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Myth of the "300 yd passer" ...to be a "great" QB

Originally posted by modninerfan:
Originally posted by jvangeystel:
The fact of the matter is if you insert ANY qb in this system you are going to get mid 200 range in passing yards. Our defense and running game are both elite. Meaning for the majority of games we are in complete control by the 3rd quarter and are just killing the clock. Look at our past games. Alex is near the half way marker for 300 yds at half time. Then closes the game under 300. Why, because the game is won.

Want us to keep throwing the ball? Running up the score? Padding the stats to stroke the ego of the average delusional football fan. The cliche is that winning percentage is the only stat that matters and that is true. The win is what matters and when we have games won by the half, and only have lost to a surprise Vikings team and an amazing Giants squad then what's to be upset about? Multiple blowouts in a season where the Cardinals won 4 straight to start the season.

Thank you thank you thank you...

Well said jv! Well said...
jv took the words out of my mouth. He summarized my thots to at tee.

Earlier, tjd commented that I would be delusional if I thot alex has been this way his entire career. As a matter of fact, I consistently remained neutral on alex, until or IF he got the great OL, the great HC/OC/ QB coach, which he did, but not until last yr. I have never rated alex as good or bad, just tenacious. The beating he took when noln and BM were here was unmerciful, and i stated many times, "How could anyone rate the kid when he had no stability at coaching and no OL?" I had not made an opinion on alex until the first time last yr after he had had one season with Coach Harbaugh, COY. Now I rate alex, and have him as one of the top worker bee QBs, among the league's elite top 5 or 6. As for him throwing 300 yrd games every week, it just isn't going to happen. If it does, it means both Frank and Hunter are out for the yr. Alex's yd production is going to be usually between 230 and 260. That is what you throw when you have one of the best rushing attacks, if not the best , in the league.

Come playoff time, running game is the key. Your QB can't be a stiff, but has to be in the top rated qB group, so that the run can be mixed with the pass, and that is exactly the way Coach H plays and games.
[ Edited by pasodoc9er on Oct 31, 2012 at 9:51 AM ]
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
jv took the words out of my mouth. He summarized my thots to at tee.

Earlier, tjd commented that I would be delusional if I thot alex has been this way his entire career. As a matter of fact, I consistently remained neutral on alex, until or IF he got the great OL, the great HC/OC/ QB coach, which he did, but not until last yr. I have never rated alex as good or bad, just tenacious. The beating he took when noln and BM were here was unmerciful, and i stated many times, "How could anyone rate the kid when he had no stability at coaching and no OL?" I had not made an opinion on alex until the first time last yr after he had had one season with Coach Harbaugh, COY. Now I rate alex, and have him as one of the top worker bee QBs, among the league's elite top 5 or 6. As for him throwing 300 yrd games every week, it just isn't going to happen. If it does, it means both Frank and Hunter are out for the yr. Alex's yd production is going to be usually between 230 and 260. That is what you throw when you have one of the best rushing attacks, if not the best , in the league.

Come playoff time, running game is the key. Your QB can't be a stiff, but has to be in the top rated qB group, so that the run can be mixed with the pass, and that is exactly the way Coach H plays and games.

I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.
[ Edited by D_Niner on Oct 31, 2012 at 1:20 PM ]
Originally posted by D_Niner:
I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.

I fail to see how yards matter. YPA and TDs to INT ratios is where it is at.
[ Edited by Jakemall on Oct 31, 2012 at 2:36 PM ]
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.

I fail to see how yards matter. YPA and TDs to INT ratios is where it is at.

Yards equate to moving the ball. Moving the ball is necessary to score points. Points are how we determine who won and who lost; therefore, yards matter.


Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.

I fail to see how yards matter. YPA and TDs to INT ratios is where it is at.

Yards equate to moving the ball. Moving the ball is necessary to score points. Points are how we determine who won and who lost; therefore, yards matter.



yes but we move the ball also by running
Originally posted by WookieOftheYear:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.

I fail to see how yards matter. YPA and TDs to INT ratios is where it is at.

Yards equate to moving the ball. Moving the ball is necessary to score points. Points are how we determine who won and who lost; therefore, yards matter.



yes but we move the ball also by running

And that would also add to the teams total Yards; therefore, yards still matter.
Originally posted by D_Niner:
I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.

Who cares? The rest of the team is very good, and he is following our great coaching staffs' orders.

It's been said a million times before but it's so true - a lot of people in the zone seem to value putting up stats over winning, or at least are not satisfied with winning unless it is done in a way that you deem dominating, or on par with how some of the more glamorous teams in the league have done it. We are unique in our old school approach, and maybe people just don't trust that. We are so good overall as a team, passing more often or stretching the field more would increase the risk of turnovers and the chance that we will give our opponents easy points. The approach we have is intelligently designed around our talent, and our coaches and players are good enough that we can buck the trends and win it all with our brand of ball. Alex does what he is asked to do better than most QB's in the league, and his selflessness and lack of ego are good for our specific team.

Here is a good way to look at it. Alex, at least for our team is that girl who is an 7 looks wise on the average dude's rating scale, and she is your girlfriend. She's hotter than that to you b/c you have a weakness for girls that have a big *ss like she has. Your buddies are thinking "she's really cool but he could get hotter". What the outside world doesn't know is that your GF is dynamite in bed, has a great personality, sense of humor, is super intelligent. Basically she's close to perfect for you, but maybe not to someone who is just looking for arm candy. Some of you guys want to dump or at least constantly talk sh*t about this chick that has almost everything you want (she could be a 10 looks wise but she's only an 8.5 even to you). Just because somewhere there is a Minka Kelly (or whoever floats your boat) somewhere out there. But Minka is not available to you anyway (much like Manning or Rodgers). So you sit around pining for what could be with this super hot woman that you don't even know and just belittle everything that your super cool and pretty hot girl does for you. Maybe Minka would be a b*tch to you or is a dead fish in bed or whatever, you don't know because you don't have a relationship with her. But you act like everything would be better for sure because everyone else thinks she's hotter. Even though what you have now is working very well for you.

Alex does just about everything this team asks him to with great regularity. He's not perfect, but he's much better than what available to us and is a great extension of what the staff wants and the teams needs on the field. The issues that the media critics have with him are very well countered by the rest of the team. So I'd suggest the haters do themselves a favor and stop dreaming about greener pastures. I know this won't happen, but hey I can dream too.
Originally posted by bpg4980:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
I love the optimism; but, now back to reality. This season, Alex averages 207 yards passing per game and he typically falls somewhere between 200 to 230 yards.

Who cares? The rest of the team is very good, and he is following our great coaching staffs' orders.

It's been said a million times before but it's so true - a lot of people in the zone seem to value putting up stats over winning, or at least are not satisfied with winning unless it is done in a way that you deem dominating, or on par with how some of the more glamorous teams in the league have done it. We are unique in our old school approach, and maybe people just don't trust that. We are so good overall as a team, passing more often or stretching the field more would increase the risk of turnovers and the chance that we will give our opponents easy points. The approach we have is intelligently designed around our talent, and our coaches and players are good enough that we can buck the trends and win it all with our brand of ball. Alex does what he is asked to do better than most QB's in the league, and his selflessness and lack of ego are good for our specific team.

Here is a good way to look at it. Alex, at least for our team is that girl who is an 7 looks wise on the average dude's rating scale, and she is your girlfriend. She's hotter than that to you b/c you have a weakness for girls that have a big *ss like she has. Your buddies are thinking "she's really cool but he could get hotter". What the outside world doesn't know is that your GF is dynamite in bed, has a great personality, sense of humor, is super intelligent. Basically she's close to perfect for you, but maybe not to someone who is just looking for arm candy. Some of you guys want to dump or at least constantly talk sh*t about this chick that has almost everything you want (she could be a 10 looks wise but she's only an 8.5 even to you). Just because somewhere there is a Minka Kelly (or whoever floats your boat) somewhere out there. But Minka is not available to you anyway (much like Manning or Rodgers). So you sit around pining for what could be with this super hot woman that you don't even know and just belittle everything that your super cool and pretty hot girl does for you. Maybe Minka would be a b*tch to you or is a dead fish in bed or whatever, you don't know because you don't have a relationship with her. But you act like everything would be better for sure because everyone else thinks she's hotter. Even though what you have now is working very well for you.

Alex does just about everything this team asks him to with great regularity. He's not perfect, but he's much better than what available to us and is a great extension of what the staff wants and the teams needs on the field. The issues that the media critics have with him are very well countered by the rest of the team. So I'd suggest the haters do themselves a favor and stop dreaming about greener pastures. I know this won't happen, but hey I can dream too.

Not sure if you're aware of this; but this thread is on the myth of the 300 yard passer. Not stats over winning, or all out domination, or even on your "7" of a girlfriend.

As I've said in this thread, if you look at the performance of the top QB's in the league, they are closer to 300 yard mark than 200.

Now the quote you took out of context... The OP posted Alex is a 230 to 260 Yard QB when in fact he is a 200 to 230 (207 average) guy. If were going to talk stats, lets at least talk accuratly instead of made up wishfull figures.

BTW, just for the record, I agree with all the "team player" stuff you said about Alex.

Have a good one,

D
[ Edited by D_Niner on Oct 31, 2012 at 5:17 PM ]
Winning > Yards... /Thread.

Some of you just need something to b***h about. STFU and enjoy being 6-2.
[ Edited by Lott49ersFan on Oct 31, 2012 at 6:42 PM ]
I'm down with winning games. Smith played a great game. Bottom line. Take care of the ball. get them where you can. I think the real thing though, is when it's on the line can you take over a game?
If you want a one and done ring like '85 Bears, '00 Ravens, or '02 Bucs, then sure, have your game manager.

This is San Francisco though, where dynasties happen. That 'fading right back into the oblivion you came from' s**t does not fly around here. No thank you.
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Not sure if you're aware of this; but this thread is on the myth of the 300 yard passer. Not stats over winning, or all out domination, or even on your "7" of a girlfriend.


I am aware, but sometimes an argument can stray a little bit and still make a valid, relate-able point. I get that the original argument was that 300 yards passing is not an indicator of good QB play, I was just trying to say that if the bar was lowered to 230 yards or whatever is still not an indicator of anything to me. Just like the great passing teams are going to pass a lot, the great running teams are going to run a lot. We run the ball as much as any team in the league, and that means we can't pass for that many yards unless our average per attempt is outrageously high. So I am good with throwing for less yards than any team in the league, as long as we are pretty good at throwing it when we choose to.

The girlfriend argument was just a different way to say that our QB does everything that our coaching staff (the people who's opinion matter) wants on a consistent basis. Harbaugh and Alex could care less about the fan/media criteria for what is good play at the position is - like a person in a relationship shouldn't care about what others think about their girlfriend. As many or as few yards that it takes to win a particular game is all Harbaugh/G-Ro expect. I'm not accusing anyone specifically of thinking this way, but if anyone thinks that a good QB or team passes for a lot of yards needs to root for someone else. This team is too good at running and too strong on D to risk the turnovers that an increased passing % might bring.

Our team is unique and I like the fact that we don't do things the way other teams do. This makes us harder to prepare for and therefore harder to beat. When we win it all this year, people still won't be satisfied because the outside world might view it as a fluke. Let them keep thinking that. I just think that our fan base should appreciate what we do a little more.
[ Edited by bpg4980 on Nov 1, 2012 at 12:31 PM ]
D_Niner, thank you for the correction, in that I did NOT look up alex's yds/game, as I should have, and just guessed. If its 207, then that is what he throws on average to get us the win. Eli threw for 177 yds last weekend in the W over the Cowboys....but they were a good 177 yds...much like Alex's. I have no idea what alex would throw for in another system...and frankly, don't care. I do care about what our HC, COY in his inaugural yr, wants. And that is what alex does, and does very well.
He finally got his coach, and all we need do to see how important that is, is to look at Drew Brees without Sean Payton. Amazing how important that HC/OC/QB coach can be to a Qb and ultimately, to the team. Alex is just doing what our HC wants, and anything Coach H wants is good by me. You will note how closely Coach keeps #running plays equal to # passing plays, except near end of game when ball rarely sees any air...unless we are way behind.
Originally posted by zillabeast:
If you want a one and done ring like '85 Bears, '00 Ravens, or '02 Bucs, then sure, have your game manager.

This is San Francisco though, where dynasties happen. That 'fading right back into the oblivion you came from' s**t does not fly around here. No thank you.


Dynasty or nothing ? Wow !