Oakland Raiders coaches Film analysis

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here's a missed opportunity in the game. This is what I'm talking about when I say that Kap's just a little slow in his reads.

Here, we start out in 22 Personnel. We motion VD over to the bottom.

It looks like Kap is trying to ask Miller to chip block - that's what I'd assume considering how the play is drawn up.

We then motion VM over to the top of the screen.

From here, we're going to run almost the same play the first INT came on - just out of a different formation and this time, we give a little better zone help on the backside.

Our play action fake does bring a couple guys up.

It looks like Oakland was focused on trying to take Boldin out of the passing game. You see the LB and Woodson close on Boldin's curl route. Oakland plays the concept side well. What CK needs to to here is move through this progression very quickly. You see the concept side is well covered - why? Because your two middle defenders are covering Boldin - that means the middle of the field will be open - you have an intermediate middle route on the backside.

You see Kap's not under immediate pressure, he's got an open VD - but he doesn't get to that read quick enough.


'From the endzone view you could see he was looking at VD's route - but he pulls down his throw - probably because it was coming a little late(I still think he could've gotten it in but I think he was scared of throwing another pick to the safety). He got to the right read, just too slow. He has to get through those reads faster. This is what Steve Young talked about when he said that these reads and knowing where to go on every play against every defense until it's reflexive. It's not reflexive yet, he's still digesting everything as it's happening and looking more at his receivers than the defenders.

After he pulls it down he gets sacked for 3 yards. Could've had a first down and move the ball, but instead....This is a sack that's on CK.

I need to see an animated GIF, but this is another one-read by design.

He probably read blitz pre-snap and was looking for Boldin... now you say he was looking at VD's route and I'm not going to even accept that until I see it....and even if that was the case the only reason he would do that because he's stuck on Boldin's primary short/'hot' route that is double teamed.

Originally posted by Jd925:

I need to see an animated GIF, but this is another one-read by design.

He probably read blitz pre-snap and was looking for Boldin... now you say he was looking at VD's route and I'm not going to even accept that until I see it....and even if that was the case the only reason he would do that because he's stuck on Boldin's primary short/'hot' route that is double teamed.

It is not a one read design...it's a spot concept with a deep in on the backside. Primary in spot is the flat and the curl is secondary with the corner as an alert.

Thl and johnny both break this play down nicely.

Originally posted by thl408:
Here's the play right after the play in post#57 (and post #74)

2Q 3rd & 10
49ers: Slant-flat to Kap's left. Double Slants to Kap's right.
OAK: cover3 (I think)


Kap takes the shotgun snap and takes a 1 step dropback (equivalent of a 3 step rhythm throw). The curl/flat defender to the double slants side (CB lined up over Boldin) runs to the flat which defeats SJ's slant. The correct throw is to Boldin. Kap is mid windup targeting Boldin.


The throw hits Boldin in the numbers and is dropped. With the hook/curl defender near Boldin on his knees, Boldin could have gotten a little RAC. At least enough to convert the 3rd down.


Incomplete pass. Punt. Even when things go right for this offense offense, something goes wrong. Story of the season.

To piggie back off this - this highlights a difference in approach and mentality between Kap and Carr.


The Raiders are gonna run a double slant at the top.


Carr recognizes that Wilhiote didn't get moved by the inside slant -he throws to the outside slant - he adjusts his throw based off the presence of the LB.


Carr purposely throws the ball behind his receiver to protect his receiver. This is what good QB's do on slant routes when they know LB's are over the middle. They will throw the ball behind the receiver so that the receiver isn't led into the LB and can turn his back around to protect himself. I watched one of the Chiefs games this year and the commentator was talking about that - that one of the rookie receivers had to get used to that in the NFL because QB's are good enough that they'll do that. If the LB is there, they'll throw the ball behind the receiver to protect their receiver. Steve Young used to do that all the time.

Kap, on the other hand, see's the LB and tries to squeeze the ball in - more like Brett Favre would on slant routes. That underscores a big difference in mentality. Carr tries to finesse the ball to the right spot and protect his receiver, understanding that they haven't won on the play, but can get some positive yards. Kap tries to force the ball into a tight window, but puts his receiver at risk and makes the catch harder.

Both passes were incomplete, but it's a good example of how two guys can throw the same pass and the way they do it is completely different.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by tondiman:
Good Qb's make plays even with bad oline. they may not always win, but they make plays. KAP DOES NOT.

Just like Peyton Manning did in the Superbowl................oh wait............

Lol it's so funny the double standard that goes on in Niner Talk.

I think everyone here would be willing to admit that Kap is not an elite QB at this time. I think these film breakdowns have shown me 2 things: 1) We need to get this OL back on track. They have sucked the entire season, and the constant in-and-out lineup isn't helping. 2) Kap is still learning how to get through these progressions. Not only that, he is often doing it in a situation where he is rushed because of the time running out on the clock, and the fact that he can't take more than 2 seconds to make a decision.

When I see him operate over the last month, he looks as if he is expecting the line to break down, so even when they do give him time (a rarity), he is not pulling the trigger because it has got him intercepted. It is a lose-lose proposition for a young QB. If our pass rush could have gotten anywhere near Carr, you would have seen the same thing with him.

Originally posted by Jd925:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here's a missed opportunity in the game. This is what I'm talking about when I say that Kap's just a little slow in his reads.

Here, we start out in 22 Personnel. We motion VD over to the bottom.

It looks like Kap is trying to ask Miller to chip block - that's what I'd assume considering how the play is drawn up.

We then motion VM over to the top of the screen.

From here, we're going to run almost the same play the first INT came on - just out of a different formation and this time, we give a little better zone help on the backside.

Our play action fake does bring a couple guys up.

It looks like Oakland was focused on trying to take Boldin out of the passing game. You see the LB and Woodson close on Boldin's curl route. Oakland plays the concept side well. What CK needs to to here is move through this progression very quickly. You see the concept side is well covered - why? Because your two middle defenders are covering Boldin - that means the middle of the field will be open - you have an intermediate middle route on the backside.

You see Kap's not under immediate pressure, he's got an open VD - but he doesn't get to that read quick enough.


'From the endzone view you could see he was looking at VD's route - but he pulls down his throw - probably because it was coming a little late(I still think he could've gotten it in but I think he was scared of throwing another pick to the safety). He got to the right read, just too slow. He has to get through those reads faster. This is what Steve Young talked about when he said that these reads and knowing where to go on every play against every defense until it's reflexive. It's not reflexive yet, he's still digesting everything as it's happening and looking more at his receivers than the defenders.

After he pulls it down he gets sacked for 3 yards. Could've had a first down and move the ball, but instead....This is a sack that's on CK.

I need to see an animated GIF, but this is another one-read by design.

He probably read blitz pre-snap and was looking for Boldin... now you say he was looking at VD's route and I'm not going to even accept that until I see it....and even if that was the case the only reason he would do that because he's stuck on Boldin's primary short/'hot' route that is double teamed.

Originally posted by Jd925:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here's a missed opportunity in the game. This is what I'm talking about when I say that Kap's just a little slow in his reads.

Here, we start out in 22 Personnel. We motion VD over to the bottom.

It looks like Kap is trying to ask Miller to chip block - that's what I'd assume considering how the play is drawn up.

We then motion VM over to the top of the screen.

From here, we're going to run almost the same play the first INT came on - just out of a different formation and this time, we give a little better zone help on the backside.

Our play action fake does bring a couple guys up.

It looks like Oakland was focused on trying to take Boldin out of the passing game. You see the LB and Woodson close on Boldin's curl route. Oakland plays the concept side well. What CK needs to to here is move through this progression very quickly. You see the concept side is well covered - why? Because your two middle defenders are covering Boldin - that means the middle of the field will be open - you have an intermediate middle route on the backside.

You see Kap's not under immediate pressure, he's got an open VD - but he doesn't get to that read quick enough.


'From the endzone view you could see he was looking at VD's route - but he pulls down his throw - probably because it was coming a little late(I still think he could've gotten it in but I think he was scared of throwing another pick to the safety). He got to the right read, just too slow. He has to get through those reads faster. This is what Steve Young talked about when he said that these reads and knowing where to go on every play against every defense until it's reflexive. It's not reflexive yet, he's still digesting everything as it's happening and looking more at his receivers than the defenders.

After he pulls it down he gets sacked for 3 yards. Could've had a first down and move the ball, but instead....This is a sack that's on CK.

I need to see an animated GIF, but this is another one-read by design.

He probably read blitz pre-snap and was looking for Boldin... now you say he was looking at VD's route and I'm not going to even accept that until I see it....and even if that was the case the only reason he would do that because he's stuck on Boldin's primary short/'hot' route that is double teamed.

From the endzone..... You really think I'm lying??

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by Jd925:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here's a missed opportunity in the game. This is what I'm talking about when I say that Kap's just a little slow in his reads.

Here, we start out in 22 Personnel. We motion VD over to the bottom.

It looks like Kap is trying to ask Miller to chip block - that's what I'd assume considering how the play is drawn up.

We then motion VM over to the top of the screen.

From here, we're going to run almost the same play the first INT came on - just out of a different formation and this time, we give a little better zone help on the backside.

Our play action fake does bring a couple guys up.

It looks like Oakland was focused on trying to take Boldin out of the passing game. You see the LB and Woodson close on Boldin's curl route. Oakland plays the concept side well. What CK needs to to here is move through this progression very quickly. You see the concept side is well covered - why? Because your two middle defenders are covering Boldin - that means the middle of the field will be open - you have an intermediate middle route on the backside.

You see Kap's not under immediate pressure, he's got an open VD - but he doesn't get to that read quick enough.


'From the endzone view you could see he was looking at VD's route - but he pulls down his throw - probably because it was coming a little late(I still think he could've gotten it in but I think he was scared of throwing another pick to the safety). He got to the right read, just too slow. He has to get through those reads faster. This is what Steve Young talked about when he said that these reads and knowing where to go on every play against every defense until it's reflexive. It's not reflexive yet, he's still digesting everything as it's happening and looking more at his receivers than the defenders.

After he pulls it down he gets sacked for 3 yards. Could've had a first down and move the ball, but instead....This is a sack that's on CK.

I need to see an animated GIF, but this is another one-read by design.

He probably read blitz pre-snap and was looking for Boldin... now you say he was looking at VD's route and I'm not going to even accept that until I see it....and even if that was the case the only reason he would do that because he's stuck on Boldin's primary short/'hot' route that is double teamed.



From the endzone..... You really think I'm lying??

an even better angle - why didn't he throw??? IDK

After forcing a quick '3 and Out', the 49ers get the last possession of the 1st half. They would go on to kick a FG to tie it up at the half. Here's a big play from that drive.

2Q 1st & 10 (0:42 left in the half)

49ers: Levels concept to Kap's right. Levels is a nice concept that can be used versus man or zone. Against zone, like below, the slot WR (VD) pushes the zone defender in the area back. The outside WR (SJ) works the vacated area. To his left, Boldin looks to hit the seam in between the middle safety and the deep 1/3 defender lined up across from Crabs.
OAK: cover3


Kap takes the snap and looks for the seam route for the chunk play - big surprise. In his defense, the half is running out and a big play is needed. Shotgun snap, 3 step rhythm throw.


The pass has to be high to get over the reach of the underneath zone defender.


Nice, gutsy throw. It needs to be a laser to prevent the deep defenders from converging on the throw. +20 yards.

Originally posted by thl408:
The OAK punt would pin the 49ers inside their own 5 yard line.

1st & 10
Gore Inside zone for +3 yards

2nd & 7
49ers: Spot concept to Kap's right with a backside In route (VD)
OAK: cover3. #24 is Woodson who is the weakside hook/curl defender (zone in the middle of the field, I forgot to highlight him).

After a playaction that does not fool the strongside curl/flat defender (defender covering Miller), Kap partially rolls right. Woodson leaves his zone to roll coverage to the strongside.

Of the Spot concept, Miller is the only one open and it's only for a very minimal gain, if that. Kap properly red lights all three routes in the Spot concept. Because Woodson (#24) has rolled coverage and is essentially double covering Boldin's Curl, there is a passing lane to VD's In route.

Kap has time in the pocket that is about to end via a bullrush by a LB that got MMartin backpeddling (mentioned by jonnydel in the OP). Kap should be looking to VD on the backside by now.

With the time that Kap has remaining of his pocket, Kap actually starts his windup. Blue are the deep zones. Orange is the underneath zones with Woodson in purple because he has left his assigned zone as the weakside hook-curl defender. Notice the passing lane to VD.

Same moment as pic above. From this angle, it looks like Kap never moved off of the Curl (Boldin). If Kap is looking at VD, which I don't think he is based off the direction of his helmet, then I don't know why he didn't pull the trigger to VD. If Kap is pump faking to Boldin, then that's a waste of time that should have been spent targeting VD.

Sacked for -3. Maybe I'm being too harsh on Kap here, but when there is one defender covering Miller, and 2 defenders covering Boldin, where does Kap think that 2nd defender covering Boldin came from? Using that logic, VD's In route is available.

Another one-read by design.. (this is the same as jonnydel)

The only possibility is that Miller was a read because Kap's head is turned that way.. but I still doubt it was the very first post-snap read in this thread. Boldin is the primary read.. he's double covered.. Kap is stuck with a blitz man coming.. That's all I see.

BTW if this was a spot concept how can you thl408 and jonnydel say he should have gone to a 4th read on a blitz? If he was going through a spot concept it would have been Boldin, Miller, and Celek on a half-field read.... not Davis on the other side...

Originally posted by Jd925:
Another one-read by design.. (this is the same as jonnydel)

The only possibility is that Miller was a read because Kap's head is turned that way.. but I still doubt it was the very first post-snap read in this thread. Boldin is the primary read.. he's double covered.. Kap is stuck with a blitz man coming.. That's all I see.

BTW if this was a spot concept how can you thl408 and jonnydel say he should have gone to a 4th read on a blitz? If he was going through a spot concept it would have been Boldin, Miller, and Celek on a half-field read.... not Davis on the other side...

I'll let you go ahead and do all the research into football to find that out. In the end - self discovery is better than us explaining it......

Originally posted by thl408:
After forcing a quick '3 and Out', the 49ers get the last possession of the 1st half. They would go on to kick a FG to tie it up at the half. Here's a big play from that drive.

2Q 1st & 10 (0:42 left in the half)

49ers: Levels concept to Kap's right. Levels is a nice concept that can be used versus man or zone. Against zone, like below, the slot WR (VD) pushes the zone defender in the area back. The outside WR (SJ) works the vacated area. To his left, Boldin looks to hit the seam in between the middle safety and the deep 1/3 defender lined up across from Crabs.
OAK: cover3


Kap takes the snap and looks for the seam route for the chunk play - big surprise. In his defense, the half is running out and a big play is needed. Shotgun snap, 3 step rhythm throw.


The pass has to be high to get over the reach of the underneath zone defender.


Nice, gutsy throw. It needs to be a laser to prevent the deep defenders from converging on the throw. +20 yards.

What I really like from Kap on this play was that he didn't stare Boldin down right away and allow the safety to read the throw and break on it like he did in the Chicago game on almost the exact same throw when he threw a pick.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by Jd925:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by Jd925:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

2. They tried to simplify the passing game - and it still struggled. This is perhaps the strongest indictment against Kap. They tried to get him into a rhythm and simplify the reads and throws from him after the early pick. On the TD drive - almost all the throws were designed throws to that receiver. When it's like that, Kap threw on time and hit the receiver well. But, any plays they dialed up that required full field reads - he was slow in his reads at best and terrible in his reads at worst.

Lol. And what makes you think the HaRoman pass offense was ever complex?

How often do you see Kap scan the entire field other than on broken plays in the past? What about in his half of 2012 and in 2013...what about your QB Alex Smith in 2011 and half of 2012? Did Smith scan the field on most of his plays when he was a starter? How sure are you about the comment 'plays they dialed up up that required full field reads'?

Easy buddy


Full field read plays require looking at the entire design of the play and seeing what's being called. And yes, I saw that quite a bit when I looked at the film from when Alex was here. The difference when Alex was here, was that most teams were playing man-coverage against us and none of our receivers could beat a 1-1 coverage.

Now - to your "how often do you see Kap scan the entire field". Scanning the entire field and full field reads begin before the ball is ever snapped. It's looking at the pre-snap alignment and defense, seeing what they're most likely going to be in and then the next possible defenses and then using your post snap-read to double check the defense hasn't rotated into a different defense. You look at the defenders - not your own players.

What I've seen this far from our offense this season was incorporated much more full field reads to try and utilize all the weapons we have on the field. However, at this point, it's been too much for Kap to do and so in this game, there were far less a percentage of those plays called. They were trying to give him half field reads more and designed plays to make it easier for him. When he was given full field reads, he's often slow in his progression. I'll show several plays where he did end up getting to the right read - it was just late.

Seriously? So you are talking pre-snap scanning of the field? Lol. Wait seriously?

i have no idea what your sarcastic questions are in regards to....seriously......

Ok let me me explicit then. We are talking about post-snap reads and PROGRESSIONS.

Originally posted by thl408:
Here's the play right after the play in post#57 (and post #74)

2Q 3rd & 10
49ers: Slant-flat to Kap's left. Double Slants to Kap's right.
OAK: cover3 (I think)


Kap takes the shotgun snap and takes a 1 step dropback (equivalent of a 3 step rhythm throw). The curl/flat defender to the double slants side (CB lined up over Boldin) runs to the flat which defeats SJ's slant. The correct throw is to Boldin. Kap is mid windup targeting Boldin.


The throw hits Boldin in the numbers and is dropped. With the hook/curl defender near Boldin on his knees, Boldin could have gotten a little RAC. At least enough to convert the 3rd down.


Incomplete pass. Punt. Even when things go right for this offense offense, something goes wrong. Story of the season.

Another one-read by design.

Originally posted by Jd925:
Ok let me me explicit then. We are talking about post-snap reads and PROGRESSIONS.

If you really don't know how pre-snap reads affect post-snap reads and progressions I'll explain it, but, since you're pretty much just being a troll - that's all I will say on the matter.

Originally posted by TheRatMan13:
Lol it's so funny the double standard that goes on in Niner Talk.

I think everyone here would be willing to admit that Kap is not an elite QB at this time. I think these film breakdowns have shown me 2 things: 1) We need to get this OL back on track. They have sucked the entire season, and the constant in-and-out lineup isn't helping. 2) Kap is still learning how to get through these progressions. Not only that, he is often doing it in a situation where he is rushed because of the time running out on the clock, and the fact that he can't take more than 2 seconds to make a decision.

When I see him operate over the last month, he looks as if he is expecting the line to break down, so even when they do give him time (a rarity), he is not pulling the trigger because it has got him intercepted. It is a lose-lose proposition for a young QB. If our pass rush could have gotten anywhere near Carr, you would have seen the same thing with him.

I agree with the bolded. It's been 14 weeks of inconsistent pass protection. Although I think it's gotten a bit better in the past couple weeks, it's just barely bearable now. But to your point, I think the damage had been done to Kap's internal clock. He feels rushed because it's been week after week of blown blocking assignments in pass pro. If pass pro is going to be bad, at least be consistently bad - but don't be horrible. As in, Kap always gets only 2 seconds. At least the QB knows what he's working with. That's not the case though. Sometimes Kap gets 2 seconds, sometimes he can't even hit his backfoot on a dropback without a defender running at him. The times he does get >3 seconds in the pocket, he never expected it and feels rushed anyway. This is a recipe for disaster to a running QB being re-wired as a pocket passer.

There's a lot of 'chicken or egg' situations going on imo.
- Do the routes in the passing game look simple because HaRo can't think of creative ways to get the WRs open? Or is it because the Oline sucks so bad they can't afford to dial up complex, longer developing routes?
- Did Gore lose a few steps? Or does the Oline suck so bad that Gore has nothing to work with?
- Is Kap really that skittish in the pocket and can't go through progressions fast enough? Or is the Oline so bad it has ingrained a shortened internal clock into Kap's head?

Fix the Oline, then we can get a true gauge as to what is the (other) root problem of this offense in terms of player fails or coaching fail. Unfortunately, we know who the fall guys will be and they deservedly share blame as well.

Originally posted by Jd925:

Another one-read by design.

That's a slant-flat on one side and a double slant/skinny concept on the other. There have been zero one read plays broke down on this thread. Concepts broke down in thread:

-spot
-mesh
-spider
-smash
-slant-flat
-double slant
-levels

Non of these are considered one read.