Chicago Bears vs. San Francisco 49ers Rebuilding Plan

Originally posted by Wewillwin:

I like that at least. I think it's a good franchise to track and compare

My friend, I think you finally got the purpose of this thread!

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Pretty straightforward to me.

LOL.

Big f**king LOL
Especially when my point somehow went over Phoenixs head
Did he even read the previous posts?

Originally posted by Wewillwin:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Wewillwin:

I just looked at everything and umm.. I still don't understand how my argument about the bears team going into their 2017 rebuild wasn't wildly at a different place than where we were.

Your other statement about what the 49ers did to surround Jimmy with talent this offseason - You mentioned Pettis and Jet - two highly priced acquisitions but you forgot to mention - Richburg, Person and McGlinchey.

Like, how could you not talk about our pro-bowl caliber first round pick, out guard who's balling out and our very highly priced center.

Here's the cliff notes...see NinerGM's novel about the reality in Chicago and my thread showing that even when Pace was here, without Trubisky, they were a 3 and 5-win team (like us).

If you take Trubisky and Cohn off their roster this year, did this "head start" really mean anything in W-L's? Did they really add that much more talent than we had? Not really. If Jimmy Garoppolo and Jerick McKinnon were healthy this year, how much closer to 8-3 would we be right now? Pretty close, right? Right. Therefore it's not "pretty straight forward."

You'll never have a perfect apples to apples comparison but this one is pretty close as I listed the reasons out for you.

If you find a rebuild partner that's pretty straight forward, please feel free to post the side by side in here and list your reasoning.

Um. I don't understand what you're trying to say here. Yeah, they're not identical. One of the reasons is that their drafts and free agencies beforehand obviously have had a big impact on how their team works today. But of course, if you don't have a good QB and a starting RB, it's not usually gonna matter.. you're probably gonna stink (usually at least).

That doesn't take away from them having more talent than us to begin with. They did. And that matters if you want to compare the two teams.

The point is simple...


BEFORE OUR INJURIES WE LOOKED LIKE THE BETTER ROSTER AND 99% OF THE PEOPLE AGREED WITH THIS BUT NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN THERE ARE CLAIMS THAT CHICAGO BY FAR HAS SUPERIOR TALENT...

WHICH IS IT

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

The point is simple...


BEFORE OUR INJURIES WE LOOKED LIKE THE BETTER ROSTER AND 99% OF THE PEOPLE AGREED WITH THIS BUT NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN THERE ARE CLAIMS THAT CHICAGO BY FAR HAS SUPERIOR TALENT...

WHICH IS IT

Correction...100% of 9er fans in the PYMWYMI thread had us beating the Bears this year.

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

The point is simple...


BEFORE OUR INJURIES WE LOOKED LIKE THE BETTER ROSTER AND 99% OF THE PEOPLE AGREED WITH THIS BUT NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN THERE ARE CLAIMS THAT CHICAGO BY FAR HAS SUPERIOR TALENT...

WHICH IS IT

They have more talent on d and everybody would have said that in April, Aug, Sep, Nov. With Jimmy we had the better o but without him it's pretty even.

Most thought they'd suck, I did too, but sometimes you just get caught in last season.

Originally posted by Wewillwin:

I'm sorry. I don't agree that we're making you're point. A great franchise does great things with a great QB. Absolutely true.

BUT the rest of the talent is still incredibly important. To disregard that doesn't make any sense to me honestly. You seem to agree as well hence the entire point of this article.

But the rebuild doesn't start when you get a franchise QB, you hope you have the right team in place so that the QB can win when you get him and afterwards.

Pace has been GM for 4 years in order to field the team you see today. When we start next year, we will begin the 3rd year of John Lynch & Shannys rebuild.

Completely agree with this.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

They have more talent on d and everybody would have said that in April, Aug, Sep, Nov. With Jimmy we had the better o but without him it's pretty even.

Most thought they'd suck, I did too, but sometimes you just get caught in last season.

Agree re: they had more talent on D going into the season and most would agree as you mention. Then, they add a player like Mack to further enhance their D. When they added Mack, I immediately thought that could help propel them to a .500 record - and even better if the offense made a leap in improvement.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Wewillwin:

I like that at least. I think it's a good franchise to track and compare

My friend, I think you finally got the purpose of this thread!

I always got the point of the thread. I disagreed with your arguments and still do.

Your guys' point about wins and losses and expected talent before the year. I think you take out Mack and add Jimmy G and Jet back, I'd still have us winning - mainly because Jimmy > Mitch.

That doesn't mean you should disregard the other 2 years that Ryan Pace had to build this team. I also correspond any rebuild commencement date with new regime(s) taking over and overhauling rosters. I'm excited about what the next 2 years will bring us and hope we're even further than where the Bears are today.

Originally posted by LottDMontanaO:

Agree re: they had more talent on D going into the season and most would agree as you mention. Then, they add a player like Mack to further enhance their D. When they added Mack, I immediately thought that could help propel them to a .500 record - and even better if the offense made a leap in improvement.

Originally posted by Wewillwin:

I always got the point of the thread. I disagreed with your arguments and still do.

Your guys' point about wins and losses and expected talent before the year. I think you take out Mack and add Jimmy G and Jet back, I'd still have us winning - mainly because Jimmy > Mitch.

That doesn't mean you should disregard the other 2 years that Ryan Pace had to build this team. I also correspond any rebuild commencement date with new regime(s) taking over and overhauling rosters. I'm excited about what the next 2 years will bring us and hope we're even further than where the Bears are today.

The issue with this newfound fan perspective (that nobody in Chicago had) that they had a great defense, is that they were 9th in points last year.

And what was their record? 5 wins. You wanna guess why that was?

You say Jimmy > Mitch but then don't say their defense > offense or their defense > our defense?

Also, we have 5 starters from pre-2017 in the rotation. They have 8.

Again, those extra 2 years you're so focused on are minuscule in this comparison exercise.

Let me ask you this: When do you define the start of a rebuild?

BTW: Your bold confirms you don't see much difference in talent between the two teams, hence, the comparison exercise and the lack of those extra two years having any significant meaning if we're equal or better after just 2 off seasons of rebuilding.

Originally posted by NCommand:

The issue with this newfound fan perspective (that nobody in Chicago had) that they had a great defense, is that they were 9th in points last year.

And what was their record? 5 wins. You wanna guess why that was?

You say Jimmy > Mitch but then don't say their defense > offense or their defense > our defense?

Also, we have 5 starters from pre-2017 in the rotation. They have 8.

Again, those extra 2 years you're so focused on are minuscule in this comparison exercise.

Let me ask you this: When do you define the start of a rebuild?

BTW: Your bold confirms you don't see much difference in talent between the two teams, hence, the comparison exercise and the lack of those extra two years having any significant meaning if we're equal or better after just 2 off seasons of rebuilding.

The difference on D is simple. Vic Fangio. Khalil Mack wouldn't be wrecking near as much for 9ers with DBs blowing coverage all over the place. I bet you can count the Bears blown coverages on one hand.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

The difference on D is simple. Vic Fangio. Khalil Mack wouldn't be wrecking near as much for 9ers with DBs blowing coverage all over the place. I bet you can count the Bears blown coverages on one hand.

Tru dat...another aggressive move they made was Nagy quickly signing Fangio for 3 years before anyone else got him. Remember, Kyle tried to get Vic in 2017 but was blocked. We had a small window to get him this off season but I think the FO was happy with Saleh. Oops.

Losing Reuben Foster certainly doesn't help esp. when Fangio is developing Roquan Smith nicely.

Light years Bears

Originally posted by NCommand:

Losing Reuben Foster certainly doesn't help esp. when Fangio is developing Roquan Smith nicely.

Just rubbing salt in the wound now huh.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Losing Reuben Foster certainly doesn't help esp. when Fangio is developing Roquan Smith nicely.

Foster could look like the Foster from last year and the Bears were still ahead. The Bears are ahead until Thomas develops and this becomes a winning team.