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Originally posted by Kolohe:Originally posted by ChazBoner:Originally posted by Kolohe:Originally posted by VDSF:Albert Breer
@AlbertBreer
Source: 49ers brass will have dinner tonight with Ohio State DE Nick Bosa, after the Buckeyes' Pro Day. Bosa is standing on his results from the combine.
Can they just hand him his contract already.
no, because he wont be there when we pick.
Wanna bet!!!
Originally posted by genus49:The WZ edge prototype is the great Harold Landry. Horizontal dancers only.
I don't get the narrative with Bosa being too slow and not athletic enough.
Bosa isn't on the level of Myles Garrett or Von Miller in terms of speed or explosiveness but he's plenty fast for a DE and this idea that he's going to just get engulfed by big OTs due to his short arms and lack of speed to beat them around the edge is silly.I think the only OT to really worry about is Trenton "D**m you Shanahan/Lynch, I'm not too fat for a ring, Imma eat your DL for lunch" Brown.
Originally posted by marc1_007:Let me rephrase that to big and slow.
At the combine Ngakoue weighed 252 but now weighs 246 and Ingram weighed 264 not 254, but now weighs 247 so obviously they put on the weight for the combine because we all get too caught up with what edge rushes weigh in order to get drafted high and when you put on bad weight, you run a lot slower like Jachai Polite.
If I'm not mistaken Ford said that he intends too weigh 245 for the Niners so do you see the similarities with these three Leos? They are all speed rushers so their games are based on speed first that's why they all weigh less than 250. I certainly will not call Bosa a speed rusher, will you? I think in this system he is too big to be a Leo but as a big end like his brother absolutely.
Now if the FO intend to trade either AA or Sol, then I believe Bosa is an upgrade on them but if not then I'll be very surprised if he is the pick.
For me If I was going to trade one of them then I'd go with Quinnen and if I wasn't , I'd go with Allen.
Originally posted by crusher49er:Originally posted by genus49:Originally posted by evil:Originally posted by marc1_007:Bosa is the most Interesting player I have evaluated because based on the hype he was getting, without watching a full game tape and depending on highlights alone, he looked beastly, but then again, anyone can look good on highlights, but you have to take in to account the bloodlines, and the fact that Joey is an elite pass rusher in the NFL and you have to imagine that during the offseason, the two of them are always working out together (iron sharpens iron).
I was always going to do my own evaluation obviously but I went along with the buzz he was receiving and was really hoping to get that 1st pick, but when we didn't and it was time to try to guess who the Niners were going to take because surely the Cardinals were going to take Bosa, I started reading up on the other prospects and the two names that kept popping up were Quinnen Williams and Josh Allen.
Not many had a bad word to say about Quinnen but surely we were not going to take another DT so the only other logical choice was Allen, the only problem was that as many people were praising him, there was quite a few that were equally critical. So ss the bowl games were coming around, I decided that it was time to start my own evaluation. Having done Allen and Quinnen, I now turned to Bosa.
Quite frankly I don't get the hype, a term I always hear is polished and that he is good with his hands, but what I see is dip and a hand swipe or he counters to the inside with a hand swipe, he has got a very good bull rush, but outside of that, I am still trying to figure what makes him so special, he is definitely good at setting the edge but so is Solomon Thomas.
In watching gametape, I watched mainly the games against superior teams like Iowa, Michigan, Wisconsin, Penn State, Oklahoma, all in 2017 as he decided that he was going to stand on his limited game tape in 2018 against the likes of TCU, Oregon State and Rutgers and leave School early after a core injury as he did not want to risk his position in the draft. I also noticed that in 2017, he was on a rotation with Tyquan Lewis and Sam Hubbard and thats where I want to start.
I am very concerned that he was a rotational player because he was always coming in fresh, In 2017, he got 8.5 sacks, Hubbard 7 and Lewis 7, so obviously the rotation worked similar to Dante Fowler getting 8 sacks in a rotational role in 2017 for the Jaguars. With Lewis and Hubbard getting drafted in 2018, it was finally a chance to see Bosa in a starting role with less rotation and he started like a freight train albeit against a bunch of scrubs, but then he got his injury and shut himself down, I am not one to be critical about a player that makes a decision for himself and his family but based on his body of work in 2017, it was not enough for him to be held in the high regard he is held in. For me there is nothing to suggest that he is not able to play starter minutes but if his body breaks down when he does isn't that something we should worry about?
The Oklahoma game was very telling in that he was quite easily controlled by the tackles, and a lot has been made about his short arms and rightly so because his favourite move is the dip with the arm swipe and if he does not have enough speed to get to the outside of a tackle to be able to use his arm swipe to get past him, if they get their longer arms on him first as Orlando Brown and Bobby Evans showed, then he is easily controlled.
I also do not see a player in Bosa that is a number 1 overall or number 2 in our case, in fact in the Penn State game, against the same Tackles, Josh Allen looked more impressive, not only did he stuff the stats sheet, but he actually drew more double teams and had more qb pressures, and in the Iowa, game he was getting bottled up until his ejection, there was a stunt that he ran that needs to be seen to be believed in how slow he looked with a clear path to the qb, it looked like he was running in quicksand. He was okay in the Michigan game and slightly better in the Wisconsin game.
To put it bluntly, I'm all in on Quinnen Williams, and if he is gone or if the niners want to take an edge rusher, because of the number of interior rushers they have, I'll go Allen all day before Bosa, I am not as confident in Bosa as I was, after watching him as I feel that his best tape were all against weaker opponent, and If I get it wrong, I will happily hold my hands up.
BTW, I thought Joey was an elite prospect as well, and he has shown his qualities in the NFL as well, but as a Big End at 280+lbs and I don't believe, Nick will be as good as Joey as a big end and for me he is definitely not a Leo in the scheme, he is too slow. Think, Bruce, Irvin, Ngakoue, Ingram, that play that Seahawks system, so I believe Shanahan and Lynch when they say that Ford is the Leo. We don't need to go into his splits or cone scores because the Leo in this scheme is based on speed and he has not got any, thats why they got Ford.
One last point I want to make is that The Ohio state defensive line is always stacked with quality players, as you saw in 2017 Bosa had 8.5 sacks, Lewis had 7 and Hubbard had 7, and this year when Bosa played only 3 games, Dremont Jones had 8.5 and Chase Young had 9.5, so that should erase any illusion that the other players are padding up their numbers because all the offensive attention is on gameplanning Bosa.
Quite simply put , If you watch the game tape against decent opposition, he does not look as elite as he has been advertised and considering I was a self proclaimed Bosa fan in the beginning, I don't believe he is the best player in this draft class, let alone the best edge rusher.
I agree that Ford is the LEO but :
A :
6'2 252lbs
32.5' arms
4.75 40 time
1.64 10 yard split
4.5 SS
7.35 3 cone
26 reps
B:
6'2 254lbs
31.5' arms
4.79 40 time
1.62 10 yard split
4.18 SS
6.83 3 cone time
28 reps
C:
6'4 266lbs
33' arms
4.79 40 time
1.55 10 yard split
4.14 SS
7.1 3 cone
29 reps
A is Ngakoue
B is Ingram
C is Nick Bosa
People need to stop with the misinformation to push their points and or narratives. He is not too slow compared to other LEO's even though we would not require him to be the LEO given Ford's presence here.
I don't get the narrative with Bosa being too slow and not athletic enough.
I legit think it's just the common thought that black athletes tend to be more athletic and white guys are more technical. Well time to get with the times fellas...white guys can be fast and athletic and black guys can be super technical as well.
Bosa isn't on the level of Myles Garrett or Von Miller in terms of speed or explosiveness but he's plenty fast for a DE and this idea that he's going to just get engulfed by big OTs due to his short arms and lack of speed to beat them around the edge is silly.
He's not perfect. He's got his flaws but he's also young and like ANY prospect he can be coached up more and improve from his college days. It's like because he's already technically sound that people think he's got no room for improvement.
That's crazy talk. He can develop more moves, work on his strength and speed, work on his agility, flexibility and improve from his college play.
he doesn't have that burst off the line, not explosive.
Originally posted by 49er_Rider:
Originally posted by crusher49er:
Originally posted by genus49:
Originally posted by evil:
Originally posted by marc1_007:
Bosa is the most Interesting player I have evaluated because based on the hype he was getting, without watching a full game tape and depending on highlights alone, he looked beastly, but then again, anyone can look good on highlights, but you have to take in to account the bloodlines, and the fact that Joey is an elite pass rusher in the NFL and you have to imagine that during the offseason, the two of them are always working out together (iron sharpens iron).
I was always going to do my own evaluation obviously but I went along with the buzz he was receiving and was really hoping to get that 1st pick, but when we didn't and it was time to try to guess who the Niners were going to take because surely the Cardinals were going to take Bosa, I started reading up on the other prospects and the two names that kept popping up were Quinnen Williams and Josh Allen.
Not many had a bad word to say about Quinnen but surely we were not going to take another DT so the only other logical choice was Allen, the only problem was that as many people were praising him, there was quite a few that were equally critical. So ss the bowl games were coming around, I decided that it was time to start my own evaluation. Having done Allen and Quinnen, I now turned to Bosa.
Quite frankly I don't get the hype, a term I always hear is polished and that he is good with his hands, but what I see is dip and a hand swipe or he counters to the inside with a hand swipe, he has got a very good bull rush, but outside of that, I am still trying to figure what makes him so special, he is definitely good at setting the edge but so is Solomon Thomas.
In watching gametape, I watched mainly the games against superior teams like Iowa, Michigan, Wisconsin, Penn State, Oklahoma, all in 2017 as he decided that he was going to stand on his limited game tape in 2018 against the likes of TCU, Oregon State and Rutgers and leave School early after a core injury as he did not want to risk his position in the draft. I also noticed that in 2017, he was on a rotation with Tyquan Lewis and Sam Hubbard and thats where I want to start.
I am very concerned that he was a rotational player because he was always coming in fresh, In 2017, he got 8.5 sacks, Hubbard 7 and Lewis 7, so obviously the rotation worked similar to Dante Fowler getting 8 sacks in a rotational role in 2017 for the Jaguars. With Lewis and Hubbard getting drafted in 2018, it was finally a chance to see Bosa in a starting role with less rotation and he started like a freight train albeit against a bunch of scrubs, but then he got his injury and shut himself down, I am not one to be critical about a player that makes a decision for himself and his family but based on his body of work in 2017, it was not enough for him to be held in the high regard he is held in. For me there is nothing to suggest that he is not able to play starter minutes but if his body breaks down when he does isn't that something we should worry about?
The Oklahoma game was very telling in that he was quite easily controlled by the tackles, and a lot has been made about his short arms and rightly so because his favourite move is the dip with the arm swipe and if he does not have enough speed to get to the outside of a tackle to be able to use his arm swipe to get past him, if they get their longer arms on him first as Orlando Brown and Bobby Evans showed, then he is easily controlled.
I also do not see a player in Bosa that is a number 1 overall or number 2 in our case, in fact in the Penn State game, against the same Tackles, Josh Allen looked more impressive, not only did he stuff the stats sheet, but he actually drew more double teams and had more qb pressures, and in the Iowa, game he was getting bottled up until his ejection, there was a stunt that he ran that needs to be seen to be believed in how slow he looked with a clear path to the qb, it looked like he was running in quicksand. He was okay in the Michigan game and slightly better in the Wisconsin game.
To put it bluntly, I'm all in on Quinnen Williams, and if he is gone or if the niners want to take an edge rusher, because of the number of interior rushers they have, I'll go Allen all day before Bosa, I am not as confident in Bosa as I was, after watching him as I feel that his best tape were all against weaker opponent, and If I get it wrong, I will happily hold my hands up.
BTW, I thought Joey was an elite prospect as well, and he has shown his qualities in the NFL as well, but as a Big End at 280+lbs and I don't believe, Nick will be as good as Joey as a big end and for me he is definitely not a Leo in the scheme, he is too slow. Think, Bruce, Irvin, Ngakoue, Ingram, that play that Seahawks system, so I believe Shanahan and Lynch when they say that Ford is the Leo. We don't need to go into his splits or cone scores because the Leo in this scheme is based on speed and he has not got any, thats why they got Ford.
One last point I want to make is that The Ohio state defensive line is always stacked with quality players, as you saw in 2017 Bosa had 8.5 sacks, Lewis had 7 and Hubbard had 7, and this year when Bosa played only 3 games, Dremont Jones had 8.5 and Chase Young had 9.5, so that should erase any illusion that the other players are padding up their numbers because all the offensive attention is on gameplanning Bosa.
Quite simply put , If you watch the game tape against decent opposition, he does not look as elite as he has been advertised and considering I was a self proclaimed Bosa fan in the beginning, I don't believe he is the best player in this draft class, let alone the best edge rusher.
I agree that Ford is the LEO but :
A :
6'2 252lbs
32.5' arms
4.75 40 time
1.64 10 yard split
4.5 SS
7.35 3 cone
26 reps
B:
6'2 254lbs
31.5' arms
4.79 40 time
1.62 10 yard split
4.18 SS
6.83 3 cone time
28 reps
C:
6'4 266lbs
33' arms
4.79 40 time
1.55 10 yard split
4.14 SS
7.1 3 cone
29 reps
A is Ngakoue
B is Ingram
C is Nick Bosa
People need to stop with the misinformation to push their points and or narratives. He is not too slow compared to other LEO's even though we would not require him to be the LEO given Ford's presence here.
I don't get the narrative with Bosa being too slow and not athletic enough.
I legit think it's just the common thought that black athletes tend to be more athletic and white guys are more technical. Well time to get with the times fellas...white guys can be fast and athletic and black guys can be super technical as well.
Bosa isn't on the level of Myles Garrett or Von Miller in terms of speed or explosiveness but he's plenty fast for a DE and this idea that he's going to just get engulfed by big OTs due to his short arms and lack of speed to beat them around the edge is silly.
He's not perfect. He's got his flaws but he's also young and like ANY prospect he can be coached up more and improve from his college days. It's like because he's already technically sound that people think he's got no room for improvement.
That's crazy talk. He can develop more moves, work on his strength and speed, work on his agility, flexibility and improve from his college play.
he doesn't have that burst off the line, not explosive.
1.55 in the 10 yard split which is considered elite he tested better than Joey
Originally posted by Waterbear:Originally posted by Kolohe:Originally posted by ChazBoner:Originally posted by Kolohe:Originally posted by VDSF:Albert Breer
@AlbertBreer
Source: 49ers brass will have dinner tonight with Ohio State DE Nick Bosa, after the Buckeyes' Pro Day. Bosa is standing on his results from the combine.
Can they just hand him his contract already.
no, because he wont be there when we pick.
Wanna bet!!!
It's okay... If we can't go out and draft Nick Bosa. We should just draft Nick Bosa.
Bosa is the first down lineman in the 3 pt stance on the left #97. Again here he shows he's not just a C-gap edge rusher. Wins inside with a swipe move as the guard goes to punch. He's just quicker than everyone else along the front with those moves. #49wz pic.twitter.com/pRUjvvSFms
— Rich (@richjmadrid) March 20, 2019
Originally posted by zonkers:The WZ edge prototype is the great Harold Landry. Horizontal dancers only.
I think the only OT to really worry about is Trenton "D**m you Shanahan/Lynch, I'm not too fat for a ring, Imma eat your DL for lunch" Brown.
Originally posted by tjd808185:
The d is versatile enough to play with a big or small leo. Seattle has Frank Clark at leo right now. While he sucks at it we've spent the last 2 years trying to jam Solomon Thomas at leo. Atlanta had Brooks Reed then played Beasley at sam. There's no 1 way to play. All you have to is look at Seattle and how different of fronts Carrol has had. He started with a 330 pounder at big end in Red Bryant, from there he goes to a 280 pounder and speed at the edge with MB, Avril, Irvin now the d line is bigger again.
Originally posted by Rathof44:Originally posted by crusher49er:Originally posted by genus49:Originally posted by evil:Originally posted by marc1_007:Bosa is the most Interesting player I have evaluated because based on the hype he was getting, without watching a full game tape and depending on highlights alone, he looked beastly, but then again, anyone can look good on highlights, but you have to take in to account the bloodlines, and the fact that Joey is an elite pass rusher in the NFL and you have to imagine that during the offseason, the two of them are always working out together (iron sharpens iron).
I was always going to do my own evaluation obviously but I went along with the buzz he was receiving and was really hoping to get that 1st pick, but when we didn't and it was time to try to guess who the Niners were going to take because surely the Cardinals were going to take Bosa, I started reading up on the other prospects and the two names that kept popping up were Quinnen Williams and Josh Allen.
Not many had a bad word to say about Quinnen but surely we were not going to take another DT so the only other logical choice was Allen, the only problem was that as many people were praising him, there was quite a few that were equally critical. So ss the bowl games were coming around, I decided that it was time to start my own evaluation. Having done Allen and Quinnen, I now turned to Bosa.
Quite frankly I don't get the hype, a term I always hear is polished and that he is good with his hands, but what I see is dip and a hand swipe or he counters to the inside with a hand swipe, he has got a very good bull rush, but outside of that, I am still trying to figure what makes him so special, he is definitely good at setting the edge but so is Solomon Thomas.
In watching gametape, I watched mainly the games against superior teams like Iowa, Michigan, Wisconsin, Penn State, Oklahoma, all in 2017 as he decided that he was going to stand on his limited game tape in 2018 against the likes of TCU, Oregon State and Rutgers and leave School early after a core injury as he did not want to risk his position in the draft. I also noticed that in 2017, he was on a rotation with Tyquan Lewis and Sam Hubbard and thats where I want to start.
I am very concerned that he was a rotational player because he was always coming in fresh, In 2017, he got 8.5 sacks, Hubbard 7 and Lewis 7, so obviously the rotation worked similar to Dante Fowler getting 8 sacks in a rotational role in 2017 for the Jaguars. With Lewis and Hubbard getting drafted in 2018, it was finally a chance to see Bosa in a starting role with less rotation and he started like a freight train albeit against a bunch of scrubs, but then he got his injury and shut himself down, I am not one to be critical about a player that makes a decision for himself and his family but based on his body of work in 2017, it was not enough for him to be held in the high regard he is held in. For me there is nothing to suggest that he is not able to play starter minutes but if his body breaks down when he does isn't that something we should worry about?
The Oklahoma game was very telling in that he was quite easily controlled by the tackles, and a lot has been made about his short arms and rightly so because his favourite move is the dip with the arm swipe and if he does not have enough speed to get to the outside of a tackle to be able to use his arm swipe to get past him, if they get their longer arms on him first as Orlando Brown and Bobby Evans showed, then he is easily controlled.
I also do not see a player in Bosa that is a number 1 overall or number 2 in our case, in fact in the Penn State game, against the same Tackles, Josh Allen looked more impressive, not only did he stuff the stats sheet, but he actually drew more double teams and had more qb pressures, and in the Iowa, game he was getting bottled up until his ejection, there was a stunt that he ran that needs to be seen to be believed in how slow he looked with a clear path to the qb, it looked like he was running in quicksand. He was okay in the Michigan game and slightly better in the Wisconsin game.
To put it bluntly, I'm all in on Quinnen Williams, and if he is gone or if the niners want to take an edge rusher, because of the number of interior rushers they have, I'll go Allen all day before Bosa, I am not as confident in Bosa as I was, after watching him as I feel that his best tape were all against weaker opponent, and If I get it wrong, I will happily hold my hands up.
BTW, I thought Joey was an elite prospect as well, and he has shown his qualities in the NFL as well, but as a Big End at 280+lbs and I don't believe, Nick will be as good as Joey as a big end and for me he is definitely not a Leo in the scheme, he is too slow. Think, Bruce, Irvin, Ngakoue, Ingram, that play that Seahawks system, so I believe Shanahan and Lynch when they say that Ford is the Leo. We don't need to go into his splits or cone scores because the Leo in this scheme is based on speed and he has not got any, thats why they got Ford.
One last point I want to make is that The Ohio state defensive line is always stacked with quality players, as you saw in 2017 Bosa had 8.5 sacks, Lewis had 7 and Hubbard had 7, and this year when Bosa played only 3 games, Dremont Jones had 8.5 and Chase Young had 9.5, so that should erase any illusion that the other players are padding up their numbers because all the offensive attention is on gameplanning Bosa.
Quite simply put , If you watch the game tape against decent opposition, he does not look as elite as he has been advertised and considering I was a self proclaimed Bosa fan in the beginning, I don't believe he is the best player in this draft class, let alone the best edge rusher.
I agree that Ford is the LEO but :
A :
6'2 252lbs
32.5' arms
4.75 40 time
1.64 10 yard split
4.5 SS
7.35 3 cone
26 reps
B:
6'2 254lbs
31.5' arms
4.79 40 time
1.62 10 yard split
4.18 SS
6.83 3 cone time
28 reps
C:
6'4 266lbs
33' arms
4.79 40 time
1.55 10 yard split
4.14 SS
7.1 3 cone
29 reps
A is Ngakoue
B is Ingram
C is Nick Bosa
People need to stop with the misinformation to push their points and or narratives. He is not too slow compared to other LEO's even though we would not require him to be the LEO given Ford's presence here.
I don't get the narrative with Bosa being too slow and not athletic enough.
I legit think it's just the common thought that black athletes tend to be more athletic and white guys are more technical. Well time to get with the times fellas...white guys can be fast and athletic and black guys can be super technical as well.
Bosa isn't on the level of Myles Garrett or Von Miller in terms of speed or explosiveness but he's plenty fast for a DE and this idea that he's going to just get engulfed by big OTs due to his short arms and lack of speed to beat them around the edge is silly.
He's not perfect. He's got his flaws but he's also young and like ANY prospect he can be coached up more and improve from his college days. It's like because he's already technically sound that people think he's got no room for improvement.
That's crazy talk. He can develop more moves, work on his strength and speed, work on his agility, flexibility and improve from his college play.
he doesn't have that burst off the line, not explosive.
Really? So who in the NFL does have that burst of the line? Who is explosive? Von Miller? Myles Garrett? Khalil Mack? Jadeveon Clowney? Guess not, because Bosa's 10yd split is better than all of them.
I'm guessing 10yd split is a decent indicator of explosives and how fast a player is off the line.
Nick Bosa takes care of a need, I mean on our defense what position isn't a position of need, but I don't know want an edge rusher that plays 10 games a year. pic.twitter.com/AcJSIIifCm
— Silver & Black Pride (@SilverBlakPride) March 19, 2019
Originally posted by genus49:
Originally posted by 49er_Rider:
Originally posted by crusher49er:
Originally posted by genus49:
Originally posted by evil:
Originally posted by marc1_007:
Bosa is the most Interesting player I have evaluated because based on the hype he was getting, without watching a full game tape and depending on highlights alone, he looked beastly, but then again, anyone can look good on highlights, but you have to take in to account the bloodlines, and the fact that Joey is an elite pass rusher in the NFL and you have to imagine that during the offseason, the two of them are always working out together (iron sharpens iron).
I was always going to do my own evaluation obviously but I went along with the buzz he was receiving and was really hoping to get that 1st pick, but when we didn't and it was time to try to guess who the Niners were going to take because surely the Cardinals were going to take Bosa, I started reading up on the other prospects and the two names that kept popping up were Quinnen Williams and Josh Allen.
Not many had a bad word to say about Quinnen but surely we were not going to take another DT so the only other logical choice was Allen, the only problem was that as many people were praising him, there was quite a few that were equally critical. So ss the bowl games were coming around, I decided that it was time to start my own evaluation. Having done Allen and Quinnen, I now turned to Bosa.
Quite frankly I don't get the hype, a term I always hear is polished and that he is good with his hands, but what I see is dip and a hand swipe or he counters to the inside with a hand swipe, he has got a very good bull rush, but outside of that, I am still trying to figure what makes him so special, he is definitely good at setting the edge but so is Solomon Thomas.
In watching gametape, I watched mainly the games against superior teams like Iowa, Michigan, Wisconsin, Penn State, Oklahoma, all in 2017 as he decided that he was going to stand on his limited game tape in 2018 against the likes of TCU, Oregon State and Rutgers and leave School early after a core injury as he did not want to risk his position in the draft. I also noticed that in 2017, he was on a rotation with Tyquan Lewis and Sam Hubbard and thats where I want to start.
I am very concerned that he was a rotational player because he was always coming in fresh, In 2017, he got 8.5 sacks, Hubbard 7 and Lewis 7, so obviously the rotation worked similar to Dante Fowler getting 8 sacks in a rotational role in 2017 for the Jaguars. With Lewis and Hubbard getting drafted in 2018, it was finally a chance to see Bosa in a starting role with less rotation and he started like a freight train albeit against a bunch of scrubs, but then he got his injury and shut himself down, I am not one to be critical about a player that makes a decision for himself and his family but based on his body of work in 2017, it was not enough for him to be held in the high regard he is held in. For me there is nothing to suggest that he is not able to play starter minutes but if his body breaks down when he does isn't that something we should worry about?
The Oklahoma game was very telling in that he was quite easily controlled by the tackles, and a lot has been made about his short arms and rightly so because his favourite move is the dip with the arm swipe and if he does not have enough speed to get to the outside of a tackle to be able to use his arm swipe to get past him, if they get their longer arms on him first as Orlando Brown and Bobby Evans showed, then he is easily controlled.
I also do not see a player in Bosa that is a number 1 overall or number 2 in our case, in fact in the Penn State game, against the same Tackles, Josh Allen looked more impressive, not only did he stuff the stats sheet, but he actually drew more double teams and had more qb pressures, and in the Iowa, game he was getting bottled up until his ejection, there was a stunt that he ran that needs to be seen to be believed in how slow he looked with a clear path to the qb, it looked like he was running in quicksand. He was okay in the Michigan game and slightly better in the Wisconsin game.
To put it bluntly, I'm all in on Quinnen Williams, and if he is gone or if the niners want to take an edge rusher, because of the number of interior rushers they have, I'll go Allen all day before Bosa, I am not as confident in Bosa as I was, after watching him as I feel that his best tape were all against weaker opponent, and If I get it wrong, I will happily hold my hands up.
BTW, I thought Joey was an elite prospect as well, and he has shown his qualities in the NFL as well, but as a Big End at 280+lbs and I don't believe, Nick will be as good as Joey as a big end and for me he is definitely not a Leo in the scheme, he is too slow. Think, Bruce, Irvin, Ngakoue, Ingram, that play that Seahawks system, so I believe Shanahan and Lynch when they say that Ford is the Leo. We don't need to go into his splits or cone scores because the Leo in this scheme is based on speed and he has not got any, thats why they got Ford.
One last point I want to make is that The Ohio state defensive line is always stacked with quality players, as you saw in 2017 Bosa had 8.5 sacks, Lewis had 7 and Hubbard had 7, and this year when Bosa played only 3 games, Dremont Jones had 8.5 and Chase Young had 9.5, so that should erase any illusion that the other players are padding up their numbers because all the offensive attention is on gameplanning Bosa.
Quite simply put , If you watch the game tape against decent opposition, he does not look as elite as he has been advertised and considering I was a self proclaimed Bosa fan in the beginning, I don't believe he is the best player in this draft class, let alone the best edge rusher.
I agree that Ford is the LEO but :
A :
6'2 252lbs
32.5' arms
4.75 40 time
1.64 10 yard split
4.5 SS
7.35 3 cone
26 reps
B:
6'2 254lbs
31.5' arms
4.79 40 time
1.62 10 yard split
4.18 SS
6.83 3 cone time
28 reps
C:
6'4 266lbs
33' arms
4.79 40 time
1.55 10 yard split
4.14 SS
7.1 3 cone
29 reps
A is Ngakoue
B is Ingram
C is Nick Bosa
People need to stop with the misinformation to push their points and or narratives. He is not too slow compared to other LEO's even though we would not require him to be the LEO given Ford's presence here.
I don't get the narrative with Bosa being too slow and not athletic enough.
I legit think it's just the common thought that black athletes tend to be more athletic and white guys are more technical. Well time to get with the times fellas...white guys can be fast and athletic and black guys can be super technical as well.
Bosa isn't on the level of Myles Garrett or Von Miller in terms of speed or explosiveness but he's plenty fast for a DE and this idea that he's going to just get engulfed by big OTs due to his short arms and lack of speed to beat them around the edge is silly.
He's not perfect. He's got his flaws but he's also young and like ANY prospect he can be coached up more and improve from his college days. It's like because he's already technically sound that people think he's got no room for improvement.
That's crazy talk. He can develop more moves, work on his strength and speed, work on his agility, flexibility and improve from his college play.
he doesn't have that burst off the line, not explosive.
1.55 in the 10 yard split which is considered elite he tested better than Joey
You can tell who watched that Bosa video...
key words/phrases to look for
1. Slow off the line/average first step
2. Short arms
3. Engulfed by Oklahoma's OTs/ OTs with long arms.
Originally posted by philosoraptor:He is a 70 percentile athlete, per 3 sigma athlete. This means he is a better athlete than 7/10 DE's in the league in terms of athletic testing. He isnt an elite athlete like JJ watt is, but it means he is very good. He has elite flexibility, and very good functional strength relative to his size, and his explosiveness is fine(a 73 percentile vert, and 76 percentile broad). He does possess short arms, no doubt about that. But 33 inches isnt as bad as people make it out to be. Khalil mack has 33 1/4 inch arms and that does him just fine. Actually Mack and Bosa have very comparable metrics when you factor in that Bosa is 15 pounds heavier:
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/nick-bosa
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/khalil-mack
Originally posted by 9moon:JUST who does Nick Bosa reminds you of?
