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Are we overrated???

Are we overrated???

Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by Hoovtrain:
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by susweel:
gotta love overreaction monday

Yup. A week ago we were self proclaimed champs.

Now we are self proclaimed chumps.

If GB loses, which is very possible, and SF wins, we will be self proclaimed champs again.


So true. I really need to remind myself to stop reading NT after a loss.

You guys are portraying a falsity. Is this place crazy after a loss? yes. But there are alot of us that have been pointing out shortcomings even after wins all season long. This team is far from perfect, and some of these decisions that have been made have amplified our shortcomings over the last half of the season.

This goes both ways. Kaep throws for 4 TD's and then all of a suden people are calling him a top 5 QB.

The truth lies somewhere in the middle, and the blame mostly falls on the coaching staff.

Well put! Many of us questioning how the 9'ers were rated have been saying these things for some time now. It's not like we went into panic mode after this one loss. And by the way, being realistic and viewing your team without the rose-colored glasses is preferable to denial!
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
I think the biggest issue is the lack of sustained drives. Then possibly a larger issue, is the lack of the coaching staff in realising what kind of Offense is most effective to run with this team, and the type of defense we run. A high octane, heavy hitting defense that relys heavily on LB's and Safetys to headhunt needs an offense that can sustain drives other wise they gas, and get injured due to too much time on the field.

everyone fell in love with Kaeps ability to make big plays, but failed to realise that the Offense with AS at the helm was much more suited to our defense due to long clock eating, drives..

A big play is fine and dandy, but sustained drives are more important when you have an elite defense to rely on.

Another thing is AS was much more efficient running th offence. We should not be dumbing down an offense at this point in the season.

Another thing that worries me, especially after this game, was Kaep was staring down his receivers really badly. That as something alot of people criticised smith for, and smith IMO was never near as bad at that as Kaep as in this game. He is also clearly starting to question his decision making. That hesitation on the manningham pass where he got injured was as bad as i have seen.

I still think Kaep will probably be OK in the long run, but it has become clear that coach made a horrible decision benching AS, and it has probally cost us our super bowl run. Harbaugh has done neither Kaep, nor this team any favors by benching AS. For all the praise he rightfully earned last season, he has been almost the exact opposite this season. He deserves alot if not most of the blame for the shortcomings of this team.

Game plan was aweful this week. Frank Gore made a name for himself against Seattle and we come out gunslinging? Still cant fix the play clock issues? f**king made me sick quite frankly.

I tend to agree with a lot of this. I think Kaep has a huge upside. But he's not ready this year. The little things like all the timeouts we use because we can't read th defense fast enough for audibles, can't get the center exchange clean, delay of game penalties, interceptions into double coverage. I like Kaep long term. But he's not ready this year.

In hindsight it may have been a mistake to switch QB's. Alex would give us a chance. Going into the playoffs with this and we are toast.

Dnt get me wrong. I am a Kaep fan. I am also a harbaugh fan(roman not so much) I just think Harbaugh really screwed the team by prematurely benching AS, and it certainly hasnt helped Kaep any. His stubborness has also been disapointing. Changes like this should happen in the offseason when they have a chance to tailor an offense to the QB, and progress that offense throughout the season. When everything is working well, you simply dont make the decision to change, simply for the sake of change. Its pretty clear at this point that it as the wrong decision.

Just about agree with all of this! Still, we know it won't change anything and it'll be Kaep to take us into the playoffs, and hopefully, beyond to the "Dance". The thing that bothers me is that a rookie plays so much better and smarter than our 2 year guy. Gotta admit, Wilson is a special player.

The way i look at it is this.This team has always had some shortcomings on Offense, But Alex, who was called a Game Manager, But was really more like a game General, did alot to comerup for those shortcomings through realtime adjustments at the LOS. That, and he beleived in spreading the football around, and riding Gore as the bell Cow. This was the way the offense was tailored to fit his mentality and strengths as a QB.

The Media latched on to AS as the weak link to the offense, for lack of a better term he was the scapegoat. Always has been since he was drafted.With AS getting the media attention, all harbaugh had to do was defend his QB. That is much easier to do than to defend ones own shortcomings as a coach.

Now that AS is no longer the scapegoat, the media is begining to see that this is not the dreamteam it was last season. They are begining to question why? A few of harbaughs questionable decisions this season are coming front and center, and harbaugh has yet to own those decisions.

My biggest problem with harbaugh right now is the fact that he is stubborn, and hasnt taken responsibility for the mistakes he has made. I still think he is a quality coach, but i am begining to seriously question his integrity when it comes to taking responsibility for the problems he and his staff has caused with this team.

I do not blame Kaep. Never have. He is a young QB with alot of talent who is obviously trying his best. It just wasnt the right time for this to happen. Russell Wilson's situation is differant in that, yes he is a rookie, but he was the starter from the getgo, his offense has had time to be tailored and molded and adjusted to best fit him over the course of an entire season, and over the last few games has hit its stride.

We attempted to change an Offense that was clearly working fine, and put Kaep out there at Midseason, with no clear vision of how that offense would look under Kaep, and no clear evidence, that even if we knew what it would look like, that it would work beter than the already strongly efficient offense we were currently running.

Good points re Wilson.
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
The way i look at it is this.This team has always had some shortcomings on Offense, But Alex, who was called a Game Manager, But was really more like a game General, did alot to comerup for those shortcomings through realtime adjustments at the LOS. That, and he beleived in spreading the football around, and riding Gore as the bell Cow. This was the way the offense was tailored to fit his mentality and strengths as a QB.

The Media latched on to AS as the weak link to the offense, for lack of a better term he was the scapegoat. Always has been since he was drafted.With AS getting the media attention, all harbaugh had to do was defend his QB. That is much easier to do than to defend ones own shortcomings as a coach.

Now that AS is no longer the scapegoat, the media is begining to see that this is not the dreamteam it was last season. They are begining to question why? A few of harbaughs questionable decisions this season are coming front and center, and harbaugh has yet to own those decisions.

My biggest problem with harbaugh right now is the fact that he is stubborn, and hasnt taken responsibility for the mistakes he has made. I still think he is a quality coach, but i am begining to seriously question his integrity when it comes to taking responsibility for the problems he and his staff has caused with this team.

I do not blame Kaep. Never have. He is a young QB with alot of talent who is obviously trying his best. It just wasnt the right time for this to happen. Russell Wilson's situation is differant in that, yes he is a rookie, but he was the starter from the getgo, his offense has had time to be tailored and molded and adjusted to best fit him over the course of an entire season, and over the last few games has hit its stride.

We attempted to change an Offense that was clearly working fine, and put Kaep out there at Midseason, with no clear vision of how that offense would look under Kaep, and no clear evidence, that even if we knew what it would look like, that it would work beter than the already strongly efficient offense we were currently running.

Another thing about Wilson is that Flynn wasn't much more experienced than Wilson before the season: he had only started two games.

McCloughan just got another notch under his belt. The guy is good.
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Originally posted by 49erLegacy:
Originally posted by NinerTeam:
Originally posted by 5280High:
The sky is not falling...

New England and Seattle is a murderers row of road games in December... The two hardest places to play in the league.

We went 1-1 and beat NE... the first time in a decade that has happened in December at their place. That game was exhausting and it showed against Seattle. This team will be fine, they will take care of AZ and win the division. Seattle will come to SF and that will have a very different outcome than last nights game.

We need more posts like this.

You are right and I agree, but you just can't disregard the effect of injuries on the team.

I've never felt this way about another team before but guys have we already passed the NFC West torch to the Seahawks???? Their defense is better than ours, their QB is better than ours, their running game is better than ours. Their special teams is better than ours. We may have a slight edge in the passing game.

Maybe if someone can figure out how to stop Russell Wilson from scrambling in the backfield they'll come down to earth.


There's a lot of truth in what you are saying. Could be a big swing in process. They have drafted even better than we have and have been playing at a consistently improving level. They've had a tough defense for a few years, but now their offense is almost as good. Russell Wilson is the real deal, better than Kaep at this time. I'm not sure he is going to last vis a vis Michael Vick. If teams figure out how to keep him in the pocket it could look real different. There defense is younger and as good or better than ours. Same may be true for their offense. With the Rams coming on this division is going to be tough to win for years to come. Positive side is we're going to see some really good, competitive football games and who wins the division is gonna have great SB hopes. We're gonna find out how good Harbalke really are...I'm still very optimistic that they can do it. Kaep has a much higher ceiling and we haven't even begun to see what's possible. We have plenty of picks next year and we are still a young team.
Can think of any team that would've gone 2-0 vs NE and Seattle at their houses, in December? Can you think of any team that would've at least won one of the two games?
Seahawks fan here. Not trying to rub anything in, but for those using the NE game as a reason for the defense coming out flat, the Seahawks played the Patriots on Sunday, then the 49ers on Thursday. Very little rest, and the Patriots ran 80 plays and had 34 minutes in ToP. Our defense wasn't flat playing @ San Francisco. I don't think starting a game with a flat defense is excused by a prior game, no matter how many snaps there were.

I think as some others have mentioned here, that your coaches need to work on swapping out players, particularly on the D-line and LBers that rush the passer. That seemed to me to be the biggest reason for your defensive performance. (Besides obviously, the offense not staying on the field.)

Again, not trying to troll, or anything. Good luck this week, and sorry that Manningham is out. I honestly think Hill was just tackling low because defensive players are getting scared to hit high, or even in the middle, more with each passing week thanks to Goodell and his crap.

One last thought - I can't believe how elite Justin Smith is. I knew he was elite, but I didn't realize he was all-world. Your defense is an entirely different unit without him. It surprises me how much Aldon Smith's production has fallen off w/o J. Smith. Hopefully he's back for you guys this week.
[ Edited by RolandDeschain on Dec 25, 2012 at 3:36 PM ]
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
The way i look at it is this.This team has always had some shortcomings on Offense, But Alex, who was called a Game Manager, But was really more like a game General, did alot to comerup for those shortcomings through realtime adjustments at the LOS. That, and he beleived in spreading the football around, and riding Gore as the bell Cow. This was the way the offense was tailored to fit his mentality and strengths as a QB.

The Media latched on to AS as the weak link to the offense, for lack of a better term he was the scapegoat. Always has been since he was drafted.With AS getting the media attention, all harbaugh had to do was defend his QB. That is much easier to do than to defend ones own shortcomings as a coach.

Now that AS is no longer the scapegoat, the media is begining to see that this is not the dreamteam it was last season. They are begining to question why? A few of harbaughs questionable decisions this season are coming front and center, and harbaugh has yet to own those decisions.

My biggest problem with harbaugh right now is the fact that he is stubborn, and hasnt taken responsibility for the mistakes he has made. I still think he is a quality coach, but i am begining to seriously question his integrity when it comes to taking responsibility for the problems he and his staff has caused with this team.

I do not blame Kaep. Never have. He is a young QB with alot of talent who is obviously trying his best. It just wasnt the right time for this to happen. Russell Wilson's situation is differant in that, yes he is a rookie, but he was the starter from the getgo, his offense has had time to be tailored and molded and adjusted to best fit him over the course of an entire season, and over the last few games has hit its stride.

We attempted to change an Offense that was clearly working fine, and put Kaep out there at Midseason, with no clear vision of how that offense would look under Kaep, and no clear evidence, that even if we knew what it would look like, that it would work beter than the already strongly efficient offense we were currently running.

Great post. I agree Harbaugh is a fine coach but he has his flaws, and some of them are showing up now at the worst possible time. (I stated my case in the ego thread and don't feel like copying it here.) Biggest mistake has been failure to develop depth at DL and WR. Also switching QBs and scheme in the middle of the season is a problem. We don't have receivers to challenge defenses on those deep routes, although Jenkins was supposed to be the guy, which just exposes his first failure.

49ers aren't over-rated with a healthy Justin Smith and Mario Manningham. However, as the 73 points in the last 6 quarters have shown, without Smith this defense is just average. I rate the 49ers about 7 or 8 right now.
Originally posted by RolandDeschain:
Seahawks fan here. Not trying to rub anything in, but for those using the NE game as a reason for the defense coming out flat, the Seahawks played the Patriots on Sunday, then the 49ers on Thursday. Very little rest, and the Patriots ran 80 plays and had 34 minutes in ToP. Our defense wasn't flat playing @ San Francisco. I don't think starting a game with a flat defense is excused by a prior game, no matter how many snaps there were.

I think as some others have mentioned here, that your coaches need to work on swapping out players, particularly on the D-line and LBers that rush the passer. That seemed to me to be the biggest reason for your defensive performance. (Besides obviously, the offense not staying on the field.)

Again, not trying to troll, or anything. Good luck this week, and sorry that Manningham is out. I honestly think Hill was just tackling low because defensive players are getting scared to hit high, or even in the middle, more with each passing week thanks to Goodell and his crap.

One last thought - I can't believe how elite Justin Smith is. I knew he was elite, but I didn't realize he was all-world. Your defense is an entirely different unit without him. It surprises me how much Aldon Smith's production has fallen off w/o J. Smith. Hopefully he's back for you guys this week.


Difference being, of course, that you guys played NE at HOME and then traveled a short distance south to San Fran. We went TO NE, then flew to SEA for back to back road games at pretty good home team venues. I think there was a lot more to it than fatigue, but lets not ignore that travel and an emotional win at Foxboro did have something to do with our intensity (or lack thereof).
Hudson, believe me, I know the travel aspect. I hate seeing those 10am east coast road games on our schedule, that we get several of EVERY YEAR. :( We played @ Miami @ 10am, then @ Bears @ 10am this year. Back to back. It sucks that the NFL only cares about the east coast larger population centers. I was shocked our NE game was @ our house when I saw our schedule for the first time before the season started, to be honest. What about Tom Brady's rest and convenience on such a long flight?....
Originally posted by RolandDeschain:
Hudson, believe me, I know the travel aspect. I hate seeing those 10am east coast road games on our schedule, that we get several of EVERY YEAR. :( We played @ Miami @ 10am, then @ Bears @ 10am this year. Back to back. It sucks that the NFL only cares about the east coast larger population centers. I was shocked our NE game was @ our house when I saw our schedule for the first time before the season started, to be honest. What about Tom Brady's rest and convenience on such a long flight?....


No excuses. I really do think that Seattle was the better team this past Sunday. Even if the Niners had traveled from SF the previous week, Im sure Seattle would have beat us up pretty bad. It's a tough venue to play at, no doubt. I just feel that the situation is compounded by the fact that we had to travel from NE to SEA in a tough back to back road schedule. Regardless, we got beat by a hungrier team playing with more intensity.

Regarding which is a better team as a whole, the only way to know for sure is IF both teams get to play each other in the playoffs. Remains to be seen.
Originally posted by SealTeam6:
We are poorly coached
Are you criticizing the coach's change at QB?
Originally posted by RolandDeschain:
Seahawks fan here. Not trying to rub anything in, but for those using the NE game as a reason for the defense coming out flat, the Seahawks played the Patriots on Sunday, then the 49ers on Thursday. Very little rest, and the Patriots ran 80 plays and had 34 minutes in ToP. Our defense wasn't flat playing @ San Francisco. I don't think starting a game with a flat defense is excused by a prior game, no matter how many snaps there were.

I think as some others have mentioned here, that your coaches need to work on swapping out players, particularly on the D-line and LBers that rush the passer. That seemed to me to be the biggest reason for your defensive performance. (Besides obviously, the offense not staying on the field.)

Again, not trying to troll, or anything. Good luck this week, and sorry that Manningham is out. I honestly think Hill was just tackling low because defensive players are getting scared to hit high, or even in the middle, more with each passing week thanks to Goodell and his crap.

One last thought - I can't believe how elite Justin Smith is. I knew he was elite, but I didn't realize he was all-world. Your defense is an entirely different unit without him. It surprises me how much Aldon Smith's production has fallen off w/o J. Smith. Hopefully he's back for you guys this week.

That was in like week 5 when players are fresh.

We are in week 16 and we're beat up.

No excuses though. We are just try to figure out why we looked different without giving SEA credit and your fan base doesn't like it. Thats why they are all in here trying to get some respect or something.

Its pretty amusing.
Originally posted by SealTeam6:
We are poorly coached

I hope this is sarcasm, because otherwise I just don't understand posts like this. Harbaugh is 23-7-1 in the last two seasons. The man has shattered expectations and turned us from a very average team to a team that is expected to win every week. What more do you people want?
Originally posted by Willisfn4life:
Originally posted by SealTeam6:
We are poorly coached

I hope this is sarcasm, because otherwise I just don't understand posts like this. Harbaugh is 23-7-1 in the last two seasons. The man has shattered expectations and turned us from a very average team to a team that is expected to win every week. What more do you people want?

To win every week?
Originally posted by RedWaltz24:
Originally posted by Willisfn4life:
Originally posted by SealTeam6:
We are poorly coached

I hope this is sarcasm, because otherwise I just don't understand posts like this. Harbaugh is 23-7-1 in the last two seasons. The man has shattered expectations and turned us from a very average team to a team that is expected to win every week. What more do you people want?

To win every week?

If only the NFL were that simple.