo:

OL: 40%
Kap: 40%
WR/TE/RB: 10%
Playcalling: 10%

I would say at least 25% of Kap's problem is the OL so they should be at 50% and Kap at 30% but in the end they are both turds right now.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:28 AM

#42

NYniner85
Veteran
Posts: 119,098

Originally posted by Jcool:
Geep Chryst as an offensive coordinator: 1998 - #26. 1999. #28. 2015 - #32. There is a reason he went 16 years between OC jobs. When you hire bad coaches you get bad results.

Yup I've been saying this...put a bunch of coaches together that have had poor results why would it be any different?

All the staff needs to be let go.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:29 AM

#43

Blindfury
Veteran
Posts: 5,663

Originally posted by sacniner:
There is no one to come in and turn the o line around. It is what it is. Geep didn't pick the players. He got f**ked. I mean, he may not be a worthy OC anyways, but impossible to tell.

Also, please check out the SD team he was the OC for

The guy has never gotten an OC gig in 15 gotdamn years man! He is not good.

Plenty of teams bring in linemen. We haven't even worked anyone out. Why is Devey even starting? sub him out. We haven't done anything with the line. No adjustments.

[ Edited by Blindfury on Nov 2, 2015 at 10:30 AM ]

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:31 AM

#44

scottym
Veteran
Posts: 802

Kap is 100% turd right now.

Originally posted by saj4423:
I would say at least 25% of Kap's problem is the OL so they should be at 50% and Kap at 30% but in the end they are both turds right now.

Nov 2, 2015 at 10:32 AM

#45

sacniner
Member
Posts: 31,684

Originally posted by Blindfury:

Originally posted by sacniner:
There is no one to come in and turn the o line around. It is what it is. Geep didn't pick the players. He got f**ked. I mean, he may not be a worthy OC anyways, but impossible to tell.

Also, please check out the SD team he was the OC for

The guy has never gotten an OC gig in 15 gotdamn years man! He is not good.

Plenty of teams bring in linemen. We haven't even worked anyone out. Why is Devey even starting? sub him out. We haven't done anything with the line. No adjustments.

Geep probably isn't good, but I don't think any OC would do that much better. Playcalling isn't the primary issue right now.

The linemen on the market right now all suck. If they didn't, they'd be working right now. Have no idea why Devey is starting. That is befuddling to all of us.