Buyer Beware: The Cardinals Game Was A Fluke

Originally posted by bzborow1:
meh. We played a good game, whoop-a-dee-do. The Colts play good games every week.

And your point is what?

Yep, that's why we play the game brutha. I have no real expectations of this team winning the Superbowl or going deep into the play-offs this season, but just making it there would be huge. A win is a win is a win, even if it's a fluke it instills confidence. Here's to another fluke in Philly this Sunday.



[ Edited by vermonator on Dec 16, 2009 at 14:30:08 ]

Originally posted by NinerGM:

Originally posted by Gavintech:

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Parcells said - and I'll repeat for over-reacting NinerTalk:

"You are what your record says you are - no more, no less."

So those who say we're terrible, we're not terrible. Those who say that keeping up with the Vikes, Colts, and Texans proves we're better than our record are also wrong.

The Niners are what their record says they are.

Parcells has said a lot of stupid things.

Yes which explains why you're a GM of a franchise with a winning record for two seasons now and your not ..... oh wait...!

What? Now you're taking after Parcells.

Originally posted by Gavintech:

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Parcells said - and I'll repeat for over-reacting NinerTalk:

"You are what your record says you are - no more, no less."

So those who say we're terrible, we're not terrible. Those who say that keeping up with the Vikes, Colts, and Texans proves we're better than our record are also wrong.

The Niners are what their record says they are.

Parcells has said a lot of stupid things.

And that's not one of them.

But the games against the Vikes and Colts have shown that we aren't far away.

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by AB83Rules:
Sorry, dont agree MadDog, yeah they beat a good Vikes team, but the D came out and out played the cards last nite.

We deserved it, and we arent a terrible team, we have talent, and we proved it.

The only game we werent in was the Atlanta game, all the others we have won or lost close. Thats not a bad team. Thats a team with some questions, but a team that doesnt give up or in.

You are right. We are not a terrible team. But, we are also not a good team. We lost the Seahawks last week, and they are not a good team. We have a losing record, and a ton of issues, including the inability to run consistently from week to week, cover anyone on the secondary, etc.

So based on your rationale, Arizona is not a good team. According to your logic they just lost to the Niners (twice) who as you pointed out is not a good team. And the Niners lost to Seattle, who you also pointed out is not a good team, hence making us and the Cardinals bad teams. Oh and Seattle.

[b][b]No. What I am saying is that the team many are trumpeting to have turned the corner was one that played poorly eight days ago, and has been wildly inconsistent all year long.

[b]A good team is marked by their consistency. Any team can have a great week. The good teams show a consistency the Niners do not possess at this point[/b].

[/b][/b]
Well that kind of is what you are saying. Arizona is inconsistent this year just as they were last year, thus making them not a good team according to you. Unless you believe that Arizona is a consistent team, which I don't believe they are and they have proven that with losses to bad teams. I am not disagreeing with the overall gist of your post, not getting over-excited after one impressive victory. But I also believe the Niners are on the cusp of something special and as you said before, it will be in 2010.

Learn how to use the Bold feature before you call someone out, grass hoppa. You will look more enlightened and less like n00b spoiling for fight.

~Ceadder

[ Edited by Ceadderman on Dec 16, 2009 at 14:49:50 ]

Originally posted by Tombo:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
The striking emotional reaction to this thread is indicative of the highly-charged roller coaster swings that limit intelligent discussion on the board. It also shows the ever-changing manic mood swings that can take place from one week to the next. Last week, the board was littered with thread declaring that this team stunk, the coaches stunk, the defense stunk, and more. Suddenly, for many (not all, so please do not become hyper-sensitive), all of the problems of the past are rectified in one 3 hour stretch of time, and we are headed to the gloryland. It is simply not true.

Instead of discussing whether the OL is now fixed, the CB's are going to play at a high level, whether the team will be more balanced on offense, whether the team has established a consistent pass rush, many people are resorting to name-calling, challenges of loyalty to the team, and profanity.

I ask those who are emotionally charged to discuss the issue on this thread. You don not need to take the original post personal. This is, after all, a football franchise, not your spouse, kids, grandchildren or Tiger Woods' lovers. If you truly believe the team has turned a corner, make that the focus of your discussion. Challenge my argument.

I believe the results we saw yesterday were way out of whack with reality. Thus, the original argument.

I see what you're trying to say, but I don't think many people here think that way-that we're all of a sudden an elite team. Having said that, I do believe we have taken the first big step. How many years in a row now have we been blown out by some really good teams after getting our hopes up after a win over a mediocre team? Atlanta aside (poor coaching--1st year OC), we have been very close to winning more than a few games. Add a few players--O-line, d-backs, and pass rusher, and I think we will be a scary team. Oh, and how could I forget punt/kickoff returner?!! I know you're a true Niner fan, and I feel your frustration, but I feel we've turned the corner, and are finally headed the right direction. I just hope that Alex pans out. Here's to great things to come! (Come on, take a sip of the Kool-Aid, it ain't half bad!)

We aren't?

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~Ceadder

I wouldn't call it a "fluke", but I see what MD is saying.

Basically it's impossible to lose when you get 7 tos and it's a "fluke" for a team to have that many TOs. But let's give our guys credit, every single one of those TOs were forced and if they're gonna give them to us it's our job to take them and we did.

I honestly think we pwn Zona. Last year we lost cuz of a TO heavy game on our part and Martz being unable to tell the difference between the 2nd and 3rd yard line. I think we just know how to beat them.

If we beat Philly I might think more highly of this game but we all know thats not likely to happen. But it sure was great to beat the snot out of Zona on national TV. I couldn't even sleep it was so exciting.

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Originally posted by AB83Rules:
Sorry, dont agree MadDog, yeah they beat a good Vikes team, but the D came out and out played the cards last nite.

We deserved it, and we arent a terrible team, we have talent, and we proved it.

The only game we werent in was the Atlanta game, all the others we have won or lost close. Thats not a bad team. Thats a team with some questions, but a team that doesnt give up or in.

You are right. We are not a terrible team. But, we are also not a good team. We lost the Seahawks last week, and they are not a good team. We have a losing record, and a ton of issues, including the inability to run consistently from week to week, cover anyone on the secondary, etc.

So based on your rationale, Arizona is not a good team. According to your logic they just lost to the Niners (twice) who as you pointed out is not a good team. And the Niners lost to Seattle, who you also pointed out is not a good team, hence making us and the Cardinals bad teams. Oh and Seattle.

[b][b]No. What I am saying is that the team many are trumpeting to have turned the corner was one that played poorly eight days ago, and has been wildly inconsistent all year long.

[b]A good team is marked by their consistency. Any team can have a great week. The good teams show a consistency the Niners do not possess at this point[/b].

[/b][/b]
Well that kind of is what you are saying. Arizona is inconsistent this year just as they were last year, thus making them not a good team according to you. Unless you believe that Arizona is a consistent team, which I don't believe they are and they have proven that with losses to bad teams. I am not disagreeing with the overall gist of your post, not getting over-excited after one impressive victory. But I also believe the Niners are on the cusp of something special and as you said before, it will be in 2010.

Learn how to use the Bold feature before you call someone out, grass hoppa. You will look more enlightened and less like n00b spoiling for fight.

~Ceadder

A thousand apologies. Maybe when I can get the time to post 6,000+ times I will have mastered this artform. Clearly not using the bold feature properly makes everything I said much less valid, that and being a noob.

Good s**t Hoovtrain.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

The same goes for Frank Gore, who looked terrific. However, let's not kid ourselves. Gore is a middle of the road running back. He's going to have a few great games, some average games, and some poor games. This was one of those special nights where everything fell into place.

This is a very dumb comment and I quit reading your nonsense after the above quote. Gore is a special player and is more than capable of having a game like Monday Night on any given day. It's the offensive line and poor play calling that prevent it from happening and anyone who can't see that needs to admit to themselves that they don't know sh*t about football. Frank Gore is an elite player and can do that same type of damage to any team as long as the line opens up some holes. If you put Adrian Peterson, or any RB in history who is not named Barry Sanders for that matter, behind an O-Line that can't block for him and an offensive coordinator who is as clueless and predictable as Jimmy Raye, performances like Frank Gore's will be few and far between.

Another thing.. It was pretty obvious the Cardinals were preparing to stop the pass due to the fact we were throwing the ball 75% of the time over the last few games, which is the reason the linemen were able to create some lanes for Frank Gore. Had we not been pass-happy the last few games, the Cardinals probably would have prepared for Gore instead of the spread passing game and we would have been shut down as usual. Singletary likes to talk about balance, but we've seen none of it outside of Monday night. The Cards had to respect the pass because of the frequency at which we've been passing and they got burned on the ground.

The bottom line is Gore needs help and the O-Line is more to blame than Frank for any lack of production in the ground game. He's proven to be a premiere back and when the line does their job at a somewhat decent level, he destroys defenses. If Frank had the line that Peterson has in Minnesota he'd be leading the league in rushing yards every year.

I did not care for your post kind Sir.

Originally posted by Butter:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

-quote snipped-

So, I raise a toast to the David Baas', Dashon Goldson's, Ahmad Brooks', Dre Bly's, Adam Snyder's of the world this week, fully knowing that these players had terrific games. But, let's be realistic in our expectation of these guys down the road.

It is simply one week in the NFL. One wild and wacky week.

Its funny that you pointed those specific guys out. After bearing much of brunt of the fans frustration this season, Baas looked fantastic in this game. When he was pulling, out leading the rush, he opened up some freeways for Gore. Maybe he's just one of those players who has the ability to get up for certain games, but can't maintain that level all season.

Personally, I still think that Baas and Snyder need to be upgraded. I am optimistic about the potential of Goldson and Brooks. And I think it'd be great if the Niners could keep Bly for depth next year. However, if the Niners have a chance in the offseason to upgrade any of those positions, I think they would do it.

Finally, over the last few games, I always try to factor in the reality that a lot of teams are sitting their best players because of injury or the chance to evaluate younger players as well. So in the final couple of games, some of our guys might look better against the sub-packages.

I just had an unsettling thought pop into my head, but don't know the answer. Is Baas in a contract year? Might he have been auditioning on national TV? I know someone here will have that answer at their fingertips.

Originally posted by BSofSF:

Originally posted by Butter:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

-quote snipped-

So, I raise a toast to the David Baas', Dashon Goldson's, Ahmad Brooks', Dre Bly's, Adam Snyder's of the world this week, fully knowing that these players had terrific games. But, let's be realistic in our expectation of these guys down the road.

It is simply one week in the NFL. One wild and wacky week.

Its funny that you pointed those specific guys out. After bearing much of brunt of the fans frustration this season, Baas looked fantastic in this game. When he was pulling, out leading the rush, he opened up some freeways for Gore. Maybe he's just one of those players who has the ability to get up for certain games, but can't maintain that level all season.

Personally, I still think that Baas and Snyder need to be upgraded. I am optimistic about the potential of Goldson and Brooks. And I think it'd be great if the Niners could keep Bly for depth next year. However, if the Niners have a chance in the offseason to upgrade any of those positions, I think they would do it.

Finally, over the last few games, I always try to factor in the reality that a lot of teams are sitting their best players because of injury or the chance to evaluate younger players as well. So in the final couple of games, some of our guys might look better against the sub-packages.

I just had an unsettling thought pop into my head, but don't know the answer. Is Baas in a contract year? Might he have been auditioning on national TV? I know someone here will have that answer at their fingertips.

Baas is signed till this year.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
It was nice to go to bed late last night with a studly victory over a hated divisional rival, especially the Arizona Cardinals. The team played well, the coaching staff seemed prepared, and the fans were pumped.

Now, back to reality.

Niners' fans have to take this game for what it is: A fluke. The Cardinals are a better team than the Niners right now, but as we know, every game is a new game, and you can only take one game at a time. This was one game. A great game for the Niners, and a stinker for the Cards.

Any victory is sweet, but the reality is that the Cardinals had no business turning the ball over seven times. Our defense is simply not that good, and their offense is simply not that bad. I hope fans do not expect the defense to be a turnover-creating machine from every game on out. This was an exception.

The same goes for Frank Gore, who looked terrific. However, let's not kid ourselves. Gore is a middle of the road running back. He's going to have a few great games, some average games, and some poor games. This was one of those special nights where everything fell into place.

The offensive line opened up huge holes, and dominated the Cardinals DL throughout the game. However, this is not our normal OL. We have struggled all season, and I doubt this one game changes the reality that our line generally stinks.

And, I sincerely doubt that our team suddenly falls back into the "smashmouth" philosophy. Who would we be kidding? We are a passing team that works best when the field is spread out. It just so happened that for one week, we could line up in a regular offensive formation and run at will.

Our CB's contained Fitzgerald and Boldin to less than 70 yards receiving TOTAL, but let's be realistic. Our passing defense was amongst the worst in the NFL going into the game, and I sincerely doubt that we are going to play weekly at a high level. It was just a wierd, wierd game.

And, finally, for those who think the Niners' pass rush has been solved, this would be another mirage. No doubt that we should salute the excellent effort of Justin Smith, Ahmad Brooks, Parys Haralson, and company. But once again, the offensive line performance this week by the Cardinals was a joke. If they played this poorly the week before, they would have surrendered 56 sacks to Jared Allen and the Vikings. They just stunk for a week, and we looked fresh.

So, while celebrating this victory, which was very sweet, the reality is that this game is indicative of the NFL. One week you can stink, and the next you can shine. The week before, the Cards whacked the Vikings and the Niners lose to the crappy Seahawks. This week, the Seahawks were crushed by the Texans 34-7, the Vikings destroyed the Bengals 30-10, and the Niners defeat a good Cardinals team.

So, I raise a toast to the David Baas', Dashon Goldson's, Ahmad Brooks', Dre Bly's, Adam Snyder's of the world this week, fully knowing that these players had terrific games. But, let's be realistic in our expectation of these guys down the road.

It is simply one week in the NFL. One wild and wacky week.

GOD DAMM HATER! SHUT THE F UP!!!

Originally posted by BSofSF:

Originally posted by Butter:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:

-quote snipped-

So, I raise a toast to the David Baas', Dashon Goldson's, Ahmad Brooks', Dre Bly's, Adam Snyder's of the world this week, fully knowing that these players had terrific games. But, let's be realistic in our expectation of these guys down the road.

It is simply one week in the NFL. One wild and wacky week.

Its funny that you pointed those specific guys out. After bearing much of brunt of the fans frustration this season, Baas looked fantastic in this game. When he was pulling, out leading the rush, he opened up some freeways for Gore. Maybe he's just one of those players who has the ability to get up for certain games, but can't maintain that level all season.

Personally, I still think that Baas and Snyder need to be upgraded. I am optimistic about the potential of Goldson and Brooks. And I think it'd be great if the Niners could keep Bly for depth next year. However, if the Niners have a chance in the offseason to upgrade any of those positions, I think they would do it.

Finally, over the last few games, I always try to factor in the reality that a lot of teams are sitting their best players because of injury or the chance to evaluate younger players as well. So in the final couple of games, some of our guys might look better against the sub-packages.

I just had an unsettling thought pop into my head, but don't know the answer. Is Baas in a contract year? Might he have been auditioning on national TV? I know someone here will have that answer at their fingertips.

Yes he was and that is the very reason he should not be resigned imo. If he plays that well against PHI, DET, and STL well maybe I'll eat the crow. Doubt that happens though.