Los Angeles Chargers QB Trey Lance Thread

Originally posted by Aj_hwd954:

Originally posted by Sickaa:

Originally posted by Aj_hwd954:
He looked like 2005 Alex Smith with legs and Deebo Samual

Not sure If serious 🤔.

He sucked. Or at least played up to the standard of a 21 yr old rookie starting in his first NFL game coming out of a backwater college. Still baffled that we gave up so much for this.

He's super raw who just played his full game in a long time... there we're some positives with some negatives. Blame Kyle for his predictable play-calling.

Originally posted by jonnydel:
I think Trey looks like Trey. Personally, I don't care for the comparisons. He's not Josh Allen so saying what worked for John's Allen will for Trey isn't fair. He's not Kaepernick so what didn't work for Kaepernick won't necessarily not work for Lance. He's not Mahomes, he's not Russ. He Trey.

I want to see Trey run the offense, help the run game and be able to make off-schedule when schedule isn't there.

That's a mountain of work for this kid but he seems to have the right disposition and deserves the benefit of the doubt for at least 3 years, IMO. People will differ on the length, but I'm expecting him to be a long-term project to reach fruition.

People saying Kyle needs to adapt, he's not about to can an offense he's ran for the past 7 years mid-season.

Kyle said the playbook won't change with Lance in there. Then WTF was up with all these Shot-gun/Pistol formations, QB draws, abandoning the run (when it was working), no screens, no play action from under center, it was just straight up college ball it seemed. That was nothing like the first four weeks. I think Kyle needs to going back and sticking with what works, with what got his team to the Super Bowl, heavy run with play-action and maybe he could sprinkle in a few Trey Lance runs here and there.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Now that it's a qb you fully support you're seeing the things I've been pointing out all year.

Lack of OL pass pro, lack of WR separation, lack of run game.

I've been saying, Jimmy has actually been masking some of these issues with quick processing and quick release - got laughed at. Was told Trey would open up more of the offense.

Here's my issues with the, "start Trey now" idea.
1. You don't give up on a season after 5 games. We don't know what's going to happen the rest of the year. We saw AZ's TE tear an ACL yesterday, you never know what can happen.

2. It's 5 games. We've had 2 games where the D looked great, 2 games they looked great for stretches and 1 game they looked bad.

3. Even if Trey develops, we still have other issues. It's not like he was our biggest problem yesterday and playing behind this shaky OL isn't helping his development much as a pocket passer.

I'm just done with Jimmy and have been for a while...regardless of everything else he was never gonna be this pro-bowl caliber QB and got paid like he was. Toss in injuries and here we are. They could put about 15 other QBs in his position and got the same results.

I'm not about to compare a 8 yr vet to a 21 yr old who hasn't gotten a real start since 2019. SF made their choice when they moved up for Lance, at that point it should have been about developing him, not trying to run it back with a bunch of brittle resigning's and QB. We're seeing the results of that now

I don't think this is a SB contending team, didn't before the season started. You think Jimmy is good enough to beat all these top tier teams and I do not.

So like you said even if Trey develops, we have a shaky OL, well okay that doesn't make this team a SB caliber team regardless of who's the QB. You said Jimmy masks all this, yet say the WRs aren't getting open quickly...so his skill set doesn't really mask anything if no one is getting open. Lance isn't gonna have perfection at any point to develop...there will always be holes and good QB play will mask it. Kid needs to play and no amount of sitting on the bench will replace what he got yesterday.

This team needs to have one QB and get reps with him, Jimmy and Lance play vastly different and that f**ks everything up. Some of those holding calls were because they're not use to a scrambling QB. That's something that needs to be developed upon as well.

They have two weeks to get one guy and this team on the same page, I'll take the one with a vastly higher upside, who's actually part of the future, and isn't injured. I'm guessing suborn Kyle will go with banged up Jimmy and I'm sure it will be no different then what we've seen

I just don't get how you think playing Trey behind a shaky OL is actually good for his development. I also don't get why you're so willing to throw away a season after 5 games. How depressing....great, well, let's ruminate iver potential for another 11 months because we've being doing that for the past 19 months and it's been so awesome.

Sit back, root for your team, whoever is starting and hope for the best. I thought that's what fans did 🥴

If I was die hard Jimmy because of Jimmy, wouldn't you expect me to come flying in after Trey's pick, "SeE, tReY sUCkz"? I didn't and aren't going to because when he's in, im rooting for the kid, big time. I don't like seeing any of our qb's throw picks but I understand it happens. I wanted the team to pull out the win, was frustrated by how it seemed so close, yet so far. I am irritated by the injuries but you know what I'm gonna believe we have a shot until we don't.

Originally posted by Aj_hwd954:
He sucked. Or at least played up to the standard of a 21 yr old rookie starting in his first NFL game coming out of a backwater college. Still baffled that we gave up so much for this.

He had SF in AZ's side of the field 8 of 9 times and that's with 100 yards worth of penalties...We get it you hated the pick and you will make up whatever narrative you can to prove you're right (which means absolutely nothing end of the day).

If you were expecting something more from a 21 yr old with a weeks worth of starting reps and not playing legit football since 2019, then that's on you bud.

Originally posted by Sickaa:
Yup. Penalties are killing us right now. Yesterday's game was very painful and frustrating to watch with all the penalties being called on the O-Line.

A couple of the OL penalties were the result of Lance not being where they were used to the QB being. On several plays you could see the OL locked onto an opponent and steering them away from the traditional QB location only to have Lance move in the opposite direction which resulted in a holding call. Again, something that can be corrected in time but it hurt the offense yesterday.

Lance needs reps AND real game time. He has only played a season and a half of college football. You just aren't going to get much success on the NFL level from him now. And you certainly aren't going to get wins with the way the team played yesterday

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
And not every call was a legit hold, a lot of "flopping" by AZ. Refs could call holding damn near every play, one team goes full LBJ flopping mode and the refs see it and will always call it. SF tries to play through the holds and doesn't get the call.

Now that it's a qb you fully support you're seeing the things I've been pointing out all year.

Lack of OL pass pro, lack of WR separation, lack of run game.

I've been saying, Jimmy has actually been masking some of these issues with quick processing and quick release - got laughed at. Was told Trey would open up more of the offense.

Here's my issues with the, "start Trey now" idea.
1. You don't give up on a season after 5 games. We don't know what's going to happen the rest of the year. We saw AZ's TE tear an ACL yesterday, you never know what can happen.

2. It's 5 games. We've had 2 games where the D looked great, 2 games they looked great for stretches and 1 game they looked bad.

3. Even if Trey develops, we still have other issues. It's not like he was our biggest problem yesterday and playing behind this shaky OL isn't helping his development much as a pocket passer.

That's what I think. Jimmy is better than Trey at this point. If you go into young-QB development mode after five games you've basically raised the white flag already for this year. Russell Wilson just got injured. The Rams always find a way to falter. If someone takes out Kyler Murray AZ is toast. And the Niners have a very soft non-division schedule. If they can split their division games and clean up on the soft non-division games, they could still squeak into the playoffs. If they squeak into the playoff behind Jimmy -- who is more consistent and efficient than Lance right now -- then they can maybe trade Jimmy for value in the offseason while still keeping this year competitive.

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
I think Trey looks like Trey. Personally, I don't care for the comparisons. He's not Josh Allen so saying what worked for John's Allen will for Trey isn't fair. He's not Kaepernick so what didn't work for Kaepernick won't necessarily not work for Lance. He's not Mahomes, he's not Russ. He Trey.

I want to see Trey run the offense, help the run game and be able to make off-schedule when schedule isn't there.

That's a mountain of work for this kid but he seems to have the right disposition and deserves the benefit of the doubt for at least 3 years, IMO. People will differ on the length, but I'm expecting him to be a long-term project to reach fruition.

People saying Kyle needs to adapt, he's not about to can an offense he's ran for the past 7 years mid-season.

Kyle said the playbook won't change with Lance in there. Then WTF was up with all these Shot-gun/Pistol formations, QB draws, abandoning the run (when it was working), no screens, no play action from under center, it was just straight up college ball it seemed. That was nothing like the first four weeks. I think Kyle needs to going back and sticking with what works, with what got his team to the Super Bowl, heavy run with play-action and maybe he could sprinkle in a few Trey Lance runs here and there.

It was 50/50. There were a number of passing plays that were staple plays, just run off a pistol zone-read instead of under center run. I think he's trying to limit the amount for times he's asking him to turn his back in the defense. Probably something he's seen in practice is showing him he's not ready for this at the NFL level in heavy doses.

The designed qb runs is trying to manufacture more offense that the defense won't be as ready for, is what I'm guessing and trying to not put too much on Trey's shoulders.

It should be pretty clear right now Kyle is trying to not overwhelm the rookie. While we can scream development, Kyle is trying to win games. We're 8 points away from being tied for the division lead.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Kyle will most likely agree with this too.

And no deep shots? No big air yards?

We tried to tell 'em (85%). Kyle even brought up the speedster in Travis Benjamin who played a lot but like Eric Davis said, the mass majority of deeper routes are just "ghost routes" designed to pull defenders for underneath routes.

They didn't even get a chance to run PA from under center because of all the flags...the whole game plan wasn't even there lol tossing on the 85% rule is silly under those circumstances and you know it.

Oh and no big air yards? Lance IAY is 9.9 and 2nd highest in the league. Jimmy's is 6.7 3rd worst in the league

Wut? Being in 1st and 2nd in long gives you MORE of a license for your silly air yards on all 15 of his completions. Let's see the spray charts. LOL.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Now that it's a qb you fully support you're seeing the things I've been pointing out all year.

Lack of OL pass pro, lack of WR separation, lack of run game.

I've been saying, Jimmy has actually been masking some of these issues with quick processing and quick release - got laughed at. Was told Trey would open up more of the offense.

Here's my issues with the, "start Trey now" idea.
1. You don't give up on a season after 5 games. We don't know what's going to happen the rest of the year. We saw AZ's TE tear an ACL yesterday, you never know what can happen.

2. It's 5 games. We've had 2 games where the D looked great, 2 games they looked great for stretches and 1 game they looked bad.

3. Even if Trey develops, we still have other issues. It's not like he was our biggest problem yesterday and playing behind this shaky OL isn't helping his development much as a pocket passer.

I'm just done with Jimmy and have been for a while...regardless of everything else he was never gonna be this pro-bowl caliber QB and got paid like he was. Toss in injuries and here we are. They could put about 15 other QBs in his position and got the same results.

I'm not about to compare a 8 yr vet to a 21 yr old who hasn't gotten a real start since 2019. SF made their choice when they moved up for Lance, at that point it should have been about developing him, not trying to run it back with a bunch of brittle resigning's and QB. We're seeing the results of that now

I don't think this is a SB contending team, didn't before the season started. You think Jimmy is good enough to beat all these top tier teams and I do not.

So like you said even if Trey develops, we have a shaky OL, well okay that doesn't make this team a SB caliber team regardless of who's the QB. You said Jimmy masks all this, yet say the WRs aren't getting open quickly...so his skill set doesn't really mask anything if no one is getting open. Lance isn't gonna have perfection at any point to develop...there will always be holes and good QB play will mask it. Kid needs to play and no amount of sitting on the bench will replace what he got yesterday.

This team needs to have one QB and get reps with him, Jimmy and Lance play vastly different and that f**ks everything up. Some of those holding calls were because they're not use to a scrambling QB. That's something that needs to be developed upon as well.

They have two weeks to get one guy and this team on the same page, I'll take the one with a vastly higher upside, who's actually part of the future, and isn't injured. I'm guessing suborn Kyle will go with banged up Jimmy and I'm sure it will be no different then what we've seen

I just don't get how you think playing Trey behind a shaky OL is actually good for his development. I also don't get why you're so willing to throw away a season after 5 games. How depressing....great, well, let's ruminate iver potential for another 11 months because we've being doing that for the past 19 months and it's been so awesome.

Sit back, root for your team, whoever is starting and hope for the best. I thought that's what fans did 🥴

If I was die hard Jimmy because of Jimmy, wouldn't you expect me to come flying in after Trey's pick, "SeE, tReY sUCkz"? I didn't and aren't going to because when he's in, im rooting for the kid, big time. I don't like seeing any of our qb's throw picks but I understand it happens. I wanted the team to pull out the win, was frustrated by how it seemed so close, yet so far. I am irritated by the injuries but you know what I'm gonna believe we have a shot until we don't.

I think a lot of us don't see going to Trey as throwing the season away.

Originally posted by 49ers81:

Originally posted by BOI49er:
Yep. I predicted before the season that I didn't expect him to start more than four or five games before injury or performance or Trey's progress benched him, and argued $25m was Way too much for four games. But i also acknowledged that giving Trey even that space to learn, and then having JG as a backup was worth something too, just not that much.

And to get rid of him, I agree we're going to have to kick in part of his salary for this year. That's negotiated in the trades all the time. Still, what we save and a draft pick is of value.

Kyle has always said the problem with "athletic" quarterbacks is that you can't keep them in the pocket until they've exhausted their reads. Well, he better, or he's going to be the first to not like it, because he's going to have used multiple plays to set up guys wide open that are left hanging.

And once again I find myself having to ask, what is it about the phrase, 'Jimmy has a no trade clause in his contract for this year", that people don't understand? It really is absolutely bewildering.

And once again, if he's faced with a choice of being a backup here, or a starter where someone wants him, what would you do? Do I have to point out he can waive that clause?

Originally posted by jonnydel:
I just don't get how you think playing Trey behind a shaky OL is actually good for his development. I also don't get why you're so willing to throw away a season after 5 games. How depressing....great, well, let's ruminate iver potential for another 11 months because we've being doing that for the past 19 months and it's been so awesome.

Sit back, root for your team, whoever is starting and hope for the best. I thought that's what fans did 🥴

If I was die hard Jimmy because of Jimmy, wouldn't you expect me to come flying in after Trey's pick, "SeE, tReY sUCkz"? I didn't and aren't going to because when he's in, im rooting for the kid, big time. I don't like seeing any of our qb's throw picks but I understand it happens. I wanted the team to pull out the win, was frustrated by how it seemed so close, yet so far. I am irritated by the injuries but you know what I'm gonna believe we have a shot until we don't.

Playing football is good for his development. Watson had a trash OL, Allen had a trash OL, Herbert had one of the worst OLs in football.

Why is playing Lance "throwing away" the season? I simply don't believe Jimmy makes this team that much better. You overvalue him, that's your problem (not trying to be snarky either)


I've always said I will root for this team no matter who's the QB...literally said it about 100xs. I have no idea why you would say what you did in that second paragraph?

I'm just more realistic, I never thought this was a SB contending team. I was fine with developing and being that much better in 2022 with a healthy cap to spend. I want to win of course, but I'm not gonna get angry and call for everyone to be fired every weekend (not saying you are) IMO it's all a process and a BIG part of the process is now trying to get our high end QB ready to play. That's not gonna get figured out by sitting on the bench or in a week...that's gonna take time, some people understand that.

Originally posted by a49erfan77:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Now that it's a qb you fully support you're seeing the things I've been pointing out all year.

Lack of OL pass pro, lack of WR separation, lack of run game.

I've been saying, Jimmy has actually been masking some of these issues with quick processing and quick release - got laughed at. Was told Trey would open up more of the offense.

Here's my issues with the, "start Trey now" idea.
1. You don't give up on a season after 5 games. We don't know what's going to happen the rest of the year. We saw AZ's TE tear an ACL yesterday, you never know what can happen.

2. It's 5 games. We've had 2 games where the D looked great, 2 games they looked great for stretches and 1 game they looked bad.

3. Even if Trey develops, we still have other issues. It's not like he was our biggest problem yesterday and playing behind this shaky OL isn't helping his development much as a pocket passer.

I'm just done with Jimmy and have been for a while...regardless of everything else he was never gonna be this pro-bowl caliber QB and got paid like he was. Toss in injuries and here we are. They could put about 15 other QBs in his position and got the same results.

I'm not about to compare a 8 yr vet to a 21 yr old who hasn't gotten a real start since 2019. SF made their choice when they moved up for Lance, at that point it should have been about developing him, not trying to run it back with a bunch of brittle resigning's and QB. We're seeing the results of that now

I don't think this is a SB contending team, didn't before the season started. You think Jimmy is good enough to beat all these top tier teams and I do not.

So like you said even if Trey develops, we have a shaky OL, well okay that doesn't make this team a SB caliber team regardless of who's the QB. You said Jimmy masks all this, yet say the WRs aren't getting open quickly...so his skill set doesn't really mask anything if no one is getting open. Lance isn't gonna have perfection at any point to develop...there will always be holes and good QB play will mask it. Kid needs to play and no amount of sitting on the bench will replace what he got yesterday.

This team needs to have one QB and get reps with him, Jimmy and Lance play vastly different and that f**ks everything up. Some of those holding calls were because they're not use to a scrambling QB. That's something that needs to be developed upon as well.

They have two weeks to get one guy and this team on the same page, I'll take the one with a vastly higher upside, who's actually part of the future, and isn't injured. I'm guessing suborn Kyle will go with banged up Jimmy and I'm sure it will be no different then what we've seen

I just don't get how you think playing Trey behind a shaky OL is actually good for his development. I also don't get why you're so willing to throw away a season after 5 games. How depressing....great, well, let's ruminate iver potential for another 11 months because we've being doing that for the past 19 months and it's been so awesome.

Sit back, root for your team, whoever is starting and hope for the best. I thought that's what fans did 🥴

If I was die hard Jimmy because of Jimmy, wouldn't you expect me to come flying in after Trey's pick, "SeE, tReY sUCkz"? I didn't and aren't going to because when he's in, im rooting for the kid, big time. I don't like seeing any of our qb's throw picks but I understand it happens. I wanted the team to pull out the win, was frustrated by how it seemed so close, yet so far. I am irritated by the injuries but you know what I'm gonna believe we have a shot until we don't.

I think a lot of us don't see going to Trey as throwing the season away.

Then I guess I'm confused on what people are seeing that says we're making a playoff run with him under center.

That's not hating the pick, I think we can all see the kid has a long ways to go in a number of areas.

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Yeah at the half, Jimmy Johnson said he already had 9 QB runs to 11 passes. That's just not sustainable.

Aside from the long windup that gives a tell to DL (knock downs at the LOS) and DB's (passes defensed), wobbly balls, high balls, clock management, diving on the heels of OL, poor short touch and ball location, etc. my biggest concern is the offense itself.

This is a straight up college offense right now and after one week of film, NFL defenses will crush it going forward. 10 points will become harder to come by. Like Kyle's 85%, it held true. 0 deep passing attempts. Low air yards. Defenders will load the A gaps and force him into 2nd and 13 (like Jimmy).

As to Trey himself, you can see the arm talent and the ability when his mechanics are on. He moved to some second reads, he audibled, he ran hard and tough, he's coachable, smart, made many great reads, moment not too big for him, etc.

I feel 100% comfortable starting him again but this offense has to change going forward. For his own health AND growth.

If the goal is to develop Lance, yesterday was a wasted day. You are correct. Shanahan's offense went out the window. What we saw yesterday is not sustainable nor did it help Lance learn how to play. Instead of just run, run, run, there should have been more of the regular NFL offense. Give the kid some real meat to chew on. That failure is on Shanahan.

I feel the same way.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Kyle will most likely agree with this too.

And no deep shots? No big air yards?

We tried to tell 'em (85%). Kyle even brought up the speedster in Travis Benjamin who played a lot but like Eric Davis said, the mass majority of deeper routes are just "ghost routes" designed to pull defenders for underneath routes.

They didn't even get a chance to run PA from under center because of all the flags...the whole game plan wasn't even there lol tossing on the 85% rule is silly under those circumstances and you know it.

Oh and no big air yards? Lance IAY is 9.9 and 2nd highest in the league. Jimmy's is 6.7 3rd worst in the league

Let's hope he keeps that up and doesn't have it ruined by a bunch of screen passes, quick slants, and checkdowns.