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Rationale for letting Goldson, Sopoaga go and not sign other FA's

Originally posted by suckafree17:
Originally posted by 9erred:
I know everyone wants to re sign Goldson, Sopoaga, Larry Grant, etc. They also want to cut Carlos Rogers and Whitner. This is the reality.

Rogers- Cannot be cut, becaue he has guaranteed money that would count as dead money, so cap saving is not there.
Whitner- See Rogers above, cannot be cut, cap savings not there

Now if Goldson and Sopoaga walk in free agency, and the niners get their replacements via the draft, Baalke et al will get compensatory selections in 2014.

The highest compensatory for Goldson (assuming he starts and plays all season for someone). 3rd rounder
Sopoaga- 7th rounder
RJF- 7th rounder

Just a little reality, niners will build through the draft.


Have never heard it better!!!!

According to overthecap.com whitner would save us 4.1 on the cap and have a 833k hit so it's doable but unlikely. The rest I agree with. I'd hate to lose Goldson but if we got a 3rd it would help ease the sting a bit. It's a good way to run a team though. Build through the draft, sign your best FA's (within a reasonable price), collect comp picks, trade down and work the draft.. acquire extra picks.
Originally posted by Garcia:
we have 15 draft picks and can find someone better/cheaper/younger

we obviously ability to draft a player who is cheaper and younger...but better?
  • dmax
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getting a pass rush and wr should be our main focus
Cut/trade savings. Potential high-priced vets who under-performed. So for 2013:

Thanks Gore_21 for the reference: http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=49ers&Year=2013

Name Base Salary Prorated Bonus Roster Bonus Workout Bonus Cap Number Dead Money Cap Savings
Alex - $7,500,000 $0 $1,000,000 $0 $8,500,000 $1,000,000 $7,500,000
Rogers - $5,500,000 $1,494,531 $250,000 $100,000 $7,344,531 $6,233,594 $1,110,937
Goodwin - $3,700,000 $666,668 $0 $0 $5,016,668 $666,668 $4,350,000
Whitner - $3,850,000 $833,334 $0$250,000 $4,933,334 $833,334 $4,100,000
Manningham - $3,600,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $100,000 $4,950,000 $1,000,000 $3,950,000
Haralson - $2,570,000 $0 $0 $100,000 $2,670,000 $0 $2,670,000
Akers - $566,668 (dead money)

AB or someone, can you explain how Rogers contract works and how these categories work?

For instance, if we release Rogers, we'd only save $1,110,937 in cap savings for 2013 but would have $6,233,594 in dead money. Why is that? The $5,500,000 base salary is guaranteed plus prorated bonuses? Are the Prorated Bonus, Roster Bonus and Workout Bonus's all guaranteed? If cut, would they still be given all of this money (although only the base salary counts towards the cap)? On the flip side, Goodwin, Whitner, Manningham and Haralson's contracts are just the opposite - we save MORE cap savings by cutting them...more than their base salary demonstrates.

That said, it looks like we're stuck with Rogers. The others are all viable cuts to say the least (and b/c we have young guys behind them who have trained for at least a year and may have more upside). If Goldson does not resign, we may stick with Whitner...and his most TD's given up in the NFL, again. But with his salary, we may be able to replace that $4,100,000 cap savings with a better FA SS (e.g Dewan Landry - 5M range).
[ Edited by NCommand on Mar 8, 2013 at 8:24 AM ]
We should retain Goldson But if we cannot, then its not the end of the World but it will hurt our run defense. Golson is not that elite in coverage but he's not that bad either. Soapaga is not that good at all if you ask me he's very replaceable.
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by dyNASTYmode:
we obviously ability to draft a player who is cheaper and younger...but better?

which is why you go out on day two of free agency and sign a more than respectable safety. they are there, we have found diamonds in the rough before and I sure as hell will not lose sleep over losing goldson and will not miss his dumb ass penalties. breaking the bank for one player, renting a player for one year is not in the DNA of the coach or this front office. If you have not figured that out after two years, well i just do not know
  • cciowa
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i should have said, renting a player for one year at a very very high price is not in the dna of the coach and front office
  • Garcia
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$
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by Garcia:
$

and i want some money in the bank to deal with some of our offensive stars down the road
Originally posted by NCommand:
Not totally true. There are lots of options for cap management starting with some of the higher paid players who clearly didn't play up to their expensive contracts and who have viable options waiting in the wings (some with players behind them training for a full year or two):

Playing GM, here are some POTENTIAL moves (see some of the bigger moves the Falcons and other teams have made to date):

Lost @ (2013 Salary Cap Amount) - Plan of Action:
Alex (- $9,750,000) - gone; replaced by rookie
Rogers (- $7,344,531) (+ $9,000,000) - gone; replaced by top FA CB/high draft pick
Goodwin (- $5,016,668) - gone; replaced by Looney/Kilgore
Whitner (- $4,933,333) - gone; replaced by Goldson
Manningham (- $4,950,000) - gone; injury settlement; replaced by AJ/Williams
Akers (- $3,616,668) - gone; replaced by draft pick
Haralson (- $2,870,000) - gone; replaced by draft pick and Johnson/Fleming
Sopoaga - gone; replaced by high draft pick
RJF - gone; replaced by Ian Williams
Moss - gone; replaced by Lockette and high draft pick

Could retain @:
Walker (+ $4,000,000) - signed to 2 year deal; 2 years @ 8 million.
Goldson (+ $7,250,000) - signed to 4 year 30 million deal and moved to SS; FS position filled with Spillman/Robinson/Culliver or high draft pick

Per AB (aka Capologist):
Cuts/Trades:
Alex - $9.75m saved
Goodwin - $4.35m saved
Mario - $2.35m saved
Akers - $4.05m saved
Haralson - $2.87m saved

Total cap room now $22.713M

Signings:
Walker and Goldson equals $11.25M
Current cap room- $11.463M left

Nice job! Dig it!
Originally posted by NCommand:
Cut/trade savings. Potential high-priced vets who under-performed. So for 2013:

Thanks Gore_21 for the reference: http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=49ers&Year=2013

Name Base Salary Prorated Bonus Roster Bonus Workout Bonus Cap Number Dead Money Cap Savings
Alex - $7,500,000 $0 $1,000,000 $0 $8,500,000 $1,000,000 $7,500,000
Rogers - $5,500,000 $1,494,531 $250,000 $100,000 $7,344,531 $6,233,594 $1,110,937
Goodwin - $3,700,000 $666,668 $0 $0 $5,016,668 $666,668 $4,350,000
Whitner - $3,850,000 $833,334 $0$250,000 $4,933,334 $833,334 $4,100,000
Manningham - $3,600,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $100,000 $4,950,000 $1,000,000 $3,950,000
Haralson - $2,570,000 $0 $0 $100,000 $2,670,000 $0 $2,670,000
Akers - $566,668 (dead money)

AB or someone, can you explain how Rogers contract works and how these categories work?

For instance, if we release Rogers, we'd only save $1,110,937 in cap savings for 2013 but would have $6,233,594 in dead money. Why is that? The $5,500,000 base salary is guaranteed plus prorated bonuses? Are the Prorated Bonus, Roster Bonus and Workout Bonus's all guaranteed? If cut, would they still be given all of this money (although only the base salary counts towards the cap)? On the flip side, Goodwin, Whitner, Manningham and Haralson's contracts are just the opposite - we save MORE cap savings by cutting them...more than their base salary demonstrates.

That said, it looks like we're stuck with Rogers. The others are all viable cuts to say the least (and b/c we have young guys behind them who have trained for at least a year and may have more upside). If Goldson does not resign, we may stick with Whitner...and his most TD's given up in the NFL, again. But with his salary, we may be able to replace that $4,100,000 cap savings with a better FA SS (e.g Dewan Landry - 5M range).

Cap savings, great list. So it looks like Whitner and Goodwin could both be cap casualties we have and could benefit from. I'm all for cutting Whitner if that gives us enough wiggle room to resign Goldson for a reasonable contract and draft a FS early to play next to him.
Originally posted by Mann716:
Damn!!! I was really hoping we would save money by letting whitner walk.

Wouldn't that be losing money? I thought Whitner was guaranteed money with his current contract.
I get the financial side of letting them walk, by why not sign a few mid level free agents, it seems to be what we do. We draft well, and look at the second and third tier free agents.
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Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
I get the financial side of letting them walk, by why not sign a few mid level free agents, it seems to be what we do. We draft well, and look at the second and third tier free agents.
and i think that is exactly what we do again. i do not rule out a trade for percy harvin. but that is just a maybe in my opinion
Originally posted by GameOver:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Cut/trade savings. Potential high-priced vets who under-performed. So for 2013:

Thanks Gore_21 for the reference: http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=49ers&Year=2013

Name Base Salary Prorated Bonus Roster Bonus Workout Bonus Cap Number Dead Money Cap Savings
Alex - $7,500,000 $0 $1,000,000 $0 $8,500,000 $1,000,000 $7,500,000
Rogers - $5,500,000 $1,494,531 $250,000 $100,000 $7,344,531 $6,233,594 $1,110,937
Goodwin - $3,700,000 $666,668 $0 $0 $5,016,668 $666,668 $4,350,000
Whitner - $3,850,000 $833,334 $0$250,000 $4,933,334 $833,334 $4,100,000
Manningham - $3,600,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $100,000 $4,950,000 $1,000,000 $3,950,000
Haralson - $2,570,000 $0 $0 $100,000 $2,670,000 $0 $2,670,000
Akers - $566,668 (dead money)

AB or someone, can you explain how Rogers contract works and how these categories work?

For instance, if we release Rogers, we'd only save $1,110,937 in cap savings for 2013 but would have $6,233,594 in dead money. Why is that? The $5,500,000 base salary is guaranteed plus prorated bonuses? Are the Prorated Bonus, Roster Bonus and Workout Bonus's all guaranteed? If cut, would they still be given all of this money (although only the base salary counts towards the cap)? On the flip side, Goodwin, Whitner, Manningham and Haralson's contracts are just the opposite - we save MORE cap savings by cutting them...more than their base salary demonstrates.

That said, it looks like we're stuck with Rogers. The others are all viable cuts to say the least (and b/c we have young guys behind them who have trained for at least a year and may have more upside). If Goldson does not resign, we may stick with Whitner...and his most TD's given up in the NFL, again. But with his salary, we may be able to replace that $4,100,000 cap savings with a better FA SS (e.g Dewan Landry - 5M range).

Cap savings, great list. So it looks like Whitner and Goodwin could both be cap casualties we have and could benefit from. I'm all for cutting Whitner if that gives us enough wiggle room to resign Goldson for a reasonable contract and draft a FS early to play next to him.

Exactly! And these are the same tough cuts we're seeing all around the NFL right now (esp. Atlanta).

With going to the Q offense (more shot gun and more mobile QB and two RB's in to block if needed), it's safe to say Baalke, in a move to validate last year's draft, may push for Looney to push Goodwin and start.

Ppl are afraid to lose Whitner but again, you can't get any worse than him in coverage (most TD's given up in the NFL and gave up 2 in the Superbowl). Even if we do lose Goldson, I'm not as concerned as many on this board to lose both.