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Thoughts from Idaho

Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
What happened to all that depth i was told we had?

Other than LMJ, and Celek, barely starting to contribute the last couple of games, we are not getting contribution from our draft class. This draft is seriously coming back to bite us in the ass. Hopefully it doesnt hurt us over the long term, but it is certainly hurting us this year. Like i said, good teams simply do not have drafts like this. Even the best teams in the league year in and year out cant afford it.
idaho said nothing that is not true

I dont claim to always be right. In fact im wrong more often than not probably. But this is one point where i think i was one of the first to see it, talked about it very early in the offseason/season and i was for the most part called a crazy, overreacting, hater.

I seriously beleive the draft was and has been the biggest factor that has hurt this team over the course of the season. I also beleive the premature benching of AS has hurt us as well, but the draft class hurt us long before that, and is really coming back to bite us in the ass here at the end of the season.
Idaho,

This was a genius post and I agree 100% with everything you said.

Regarding the draft class, that is most disappointing this far. One horrible draft can haunt a team for years. While HarBaalke get praise for the 2011 draft class, the 2012 is just the opposite, and turning into a disaster. Makes me very concerned for the 2013 draft.

Anyways, thanks for the great post!
Originally posted by rondoman:
Idaho,

This was a genius post and I agree 100% with everything you said.

Regarding the draft class, that is most disappointing this far. One horrible draft can haunt a team for years. While HarBaalke get praise for the 2011 draft class, the 2012 is just the opposite, and turning into a disaster. Makes me very concerned for the 2013 draft.

Anyways, thanks for the great post!

Im personally under the opinion that this draft class, Baalkie defered more to what Harbaugh and company wanted. Atleast thats the only way i can justify the fall off. I could certainly be wrong. But i just dont see how Baalkie, who has been great at his drafts, and evaluations, ends up with this last draft unless he accepted much more imput for harbaugh and Co.

This draft could certainly come back to haunt us in the future more so than it has already. I just hope with all the draft picks we have this coming year that Baalkie will get back on track. Atleast thats what i keep telling myself.
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:


Really enjoyed your post, and agreed with much of it, Idaho. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:

Really enjoyed your post, and agreed with much of it, Idaho. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Thanks for reading it. Better late than never.
[ Edited by IdahoNiner on Dec 27, 2012 at 6:37 PM ]
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:

Really enjoyed your post, and agreed with much of it, Idaho. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Thanks for reading it. Better late than never.

Yeah, haha... just realized after posting and as I read beyond your OP. Not sure how I missed it back then... but it seems to apply to today and it was very worthwhile.
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Yeah, haha... just realized after posting and as I read beyond your OP. Not sure how I missed it back then... but it seems to apply to today and it was very worthwhile.

Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
What happened to all that depth i was told we had?

Other than LMJ, and Celek, barely starting to contribute the last couple of games, we are not getting contribution from our draft class. This draft is seriously coming back to bite us in the ass. Hopefully it doesnt hurt us over the long term, but it is certainly hurting us this year. Like i said, good teams simply do not have drafts like this. Even the best teams in the league year in and year out cant afford it.

It seems like it was a questionable draft. LaMichael James might be a decent weapon long-term and even AJ Jenkins could turn out to be a useful player, but you can't really have a whole draft and not get any contribution from your draft picks for a majority of the season. The argument that this team is "too deep" is ridiculous, if Jenkins can't beat out a former 6th round pick in Williams who is decent but nothing amazing and an aging Randy Moss, maybe they really weren't that deep to begin with. Teams with arguably better receiving corps such as the Giants have found ways to get their rookies out on to the field to contribute so I don't buy that excuse at all.


Looney might end up a good prospect but he's contributed nothing, mostly due to injury which limited him early on. Beyond that, nobody knows what this team has with Fleming or Cam Johnson.


Now this year, they have figured out they need better 3-4 DE depth and this draft actually looks kind of crappy in that regards. Lots of guys with potential but with various issues and problems of their own, meanwhile last year, in lieu of Jenkins they could have snagged either Derek Wolfe or Kendall Reyes, either of which could have developed behind Justin Smith and filled in as starters quite ably.

They can't afford more drafts like this, picking guys that simply don't play, teams that are developing and losing 10 or 11 games a year can afford to do that, not someone that is primed to go deep in the playoffs, they need as many active contributors as possible.
It is an interesting point. After Baalke was annointed Executive of the Year last year, I thought about how Al Davis had dominant teams, then not so much. And AJ Smith of the Chargers had dominant teams for years, then not so much. When GMs have good teams, followed by average teams, you begin to think it has more to do with lucky choices followed by not so luckychoices. That is why when Ballke was recognized last year I told myself that it will take a few more drafts before we should decide just how good he is.
Originally posted by rondoman:
Idaho,

This was a genius post and I agree 100% with everything you said.

Regarding the draft class, that is most disappointing this far. One horrible draft can haunt a team for years. While HarBaalke get praise for the 2011 draft class, the 2012 is just the opposite, and turning into a disaster. Makes me very concerned for the 2013 draft.

Anyways, thanks for the great post!


The 2012 draft could still end up being solid. LaMichael James looks like he'll be a solid offensive and special teams weapon for years to come. AJ Jenkins I'm hoping ends up as a very capable receiver and playmaker but its not promising to hear that this late in the season, he's still having issues with the playbook. Looney could very well end up as a starting guard for this team in the future if either Iupati doesn't resign or Davis doesn't resign and Boone gets moved to tackle. He was rated higher and fell as a result of injury. I don't know how Fleming will look when he comes back, he's a question mark and might not go anywhere.

Slowey was an absolute bust, which is okay considering he's a 6th rounder but Nate Potter of Boise was still available and has looked relatively decent as a starter for the Cardinals lately. Cam Johnson was a great value pick considering where he was drafted, I still fully expect great things from him down the road.


It is clear that it was not an optimal draft though and I hope going forward that they pick more players who can become regular contributors from early on.
Originally posted by excelsior:
It is an interesting point. After Baalke was annointed Executive of the Year last year, I thought about how Al Davis had dominant teams, then not so much. And AJ Smith of the Chargers had dominant teams for years, then not so much. When GMs have good teams, followed by average teams, you begin to think it has more to do with lucky choices followed by not so luckychoices. That is why when Ballke was recognized last year I told myself that it will take a few more drafts before we should decide just how good he is.

To be fair, James was a good pick in the 2nd round and represented good value. There was no 3rd round pick, Looney was someone that was also a good choice, so was Cam Johnson, beyond that, I think they could have done better but if James, Jenkins and Johnson live up to their billing, then it will still be a pretty damn good draft overall, along with whomever they end up choosing with Carolina's 3rd round pick this year.
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
What happened to all that depth i was told we had?

Other than LMJ, and Celek, barely starting to contribute the last couple of games, we are not getting contribution from our draft class. This draft is seriously coming back to bite us in the ass. Hopefully it doesnt hurt us over the long term, but it is certainly hurting us this year. Like i said, good teams simply do not have drafts like this. Even the best teams in the league year in and year out cant afford it.

It seems like it was a questionable draft. LaMichael James might be a decent weapon long-term and even AJ Jenkins could turn out to be a useful player, but you can't really have a whole draft and not get any contribution from your draft picks for a majority of the season. The argument that this team is "too deep" is ridiculous, if Jenkins can't beat out a former 6th round pick in Williams who is decent but nothing amazing and an aging Randy Moss, maybe they really weren't that deep to begin with. Teams with arguably better receiving corps such as the Giants have found ways to get their rookies out on to the field to contribute so I don't buy that excuse at all.


Looney might end up a good prospect but he's contributed nothing, mostly due to injury which limited him early on. Beyond that, nobody knows what this team has with Fleming or Cam Johnson.


Now this year, they have figured out they need better 3-4 DE depth and this draft actually looks kind of crappy in that regards. Lots of guys with potential but with various issues and problems of their own, meanwhile last year, in lieu of Jenkins they could have snagged either Derek Wolfe or Kendall Reyes, either of which could have developed behind Justin Smith and filled in as starters quite ably.

They can't afford more drafts like this, picking guys that simply don't play, teams that are developing and losing 10 or 11 games a year can afford to do that, not someone that is primed to go deep in the playoffs, they need as many active contributors as possible.

For me, the most worrisome at first was the lack of ST contributions. I would at the very least expect contributions on ST especially when we let our to best contributers on ST walk. It has gotten worse since then with injurys, and still very little contributions. Fact is our depth all over was largely exagerated.

I liked Wolfe as well, and as personally on the TE bandwagon, because i thought this offense as going to morph into something differant than what it has, but i would have been happy with Wolfe, Janoris Jenkins, or Doug Martin. Martin was the only RB that i really wanted would have taken in this draft. I personally was really high on Alshon Jefferey in the second as a WR prospect.

As far as DE goes this year, i really like...

Margus Hunt- DE- Southern Methodist-6-7, 280, rSR
Willie Jefferson-DE-Stephen F. Austin- 6-6, 230, SR
Ben Obaseki, DE, Indiana State, 6-2, 260 SR

But all three are extreme projects, and Jefferson projects more to a 3-4 OLB. There are a good amount of DE projects in this draft but no real sure things.
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by excelsior:
It is an interesting point. After Baalke was annointed Executive of the Year last year, I thought about how Al Davis had dominant teams, then not so much. And AJ Smith of the Chargers had dominant teams for years, then not so much. When GMs have good teams, followed by average teams, you begin to think it has more to do with lucky choices followed by not so luckychoices. That is why when Ballke was recognized last year I told myself that it will take a few more drafts before we should decide just how good he is.

To be fair, James was a good pick in the 2nd round and represented good value. There was no 3rd round pick, Looney was someone that was also a good choice, so was Cam Johnson, beyond that, I think they could have done better but if James, Jenkins and Johnson live up to their billing, then it will still be a pretty damn good draft overall, along with whomever they end up choosing with Carolina's 3rd round pick this year.

I wasnt sold on the LMJ pick because i felt he would be a hunter clone, and i felt what we needed was an eventual replacment to gore. If hunter doesnt get injured, we dont need LMJ but if Gore had gotten injured instead, we would have virtually two of the same type RB.

In Hindsight, if we were going to go WR/RB in the first and second, They should have taken Martin in the first, especially with all the WR's in the second that were seen as projects with upside. Martin/Jefferey would have been my choice if i would have known we were going WR/RB first and second.

I have however been pleasantly suprised with LMJ since he has been getting action. I still think they should use him between the tackles more, but thats something else all together.
You made good observations with all your points, and I read each one. However, each one could have been a thread unto itself and some of us have that 21st century malady of short attention span.
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
For me, the most worrisome at first was the lack of ST contributions. I would at the very least expect contributions on ST especially when we let our to best contributers on ST walk. It has gotten worse since then with injurys, and still very little contributions. Fact is our depth all over was largely exagerated.

Having them trade away Colin Jones after the awesome performances he put out on special teams last year pissed me off to no end. Along with trading him and letting Costanzo walk, the special teams performance has markedly gone down, and for what? Brandon Jacobs? There was no value in the moves that they made. Now the special teams is struggling in coverage and Jones and Costanzo are outstanding special teams performers for their respective teams.
[ Edited by Phoenix49ers on Dec 27, 2012 at 7:30 PM ]