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George Seifert ... Its about time

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  • Geeked
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 10,057
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by Geeked:
Hmmm, are you telling me you're rooting your argument in the judgments of the NCAA. The same organization that employed Missy Conboy and Paul Dee to oversee the investigation?

Are you protesting the advisement to do a little research before you cast derisive judgments?

FYI, I went to USC and I wasn't the Smartest or Richest guy in the room. I actually had to work my ass off to get in and STAY IN. I was the guy that spent hours in the library RESEARCHING my positions before memorializing them in papers for committee REVIEW.

I'm well qualified in the position that EVERY PARTY has a RESPONSIBILITY to the audience to do a little investigative work before communicating the findings.

You sir, are basically formalizing your hatred of a Coach and a University through baseless claims rooted in half truths. Your whole premise is a fabricated and wouldn't make it past the Junior High debate team with a couple of hours of research preparation.

The minute you say (I don't have to research my position) is the minute you lose all credibility... Your position, your judgement, is the very same qualifying logic that has the NCAA staring down a multi-million dollar lawsuits from Todd McNair, the State of Pennsylvania, and O'bannon.

So, not only do I believe you're completely flawed in thought, apparently, there are several court proceedings that are founded in the same observation.

Yawn. Where is the *denial* of the facts I presented? All that gobbledygook you posted is irrelevant and opinionated. If that's all you got, see you later bud. Good luck in presenting opinions as fact here in the webzone. Opinions are like armpits- everybody has 'Em and they all stink.

??????

I, I, don't know how to respond. So, you bury your head in the sand, stick your fingers in your ear and scream "la la la la". And that's your defense?

Wow, just wow. It's quite apparent we chose different paths in life to address similar challenges. Good luck on yours pal.
Originally posted by Geeked:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by Geeked:
Hmmm, are you telling me you're rooting your argument in the judgments of the NCAA. The same organization that employed Missy Conboy and Paul Dee to oversee the investigation?

Are you protesting the advisement to do a little research before you cast derisive judgments?

FYI, I went to USC and I wasn't the Smartest or Richest guy in the room. I actually had to work my ass off to get in and STAY IN. I was the guy that spent hours in the library RESEARCHING my positions before memorializing them in papers for committee REVIEW.

I'm well qualified in the position that EVERY PARTY has a RESPONSIBILITY to the audience to do a little investigative work before communicating the findings.

You sir, are basically formalizing your hatred of a Coach and a University through baseless claims rooted in half truths. Your whole premise is a fabricated and wouldn't make it past the Junior High debate team with a couple of hours of research preparation.

The minute you say (I don't have to research my position) is the minute you lose all credibility... Your position, your judgement, is the very same qualifying logic that has the NCAA staring down a multi-million dollar lawsuits from Todd McNair, the State of Pennsylvania, and O'bannon.

So, not only do I believe you're completely flawed in thought, apparently, there are several court proceedings that are founded in the same observation.

Yawn. Where is the *denial* of the facts I presented? All that gobbledygook you posted is irrelevant and opinionated. If that's all you got, see you later bud. Good luck in presenting opinions as fact here in the webzone. Opinions are like armpits- everybody has 'Em and they all stink.

??????

I, I, don't know how to respond. So, you bury your head in the sand, stick your fingers in your ear and scream "la la la la". And that's your defense?

Wow, just wow. It's quite apparent we chose different paths in life to address similar challenges. Good luck on yours pal.

Nobody cares. Stop de-railing the thread with this crap.
...and to hell with Coach Carrol.
  • LVJay
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 27,847
Anyone defending Cheat Carrol (especially) on this thread has got to be an undercover fan from the rivals up north... if you get defensive over this comment, then you prove my case, now GTFO!

Congrats to Georgie!!
Originally posted by Kauaiguy:
George Seifert inherited a great 49er's team and without this inheritance, I don't think he would have done as well.

Give credit to Bill Walsh who actually put the initial team together and made them super.

All Seifert had to do was try and keep it together, and when he left for another team?

If it were that easy, every coach that succeeded a legend and inherited a strong roster would've continued to win. Jon Gruden f'ed up the team Tony Dungy put together. Look at the Redskins after Joe Gibbs retired. The wheels came off in NY for a bit after Parcells left them. Keeping a dynasty going is no small feat.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 33,859
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If it were that easy, every coach that succeeded a legend and inherited a strong roster would've continued to win. Jon Gruden f'ed up the team Tony Dungy put together. Look at the Redskins after Joe Gibbs retired. The wheels came off in NY for a bit after Parcells left them. Keeping a dynasty going is no small feat.

Gorge was a great defensive coach. But unlike landry, he never could really master the offensive side. When Holmgren and shanahan left and he got trestman, his doom was written.
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If it were that easy, every coach that succeeded a legend and inherited a strong roster would've continued to win. Jon Gruden f'ed up the team Tony Dungy put together. Look at the Redskins after Joe Gibbs retired. The wheels came off in NY for a bit after Parcells left them. Keeping a dynasty going is no small feat.

Gorge was a great defensive coach. But unlike landry, he never could really master the offensive side. When Holmgren and shanahan left and he got trestman, his doom was written.

I think if we had Ricky Watters instead of Derek Loville the 1995 season would've ended differently.
Originally posted by Giedi:
Gorge was a great defensive coach. But unlike landry, he never could really master the offensive side. When Holmgren and shanahan left and he got trestman, his doom was written.

Those passes to Jerry only 2 ft in front of the line was killing Jerry that he would come up with.
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 60,541
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If it were that easy, every coach that succeeded a legend and inherited a strong roster would've continued to win. Jon Gruden f'ed up the team Tony Dungy put together. Look at the Redskins after Joe Gibbs retired. The wheels came off in NY for a bit after Parcells left them. Keeping a dynasty going is no small feat.

Gorge was a great defensive coach. But unlike landry, he never could really master the offensive side. When Holmgren and shanahan left and he got trestman, his doom was written.
plus the team did not draft young talent on defense. we got old and slow and then we went to the well one to many times for free agents like rod woodson and kevin greene who did not do much and with woodson , for whatever reason, he was bad for us
Originally posted by LVJay:
Anyone defending Cheat Carrol (especially) on this thread has got to be an undercover fan from the rivals up north... if you get defensive over this comment, then you prove my case, now GTFO!

Congrats to Georgie!!

I am no way a fan of Carrol, he is our rival but when did he cheat?
Fill me in please
  • LVJay
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 27,847
Originally posted by Constantine:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Anyone defending Cheat Carrol (especially) on this thread has got to be an undercover fan from the rivals up north... if you get defensive over this comment, then you prove my case, now GTFO!

Congrats to Georgie!!

I am no way a fan of Carrol, he is our rival but when did he cheat?
Fill me in please

Gawd, please tell me you're joking with me....
Originally posted by Constantine:
I am no way a fan of Carrol, he is our rival but when did he cheat?
Fill me in please

When he was at USC, unless you really think he didn't know "donors" were running amok giving gifts and cash to his team and recruits.
Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
Originally posted by Constantine:
I am no way a fan of Carrol, he is our rival but when did he cheat?
Fill me in please

When he was at USC, unless you really think he didn't know "donors" were running amok giving gifts and cash to his team and recruits.
We'll I dont watch much college, weird right but I love NFL and have to watch my Niners. I get it Carrol was a cheat at USC but what about in Seattle... and trust me im not sticking up the man. Just want facts...
and LVJay not helpful at all, im not joking you... I know Carrol was a coach back in the day for the Patriots and I remember that but when he left he left and I didnt keep tabs.
Originally posted by VPofCarnage:
49ers HOF? Absolutely.

Football HOF? No way. I happen to think Seifert is one of the most overrated coaches of all time.

Bill Walsh: 92-59, 10-4 in the playoffs, 3 SB titles in 10 seasons.

George Seifert: 98-30, 10-5 in the playoffs, 2 SB titles in 8 seasons

Obviously Walsh set things up, and Seifert inherited a great team, but the 49ers were more dominant under Seifert. He led the 49ers to 14-2 seasons in 3 of his first 4 years running the show.

Seifert averaged 12.25 wins per season for his entire tenure with SF.

Nobody thinks Seifert was as good or better than Walsh, I just think people get WAY too critical of Seifert. He won 98 games in 8 seasons. At some point you have to give him the credit rather than what Walsh "set up". NFL teams are revised versions every single year.
[ Edited by Niners99 on Jun 28, 2014 at 1:00 AM ]
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If it were that easy, every coach that succeeded a legend and inherited a strong roster would've continued to win. Jon Gruden f'ed up the team Tony Dungy put together. Look at the Redskins after Joe Gibbs retired. The wheels came off in NY for a bit after Parcells left them. Keeping a dynasty going is no small feat.

Gorge was a great defensive coach. But unlike landry, he never could really master the offensive side. When Holmgren and shanahan left and he got trestman, his doom was written.
plus the team did not draft young talent on defense. we got old and slow and then we went to the well one to many times for free agents like rod woodson and kevin greene who did not do much and with woodson , for whatever reason, he was bad for us

Rod Woodson was just coming off of the injury wasn't he? Or if he wasn't, his days as a corner were numbered anyway. I can't remember if he ever played corner for the Ravens but they are the ones that made the brilliant move of shifting him to safety. Our drafts by in large in the 90s bombed with the exception of 1994. This probably sealed George Seifert's fate more than anything. There was no influx of new talent coming in. And who can forget in 1997 (though Seifert was gone by then) when Bill Walsh advised the club to draft Jake Plummer and they instead took Jim Druckenmiller. Just shows the ineptitude of the front office at the time.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 33,859
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
If it were that easy, every coach that succeeded a legend and inherited a strong roster would've continued to win. Jon Gruden f'ed up the team Tony Dungy put together. Look at the Redskins after Joe Gibbs retired. The wheels came off in NY for a bit after Parcells left them. Keeping a dynasty going is no small feat.

Gorge was a great defensive coach. But unlike landry, he never could really master the offensive side. When Holmgren and shanahan left and he got trestman, his doom was written.
plus the team did not draft young talent on defense. we got old and slow and then we went to the well one to many times for free agents like rod woodson and kevin greene who did not do much and with woodson , for whatever reason, he was bad for us

Yeah he relied on scheme too much on defense. He thought he could take lesser talent on defense and situation substitute them and have those defenders play higher than where they were athletically. Just like how Walsh would with lesser talent on offense but put them into the WCO, and have them play better than their draft position.

He was never able to draft or acquire a Haley or Fred Dean. And he never really got good at running the WCO without his assistants. I think one reason is he never understood the QB position as well as Holmgren and Shanahan did. Marc Trestman was basically a nobody he hired so he could try to dabble in the offense himself, and unfortunately for us - we found out right quick that George had no talent in running the WCO offense.
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