What exactly is make or break for you?

Originally posted by mryan1004:
i just dont agree with blaming everything on the line. do we need help absolutely 100%, but again smith is behind the same line that gore has had his success behind

The difference is Gore has proven to be very GOOD, while Smith has proven to be very mediocre.

Still, all the deficiencies I pointed out with Smith are not dependent upon the offensive line.

I don't have stats in mind, it is the intangible playmaker stuff I want to see consistently...Become clutch on 3rd down passes to sustain drives. Finish drives with TDs. Minimal bonehead interception plays. Lead the offense to victory even when the defense isn't playing at their best.

Originally posted by fly15:
Prediction: Alex will start, he'll be benched by the 4th regular game, Carr will take over the rest of the season.

Prediction: Alex plays well the first four games but there will be some who refuse to give him any credit whatsoever.

Originally posted by BHulman:

Originally posted by fly15:
Prediction: Alex will start, he'll be benched by the 4th regular game, Carr will take over the rest of the season.

Prediction: Alex plays well the first four games but there will be some who refuse to give him any credit whatsoever.

Prediction: Alex sucks (again) - this time, because the team keeps changing GMs on him.

First of all the source for the article is Tim Kawakami, the only Bay Area sports writer that makes Ray Ratto look optomistic. So you have to keep a little perspective.

That being said, Alex needs a QB rating around 90 and a 10-6 record to make sure he is the QB of the future. 9-7 and the playoffs probably gets him another couple of years. Anything short of that and they will start looking to replace him.

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

Originally posted by djfullshred:
I don't have stats in mind, it is the intangible playmaker stuff I want to see consistently...Become clutch on 3rd down passes to sustain drives. Finish drives with TDs. Minimal bonehead interception plays. Lead the offense to victory even when the defense isn't playing at their best.

I agree with this. If he can do these things, Alex will become a GOOD QB. The problem is all the deficiencies I pointed out earlier, you know the ones not associated with the offensive line, are what is keeping him from doing these things.

Originally posted by BHulman:

Originally posted by fly15:
Prediction: Alex will start, he'll be benched by the 4th regular game, Carr will take over the rest of the season.

Prediction: Alex plays well the first four games but there will be some who refuse to give him any credit whatsoever.

What do you consider "well?" If he's playing at mediocrity like usual, then no, he will not get credit even though YOU might think he's playing well.

220 yards, 2 TDs and 1 INT and 4/11 on 3rd downs from a spread offense is not playing "well" to me.

So again, what do you consider "well?"

Originally posted by dbdublin:

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

If you didn't want him brought up, you shouldn't have mentioned him.

How many years should he sit and watch before you people feel he can contribute? 5? 6? 10?

It's funny how people who want Alex to be the guy refuse to give anyone else a chance. "Nate Davis is too raw, he can't succeed right away because Alex couldn't do it, he needs to sit and learn.." Clearly some of you don't understand that Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith and he may or may not have the same results if given playing time early in his career.

So what is YOUR problem with Nate Davis? Why do you not want to see him get a chance? Is it because Alex Smith bombed when given a chance to start early in his career? If so, what about guys like Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez? Why didn't they bomb? After all, they were "thrown to the wolves" just like Alex Smith was. Let me guess, their O-Lines are the only reason those guys were successful, right? Yeah. Of course.

The point is none of you know a damn thing about Nate Davis, but you ASSUME he will fail if played early in his career and his confidence will be shattered because it happened to Alex Smith. Once again, Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith.

P.S. I'm not comparing Alex to Ryan, Flacco or Sanchez because each of those guys had a different situation on their plate. What I was pointing out is that a young QB CAN indeed be successful. Just because Alex wasn't doesn't mean Nate or any other young QB can't be.

[ Edited by 49erRider on Mar 26, 2010 at 10:36:19 ]

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by dbdublin:

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

If you didn't want him brought up, you shouldn't have mentioned him.

How many years should he sit and watch before you people feel he can contribute? 5? 6? 10?

It's funny how people who want Alex to be the guy refuse to give anyone else a chance. "Nate Davis is too raw, he can't succeed right away because Alex couldn't do it, he needs to sit and learn.." Clearly some of you don't understand that Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith and he may or may not have the same results if given playing time early in his career.

So what is YOUR problem with Nate Davis? Why do you not want to see him get a chance? Is it because Alex Smith bombed when given a chance to start early in his career? If so, what about guys like Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez? Why didn't they bomb? After all, they were "thrown to the wolves" just like Alex Smith was. Let me guess, their O-Lines are the only reason those guys were successful, right? Yeah. Of course.

The point is none of you know a damn thing about Nate Davis, but you ASSUME he will fail if played early in his career and his confidence will be shattered because it happened to Alex Smith. Once again, Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith.

P.S. I'm not comparing Alex to Ryan, Flacco or Sanchez because each of those guys had a different situation on their plate. What I was pointing out is that a young QB CAN indeed be successful. Just because Alex wasn't doesn't mean Nate or any other young QB can't be.

I suspect that the reason may have been because it has all been said before, rather than a dig at the player himself.

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by dbdublin:

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

If you didn't want him brought up, you shouldn't have mentioned him.

How many years should he sit and watch before you people feel he can contribute? 5? 6? 10?

It's funny how people who want Alex to be the guy refuse to give anyone else a chance. "Nate Davis is too raw, he can't succeed right away because Alex couldn't do it, he needs to sit and learn.." Clearly some of you don't understand that Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith and he may or may not have the same results if given playing time early in his career.

So what is YOUR problem with Nate Davis? Why do you not want to see him get a chance? Is it because Alex Smith bombed when given a chance to start early in his career? If so, what about guys like Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez? Why didn't they bomb? After all, they were "thrown to the wolves" just like Alex Smith was. Let me guess, their O-Lines are the only reason those guys were successful, right? Yeah. Of course.

The point is none of you know a damn thing about Nate Davis, but you ASSUME he will fail if played early in his career and his confidence will be shattered because it happened to Alex Smith. Once again, Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith.

P.S. I'm not comparing Alex to Ryan, Flacco or Sanchez because each of those guys had a different situation on their plate. What I was pointing out is that a young QB CAN indeed be successful. Just because Alex wasn't doesn't mean Nate or any other young QB can't be.

I suspect that the reason may have been because it has all been said before, rather than a dig at the player himself.

Gotcha.. But if that's the case, the arguments for and against Alex Smith have all been made before as well.

I think Nate can be a legitimate option. It's not like Alex Smith has done anything to make us forget we have 2 other QBs on the roster.

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by dbdublin:

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

If you didn't want him brought up, you shouldn't have mentioned him.

How many years should he sit and watch before you people feel he can contribute? 5? 6? 10?

It's funny how people who want Alex to be the guy refuse to give anyone else a chance. "Nate Davis is too raw, he can't succeed right away because Alex couldn't do it, he needs to sit and learn.." Clearly some of you don't understand that Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith and he may or may not have the same results if given playing time early in his career.

So what is YOUR problem with Nate Davis? Why do you not want to see him get a chance? Is it because Alex Smith bombed when given a chance to start early in his career? If so, what about guys like Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez? Why didn't they bomb? After all, they were "thrown to the wolves" just like Alex Smith was. Let me guess, their O-Lines are the only reason those guys were successful, right? Yeah. Of course.

The point is none of you know a damn thing about Nate Davis, but you ASSUME he will fail if played early in his career and his confidence will be shattered because it happened to Alex Smith. Once again, Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith.

P.S. I'm not comparing Alex to Ryan, Flacco or Sanchez because each of those guys had a different situation on their plate. What I was pointing out is that a young QB CAN indeed be successful. Just because Alex wasn't doesn't mean Nate or any other young QB can't be.

I suspect that the reason may have been because it has all been said before, rather than a dig at the player himself.

Gotcha.. But if that's the case, the arguments for and against Alex Smith have all been made before as well.

I think Nate can be a legitimate option. It's not like Alex Smith has done anything to make us forget we have 2 other QBs on the roster.

But 75% of the zone thinks Davis can't immediately be successful directly because of Alex's non-success. I think it is an atrocity and looking at Nate Davis' nubers in college, under center, I think he can truly challenge Carr and Smith in camp right now if he had some reps.

Originally posted by ninerfan818:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by dbdublin:

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

If you didn't want him brought up, you shouldn't have mentioned him.

How many years should he sit and watch before you people feel he can contribute? 5? 6? 10?

It's funny how people who want Alex to be the guy refuse to give anyone else a chance. "Nate Davis is too raw, he can't succeed right away because Alex couldn't do it, he needs to sit and learn.." Clearly some of you don't understand that Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith and he may or may not have the same results if given playing time early in his career.

So what is YOUR problem with Nate Davis? Why do you not want to see him get a chance? Is it because Alex Smith bombed when given a chance to start early in his career? If so, what about guys like Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez? Why didn't they bomb? After all, they were "thrown to the wolves" just like Alex Smith was. Let me guess, their O-Lines are the only reason those guys were successful, right? Yeah. Of course.

The point is none of you know a damn thing about Nate Davis, but you ASSUME he will fail if played early in his career and his confidence will be shattered because it happened to Alex Smith. Once again, Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith.

P.S. I'm not comparing Alex to Ryan, Flacco or Sanchez because each of those guys had a different situation on their plate. What I was pointing out is that a young QB CAN indeed be successful. Just because Alex wasn't doesn't mean Nate or any other young QB can't be.

I suspect that the reason may have been because it has all been said before, rather than a dig at the player himself.

Gotcha.. But if that's the case, the arguments for and against Alex Smith have all been made before as well.

I think Nate can be a legitimate option. It's not like Alex Smith has done anything to make us forget we have 2 other QBs on the roster.

But 75% of the zone thinks Davis can't immediately be successful directly because of Alex's non-success. I think it is an atrocity and looking at Nate Davis' nubers in college, under center, I think he can truly challenge Carr and Smith in camp right now if he had some reps.

I don't know about 75% but I am one that feels he is a work in progress who may or may not become an NFL qb in due course. There has been vast numbers of college qb's who just couldn't make the jump, and performance in an early preseason game is no real pointer.

But if the guy is really that good and NFL ready, how come you have noticed but none of the coaches have? How come none of the other players aren't beating the drum for him? It's a long jump from college, and mostly it used to take a few years. Colleges tend to turn out a more NFL-ready product now, and economic pressures force teams to try them early. But with our line I am glad he is still in development. An early start did Smith no favours.

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by ninerfan818:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by 49erRider:

Originally posted by dbdublin:

Please, please folks, don't start with the Nate Davis routine. I'm begging you.

If you didn't want him brought up, you shouldn't have mentioned him.

How many years should he sit and watch before you people feel he can contribute? 5? 6? 10?

It's funny how people who want Alex to be the guy refuse to give anyone else a chance. "Nate Davis is too raw, he can't succeed right away because Alex couldn't do it, he needs to sit and learn.." Clearly some of you don't understand that Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith and he may or may not have the same results if given playing time early in his career.

So what is YOUR problem with Nate Davis? Why do you not want to see him get a chance? Is it because Alex Smith bombed when given a chance to start early in his career? If so, what about guys like Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco or Mark Sanchez? Why didn't they bomb? After all, they were "thrown to the wolves" just like Alex Smith was. Let me guess, their O-Lines are the only reason those guys were successful, right? Yeah. Of course.

The point is none of you know a damn thing about Nate Davis, but you ASSUME he will fail if played early in his career and his confidence will be shattered because it happened to Alex Smith. Once again, Nate Davis is NOT Alex Smith.

P.S. I'm not comparing Alex to Ryan, Flacco or Sanchez because each of those guys had a different situation on their plate. What I was pointing out is that a young QB CAN indeed be successful. Just because Alex wasn't doesn't mean Nate or any other young QB can't be.

I suspect that the reason may have been because it has all been said before, rather than a dig at the player himself.

Gotcha.. But if that's the case, the arguments for and against Alex Smith have all been made before as well.

I think Nate can be a legitimate option. It's not like Alex Smith has done anything to make us forget we have 2 other QBs on the roster.

But 75% of the zone thinks Davis can't immediately be successful directly because of Alex's non-success. I think it is an atrocity and looking at Nate Davis' nubers in college, under center, I think he can truly challenge Carr and Smith in camp right now if he had some reps.

I don't know about 75% but I am one that feels he is a work in progress who may or may not become an NFL qb in due course. There has been vast numbers of college qb's who just couldn't make the jump, and performance in an early preseason game is no real pointer.

But if the guy is really that good and NFL ready, how come you have noticed but none of the coaches have? How come none of the other players aren't beating the drum for him? It's a long jump from college, and mostly it used to take a few years. Colleges tend to turn out a more NFL-ready product now, and economic pressures force teams to try them early. But with our line I am glad he is still in development. An early start did Smith no favours.

English, our management/coaches have been stuck on the Smith bandwagon for 5 years plus. What makes you think they have any idea of talent at the position. Any other team would have cut Smith long ago.

It is ever more apparent that they don't want to damage Alex's fragile ego as opposed to trying to find an adequate replacement/challenger for the position. Really poor decision making if you ask me. Just because I am not the GM doesn't make my opinion any more or less valid. It just means that I really have no say in the matter, obviously.

On your basis that some QB's need time to mature and develop. Yes, some do (Alex, though I think he has reached his ceiling, talent wise) bu I truly believe Nate could come in now and challenge. He has more tangibles than Smith does. Regardless of who he played against. Smith in pre-seasons past NEVER looked that good, even against 3rd stringers.

Go Niners!!!

i think Alex is going to be very good. last year he showed huge improvement and he came in mid-season and they had to tweak the offense halfway through the year, he didnt have timing with the receivers and he still did pretty good. i think these factors along with our hopefully improved line and continuity he will have in the same offense tailored to his strengths are reason to believe he will be much better this year. as far as nate davis i think he will be a very good QB, the guy has all the tools to succeed but i think alex is more ready to play right now and we need to find out if continuity was the main issue in his development so he must start this year. nate will get his shot. steve young didnt start till he was 30 for us and he turned out fine. we have a 25 year old former 1st overall pick who is showing signs of becoming the man and he will start.

If we make the playoffs or not will be make or break for me. If we cant win the NFC west then I will s**t myself.