Graham Barton - OT Duke

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by 49ers808:
I'm the guy asking in the OL thread why he can't play OT? Is it just because measurables and C/OG is a better "projection" in the pros? This is just my opinion, but what we would be spending our first for is a guy that I believe can play RT, and if that fails, can play Center, and if that fails, is versatile enough to play guard.

Wrong guy to ask about Frazier, I absolutely love Frazier and would be happy to get him, even with our first, cause I don't think he makes it to our second and we'd have to trade up. But to answer your question, Frazier did not play OT like Graham did. Not only did Graham play LT for three years, he freaking thrived at it and put out some damn good tape against guys currently playing in the NFL right now.

The NFL believes his arms aren't long enough fir tackle. So much so he was going to be exclusively playing IOL at the senior bowl.

I'm fine with drafting him with the notion of playing him at OT. Thats what he has played. What I'm not fine with is drafting him with the notion of playing him at guard. A position he's never played. Wouldn't be thrilled with drafting him to play Center either

That's fine, to each his own. I'm fine with the notion of believing that he can play any of the three, with him already proving that he can play two of the three. I don't think he'd be overpowered or whatever reasons why you believe he can't play guard. If it's because he never played it, well only time will tell on that one if and when he ever does move to guard. But his tape at LT gives me confidence that moving inside to guard wouldn't be a problem at all. I'm no OL expert so we will see I guess.

Barton has amazing potential, but he seems like a luxury pick. His best position may be center, but he's never played center. Plus, Shanahan requires a LOT from his center. He's intriguing, but he's a long term investment, and the Niners should finding players who can help them win now.

If the Niners did draft Barton, he's probably starting out at RG, which would be an upgrade, but they still need OT depth.

Originally posted by Butter:
Barton has amazing potential, but he seems like a luxury pick. His best position may be center, but he's never played center. Plus, Shanahan requires a LOT from his center. He's intriguing, but he's a long term investment, and the Niners should finding players who can help them win now.

If the Niners did draft Barton, he's probably starting out at RG, which would be an upgrade, but they still need OT depth.

I agree but didn't he play center his freshman year? Thought I heard that, could be wrong.

A lot of mocks have him drafted before our pick.

Originally posted by Butter:
Barton has amazing potential, but he seems like a luxury pick. His best position may be center, but he's never played center. Plus, Shanahan requires a LOT from his center. He's intriguing, but he's a long term investment, and the Niners should finding players who can help them win now.

If the Niners did draft Barton, he's probably starting out at RG, which would be an upgrade, but they still need OT depth.

I don't agree with your logic. If you are relying on a rookie to come in and be a game changer immediately at pick 31 you are in some deep doo doo. Draft is for the future not necessarily the here and now. Yes all teams would like their rookies to come in and dominate but thats rarely the case.

If you draft Barton and he takes over for McKivitiz next year and turns out to be better then is it a bad draft pick? Is it still a luxury pick? You can probably classify all our picks on offense as luxury picks considering we are bringing back every starter.

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by Butter:
Barton has amazing potential, but he seems like a luxury pick. His best position may be center, but he's never played center. Plus, Shanahan requires a LOT from his center. He's intriguing, but he's a long term investment, and the Niners should finding players who can help them win now.

If the Niners did draft Barton, he's probably starting out at RG, which would be an upgrade, but they still need OT depth.

I don't agree with your logic. If you are relying on a rookie to come in and be a game changer immediately at pick 31 you are in some deep doo doo. Draft is for the future not necessarily the here and now. Yes all teams would like their rookies to come in and dominate but thats rarely the case.

If you draft Barton and he takes over for McKivitiz next year and turns out to be better then is it a bad draft pick? Is it still a luxury pick? You can probably classify all our picks on offense as luxury picks considering we are bringing back every starter.

Thats the thing. People want to upgrade RG because of the Superbowl, but Feliciano was a top 10 G based on PFF last year. People want to upgrade center because Brendel isnt a big name with a big pedigree but he has an elite 9.94 RAS Score and has all the movement skills KS is looking for. Plus experience in this system. He isnt going to hand over his job. Likewise for McKivitz. Hes not a great player and should be replaced, but he is an average RT. Banks was a second round pick and only played 5 snaps his rookie year. To think Mckivitz is out from the get go because someone has some draft capital is absurd.

I got no problem with Barton at 31 if you have him as BPA on the big board. We could easily have holes at every position on the line in a year or two and if hes the best OL, then you'll want that piece to build around. And depends what other "tackles" are on the board. Barton has the same size and arm length as Jordan Morgan. If you dismiss Barton as having a chance to play RT, I dont know what the argument for Morgan is. Suamataia has major issues with pad level and is raw in pass sets. He may very well up as a guard as well. At least Barton offer RT, RG, LG, C versatility.

Originally posted by scooterhd:
Thats the thing. People want to upgrade RG because of the Superbowl, but Feliciano was a top 10 G based on PFF last year. People want to upgrade center because Brendel isnt a big name with a big pedigree but he has an elite 9.94 RAS Score and has all the movement skills KS is looking for. Plus experience in this system. He isnt going to hand over his job. Likewise for McKivitz. Hes not a great player and should be replaced, but he is an average RT. Banks was a second round pick and only played 5 snaps his rookie year. To think Mckivitz is out from the get go because someone has some draft capital is absurd.

I got no problem with Barton at 31 if you have him as BPA on the big board. We could easily have holes at every position on the line in a year or two and if hes the best OL, then you'll want that piece to build around. And depends what other "tackles" are on the board. Barton has the same size and arm length as Jordan Morgan. If you dismiss Barton as having a chance to play RT, I dont know what the argument for Morgan is. Suamataia has major issues with pad level and is raw in pass sets. He may very well up as a guard as well. At least Barton offer RT, RG, LG, C versatility.

Barton offers LT versatility as well, that's the position he played the last 3 years in college. He'd be a MUCH better Daniel Brunskill as far as being able to play anywhere for this team. Nobody can convince me that isn't worth the 31st pick and that ALL teams don't value that. Since I've been in arguments about positional value. The irony in that is that he likely won't even make it to our pick at 31 so we won't have the option to draft him anyways lol

Originally posted by scooterhd:
Thats the thing. People want to upgrade RG because of the Superbowl, but Feliciano was a top 10 G based on PFF last year. People want to upgrade center because Brendel isnt a big name with a big pedigree but he has an elite 9.94 RAS Score and has all the movement skills KS is looking for. Plus experience in this system. He isnt going to hand over his job. Likewise for McKivitz. Hes not a great player and should be replaced, but he is an average RT. Banks was a second round pick and only played 5 snaps his rookie year. To think Mckivitz is out from the get go because someone has some draft capital is absurd.

I got no problem with Barton at 31 if you have him as BPA on the big board. We could easily have holes at every position on the line in a year or two and if hes the best OL, then you'll want that piece to build around. And depends what other "tackles" are on the board. Barton has the same size and arm length as Jordan Morgan. If you dismiss Barton as having a chance to play RT, I dont know what the argument for Morgan is. Suamataia has major issues with pad level and is raw in pass sets. He may very well up as a guard as well. At least Barton offer RT, RG, LG, C versatility.

If they can't find a guy who would come in and replace McKivitz at RT in THIS draft class, then I question their entire approach to personnel acquisition and scouting.

I think Barton is gonna go higher than a lot of people think.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
If they can't find a guy who would come in and replace McKivitz at RT in THIS draft class, then I question their entire approach to personnel acquisition and scouting.

To be clear, replacing McKivtiz and replacing McKivitz day 1 are very different things. I think the list of guys who can do that immediately will be gone by 31. Then you move into guys challenging for the spot.

Originally posted by scooterhd:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
If they can't find a guy who would come in and replace McKivitz at RT in THIS draft class, then I question their entire approach to personnel acquisition and scouting.

To be clear, replacing McKivtiz and replacing McKivitz day 1 are very different things. I think the list of guys who can do that immediately will be gone by 31. Then you move into guys challenging for the spot.

I agree. We all want to upgrade from McKivitz. I don't think it's gonna be a snap of the fingers.

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by Butter:
Barton has amazing potential, but he seems like a luxury pick. His best position may be center, but he's never played center. Plus, Shanahan requires a LOT from his center. He's intriguing, but he's a long term investment, and the Niners should finding players who can help them win now.

If the Niners did draft Barton, he's probably starting out at RG, which would be an upgrade, but they still need OT depth.

I don't agree with your logic. If you are relying on a rookie to come in and be a game changer immediately at pick 31 you are in some deep doo doo. Draft is for the future not necessarily the here and now. Yes all teams would like their rookies to come in and dominate but thats rarely the case.

If you draft Barton and he takes over for McKivitiz next year and turns out to be better then is it a bad draft pick? Is it still a luxury pick? You can probably classify all our picks on offense as luxury picks considering we are bringing back every starter.

While I wouldn't consider it a bad pick I certainly disagree that this draft is for the future these early picks need to be capable of contributing to some degree immediately.

Originally posted by Kolohe:
I think Barton is gonna go higher than a lot of people think.

Almost all the o line guys we've been discussing will.

Originally posted by adrianlesnar:

Originally posted by scooterhd:

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
If they can't find a guy who would come in and replace McKivitz at RT in THIS draft class, then I question their entire approach to personnel acquisition and scouting.

To be clear, replacing McKivtiz and replacing McKivitz day 1 are very different things. I think the list of guys who can do that immediately will be gone by 31. Then you move into guys challenging for the spot.

I agree. We all want to upgrade from McKivitz. I don't think it's gonna be a snap of the fingers.

This