MadDog's Niners Draft Grade and Analysis for 2012 NFL Draft

You aren't also suggesting that the Harbaugh/Roman offense is on the same sophistication level as the Kyle Shanahan offense are you?

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
You aren't also suggesting that the Harbaugh/Roman offense is on the same sophistication level as the Kyle Shanahan offense are you?

I don't get where you say they didn't use Gin and Moss - I think they played in the playoffs and were on the field. Why they didn't throw to him, I don't know but they played a role in that year's playoff run and in the super bowl, if I recall correctly. Again, the offense Harbaugh uses isn't the WCO, it's a vertical offense. His run game is very sophisticated and his passing game isn't neanderthal. It's not as sophisticated or well designed as Kyle's passing offense for sure, but I don't think a neanderthal offense gets you almost a 70% winning percentage over 4 years in the NFL - do you?

"We tend to put everyone in the Hall of Fame when they have a great game, or say everyone's great when they do one good thing," Madden said during an interview at his San Francisco condominium. "I kind of think that Jim Harbaugh's first year, by getting to the championship game, was the best coaching job in the history of the NFL.
"Just in my mind, the time that I've studied the game, someone that had all those things stacked against him. There was a lockout, so he didn't get to work with any of the players. He couldn't put his program in. He had to take what was there, he had no time for free agency. And he made the best of it and got to the championship game, came that close."

https://www.google.com/amp/www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-49ers-harbaugh-farmer-20141205-column.html%3foutputType=amp

As much as many want to pretend like there was a golden platter with diamonds on the edges waiting for Harbaugh, with a Super Bowl team just waiting for any coach to come lead us is just straight out false...

That narrative just simply isn't true. It wasn't true then and will not be in the real history books...

All those odds stacked against him and still to turn Alex Smith into a winner? When we reflect some sound real ungrateful for what he really has done for us. Perhaps he should have failed his first year.. He coached that talent and made them winners because he is a players coach, they bought into his system, he got the best out of them. It wasn't running right late true but we needed a rush of fresh talent throughout that 3-4 year window. Let's stop the nonsense.

Originally posted by Giedi:
I don't get where you say they didn't use Gin and Moss - I think they played in the playoffs and were on the field. Why they didn't throw to him, I don't know but they played a role in that year's playoff run and in the super bowl, if I recall correctly. Again, the offense Harbaugh uses isn't the WCO, it's a vertical offense. His run game is very sophisticated and his passing game isn't neanderthal. It's not as sophisticated or well designed as Kyle's passing offense for sure, but I don't think a neanderthal offense gets you almost a 70% winning percentage over 4 years in the NFL - do you?

When you have an elite Defense it sure as hell can.

I wouldn't categorize it as neanderthal however but it was a below average passing offense.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Giedi:

I don't get where you say they didn't use Gin and Moss - I think they played in the playoffs and were on the field. Why they didn't throw to him, I don't know but they played a role in that year's playoff run and in the super bowl, if I recall correctly. Again, the offense Harbaugh uses isn't the WCO, it's a vertical offense. His run game is very sophisticated and his passing game isn't neanderthal. It's not as sophisticated or well designed as Kyle's passing offense for sure, but I don't think a neanderthal offense gets you almost a 70% winning percentage over 4 years in the NFL - do you?

When you have an elite Defense it sure as hell can.

I wouldn't categorize it as neanderthal however but it was a below average passing offense.

The same below average passing offense that came back from a 17 point deficit in the title game?

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Giedi:
I don't get where you say they didn't use Gin and Moss - I think they played in the playoffs and were on the field. Why they didn't throw to him, I don't know but they played a role in that year's playoff run and in the super bowl, if I recall correctly. Again, the offense Harbaugh uses isn't the WCO, it's a vertical offense. His run game is very sophisticated and his passing game isn't neanderthal. It's not as sophisticated or well designed as Kyle's passing offense for sure, but I don't think a neanderthal offense gets you almost a 70% winning percentage over 4 years in the NFL - do you?

When you have an elite Defense it sure as hell can.

I wouldn't categorize it as neanderthal however but it was a below average passing offense.

I thought the offense was pretty impressive against the new orleans playoff game. As for defense, that's Harbaugh's hallmark. His defenses are always stingy, disciplined, and love to apply pass rush heat. So that is also a check mark *for* Harbaugh. As for offense, the times his offense had some decent speed players, he's always reached deep into the playoffs. I attribute the falloff of the offense squarely on Baalke. The AJ Jenkins draft was a classic example of Baalke's inability to find WR's - and I think a symptom of his inability to submit his ego to his HC - and allow his HC to pick *his* offensive players.

SANTA CLARA — General manager Trent Baalke spoke Friday for the first time since the 49ers released rookie quarterback B.J. Daniels and replaced him with former Arizona Cardinals starter John Skelton. Baalke, speaking on his weekly radio show on 95.7
[...]
Here is what Harbaugh had to say today on the Daniels-Skelton swap:
When we spoke to you on Wednesday, QB B.J. Daniels was still in limbo. Obviously he's not with the team. What's your reaction? Are you disappointed that you don't have him anymore on the squad?
"Yes, we would have liked to have had B.J. back on the practice squad, and we don't. So, rolled the dice there, and now we don't have him."

https://www.mercurynews.com/2013/10/04/49ers-g-m-defends-decision-to-release-b-j-daniels/

Let's go the the footage.

"Epic" was the word used to describe the first comeback under Jim Harbaugh, far from below average if you asked me.

Imagine if our GM would have done his job and drafted for his head coach? Especially in the wr department.. Some must have forgotten the multiple comebacks..

Just a year back they were 6-10 watching from home eating cheese doodles..

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:
"Harbaugh has invested a lot of time, effort and money into this program in his three years so far as the head coach. From overseas trips to satellite camps to crazy recruiting tactics, he has went to the end of the world for the university and the football team. He recruits kids that want to succeed both on the field and in the classroom — something not every head coach does."

"ESPN NFL Insider Dan Graziano published a story Thursday predicting 25 things that will happen in the NFL by 2021."

Something our GM had a hard time doing, You cannot tell me 2012 and 2013 did not affect Jim Harbaugh and there was arguing about personnel.. Lol now Baalke drafts had no affect on his tenure there?

What did the other coaches do with all that talent you speak of?

The niners should have made Trent head coach and Gm then if they love him so much and think he did so great despite not having one coach he can be proud of and say they worked well. Yet I'm supposed to believe otherwise.. lol

Baalke should learn some pointers, how to recruit and draft..

One guy is successful everywhere.

The other guy is successful nowhere.
Success is no coincidence.... Never has been..

He got out coached in the super bowl and had superior talent...yes his 3rd and 4th positional roster spots (that go towards rookies) wasn't amazing didn't matter in 2012-2013 When our starters were as good as they were. Jim's job was to develop Kap he didn't, Baalke's job was to build a long lasting pipeline of talent he didn't and it really affected the team until after that 2014 off season...more than when Jim was here without question.

again Jim didn't win all 3 of those seasons with a goof troop of players...they were good NFL vets.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

He got out coached in the super bowl and had superior talent...yes his 3rd and 4th positional roster spots (that go towards rookies) wasn't amazing didn't matter in 2012-2013 When our starters were as good as they were. Jim's job was to develop Kap he didn't, Baalke's job was to build a long lasting pipeline of talent he didn't and it really affected the team until after that 2014 off season...more than when Jim was here without question.

again Jim didn't win all 3 of those seasons with a goof troop of players...they were good NFL vets.

So in other words Baalke gets a pass for ruining the 2012 draft, 2013 draft and 2014, 2015 and 2016 draft, which had no affect on his coach???? Huh?? Yet I am supposed to believe it had no affect on his coach?!?!?!

In every year of Harbaugh's tenure he flopped drafts but I am supposed to believe it didn't affect Harbaugh till 2014??? Lol

He developed Alex Smith and had an epic comback in New Orleans 2012.. During a lockout.. He had Kap rolling.. You would think a gm should help him in the draft, not in ninerland we look for excuses, for a guy who did s**t in 6 years... WoW

The GM did nothing for the guy and more excuses for him? Who is this guy?

Is Trent Baalke a saint??? He did nothing for any of his coaches and still the excuses pour out.

So what coach could have worked with Baalke because he ran through 3-4 of them right out the door before he went?

What coach has been successful with Lord Baalke besides Harbaugh??

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

He got out coached in the super bowl and had superior talent...yes his 3rd and 4th positional roster spots (that go towards rookies) wasn't amazing didn't matter in 2012-2013 When our starters were as good as they were. Jim's job was to develop Kap he didn't, Baalke's job was to build a long lasting pipeline of talent he didn't and it really affected the team until after that 2014 off season...more than when Jim was here without question.

again Jim didn't win all 3 of those seasons with a goof troop of players...they were good NFL vets.

So in other words Baalke gets a pass for ruining the 2012 draft, 2013 draft and 2014, 2015 and 2016 draft, which had no affect on his coach???? Huh?? Yet I am supposed to believe it had no affect on his coach?!?!?!

In every year of Harbaugh's tenure he flopped drafts but I am supposed to believe it didn't affect Harbaugh till 2014??? Lol

He developed Alex Smith and had an epic comback in New Orleans 2012.. During a lockout.. He had Kap rolling.. You would think a gm should help him in the draft, not in ninerland we look for excuses, for a guy who did s**t in 6 years... WoW

The GM did nothing for the guy and more excuses for him? Who is this guy?

Is Trent Baalke a saint??? He did nothing for any of his coaches and still the excuses pour out.

So what coach could have worked with Baalke because he ran through 3-4 of them right out the door before he went?

What coach has been successful with Lord Baalke besides Harbaugh??

We wouldn't be better if we took Alshon Jeffery and Travis Kelce over Jenkins and McDonald who are you kidding with that?

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Wu-5Rings:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

He got out coached in the super bowl and had superior talent...yes his 3rd and 4th positional roster spots (that go towards rookies) wasn't amazing didn't matter in 2012-2013 When our starters were as good as they were. Jim's job was to develop Kap he didn't, Baalke's job was to build a long lasting pipeline of talent he didn't and it really affected the team until after that 2014 off season...more than when Jim was here without question.

again Jim didn't win all 3 of those seasons with a goof troop of players...they were good NFL vets.

So in other words Baalke gets a pass for ruining the 2012 draft, 2013 draft and 2014, 2015 and 2016 draft, which had no affect on his coach???? Huh?? Yet I am supposed to believe it had no affect on his coach?!?!?!

In every year of Harbaugh's tenure he flopped drafts but I am supposed to believe it didn't affect Harbaugh till 2014??? Lol

He developed Alex Smith and had an epic comback in New Orleans 2012.. During a lockout.. He had Kap rolling.. You would think a gm should help him in the draft, not in ninerland we look for excuses, for a guy who did s**t in 6 years... WoW

The GM did nothing for the guy and more excuses for him? Who is this guy?

Is Trent Baalke a saint??? He did nothing for any of his coaches and still the excuses pour out.

So what coach could have worked with Baalke because he ran through 3-4 of them right out the door before he went?

What coach has been successful with Lord Baalke besides Harbaugh??

We wouldn't be better if we took Alshon Jeffery and Travis Kelce over Jenkins and McDonald who are you kidding with that?

So Ted Ginn couldnt see the field because of too much talent but rookies Kelce and Jeffrey would be impact guys?

So one drive against New Orleans negates the fact they coulrnt get one stinking 3rd down conversion against the Giants?

Good offenses are good on 3rd down and in the red zone. Things this offense was never good at outside of Kap making plays with his legs.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

So Ted Ginn couldnt see the field because of too much talent but rookies Kelce and Jeffrey would be impact guys?

McDonald saw the field plenty his rookie season. Started 4/ played in 15. With Jeffrey 1st year yeah he'd held back some in 12 but in 2013 with Crabs injured, no Ginn/ Moss/ Manningham. He only put up 1400 yards in Chc in year 2 but I'm sure we couldn't use that.

Baalke's bad drafts effected 13. At that point we had to replace Walker and the receivers I listed and his picks contributed nothing. 1 was so bad he that he didn't even make it to year 2.

"McDonald, a 2013 second-round draft pick, recorded 64 receptions in his four seasons. But it was his rash of drops and injuries that cast doubt on his tenure. He missed 16 games because of injuries, and he dropped 12 of 76 catchable passes, according to ProFootballFocus.com.
That 15.8 percentage of drops since 2013 ranks as the league's worst among tight eight who had at least 75 catchable targets, PFF reported."



I wish we would have seen a gm that actually helped that specific coach. It would have been lovely.

Helped No one!!

"The rise and fall and rise again of Ted Ginn Jr."

"CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Two catches ... 1 yard ... 13 games. That was the entirety of Ted Ginn Jr.'s contribution to the San Francisco 49ers' offense in 2012, when his once-promising career bottomed out.

Back then, the wide receiver was hearing concerns from everyone: his wife, friends and total strangers. Many of them came from back home in Cleveland. Locals wanted to know why Ginn -- football's version of LeBron James in the area, the city's highest offensive draft pick since Desmond Howard -- wasn't catching more passes.

Ginn's mind was elsewhere. His father's pancreatic cancer had worsened, and in December 2012, Ginn received a call from his family suggesting he get home quickly. "This might be it," he remembered. Dad had been in a coma for a few days. Ginn flew home and arrived at Cleveland Clinic around 6 a.m., a convenient time, considering no one was awake to ask him about football. In the previous months, Ginn had bemoaned to his father the helplessness he felt on the field. Ted Ginn Sr. didn't have the strength to talk much, with tubes in his nose and a family member holding the phone, and he was left to hear the crying without a father's guidance in return. Now, Ginn was preparing to say goodbye."

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/14688116/the-rise-fall-rise-again-carolina-panthers-wr-ted-ginn-jr-nfl

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000100510/Ginn-Jr-muffs-punt

Very clearly he was going through personal problems during that time and was out of it, accompanied by dropped passes..

Debunked...

Talent was the main problem no matter how many still protect 6 seasons of wasted draft picks. It would help drafting players that can actually catch the ball? Eh? In case the starters underperform, get hurt or other reasons unknown..

That's thinking logically but when you got an obsessive gm addicted to injured players. Logic is far fetched..