Drafting 2 quarterbacks

Originally posted by Nuns:

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:

Originally posted by Paul:
last time we did that we ended up with....

whos that?

I think that's Carmazzi. Didn't we draft him and Rattay in the same draft?

Yes it is, and that actually proves the point why it's a good idea this year. Even though we completely busted on Carmazzi in round 3, we took a flyer on Rattay with one of our 2 7th round picks and got some good value out of him.

Certainly Rattay didn't turn into the next great Niner QB. But on a lousy team he was a serviceable QB for a while and had we hit on our earlier QB, he would have been a fine backup.

Also of note, Tom Brady was a 6th round pick in that draft. Seems well worth a late round pick to try and find a diamond in the rough to me.

Originally posted by NewEraNiner:

Originally posted by krizay:
I for one am probably in the minority (what else is new come draft time eh? )but i'd be ok with it. IF all the stars aligned correctly.

Say Ponder in the 2nd. (Though I believe we'll have to trade up to get but...) Then if say Dalton or Stanzi is still there in the 4th, Why the hell not?

The 4th round picdk we choose. Who ever that may be, will likely be a backup player for us. So why not a backup QB? Would provide competition for both QB's. Not too mention in theory they'd likely get the same tutledge right out of the gate as opposed to trying to coach up the starter and letting the backup guy basically learn from watching.

If QB is the most important player on the field. Then backup QB > than backup any thing else right?

After thinking about it, I'm not sure I agree with this krizay.

I think the value of depth/backup players at a certain position should be based on the chance they'll have to play sooner than later.

The QB (assuming decent protection, and I know that's a pretty big assumption at this point) should have a lower chance of injury than a lot of other positions on the field. I think this is supported by the longer careers of QBs.

At other positions, especially things like DL where there's a rotation, I think depth might be more important than QB depth.

While you are probably right in the BIG PICTURE of things. In THIS situation I don't think you are.

My reasons...
We have no backup QB as we speak. The one guy we do have on roster isn't even worthy of a backup spot here. We already know what we have in Carr. Same goes for Smith. While I'd gladly keep him as a backup.... But if we don't like the guy as a starter, why should we like him as a 2nd stringer that we really don't WANT starting?

In contrast, what postions/players would be there with the pick we choose the 2nd/backup QB? Would they really have a chance to fit into the rotation and being a contributor right away? Would a guy that we'd get at another position at that draft position be that much better than what we already have? Or bthat much better than an UDFA we could bring in and give a shot to?

In the grand scheme of things... a 3rd OLB or CB or S etc... > a 2nd string QB. But 2nd string QB > than 4th/5th string anything. Which I believe the latter is the situation we're basically talking about.

Originally posted by ChaunceyGardner:
2nd rounder and Greg "he's our new 6th round boy" McElroy.

That would be nice. I think there's a really good chance that we'll draft two QB's whether or not we re-sign Smith or trade for Kolb/Orton/McNabb/Whoever because we're surely going to cut Carr. Basically, we have no QB's at the moment and we need 3.

These are the two combos I see as most likely to happen...

1) Draft a QB in 1st or 2nd + Draft a QB in 5th or 6th + Alex Smith/or Trade
2) Draft a QB in 1st or 2nd + Alex Smith or Trade + Journeyman Free Agent

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by NewEraNiner:

Originally posted by krizay:
I for one am probably in the minority (what else is new come draft time eh? )but i'd be ok with it. IF all the stars aligned correctly.

Say Ponder in the 2nd. (Though I believe we'll have to trade up to get but...) Then if say Dalton or Stanzi is still there in the 4th, Why the hell not?

The 4th round picdk we choose. Who ever that may be, will likely be a backup player for us. So why not a backup QB? Would provide competition for both QB's. Not too mention in theory they'd likely get the same tutledge right out of the gate as opposed to trying to coach up the starter and letting the backup guy basically learn from watching.

If QB is the most important player on the field. Then backup QB > than backup any thing else right?

After thinking about it, I'm not sure I agree with this krizay.

I think the value of depth/backup players at a certain position should be based on the chance they'll have to play sooner than later.

The QB (assuming decent protection, and I know that's a pretty big assumption at this point) should have a lower chance of injury than a lot of other positions on the field. I think this is supported by the longer careers of QBs.

At other positions, especially things like DL where there's a rotation, I think depth might be more important than QB depth.

While you are probably right in the BIG PICTURE of things. In THIS situation I don't think you are.

My reasons...
We have no backup QB as we speak. The one guy we do have on roster isn't even worthy of a backup spot here. We already know what we have in Carr. Same goes for Smith. While I'd gladly keep him as a backup.... But if we don't like the guy as a starter, why should we like him as a 2nd stringer that we really don't WANT starting?

In contrast, what postions/players would be there with the pick we choose the 2nd/backup QB? Would they really have a chance to fit into the rotation and being a contributor right away? Would a guy that we'd get at another position at that draft position be that much better than what we already have? Or bthat much better than an UDFA we could bring in and give a shot to?

In the grand scheme of things... a 3rd OLB or CB or S etc... > a 2nd string QB. But 2nd string QB > than 4th/5th string anything. Which I believe the latter is the situation we're basically talking about.

Yeah I'm with you on that. Especially after seeing us lose the Carolina game because we had no backup. Hopefully they address that this year, through the draft or FA or whatever.

I pray we draft a least 1 QB in the top 3 rounds.. I be ticked off even more about this season if we ignore QB again..

Originally posted by fakers23:
I pray we draft a least 1 QB in the top 3 rounds.. I be ticked off even more about this season if we ignore QB again..

That will not happen (.........I hope). New regimes almost always mean new QB's.

Two QB's would work for me if the Niners think the lack of a CBA will restrict them from getting what they want in free agency or by trade.

Originally posted by krizay:
I for one am probably in the minority (what else is new come draft time eh? )but i'd be ok with it. IF all the stars aligned correctly.

Say Ponder in the 2nd. (Though I believe we'll have to trade up to get but...) Then if say Dalton or Stanzi is still there in the 4th, Why the hell not?

The 4th round picdk we choose. Who ever that may be, will likely be a backup player for us. So why not a backup QB? Would provide competition for both QB's. Not too mention in theory they'd likely get the same tutledge right out of the gate as opposed to trying to coach up the starter and letting the backup guy basically learn from watching.

If QB is the most important player on the field. Then backup QB > than backup any thing else right?

I agree with this line of thinking and believe it is a certainty if A. Smith is not resigned, and the CBA is not hashed out well before the draft.

Can the team have 0 (Carrcrash doesn't count) QB's heading into the draft and not draft 2 qb's?

Originally posted by m_brockalexander:

Originally posted by fakers23:
I pray we draft a least 1 QB in the top 3 rounds.. I be ticked off even more about this season if we ignore QB again..

That will not happen (.........I hope). New regimes almost always mean new QB's.

Two QB's would work for me if the Niners think the lack of a CBA will restrict them from getting what they want in free agency or by trade.

I'm all for taking 2 QBs,but some thing tells me it wont happen.. Not because it's a bad idea,but because our front office is afraid of real competion at QB.. Just look at 2010 and who they brought in..

Originally posted by TexasNiner:

Originally posted by Nuns:

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:

Originally posted by Paul:
last time we did that we ended up with....

whos that?

I think that's Carmazzi. Didn't we draft him and Rattay in the same draft?

Yes it is, and that actually proves the point why it's a good idea this year. Even though we completely busted on Carmazzi in round 3, we took a flyer on Rattay with one of our 2 7th round picks and got some good value out of him.

Certainly Rattay didn't turn into the next great Niner QB. But on a lousy team he was a serviceable QB for a while and had we hit on our earlier QB, he would have been a fine backup.

Also of note, Tom Brady was a 6th round pick in that draft. Seems well worth a late round pick to try and find a diamond in the rough to me.

That's the very first thing that came to mind, that we wiffed one of the best QBs to play the game last time we picked 2 qbs.

I don't see it.

None of the current group are worthy of the #7 overall. There are far better value/need matches there.

By #45 Ponder and Dalton may still be there but neither one of them will be as important as OLB/CB, whichever one wasn't picked in round 1.

Depending on who is there, it might be worth using the 3rd and 4th picks to move up and grab Dalton/Ponder (the only other ones I consider worth while).

After that, I would rather be filling ST and situational player needs than taking a shot at a second QB.

I still prefer go after a QB next year. Re-sign Alex and Dennis Dixon for this year. I believe Dixon has more potential than any QB we might get from round 3 on.

i wouldnt mind drafting another QB in the 6th or 7th round.. i believe that we have two 6th and two sevent, don't we??

There's nothing wrong with drafting another talent in the 6th round.. there's nothing to lose and everything to gain..

here are my late round talent at the QB position..

Mitch Mustain, QB - USC (he reminded me of Jake the Snake when he was a young gunslinger at Arkansas)

Mike Hartline, QB - Kentucky (a trouble young man but full of potential, reminded me of Matt Hasselbach)

Jerrod Johnson, QB - Texas A&M (a once heismann trophy hopefull, this kid reminds me of David Gerard)

TJ Yates, QB - UNC (knows pro offense very well, Danny Kennel all over again)

Tyrod Taylor, Virginia Tech (Im sure everyone knows how very good this kid can play)

Originally posted by 9moon:
i wouldnt mind drafting another QB in the 6th or 7th round.. i believe that we have two 6th and two sevent, don't we??

There's nothing wrong with drafting another talent in the 6th round.. there's nothing to lose and everything to gain..

here are my late round talent at the QB position..

Mitch Mustain, QB - USC (he reminded me of Jake the Snake when he was a young gunslinger at Arkansas)

Mike Hartline, QB - Kentucky (a trouble young man but full of potential, reminded me of Matt Hasselbach)

Jerrod Johnson, QB - Texas A&M (a once heismann trophy hopefull, this kid reminds me of David Gerard)

TJ Yates, QB - UNC (knows pro offense very well, Danny Kennel all over again)

Tyrod Taylor, Virginia Tech (Im sure everyone knows how very good this kid can play)

I wouldn't mind Mustain, McElroy, Hartline, Tolzien (sp?) from Wisconsin or even Yates late. But TT I dont see being a QB at the next level and Jerrod Johnson is hot ish.

It's not a bad idea to draft 2 QBs at all. We need as many viable arms as possible. This is the position that MUST be figured out (and by figuring out, no I don't mean resign Alex Smith).