Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by Afrikan:
Oh ok.

Edit-I was watching footage of that game last night and that call for Juice still pisses me off. Like we just ran it the previous week. I wonder where the communication went wrong.

Many internet personalities that review game film believe it was supposed to be a toss to Trey

a counter attack play based on the fact we ran the same play the previous week and were luring them in

game film review shows left side of line and trey break left when the ball is snapped

juice allegedly ran the wrong version of the play and kept it

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NCommand:
No, I said this is Kyle-thing. He is conservative and plays to probability. He'll be the same with Trey too.

He just talked about this the other day too. Now, if he HAD a Tyreek Hill, sure, he'd dial him up more but still be conservative and calculated with those shots. Eric Davis also talked about how most deeper routes are just ghost routes...defenders know this too. Need more evidence? Kyle himself a few games ago, said instead of going to Kittle with 2 defenders on him (INT) noted the next read (correct) was a check down...NOT the wide open deeper ghost route run by Sherfield (?) which fans thought was an easy TD. Jimmy himself confirmed playing within the play calls. Trey started and it was the exact same thing.

Let's just watch for it going forward and see if anything changes.

It still doesn't mean Deebo and Aiyuk strengths are suddenly deep threats. They, to fit Kyle's philosophy, are quick-area YAC monsters.

The body-slam sack where Garoppolo got injured? Kyle had max protect with both Kittle and Juice in to help with pass protection. 3rd and 10. Jennings was 4 yards short of the market. Garoppolo was waiting for either Deebo or Aiyuk to get open deeper. They couldn't. Game over. 49ers career over.

Great attempt at the deflection. IDGAF what Kyle or Eric Davis said, I'm talking about what YOU said. Don't make me dig it up, you know what you said regarding us not having the "speed" and all that junk you were spewing regarding this.

Yes. We don't have deep speed (like Goodwin had --- it helps). LOL.

Nobody is giving Kittle, Deebo and Aiyuk massive cushions because of their deep speed or prowess to get deep.

To my point, Benjamin does (or did) have that speed and we've attempted, what, one shot to him? Case. In. Point.

But keep telling me we have deep threats. Classic.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NCommand:
No, I said this is Kyle-thing. He is conservative and plays to probability. He'll be the same with Trey too.

He just talked about this the other day too. Now, if he HAD a Tyreek Hill, sure, he'd dial him up more but still be conservative and calculated with those shots. Eric Davis also talked about how most deeper routes are just ghost routes...defenders know this too. Need more evidence? Kyle himself a few games ago, said instead of going to Kittle with 2 defenders on him (INT) noted the next read (correct) was a check down...NOT the wide open deeper ghost route run by Sherfield (?) which fans thought was an easy TD. Jimmy himself confirmed playing within the play calls. Trey started and it was the exact same thing.

Let's just watch for it going forward and see if anything changes.

It still doesn't mean Deebo and Aiyuk strengths are suddenly deep threats. They, to fit Kyle's philosophy, are quick-area YAC monsters.

The body-slam sack where Garoppolo got injured? Kyle had max protect with both Kittle and Juice in to help with pass protection. 3rd and 10. Jennings was 4 yards short of the market. Garoppolo was waiting for either Deebo or Aiyuk to get open deeper. They couldn't. Game over. 49ers career over.

Great attempt at the deflection. IDGAF what Kyle or Eric Davis said, I'm talking about what YOU said. Don't make me dig it up, you know what you said regarding us not having the "speed" and all that junk you were spewing regarding this.

Yes. We don't have deep speed (like Goodwin had --- it helps). LOL.

Nobody is giving Kittle, Deebo and Aiyuk massive cushions because of their deep speed or prowess to get deep.

To my point, Benjamin does (or did) have that speed and we've attempted, what, one shot to him? Case. In. Point.

But keep telling me we have deep threats. Classic.

I don't think Jimmy is great at deep reads/throws.

jimmys pass selection is similar to Matt Ryan's under Kyle… with the exception of Matt taking more deep shots. Not a lot, mind you… but more. And that makes a big difference for multiple reasons.

hopefully Trey can stretch the field a bit

Originally posted by 5thSFG:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NCommand:
No, I said this is Kyle-thing. He is conservative and plays to probability. He'll be the same with Trey too.

He just talked about this the other day too. Now, if he HAD a Tyreek Hill, sure, he'd dial him up more but still be conservative and calculated with those shots. Eric Davis also talked about how most deeper routes are just ghost routes...defenders know this too. Need more evidence? Kyle himself a few games ago, said instead of going to Kittle with 2 defenders on him (INT) noted the next read (correct) was a check down...NOT the wide open deeper ghost route run by Sherfield (?) which fans thought was an easy TD. Jimmy himself confirmed playing within the play calls. Trey started and it was the exact same thing.

Let's just watch for it going forward and see if anything changes.

It still doesn't mean Deebo and Aiyuk strengths are suddenly deep threats. They, to fit Kyle's philosophy, are quick-area YAC monsters.

The body-slam sack where Garoppolo got injured? Kyle had max protect with both Kittle and Juice in to help with pass protection. 3rd and 10. Jennings was 4 yards short of the market. Garoppolo was waiting for either Deebo or Aiyuk to get open deeper. They couldn't. Game over. 49ers career over.

Great attempt at the deflection. IDGAF what Kyle or Eric Davis said, I'm talking about what YOU said. Don't make me dig it up, you know what you said regarding us not having the "speed" and all that junk you were spewing regarding this.

Yes. We don't have deep speed (like Goodwin had --- it helps). LOL.

Nobody is giving Kittle, Deebo and Aiyuk massive cushions because of their deep speed or prowess to get deep.

To my point, Benjamin does (or did) have that speed and we've attempted, what, one shot to him? Case. In. Point.

But keep telling me we have deep threats. Classic.

I don't think Jimmy is great at deep reads/throws.

jimmys pass selection is similar to Matt Ryan's under Kyle… with the exception of Matt taking more deep shots. Not a lot, mind you… but more. And that makes a big difference for multiple reasons

we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

Originally posted by 5thSFG:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NCommand:
No, I said this is Kyle-thing. He is conservative and plays to probability. He'll be the same with Trey too.

He just talked about this the other day too. Now, if he HAD a Tyreek Hill, sure, he'd dial him up more but still be conservative and calculated with those shots. Eric Davis also talked about how most deeper routes are just ghost routes...defenders know this too. Need more evidence? Kyle himself a few games ago, said instead of going to Kittle with 2 defenders on him (INT) noted the next read (correct) was a check down...NOT the wide open deeper ghost route run by Sherfield (?) which fans thought was an easy TD. Jimmy himself confirmed playing within the play calls. Trey started and it was the exact same thing.

Let's just watch for it going forward and see if anything changes.

It still doesn't mean Deebo and Aiyuk strengths are suddenly deep threats. They, to fit Kyle's philosophy, are quick-area YAC monsters.

The body-slam sack where Garoppolo got injured? Kyle had max protect with both Kittle and Juice in to help with pass protection. 3rd and 10. Jennings was 4 yards short of the market. Garoppolo was waiting for either Deebo or Aiyuk to get open deeper. They couldn't. Game over. 49ers career over.

Great attempt at the deflection. IDGAF what Kyle or Eric Davis said, I'm talking about what YOU said. Don't make me dig it up, you know what you said regarding us not having the "speed" and all that junk you were spewing regarding this.

Yes. We don't have deep speed (like Goodwin had --- it helps). LOL.

Nobody is giving Kittle, Deebo and Aiyuk massive cushions because of their deep speed or prowess to get deep.

To my point, Benjamin does (or did) have that speed and we've attempted, what, one shot to him? Case. In. Point.

But keep telling me we have deep threats. Classic.

I don't think Jimmy is great at deep reads/throws.

jimmys pass selection is similar to Matt Ryan's under Kyle… with the exception of Matt taking more deep shots. Not a lot, mind you… but more. And that makes a big difference for multiple reasons

That's definitely not his strength. Agreed.

Yeah, if we get a Julio Jones, Tyreek Hill, etc. to go with Trey's strength, which is deeper shots, I have no doubt Kyle will dial those primaries up more. But to you point probably still in the conservative-calculated bucket still.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

100% this

KS schemes open the deep shots

Look no further than Juice last week...that route has been wide open like 3 or 4 times this year. Jimmy G has badly missed the last 2 times it has been called

Originally posted by NCommand:
That's definitely not his strength. Agreed.

Yeah, if we get a Julio Jones, Tyreek Hill, etc. to go with Trey's strength, which is deeper shots, I have no doubt Kyle will dial those primaries up more. But to you point probably still in the conservative-calculated bucket still.

You're prob right. I expect shotgun formation "Trey run right up the centers ass" plays for most of the game. Trey was pretty effective with them before 🤦‍♂️

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

Great. I keep hearing that. So now let's see if that's true. It certainly wasn't when Jimmy got killed.

Originally posted by 5thSFG:

Originally posted by NCommand:
That's definitely not his strength. Agreed.

Yeah, if we get a Julio Jones, Tyreek Hill, etc. to go with Trey's strength, which is deeper shots, I have no doubt Kyle will dial those primaries up more. But to you point probably still in the conservative-calculated bucket still.

You're prob right. I expect shotgun formation "Trey run right up the centers ass" plays for most of the game.

Haha. I hope not.

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

100% this

KS schemes open the deep shots

Look no further than Juice last week...that route has been wide open like 3 or 4 times this year. Jimmy G has badly missed the last 2 times it has been called

Haha. True. But we weren't talking about a FB wheel route.

But yes, we should certainly have more confidence in Trey on those. LOL

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

100% this

KS schemes open the deep shots

Look no further than Juice last week...that route has been wide open like 3 or 4 times this year. Jimmy G has badly missed the last 2 times it has been called

Haha. True. But we weren't talking about a FB wheel route.

But yes, we should certainly have more confidence in Trey on those. LOL

we can go BA and TB missed Opptys.. so many times these guys get open and don't even get looked at

not expecting it off the bat here.. but we def have the arm to do it now.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

100% this

KS schemes open the deep shots

Look no further than Juice last week...that route has been wide open like 3 or 4 times this year. Jimmy G has badly missed the last 2 times it has been called

Haha. True. But we weren't talking about a FB wheel route.

But yes, we should certainly have more confidence in Trey on those. LOL

we can go BA and TB missed Opptys.. so many times these guys get open and don't even get looked at

not expecting it off the bat here.. but we def have the arm to do it now.

Great. Looking forward to that for sure.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

100% this

KS schemes open the deep shots

Look no further than Juice last week...that route has been wide open like 3 or 4 times this year. Jimmy G has badly missed the last 2 times it has been called

Haha. True. But we weren't talking about a FB wheel route.

But yes, we should certainly have more confidence in Trey on those. LOL

we can go BA and TB missed Opptys.. so many times these guys get open and don't even get looked at

not expecting it off the bat here.. but we def have the arm to do it now.

Great. Looking forward to that for sure.

Go look at JG 2019 highlight reel
https://youtu.be/PgW5i-MioVk

Look how many are 1st read play designs or wide open after PA

Even the famous Kittle TD where KS said it pre snap then turned around and walked away

We just need someone to execute and we will see a massive boost

Good or bad, can't wait til Sunday

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Tigerlaw:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
we have the players that can get deep due to play calling.. you don't need T Hill... to be considered a deep threat

100% this

KS schemes open the deep shots

Look no further than Juice last week...that route has been wide open like 3 or 4 times this year. Jimmy G has badly missed the last 2 times it has been called

Haha. True. But we weren't talking about a FB wheel route.

But yes, we should certainly have more confidence in Trey on those. LOL

we can go BA and TB missed Opptys.. so many times these guys get open and don't even get looked at

not expecting it off the bat here.. but we def have the arm to do it now.

Great. Looking forward to that for sure.

Go look at JG 2019 highlight reel
https://youtu.be/PgW5i-MioVk

Look how many are 1st read play designs or wide open after PA

Even the famous Kittle TD where KS said it pre snap then turned around and walked away

We just need someone to execute and we will see a massive boost

Man, we miss that speed of Goodwin. They had great chemistry from the start too.

I guess "deep threat" can be viewed through different lenses. Through scheme where the speed or his lack of prowless to get deep doesn't matter and "respect" deep threat.

I'm talking about the respect players...the ones where defenders constantly have to respect the theat of a deep shot because of the speed or prowess to get deep and make plays consistently.

I think Kyle has been trying to replace Goodwin since he left with a slew of speed guys like Benjamin over the years but he hasn't found one yet...one that defenders are giving automatic 15 yard cushions out of respect for the deep threat. I think that element has been missing from Kyle's scheme which used to help guys like Kittle underneath a ton.

Does that make sense?