our current receiver corps/the forgotten man

Originally posted by buck:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
DZ is our current model of Thomas Clayton and Nate Davis.

On a side note: I find it almost funny that many people on this board are shoving Ginn out the door already. He is the only deep threat we have on the team at WR, and he still is the best returner on the team. He may end getting cut (who knows how this is all going to shake out), but people are dismissing him way too early at this point, especially with a lock-out.

I agree with you on Ginn. If the offense gets some creative play action plays and can sell the defense on it consistently, Ginn could see something like 40-60 catches with a 16 ypc average. Good coaching is about putting your players in a position to succeed, let's hope the niners finally found someone capable of doing it instead of saying it.

His hands are pretty bad though. Still can't believe Holmes is the better receiver of the two coming out of college. I remember watching the HS All-American Game and the announcers were actually making the argument that Ginn could transition straight to the NFL from highschool. (This was during the Clarett/Williams Lawsuit/fiasco against the NFL trying to waive the 2 yr college requirement).... Boy were they off.

In the end I think Ziggy gets cut over Ginn, Kyle W. is quick and speedy but it's gonna be hard for the coaches to ignore Ginn's straight line speed and play making potential.

Ted Ginn has the speed to be a deep threat, but I am not sure that he really can be classified as a deep threat.

Last year he only had 12 receptions for 163 yards with 1 touchdown. He averaged 13.6 per catch.

I would say his job is on the line, but even with that paltry production he was the third leading WR on the team.

How many drops did he have thougH? thats the real stat..

VD and Morgan are the two most reliable receivers in the team. Walker and Zeigler are injury prone and Ginn and Crabtree are drop prone. If at least two of the latter four can elevate their game the 9ers will be a very potent team. If they don't, perhaps Johnson can surprise everyone and make a difference as a rookie.

Would not be surprised to see A Davis sitting on the bench at the beginning of the season. Can't see Harbaugh and company giving him as much latitude as Singletary did. I like veterans on the line but Iapati seems to be ready.

If the line can give the QB a bit more time Crabtree and Morgan should have very good years. While I really like Zeigler he is more a spot player unless he can stay healthy.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
VD and Morgan are the two most reliable receivers in the team. Walker and Zeigler are injury prone and Ginn and Crabtree are drop prone. If at least two of the latter four can elevate their game the 9ers will be a very potent team. If they don't, perhaps Johnson can surprise everyone and make a difference as a rookie.

Would not be surprised to see A Davis sitting on the bench at the beginning of the season. Can't see Harbaugh and company giving him as much latitude as Singletary did. I like veterans on the line but Iapati seems to be ready.

If the line can give the QB a bit more time Crabtree and Morgan should have very good years. While I really like Zeigler he is more a spot player unless he can stay healthy.

People blame alex for our 0-5 start, i think A. Davis was responsible for like 6-7 losses last year, from horrible play, untimely sacks or penalties, drive and momentum killing bad blocking.. etc.

Originally posted by unst4bl3:

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
VD and Morgan are the two most reliable receivers in the team. Walker and Zeigler are injury prone and Ginn and Crabtree are drop prone. If at least two of the latter four can elevate their game the 9ers will be a very potent team. If they don't, perhaps Johnson can surprise everyone and make a difference as a rookie.

Would not be surprised to see A Davis sitting on the bench at the beginning of the season. Can't see Harbaugh and company giving him as much latitude as Singletary did. I like veterans on the line but Iapati seems to be ready.

If the line can give the QB a bit more time Crabtree and Morgan should have very good years. While I really like Zeigler he is more a spot player unless he can stay healthy.

People blame alex for our 0-5 start, i think A. Davis was responsible for like 6-7 losses last year, from horrible play, untimely sacks or penalties, drive and momentum killing bad blocking.. etc.

so basically he is Harris 2.0....

Let's look back one year to 2009. Under the punt return category, the 8 fumbles we gave up led the entire league, not only in 2009, but would have also led the league in 2010. Last year, we had a total of 2, and one of those was a huge part of the loss to New Orleans on Monday Night, coughed up at our own 15 yard line by Phillip Adams, not Ted Ginn. Kyle Williams was injured most of the season, and there was no reason to use him with Ginn back there as a stable presence.

Ginn undoubtedly stabilized the punt return game. To go from a league worst 8 fumbles to 2 was a huge improvement. While the kick return game was not up to par, at least we weren't giving away games like we did in 2009 to Houston or one of the many gaffes committed throughout the season after Singletary cut Rossum without having a backup plan after that horrendous loss to Atlanta (Rossum wasn't even on the field for that game!). Having Delanie Walker back there returning was not much better than having Kentwan Balmer field kicks.

As we all know, Singletary and Raye had a caveman-like mentality towards offense. Mike Johnson was Singlebraincell's b***h, for the most part. Finally Jerry Sullivan and his teacher's pet receivers are gone. Let's throw out everything, and see what Harbaugh and Greg Roman are capable of before we start assessing our team's true talent.

I like DZ, but he won't be the same after the injury.


RIP Dolph Ziggler

I think that mostly we will run two TE and two WR, so probably only ~~15 plays a game with 3 WR.
I suspect this is the WR pecking order:
1. Crabtree
2. Morgan
3.a Kyle Williams
3.b Ron Johnson (Rojo)
5. Ginn . . . . then Zieglar, . . . then UDFA

Originally posted by NinerGM:
No sugar coating. Our WRs suck. Even Crabtree. Again, we need to purge this group of all the McCloughan f**k-ups.

Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:

Originally posted by nevadalove9ers2:

Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:

Originally posted by 5280High:
Anyone think Kyle Williams might develop? I really liked him before his injury but I still don't know if the niners are gonne be running an offense where he could be successful. Doesn't look like it IMO.

he will be our slot/speedy guy he is a gin but with better hands

He's no where near as fast as Ginn.

combine numbers ginn was faster by only.02 seconds

and in pro day kyle williams was faster by .02 seconds


so tehyre about the same speed

Zieglar has been working hard getting back from his ACL injury. He'll compete

Originally posted by unst4bl3:

Originally posted by buck:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
DZ is our current model of Thomas Clayton and Nate Davis.

On a side note: I find it almost funny that many people on this board are shoving Ginn out the door already. He is the only deep threat we have on the team at WR, and he still is the best returner on the team. He may end getting cut (who knows how this is all going to shake out), but people are dismissing him way too early at this point, especially with a lock-out.

I agree with you on Ginn. If the offense gets some creative play action plays and can sell the defense on it consistently, Ginn could see something like 40-60 catches with a 16 ypc average. Good coaching is about putting your players in a position to succeed, let's hope the niners finally found someone capable of doing it instead of saying it.

His hands are pretty bad though. Still can't believe Holmes is the better receiver of the two coming out of college. I remember watching the HS All-American Game and the announcers were actually making the argument that Ginn could transition straight to the NFL from highschool. (This was during the Clarett/Williams Lawsuit/fiasco against the NFL trying to waive the 2 yr college requirement).... Boy were they off.

In the end I think Ziggy gets cut over Ginn, Kyle W. is quick and speedy but it's gonna be hard for the coaches to ignore Ginn's straight line speed and play making potential.

Ted Ginn has the speed to be a deep threat, but I am not sure that he really can be classified as a deep threat.

Last year he only had 12 receptions for 163 yards with 1 touchdown. He averaged 13.6 per catch.

I would say his job is on the line, but even with that paltry production he was the third leading WR on the team.

How many drops did he have thougH? thats the real stat..

True, Ginn can't catch. The majority of the decision to keep Ginn might rest with Seely and whether he thinks Ginn is that far ahead of other Punt Returner options. If Seely thinks he can do just as well with Adams, Williams, Rojo, or anyone else wanting a shot, then it really becomes a hard decision and turns into offensive production which he is lacking.

Another thing to keep in mind is that we still gave up value for Ginn, though it wasn't much... it's more than we gave for Zeigler. And I don't remember the timing but I believe the move was made under Baalke's interim GM watch, so ego's may also start coming into the decision as well.

Watch out for Kevin jurovich this year, he's been working with Alex all off season so he'll have a chance to look good whenever the coaches get to work with these guys.

Originally posted by 5280High:

Another thing to keep in mind is that we still gave up value for Ginn, though it wasn't much... it's more than we gave for Zeigler. And I don't remember the timing but I believe the move was made under Baalke's interim GM watch, so ego's may also start coming into the decision as well.

That's an absolutely ridiculous notion. We parted with a 5th rounder to get a former 1st round pick. I don't think "value" is a part of the equation unless you are referring to how we screwed the Dolphins, or the Dolphins screwed themselves.

Originally posted by Psinex:

Originally posted by 5280High:

Another thing to keep in mind is that we still gave up value for Ginn, though it wasn't much... it's more than we gave for Zeigler. And I don't remember the timing but I believe the move was made under Baalke's interim GM watch, so ego's may also start coming into the decision as well.

That's an absolutely ridiculous notion. We parted with a 5th rounder to get a former 1st round pick. I don't think "value" is a part of the equation unless you are referring to how we screwed the Dolphins, or the Dolphins screwed themselves.

True it was a late rounder... but it was still a draft pick, compared to an UDFA. Im just saying at some point of the decision making process it could be taken into account, not that it will. In any personel file there has to be a section on how a player was acquired, if in the eyes of the coaches the players are neck and neck in terms of roster cuts... then you cut the person that was free, not the person who you gave up something for.

Ultimately it is up to the coaches to put together what they think the best 53 are, but as a "tie-breaker", this might (not will)be what they defer to. Just my $0.02.

edit, delete once the above post is gone