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Myth of the "300 yd passer" ...to be a "great" QB

Originally posted by Grinner:
Originally posted by zillabeast:
If you want a one and done ring like '85 Bears, '00 Ravens, or '02 Bucs, then sure, have your game manager.

This is San Francisco though, where dynasties happen. That 'fading right back into the oblivion you came from' s**t does not fly around here. No thank you.


Dynasty or nothing ? Wow !

In a time when dynasties don't exist anymore. The only team that resembles a dynasty now is NE and they benefit from a weak conference.
Even a dynasty has to have a starting point. The Harbaugh era has started.
  • obx49
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Originally posted by kingairta:
Originally posted by Grinner:
Originally posted by zillabeast:
If you want a one and done ring like '85 Bears, '00 Ravens, or '02 Bucs, then sure, have your game manager.

This is San Francisco though, where dynasties happen. That 'fading right back into the oblivion you came from' s**t does not fly around here. No thank you.


Dynasty or nothing ? Wow !

In a time when dynasties don't exist anymore. The only team that resembles a dynasty now is NE and they benefit from a weak conference.

Dynasties are a thing off the past. NFL franchises didn't have to account for the cap so this allowed big market teams to load up on talent. In today's game however, the league is full of talented players much more than the past as a whole and there is a cap that teams have to account for. This, of course, is very beneficial for the league because there is more parity and more competitive games. That being said, I believe the Pats and the Giants are the closest thing to a dynasty that you can have in this day and age.
Originally posted by tjd808185:
This is a game Alex easily could have put 300 yards but the situation didn't warrant it. I don't think anyone is going to fault Alex for going 18-19 233 yards and 3 TDs. If he did that thru out his career nobody would be bashing him.

Obviously no one is going to go 18-19 every week but the point is if he consistently moves the chains thru the air very few will complain that he's not a fantasy God. The problem is you're delusional if you think Alex has been that thru out his career. Statisically he's not been an efficient qb over the course of his career. He's just now developing into this.


Bottom line is that Jim Harbaugh is showing signs of being a super elite coach..Why? He is incredibly football smart and has no inhibitions to doing what is necessary to do the only thing important win games. I think he means what he says. Stats don't matter to him. He demands his coaches and players put their ego's aside and totally support what ever it takes for the team to win. He and his staff concentrate on winning each game in any way they can and the players are behind it even if it means sacrificing stats. He demands the players put their personal egos aside and fully buy into team first. He's found a formula that works for the talent he has on this team. He knows what he has and is brilliant at optimizing the potential of each player and synergistically as a team. He is laser focused all the time, has a brilliant mind and a skin as thick as a rhino. All of us sitting around and second guessing him and what they need to do is fun, but so far he's proven he's far beyond anything anyone here can conjure up in terms of a better way to win games.
Good post, Barry, and if you look at how many guys ran the ball, (some games 6 or 7 guys have run plays), how many guys get passes( one game I think it was 10), but frequently is 7 or 8....you get the idea that Coach H is either trying to have everybody have a bit of skin in the game, or he just wants 8, 9 or 10 guys catching passes every game. I know occasionally, somebody, eg Celek, gets a pass, and the D doesn't even cover him because they were unaware of who he was. Whatever, with spreading the ball around so much, it makes it hard for a guy to routinely get 8-10 passes/game, tho #15 came close once. If alex doesn't have one or two guys to practice timing routes with, then that is a downside to so many guys getting a chance to catch the ball. Welker gets 15-20 chances/game....or close to it. Same for Fitz, Wallace, et al. I don't really know if this affects alex's timing patterns or not, but i would think so when so many guys are getting a chance to catch a pass. Upside is all WRs , RBs, TEs, always have to be paying attn, because their number may be called next. It would seem to make it harder on alex to hit timing passes with so many guys catching passes. Anyone else have any thots on that?
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?
Since 300yd QB's only win about 50% of the time and I was bored watching the Cincy, Denver game I kept these 1st half stats.
Manning
First series, 4 passes less than 5 yds in the air from LOS. 1-10yd and 1 underthrown into the dirt 4 yds short of rec.
2nd series
4yd, 6yd, 1yd dump off but PI called.
15yd on 3rd and 15-dropped when rec. hit.
Field goal
3rd series
3yd, 2yd, 25yd, 1yd at this point 10/13 108yards , 2yd(10yac TD)
4th series
9yd+ 9yac=18
15yd but pass defensed incomplete.
0yd dump off no gain
(I missed one less than 10yd)
0yd +1yac
2min warning
18yd defensed and dropped. Denver leading 10-3 1 20+ yarder thrown
2nd half- more of the same
3 passes traveled 20 yds beyond the LOS, 1PI, 1Int, 1 catch
27/35 291 yards 2/3 and 11 point lead
Andy Dalton 299yds and 1int and loses
[ Edited by Born49R on Nov 4, 2012 at 1:24 PM ]
Originally posted by SashRoxx-1:
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?


There's a very small list of teams that have multiple Super Bowl wins. Even tougher now with all of the parody in this league. You want to go over all of the great defenses in the league and tell me how many Super Bowls they have?

Baltimore. Ray Lewis has 1.
Tampa Bay 1.

By your logic I guess great defenses aren't that important either because they can't rack up multiple Super Bowl wins.
well, we will eventually find out with our team.

Alex Smith as QB + our top defense

we will see how many super bowls we win in the next year or two with Alex as our QB.

Time will answer this question.

Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SashRoxx-1:
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?


There's a very small list of teams that have multiple Super Bowl wins. Even tougher now with all of the parody in this league. You want to go over all of the great defenses in the league and tell me how many Super Bowls they have?

Baltimore. Ray Lewis has 1.
Tampa Bay 1.

By your logic I guess great defenses aren't that important either because they can't rack up multiple Super Bowl wins.

He just debunked the Myth....

Look at the list of top 300+ passers. They are filled with super bowl champs and multiple super bowl apperences


Top 10 QBs with the most 300 yard games:

1. P. Manning - 1 Super Bowl victory. 1 Super bowl defeat.
2. D. MArino - 1 super bowl appearence
3. Brett Favre - 1 super bowl victory. 1 super bowl defet.
4. Drew Brees - 1 super bowl win
5. Kurt WArner - 1 super bowl win 2 super bowl apperences
6. Dan Foutes - Never made it
7. Tom Brady - 3 super bowl wins 2 appearences
8. Warren Moon - never made it
9. Joe Montana - 4 super bowl wins
10. Drew Bledsoe - 1 super bowl apprearence.

Alex Smith has 3. Aaron Rogers has 26. Recent super bowl champs like Eli and Big Ben have 20+.

So we have 11 super bowl champs and 19 super bowl appearances out of the top ten 300 yard passers.

Sometimes you need a guy to huck the ball down the field.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_career_300-yard_passing_games_in_the_NFL
[ Edited by Young2Rice on Nov 4, 2012 at 6:03 PM ]
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SashRoxx-1:
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?


There's a very small list of teams that have multiple Super Bowl wins. Even tougher now with all of the parody in this league. You want to go over all of the great defenses in the league and tell me how many Super Bowls they have?

Baltimore. Ray Lewis has 1.
Tampa Bay 1.

By your logic I guess great defenses aren't that important either because they can't rack up multiple Super Bowl wins.

Tampa Bay won 1 with Brad Johnson, who has 15, 300+ yard games in his career
Baltimore won it with Trent Dilfer, who has only 5

I'm not loosing hope though. I think Alex is on par with Trent Dilfer. Not sure if he's better than Dilfer but I would say on par.
Not sure about Brad Johnson, haven't really watched Brad Johnson play. But I remember Brad was pretty good when he was with the Vikings.
[ Edited by ginseng1000 on Nov 4, 2012 at 6:24 PM ]
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SashRoxx-1:
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?


There's a very small list of teams that have multiple Super Bowl wins. Even tougher now with all of the parody in this league. You want to go over all of the great defenses in the league and tell me how many Super Bowls they have?

Baltimore. Ray Lewis has 1.
Tampa Bay 1.

By your logic I guess great defenses aren't that important either because they can't rack up multiple Super Bowl wins.

He just debunked the Myth....

Look at the list of top 300+ passers. They are filled with super bowl champs and multiple super bowl apperences


Top 10 QBs with the most 300 yard games:

1. P. Manning - 1 Super Bowl victory. 1 Super bowl defeat.
2. D. MArino - 1 super bowl appearence
3. Brett Favre - 1 super bowl victory. 1 super bowl defet.
4. Drew Brees - 1 super bowl win
5. Kurt WArner - 1 super bowl win 2 super bowl apperences
6. Dan Foutes - Never made it
7. Tom Brady - 3 super bowl wins 2 appearences
8. Warren Moon - never made it
9. Joe Montana - 4 super bowl wins
10. Drew Bledsoe - 1 super bowl apprearence.

Alex Smith has 3. Aaron Rogers has 26. Recent super bowl champs like Eli and Big Ben have 20+.

So we have 11 super bowl champs and 19 super bowl appearances out of the top ten 300 yard passers.

Sometimes you need a guy to huck the ball down the field.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_career_300-yard_passing_games_in_the_NFL

How many of the 300 yard games came in superbowl winning seasons? How many of the non 300 yard game QBs had excellent rushing attacks? How many had excellent defenses?

I will bet ANYONE on this board that defense wins Superbowls as much or MORE than offense does.
Originally posted by mkmasn:
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SashRoxx-1:
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?


There's a very small list of teams that have multiple Super Bowl wins. Even tougher now with all of the parody in this league. You want to go over all of the great defenses in the league and tell me how many Super Bowls they have?

Baltimore. Ray Lewis has 1.
Tampa Bay 1.

By your logic I guess great defenses aren't that important either because they can't rack up multiple Super Bowl wins.

He just debunked the Myth....

Look at the list of top 300+ passers. They are filled with super bowl champs and multiple super bowl apperences


Top 10 QBs with the most 300 yard games:

1. P. Manning - 1 Super Bowl victory. 1 Super bowl defeat.
2. D. MArino - 1 super bowl appearence
3. Brett Favre - 1 super bowl victory. 1 super bowl defet.
4. Drew Brees - 1 super bowl win
5. Kurt WArner - 1 super bowl win 2 super bowl apperences
6. Dan Foutes - Never made it
7. Tom Brady - 3 super bowl wins 2 appearences
8. Warren Moon - never made it
9. Joe Montana - 4 super bowl wins
10. Drew Bledsoe - 1 super bowl apprearence.

Alex Smith has 3. Aaron Rogers has 26. Recent super bowl champs like Eli and Big Ben have 20+.

So we have 11 super bowl champs and 19 super bowl appearances out of the top ten 300 yard passers.

Sometimes you need a guy to huck the ball down the field.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_career_300-yard_passing_games_in_the_NFL

How many of the 300 yard games came in superbowl winning seasons? How many of the non 300 yard game QBs had excellent rushing attacks? How many had excellent defenses?

I will bet ANYONE on this board that defense wins Superbowls as much or MORE than offense does.

well, you need to list the number of superbowl wins with high ranked defensed and mediocre offense

versus

the number of superbowl wins with high ranked offense and and mediocre defense.

The only superbowl wins I can think of with a top defense and mediocre offense are: tampa bay and Baltimore, and Bears superbowl XX
Originally posted by ginseng1000:
Originally posted by mkmasn:
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SashRoxx-1:
OK Heres a stat for those that think 300 yd games are SO Important.
J Montana had 39 games of 300+ yd passing in 192 games roughly 1 game in 5...S Young had 27 games passing 300+ yds sorry dont have a stat on how many total games Steve played in.

Now lets look at this stat...
P Manning has 68 games of 300 yd passing games
D Marino has 63 games of 300 yd passing games
B Favre has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
D Brees has 62 games of 300 yd passing games
K Warner has 52 games of 300 yd passing games
D Fouts has 51 games of 300 yd passing games
and with all those above named QBs they have a total of what 4 SB wins? Marino for all his passing records never even won a SB So what did all his 300 yd games get him? 1 trip to the SB his rookie season and he gets BLOWN out. If you want to see a 300yd passing QB go watch Manning or C Newton who cant even smell a SB. P Manning, D Brees won just 1 SB and I dont remember if Favre won 1 or 2...actually I think he only won 1. K Warner went to 2 SBs won 1 lost 1... D Fouts ever even made it that far.

So Whats the Big deal with a QB throwing for 300 yds? Wheres the proof that throwing for 300 yds makes you into a winner?


There's a very small list of teams that have multiple Super Bowl wins. Even tougher now with all of the parody in this league. You want to go over all of the great defenses in the league and tell me how many Super Bowls they have?

Baltimore. Ray Lewis has 1.
Tampa Bay 1.

By your logic I guess great defenses aren't that important either because they can't rack up multiple Super Bowl wins.

He just debunked the Myth....

Look at the list of top 300+ passers. They are filled with super bowl champs and multiple super bowl apperences


Top 10 QBs with the most 300 yard games:

1. P. Manning - 1 Super Bowl victory. 1 Super bowl defeat.
2. D. MArino - 1 super bowl appearence
3. Brett Favre - 1 super bowl victory. 1 super bowl defet.
4. Drew Brees - 1 super bowl win
5. Kurt WArner - 1 super bowl win 2 super bowl apperences
6. Dan Foutes - Never made it
7. Tom Brady - 3 super bowl wins 2 appearences
8. Warren Moon - never made it
9. Joe Montana - 4 super bowl wins
10. Drew Bledsoe - 1 super bowl apprearence.

Alex Smith has 3. Aaron Rogers has 26. Recent super bowl champs like Eli and Big Ben have 20+.

So we have 11 super bowl champs and 19 super bowl appearances out of the top ten 300 yard passers.

Sometimes you need a guy to huck the ball down the field.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_career_300-yard_passing_games_in_the_NFL

How many of the 300 yard games came in superbowl winning seasons? How many of the non 300 yard game QBs had excellent rushing attacks? How many had excellent defenses?

I will bet ANYONE on this board that defense wins Superbowls as much or MORE than offense does.

well, you need to list the number of superbowl wins with high ranked defensed and mediocre offense

versus

the number of superbowl wins with high ranked offense and and mediocre defense.

The only superbowl wins I can think of with a top defense and mediocre offense are: tampa bay and Baltimore, and Bears superbowl XX

Nope. The team with the better defense as opposed to the better offense in the superbowl wins just as frequently, if not more frequently.
Originally posted by mkmasn:
Nope. The team with the better defense as opposed to the better offense in the superbowl wins just as frequently, if not more frequently.

proof proof proof

I need to see some past examples.