Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by a49erfan77:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by dj43:
If the goal is to develop Lance, yesterday was a wasted day. You are correct. Shanahan's offense went out the window. What we saw yesterday is not sustainable nor did it help Lance learn how to play. Instead of just run, run, run, there should have been more of the regular NFL offense. Give the kid some real meat to chew on. That failure is on Shanahan.

It's only wasted if he can't take anything away from the game to learn from and I feel there were definitely things to take from the game. The hope is that the more a rookie plays, the slower the game gets. Besides the INT that was a result of inaccuracy, not a bad read, he took care of the ball and did not have any near INT throws from what I remember. There were plays where he had time and didn't pull the trigger downfield, and I'd like see why he didn't. Give him a chance to learn from the mistakes before we claim that it was a wasted effort.

If this is the kind of offense it's going to be going forward, I agree. If not, then there isn't but a handful of plays to learn from given the volume of QB runs and only 15 completions. But to your larger point, there is always something to learn from.

Very hard to judge what the offense is going to look like considering he only had a week to prepare. I'd wager if he starts after the bye week, it'll look much more like the normal Kyle offense.

Yes and no. Weren't fans jabbering all week, "last game wasn't what you'll see. The game plan was built around Jimmy. Give him a full week with the game plan around him and you'll see a much different Trey".

They get 3 days during the week to get it right.
Ike it or not, if Trey doesn't have the grasp on portions of the playbook, Kyle isn't putting it in the game plan. He doesn't have time to work on it 10 times just to work on it. That's what OTA's and TC are for.

This is what you'll see the majority of the year if Trey continues to play. That's why Jimmy has been in the plans the entire time.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by thl408:
Lance is not good enough at the moment to operate an offense that consists of rhythm passing plays in the short/quick game (Jimmy's bread and butter). Had Kyle dialed up a bunch of those plays yesterday I would have considered it putting Lance in a position to fail. Would it have given Lance more reps to work on what he needs to develop? Yes, but there was a game to try and win so there is a balancing act for Kyle when it comes to the playcalling.

100%. People want Trey developed for 2022, Kyle is fighting to win games. Cause that's his job.

There was ZERO "balancing act" yesterday, although I agree with the premise. I don't think anyone is saying that Kyle should just tank the season to develop Trey. But come on, 16 rushing attempts (and almost all by design)? Yesterday's game plan was a travesty and Shanahan should be ashamed for being so short sighted regarding Trey's health and long term career.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by thl408:
Lance is not good enough at the moment to operate an offense that consists of rhythm passing plays in the short/quick game (Jimmy's bread and butter). Had Kyle dialed up a bunch of those plays yesterday I would have considered it putting Lance in a position to fail. Would it have given Lance more reps to work on what he needs to develop? Yes, but there was a game to try and win so there is a balancing act for Kyle when it comes to the playcalling.

100%. People want Trey developed for 2022, Kyle is fighting to win games. Cause that's his job.

If Kyle goes full on "let's develop Trey" in week 5, that's a slap in the face to vet leaders like Trent Williams, Warner, Kittle. Besides game losses, the worst thing for a head coach is losing the locker room's vets. It doesn't matter how much Kyle wants to develop Trey, he cannot lose the vets in the locker room in week 6 of the season.

Originally posted by pete98146:
All in all I was quite pleased with Trey's outing. The one thing that our team could benefit from is a better slot receiver. I watch Robert Woods on the Rams and immediately have "wide receiver" envy. But heck, I'd settle for a healthy Trent Taylor/Wes Welker type of jitterbug that can quickly find the seams in the defense. Having such a player as a safety outlet would be a huge plus.

Kupp and Woods are way better at getting open than our guys. Deebo with the ball in his hands? I'd take over about any other WR.

Originally posted by 49ersRing:

Originally posted by JTB1974:
Trey's PFF grade was higher than 3 of Jimmy's 4 starts this season.

A rookie in his first start outplaying an 8 year vet with 4 years in the offense.

But his passer rating wasnt.

Pff not grading lots o stuff like deflections tips and going off schedule just 'cuz.

Whoooooooh

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by thl408:
Lance is not good enough at the moment to operate an offense that consists of rhythm passing plays in the short/quick game (Jimmy's bread and butter). Had Kyle dialed up a bunch of those plays yesterday I would have considered it putting Lance in a position to fail. Would it have given Lance more reps to work on what he needs to develop? Yes, but there was a game to try and win so there is a balancing act for Kyle when it comes to the playcalling.

100%. People want Trey developed for 2022, Kyle is fighting to win games. Cause that's his job.

There was ZERO "balancing act" yesterday, although I agree with the premise. I don't think anyone is saying that Kyle should just tank the season to develop Trey. But come on, 16 rushing attempts (and almost all by design)? Yesterday's game plan was a travesty and Shanahan should be ashamed for being so short sighted regarding Trey's health and long term career.

What do you mean there was no balancing act? Kyle called plays that Lance knows how to execute from his college days. Those are the plays that Lance is comfortable with. Those QB runs also serve a purpose in slowing down the ARI pass rush. QB power not so much, but the draw plays force the pass rush to stay disciplined in their rush lanes, which in theory, helps the OL pass protect.

Originally posted by jball:
On top of that when was the last time a team won the super bowl let alone got to a Super Bowl based on a QB that could only run and throw well only intermittently?

I'd say Kaepernick, 49ers

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by dj43:
If the goal is to develop Lance, yesterday was a wasted day. You are correct. Shanahan's offense went out the window. What we saw yesterday is not sustainable nor did it help Lance learn how to play. Instead of just run, run, run, there should have been more of the regular NFL offense. Give the kid some real meat to chew on. That failure is on Shanahan.

It's only wasted if he can't take anything away from the game to learn from and I feel there were definitely things to take from the game. The hope is that the more a rookie plays, the slower the game gets. Besides the INT that was a result of inaccuracy, not a bad read, he took care of the ball and did not have any near INT throws from what I remember. There were plays where he had time and didn't pull the trigger downfield, and I'd like see why he didn't. Give him a chance to learn from the mistakes before we claim that it was a wasted effort.

To clarify, my "wasted effort" comment was based largely on how KS gave him such a small portion of the regular offense. Instead of the regular offense with some unique run plays for Lance, it seemed more based on Lance's running with some of the regular offense mixed in.

For example, Mitchell averaged 4.8 yards/carry but only got the ball 9 times. By any standard, that is good production. Why not continue feeding him rather than putting so much of the load on the rookie?

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Yeah at the half, Jimmy Johnson said he already had 9 QB runs to 11 passes. That's just not sustainable.

Aside from the long windup that gives a tell to DL (knock downs at the LOS) and DB's (passes defensed), wobbly balls, high balls, clock management, diving on the heels of OL, poor short touch and ball location, etc. my biggest concern is the offense itself.

This is a straight up college offense right now and after one week of film, NFL defenses will crush it going forward. 10 points will become harder to come by. Like Kyle's 85%, it held true. 0 deep passing attempts. Low air yards. Defenders will load the A gaps and force him into 2nd and 13 (like Jimmy).

As to Trey himself, you can see the arm talent and the ability when his mechanics are on. He moved to some second reads, he audibled, he ran hard and tough, he's coachable, smart, made many great reads, moment not too big for him, etc.

I feel 100% comfortable starting him again but this offense has to change going forward. For his own health AND growth.

If the goal is to develop Lance, yesterday was a wasted day. You are correct. Shanahan's offense went out the window. What we saw yesterday is not sustainable nor did it help Lance learn how to play. Instead of just run, run, run, there should have been more of the regular NFL offense. Give the kid some real meat to chew on. That failure is on Shanahan.

I feel the same way.

100% agreed. It was ugly and reminded me of Harbaugh/Kaep's last year where Harbaugh basically threw in the towel on Kaep and the season because he was headed to Michigan. It was by far the laziest coaching performance by Kyle as the Niner's head coach. Embarrassing.

Lance exceeded my expectations yesterday, especially in eluding the pass rush. He certainly have plenty to work on, but you can see a lot of his misses are simply due to not enough reps. I'm betting we'll see a big improvement in timing with the rest of the offense if he starts against the Colts.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by thl408:
Lance is not good enough at the moment to operate an offense that consists of rhythm passing plays in the short/quick game (Jimmy's bread and butter). Had Kyle dialed up a bunch of those plays yesterday I would have considered it putting Lance in a position to fail. Would it have given Lance more reps to work on what he needs to develop? Yes, but there was a game to try and win so there is a balancing act for Kyle when it comes to the playcalling.

100%. People want Trey developed for 2022, Kyle is fighting to win games. Cause that's his job.

All of this. And there's still a lot of football left...anything can happen each week to any team. Add in the healthy talent this team still has on both sides of the ball and the talent that will return from IR plus looking at the remaining games on the schedule...this team can start building momentum in playing better and having a healthy Garoppolo back at QB.

Garoppolo gets & stays healthy and runs this offense like he can as mentioned above, this team can do some damage going forward vs. the teams remaining on the schedule. Especially with the D playing like what we saw yesterday. Get into the playoffs playing good complementary football and then you never know.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by pete98146:
All in all I was quite pleased with Trey's outing. The one thing that our team could benefit from is a better slot receiver. I watch Robert Woods on the Rams and immediately have "wide receiver" envy. But heck, I'd settle for a healthy Trent Taylor/Wes Welker type of jitterbug that can quickly find the seams in the defense. Having such a player as a safety outlet would be a huge plus.

Kupp and Woods are way better at getting open than our guys. Deebo with the ball in his hands? I'd take over about any other WR.

Yep,the current receivers we have are built to catch short routes then cause havoc. It's a problem that Trey has trouble throwing those routes accurately.

We might have won if Kyle didn't go for it on every 4th down. The last one was really baffling. 4th and 4 at midfield only down 3 points with 8 minutes left and the defense playing great. Could have tried to pin them inside the 10 yard line. Also the waste of timeouts in the 2nd half hurt us. wasted two of them and didn't accomplish anything with them.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by thl408:
Lance is not good enough at the moment to operate an offense that consists of rhythm passing plays in the short/quick game (Jimmy's bread and butter). Had Kyle dialed up a bunch of those plays yesterday I would have considered it putting Lance in a position to fail. Would it have given Lance more reps to work on what he needs to develop? Yes, but there was a game to try and win so there is a balancing act for Kyle when it comes to the playcalling.

100%. People want Trey developed for 2022, Kyle is fighting to win games. Cause that's his job.

If Kyle goes full on "let's develop Trey" in week 5, that's a slap in the face to vet leaders like Trent Williams, Warner, Kittle. Besides game losses, the worst thing for a head coach is losing the locker room's vets. It doesn't matter how much Kyle wants to develop Trey, he cannot lose the vets in the locker room in week 6 of the season.

It's not a slap in the face to the vets to bench a bad player and Jimmy has been a bad player this year. If the vets grumble about it, show them his PFF scores.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by thl408:
Lance is not good enough at the moment to operate an offense that consists of rhythm passing plays in the short/quick game (Jimmy's bread and butter). Had Kyle dialed up a bunch of those plays yesterday I would have considered it putting Lance in a position to fail. Would it have given Lance more reps to work on what he needs to develop? Yes, but there was a game to try and win so there is a balancing act for Kyle when it comes to the playcalling.

100%. People want Trey developed for 2022, Kyle is fighting to win games. Cause that's his job.

There was ZERO "balancing act" yesterday, although I agree with the premise. I don't think anyone is saying that Kyle should just tank the season to develop Trey. But come on, 16 rushing attempts (and almost all by design)? Yesterday's game plan was a travesty and Shanahan should be ashamed for being so short sighted regarding Trey's health and long term career.

What do you mean there was no balancing act? Kyle called plays that Lance knows how to execute from his college days. Those are the plays that Lance is comfortable with. Those QB runs also serve a purpose in slowing down the ARI pass rush. QB power not so much, but the draw plays force the pass rush to stay disciplined in their rush lanes, which in theory, helps the OL pass protect.

You mentioned a balancing act in regards to calling plays within the regular offense to develop Trey versus calling plays that Trey is most comfortable with (running, which is debatable because we can't get inside Trey's head to know that). I saw maybe 2-3 plays under center that looked like our regular offense versus the rest out of shotgun and Pistol, read option, QB power. There was no balance there.

The QB draw plays with 3-4 WR's and defenders spread out are fine, because it gives Trey the opportunity to slide after gaining some yards. QB power 6-8 times (or however many it was) was immoral.