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Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

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May 13, 2022 at 7:37 AM
  • mayo49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 65,216
Tear it up, Trey.
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May 13, 2022 at 7:40 AM
This is kind of long but it's pretty interesting. Talks about the draft but also goes quite a bit into the situation with Lance. I like this kid Vish a lot. Really has sensible takes on things and has a way of delivering his opinions that make them easy to digest even if you don't always agree with him. Worth checking out if you haven't seen it.

May 13, 2022 at 10:10 AM
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
Originally posted by Hysterikal:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I can attest that NYniner85 was way, WAY off on Mahomes.

Yup. So where a lot of people. To be fair what I had issue with was legit. Talent ended up being the bigger then all those issues

I think Mahomes and Allen were great learning moments for a lot of people to take the talent

*Talent PLUS character/background. Mahomes had not one but TWO pro athletes in his family/close friends circle. There was no doubt he would understand what it takes to be a professional athlete. And both those guys have character for days.

Yup that stuff kinda gets lost in the shuffle by fans during the draft process. Having the talent and intangibles. For me with Mahomes it was just the lack of mechanics, the WTF are you doing throws, and just going rouge on plays. It was literally backyard football BUT he found the right HC, right system, and roster to harness all that god given ability...would Mahomes be who he is if say Adam Gase drafted him in NJ? I mean his talent/drive might overcome all that s**t, but he might not have gotten to be him and that's what makes him great.

Kyle loves his scheme no doubt. I do think he's realizing he needs a guy that can both run his offense and make a play when s**t breaks down. Watching Josh Allen destroy you regardless of your defensive scheme being on point opened his eyes. Watching Mahomes be Mahomes in the SB opened his eyes. If he wanted just a robot that will only run his offense and offered you nothing if s**t breaks down then maybe McCorkle would have been the pick. Clearly he wanted more and hopefully we see it all come to fruition, if it does I don't see how this offenses doesn't become elite.


If Trey had another full season of college QB play under his belt, he would have been the #1 pick. Niners got lucky.
[ Edited by SinceXVI on May 13, 2022 at 10:29 AM ]
May 13, 2022 at 10:38 AM
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 33,283
Originally posted by SinceXVI:

If Trey had another full season of college QB play under his belt, he would have been the #1 pick. Niners got lucky.

No doubt considering the lowly projected QB prospects coming out this past draft. I do think the 49ers foresaw that and acted aggressively in the 2021 draft.
That play above was rather simple but it takes an agile QB that can throw off platform to complete that pass.
May 13, 2022 at 10:45 AM
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
So many scribes hating on Lance. Problem is they have no clue about this team, never watched them with Garapollo, and just assume Lance blows. They don't know that we won in spite of Garapollo many times, not because of him. If Lance can just maintain even a level comparable with Jimmy, we will be fine. That shouldn't be that hard.

Jimmy's level is up around 70% accuracy, and despite test you may think, Jimmy led the team to many comeback wins with his clutch passes on the last drive of games. That's not a low bar. In 2019, Jimmy led 6 4th quarter comebacks.

Can Trey take the offense down the field with 40 seconds left in the game, needing a TD? He couldn't do it against AZ. The Texans game wasn't that close. At ND State, most of the games Trey started were blowouts so he didn't play many close games. We'll see whether or not Trey is a clutch QB.
May 13, 2022 at 10:47 AM
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by SinceXVI:

If Trey had another full season of college QB play under his belt, he would have been the #1 pick. Niners got lucky.

No doubt considering the lowly projected QB prospects coming out this past draft. I do think the 49ers foresaw that and acted aggressively in the 2021 draft.
That play above was rather simple but it takes an agile QB that can throw off platform to complete that pass.

Oh without question he would have been the top pick this yr if in the draft...not sure if he's talking about if Lance didn't lose that covid season, where he would have been drafted in 2021 Not a chance Lawrence still doesn't go #1 IMO....but Zach Wilson vs Lance with another season would have been debatable (if Lance played like he did his first yr) All what ifs, but fun to think about.
May 13, 2022 at 10:48 AM
Originally posted by Psinex:
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
So many scribes hating on Lance. Problem is they have no clue about this team, never watched them with Garapollo, and just assume Lance blows. They don't know that we won in spite of Garapollo many times, not because of him. If Lance can just maintain even a level comparable with Jimmy, we will be fine. That shouldn't be that hard.

Jimmy's level is up around 70% accuracy, and despite test you may think, Jimmy led the team to many comeback wins with his clutch passes on the last drive of games. That's not a low bar. In 2019, Jimmy led 6 4th quarter comebacks.

Can Trey take the offense down the field with 40 seconds left in the game, needing a TD? He couldn't do it against AZ. The Texans game wasn't that close. At ND State, most of the games Trey started were blowouts so he didn't play many close games. We'll see whether or not Trey is a clutch QB.

Jimmy G needs comeback wins because he fails to put teams away late in games

The Texans game wasnt close because Trey went super saiyan and destroyed them in the 2nd half
May 13, 2022 at 10:50 AM
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 33,283
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by SinceXVI:

If Trey had another full season of college QB play under his belt, he would have been the #1 pick. Niners got lucky.

No doubt considering the lowly projected QB prospects coming out this past draft. I do think the 49ers foresaw that and acted aggressively in the 2021 draft.
That play above was rather simple but it takes an agile QB that can throw off platform to complete that pass.

Oh without question he would have been the top pick this yr if in the draft...not sure if he's talking about if Lance didn't lose that covid season, where he would have been drafted in 2021 Not a chance Lawrence still doesn't go #1 IMO....but Zach Wilson vs Lance with another season would have been debatable (if Lance played like he did his first yr) All what ifs, but fun to think about.

Oh right. Maybe sinceXVI meant #1 in 2021 and I misunderstood. I think Lawrence still goes #1 too. I do think 49ers analyzed the 2021 class, then forecasted the 2022 draft and thought they needed to act now (in 2021).
May 13, 2022 at 10:53 AM

May 13, 2022 at 10:56 AM
Originally posted by SinceXVI:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
Originally posted by Hysterikal:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I can attest that NYniner85 was way, WAY off on Mahomes.

Yup. So where a lot of people. To be fair what I had issue with was legit. Talent ended up being the bigger then all those issues

I think Mahomes and Allen were great learning moments for a lot of people to take the talent

*Talent PLUS character/background. Mahomes had not one but TWO pro athletes in his family/close friends circle. There was no doubt he would understand what it takes to be a professional athlete. And both those guys have character for days.

Yup that stuff kinda gets lost in the shuffle by fans during the draft process. Having the talent and intangibles. For me with Mahomes it was just the lack of mechanics, the WTF are you doing throws, and just going rouge on plays. It was literally backyard football BUT he found the right HC, right system, and roster to harness all that god given ability...would Mahomes be who he is if say Adam Gase drafted him in NJ? I mean his talent/drive might overcome all that s**t, but he might not have gotten to be him and that's what makes him great.

Kyle loves his scheme no doubt. I do think he's realizing he needs a guy that can both run his offense and make a play when s**t breaks down. Watching Josh Allen destroy you regardless of your defensive scheme being on point opened his eyes. Watching Mahomes be Mahomes in the SB opened his eyes. If he wanted just a robot that will only run his offense and offered you nothing if s**t breaks down then maybe McCorkle would have been the pick. Clearly he wanted more and hopefully we see it all come to fruition, if it does I don't see how this offenses doesn't become elite.


If Trey had another full season of college QB play under his belt, he would have been the #1 pick. Niners got lucky.

I don't think it's necessarily luck because the reason why we were in range to trade up for him was because of the unlucky 2020 year. It was more organizational strategy and risk assessment imo. Some teams would've played it safe and decide last year was super unlucky and something that catastrophic wouldn't happen again. The niners decided to take a swing and weigh the risks of trading up and getting an unknown but also could bring more value. I'm sure the 2022 class and how bad it was also played into account in their valuation.
May 13, 2022 at 11:05 AM
Originally posted by Ghostofabshelmet:


3DQB Beck/house
May 13, 2022 at 11:07 AM
Originally posted by Tigerlaw:
Originally posted by Psinex:
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
So many scribes hating on Lance. Problem is they have no clue about this team, never watched them with Garapollo, and just assume Lance blows. They don't know that we won in spite of Garapollo many times, not because of him. If Lance can just maintain even a level comparable with Jimmy, we will be fine. That shouldn't be that hard.

Jimmy's level is up around 70% accuracy, and despite test you may think, Jimmy led the team to many comeback wins with his clutch passes on the last drive of games. That's not a low bar. In 2019, Jimmy led 6 4th quarter comebacks.

Can Trey take the offense down the field with 40 seconds left in the game, needing a TD? He couldn't do it against AZ. The Texans game wasn't that close. At ND State, most of the games Trey started were blowouts so he didn't play many close games. We'll see whether or not Trey is a clutch QB.

Jimmy G needs comeback wins because he fails to put teams away late in games

The Texans game wasnt close because Trey went super saiyan and destroyed them in the 2nd half

That is a ridiculous statement. You can like one QB without s**tting on another's accomplishments. Jimmy did a lot of good things for this team, including carrying the team to a couple of huge wins when the defense played like s**t, and more than a few clutch drives. If he could do that consistently, we wouldn't even have drafted Trey. When people post s**t like this it makes me think they don't understand the game any deeper than a Madden video game level understanding. We still don't know if Trey is up to the hype we have been hearing, we hope so. I liked the pick when it was made, and remain cautiously optimistic because we have put him in a good position to succeed. It is all up to him now to be the smart, tough, level-headed young man we have been told he is, and hit the ground running in the pros. The only part that has me much concerned is his accuracy, it was pretty bad last year in his small sample of actual playing time. Totally fixable problem.
May 13, 2022 at 11:07 AM
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
Originally posted by Hysterikal:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I can attest that NYniner85 was way, WAY off on Mahomes.

Yup. So where a lot of people. To be fair what I had issue with was legit. Talent ended up being the bigger then all those issues

I think Mahomes and Allen were great learning moments for a lot of people to take the talent

*Talent PLUS character/background. Mahomes had not one but TWO pro athletes in his family/close friends circle. There was no doubt he would understand what it takes to be a professional athlete. And both those guys have character for days.

Yup that stuff kinda gets lost in the shuffle by fans during the draft process. Having the talent and intangibles. For me with Mahomes it was just the lack of mechanics, the WTF are you doing throws, and just going rouge on plays. It was literally backyard football BUT he found the right HC, right system, and roster to harness all that god given ability...would Mahomes be who he is if say Adam Gase drafted him in NJ? I mean his talent/drive might overcome all that s**t, but he might not have gotten to be him and that's what makes him great.

Kyle loves his scheme no doubt. I do think he's realizing he needs a guy that can both run his offense and make a play when s**t breaks down. Watching Josh Allen destroy you regardless of your defensive scheme being on point opened his eyes. Watching Mahomes be Mahomes in the SB opened his eyes. If he wanted just a robot that will only run his offense and offered you nothing if s**t breaks down then maybe McCorkle would have been the pick. Clearly he wanted more and hopefully we see it all come to fruition, if it does I don't see how this offenses doesn't become elite.

I'd say almost. Talent is more important than scheme. Surrounding cast is, too. And I'd also say Aaron Rodgers would have succeeded where Alex Smith failed. Worst case Rodgers wouldn't have come close to 1TD to 11 INTs in his rookie year here. And I think Mahomes may not have had a 50 TD season, but he'd at worst be considered an up and comer, no matter who drafted him.

Because, again, he's still doing the WTF mechanics. He's just so good that he can get away with it. People missed the talent for the dogma.
May 13, 2022 at 11:15 AM
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
Originally posted by Hysterikal:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:
I can attest that NYniner85 was way, WAY off on Mahomes.

Yup. So where a lot of people. To be fair what I had issue with was legit. Talent ended up being the bigger then all those issues

I think Mahomes and Allen were great learning moments for a lot of people to take the talent

*Talent PLUS character/background. Mahomes had not one but TWO pro athletes in his family/close friends circle. There was no doubt he would understand what it takes to be a professional athlete. And both those guys have character for days.

Yup that stuff kinda gets lost in the shuffle by fans during the draft process. Having the talent and intangibles. For me with Mahomes it was just the lack of mechanics, the WTF are you doing throws, and just going rouge on plays. It was literally backyard football BUT he found the right HC, right system, and roster to harness all that god given ability...would Mahomes be who he is if say Adam Gase drafted him in NJ? I mean his talent/drive might overcome all that s**t, but he might not have gotten to be him and that's what makes him great.

Kyle loves his scheme no doubt. I do think he's realizing he needs a guy that can both run his offense and make a play when s**t breaks down. Watching Josh Allen destroy you regardless of your defensive scheme being on point opened his eyes. Watching Mahomes be Mahomes in the SB opened his eyes. If he wanted just a robot that will only run his offense and offered you nothing if s**t breaks down then maybe McCorkle would have been the pick. Clearly he wanted more and hopefully we see it all come to fruition, if it does I don't see how this offenses doesn't become elite.

I'd say almost. Talent is more important than scheme. Surrounding cast is, too. And I'd also say Aaron Rodgers would have succeeded where Alex Smith failed. Worst case Rodgers wouldn't have come close to 1TD to 11 INTs in his rookie year here. And I think Mahomes may not have had a 50 TD season, but he'd at worst be considered an up and comer, no matter who drafted him.

Because, again, he's still doing the WTF mechanics. He's just so good that he can get away with it. People missed the talent for the dogma.

Dude, Rodgers likely would've been even worse than Smith. Rogers is a prima donna with nowhere near the mental, or physical toughness of Smith. You take any talent and put them on that 2005 niners team, and they would've struggled mightily, even Tom Brady or Joe Montana. It was the second worst niner team I have seen in my 40 plus years of being a fan of the team, second only to the team that landed them the pick they took Smith with in the first place.
May 13, 2022 at 11:16 AM
Originally posted by Psinex:
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
So many scribes hating on Lance. Problem is they have no clue about this team, never watched them with Garapollo, and just assume Lance blows. They don't know that we won in spite of Garapollo many times, not because of him. If Lance can just maintain even a level comparable with Jimmy, we will be fine. That shouldn't be that hard.

Jimmy's level is up around 70% accuracy, and despite test you may think, Jimmy led the team to many comeback wins with his clutch passes on the last drive of games. That's not a low bar. In 2019, Jimmy led 6 4th quarter comebacks.

Can Trey take the offense down the field with 40 seconds left in the game, needing a TD? He couldn't do it against AZ. The Texans game wasn't that close. At ND State, most of the games Trey started were blowouts so he didn't play many close games. We'll see whether or not Trey is a clutch QB.

The problem with "accuracy" is this: the main reason we lost the Super Bowl, it seems to me, is that two complete passes were made short of the sticks on 3rd down in the red zone, when other guys were open passed the sticks. Both of those passes were not just complete but accurate.

As for 4QC, in the metric 4QC/(4QC+Losses+0.01), a modified version of it to assess a sort of 4QC percentage, Jimmy was ranked 7th in 2021. So it is indeed true he's one of the more trustworthy QBs in the key moments. He's also one of the best QBs at passes on third down that convert to first. BUT... he's not so great in the rest of the game. Who knows why? It's been suggested that maybe it's because in the no-huddle, defenses are simplified, which reduces his need to read defenses post-snap.
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