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Out-coached!

Originally posted by defenderDX:
Offensively I don't see how we were out-coached. We just went IN with a retarded gameplan that we expected to work for whatever reason



not switching out of that game plan is a start.......................................................
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
Originally posted by defenderDX:
Offensively I don't see how we were out-coached. We just went IN with a retarded gameplan that we expected to work for whatever reason



not switching out of that game plan is a start.......................................................

I see that more as us just being stubborn instead of trying to adjust to what the Giants were trying to do. It's almost like we ignored the Giants and what they were doing
Great post dj43. Completely agree with your post, so ready for Thursday's game. It won't get here soon enough.
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
It's one thing for JH to rev up Smith by telling him and the media, the Smith is an elite QB, it is entirely another when JH starts to believe it! Smith is an average, "serviceable" QB, the game plans need to reflect that. Smith is fine and can get us where we all want to go, but he needs to be in the system, and not the focus of the system.

Giving up on the running game even though it had been very successful was a MAJOR reason that the passing game failed. The 49ers and Alex Smith are one of the very best play action passing teams in the league. This is due largely to the strength of the running game which forces at least one safety to play close to the LOS to defend against the run.

At the beginning of the game yesterday, 49er receivers were finding space due to the fact the safeties were usually occupied elsewhere. Once Roman abandoned the run, the safeties were either sitting back waiting to poach or were double covering the receivers. Without any of the easy options Smith had at the beginning of the game he began forcing throws and the result was disaster.

This is not rocket science. I would bet/hope, that Harbaugh and Roman are sitting down at 4949 right now saying, "we REALLY screwed up."

You abandon the run when you need to score...because you are behind, we see other teams do this against us almost every week. When we game plan against our type, and it shows pretty clearly. Also I find it sad that we need to bring in our deep passing QB to get the ball downfield more than 30 yards in the air.

Had we stuck with the run, I believe we would have scored, certainly more than the 3 pts we did trying to pass! and at the time, there was sufficient opportunity to keep running, but we abandoned it early on. As it was, we averaged nearly 5 yds a carry between Frank and Kendall only to put it all on Alex's shoulders and we saw what happened there. Then, in the 4th quarter with only about 10 minutes left and 3 touchdowns behind, did we go no huddle? Call plays to advance down the field and stop the clock? Have any sense of urgency whatsoever? NO! Mystifying!!!! It's a good thiong I have a buzz cut, 'cause if my hair had been long enough to grab, I'd have pulled it out by the roots! The ride home was not fun.

I agree with your points about sticking with the running game.

I would add a comparison to what the Giants did: Even though the 49ers were stuffing the Giants' running game early, they stuck with it, even when behind at the beginning. As a result, when Eli used play action, it froze the safeties and opened up lanes for their receivers. Play action was effective for them all game long.

The 49ers, in contrast, gave up on the running game and consequently the play action was no longer an effective way to control the rushers and the safeties. It was comical on one of Kaepernick's "fakes" to Kendall Hunter, IIRC, who was five yards away from him when he faked it to him. Aikman and Buck both commented on how silly it was to fake when everybody in the park knew what was coming.
RUN THE f**kING BALL IDIOTS. THIS IS OUR STRENGTH
If I've said it once, I've said it 1,000 times. We lose every time we make Alex the focal point of the offense. That's just the truth.
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 25,227
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
If I've said it once, I've said it 1,000 times. We lose every time we make Alex the focal point of the offense. That's just the truth.
it worked against the bills cuz the bills are not the giants,, oops i just bashed smith! actually its true,, when we for some odd ball reason decide to go away from the run, we are predictable, we struggle , we get sacked and make mistakes. s**t i do not know if its alex , the coaches, the line, or maybe its just one of those games... i tell you though i do not like it when i see the same s**t twice this year and they better damn well get back on track thursday
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
If I've said it once, I've said it 1,000 times. We lose every time we make Alex the focal point of the offense. That's just the truth.
it worked against the bills cuz the bills are not the giants,, oops i just bashed smith! actually its true,, when we for some odd ball reason decide to go away from the run, we are predictable, we struggle , we get sacked and make mistakes. s**t i do not know if its alex , the coaches, the line, or maybe its just one of those games... i tell you though i do not like it when i see the same s**t twice this year and they better damn well get back on track thursday
To be fair, we also ran for 300 yards....yikes.
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
If I've said it once, I've said it 1,000 times. We lose every time we make Alex the focal point of the offense. That's just the truth.
it worked against the bills cuz the bills are not the giants,, oops i just bashed smith! actually its true,, when we for some odd ball reason decide to go away from the run, we are predictable, we struggle , we get sacked and make mistakes. s**t i do not know if its alex , the coaches, the line, or maybe its just one of those games... i tell you though i do not like it when i see the same s**t twice this year and they better damn well get back on track thursday
To be fair, we also ran for 300 yards....yikes.
And to be fair as well, the passing game is the least developed part of our offense. Had Kap been the focal point, we would have likely been toast as well, so I respectfully disagree.
Originally posted by truekingcarlos:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
If I've said it once, I've said it 1,000 times. We lose every time we make Alex the focal point of the offense. That's just the truth.
it worked against the bills cuz the bills are not the giants,, oops i just bashed smith! actually its true,, when we for some odd ball reason decide to go away from the run, we are predictable, we struggle , we get sacked and make mistakes. s**t i do not know if its alex , the coaches, the line, or maybe its just one of those games... i tell you though i do not like it when i see the same s**t twice this year and they better damn well get back on track thursday
To be fair, we also ran for 300 yards....yikes.
And to be fair as well, the passing game is the least developed part of our offense. Had Kap been the focal point, we would have likely been toast as well, so I respectfully disagree.

So you're argument is "because Kap couldnt' do it" you disagree with my point about Alex.... Also, how does pointing out that our "passing game is the least developed" support you position on Alex who happens to be the QB?

Kids these days....
Originally posted by dj43:
Not true. On one of them the cameras actually showed Alex "looking off" the left safety to keep him away from the target, then moving to the middle of the field and finally back to the target. Unfortunately, with only an under target other than MM, Rolle was able to sit back in center field and move to the ball as soon as Alex released it. Smith should have seen Rolle coming but he did not "stare down the receiver."

The first pick on the pass to Walker was a play the Giants had been burned on in the NFCC game and so they scouted it well and defended it perfectly. The safety stayed in disguise just long enough to invite the throw, then jumped it and made the play. Walker is a big strong guy but not agile enough to defend the ball against the pick.

Couldn't tell where Smith eyes went on the third pick.

One thing is clear. Each throw was "taking a chance" which is what many have asked him to do. He took chances on guys who were not open and got burned. Bad choices. Don't do it again. Play winning football, not fantasy football.


Let's not make it like this was a different Alex. He's the same qb he always is only he was put in a place he rarely gets put in.

Down 2 scores against a great defense. Asked to make plays. Just made too many mistakes in that situation Sunday.
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
It's one thing for JH to rev up Smith by telling him and the media, the Smith is an elite QB, it is entirely another when JH starts to believe it! Smith is an average, "serviceable" QB, the game plans need to reflect that. Smith is fine and can get us where we all want to go, but he needs to be in the system, and not the focus of the system.

Giving up on the running game even though it had been very successful was a MAJOR reason that the passing game failed. The 49ers and Alex Smith are one of the very best play action passing teams in the league. This is due largely to the strength of the running game which forces at least one safety to play close to the LOS to defend against the run.

At the beginning of the game yesterday, 49er receivers were finding space due to the fact the safeties were usually occupied elsewhere. Once Roman abandoned the run, the safeties were either sitting back waiting to poach or were double covering the receivers. Without any of the easy options Smith had at the beginning of the game he began forcing throws and the result was disaster.

This is not rocket science. I would bet/hope, that Harbaugh and Roman are sitting down at 4949 right now saying, "we REALLY screwed up."

You abandon the run when you need to score...because you are behind, we see other teams do this against us almost every week. When we game plan against our type, and it shows pretty clearly. Also I find it sad that we need to bring in our deep passing QB to get the ball downfield more than 30 yards in the air.

Had we stuck with the run, I believe we would have scored, certainly more than the 3 pts we did trying to pass! and at the time, there was sufficient opportunity to keep running, but we abandoned it early on. As it was, we averaged nearly 5 yds a carry between Frank and Kendall only to put it all on Alex's shoulders and we saw what happened there. Then, in the 4th quarter with only about 10 minutes left and 3 touchdowns behind, did we go no huddle? Call plays to advance down the field and stop the clock? Have any sense of urgency whatsoever? NO! Mystifying!!!! It's a good thiong I have a buzz cut, 'cause if my hair had been long enough to grab, I'd have pulled it out by the roots! The ride home was not fun.

I agree with your points about sticking with the running game.

I would add a comparison to what the Giants did: Even though the 49ers were stuffing the Giants' running game early, they stuck with it, even when behind at the beginning. As a result, when Eli used play action, it froze the safeties and opened up lanes for their receivers. Play action was effective for them all game long.

The 49ers, in contrast, gave up on the running game and consequently the play action was no longer an effective way to control the rushers and the safeties. It was comical on one of Kaepernick's "fakes" to Kendall Hunter, IIRC, who was five yards away from him when he faked it to him. Aikman and Buck both commented on how silly it was to fake when everybody in the park knew what was coming.

You are dead on!
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by dj43:
Not true. On one of them the cameras actually showed Alex "looking off" the left safety to keep him away from the target, then moving to the middle of the field and finally back to the target. Unfortunately, with only an under target other than MM, Rolle was able to sit back in center field and move to the ball as soon as Alex released it. Smith should have seen Rolle coming but he did not "stare down the receiver."

The first pick on the pass to Walker was a play the Giants had been burned on in the NFCC game and so they scouted it well and defended it perfectly. The safety stayed in disguise just long enough to invite the throw, then jumped it and made the play. Walker is a big strong guy but not agile enough to defend the ball against the pick.

Couldn't tell where Smith eyes went on the third pick.

One thing is clear. Each throw was "taking a chance" which is what many have asked him to do. He took chances on guys who were not open and got burned. Bad choices. Don't do it again. Play winning football, not fantasy football.


Let's not make it like this was a different Alex. He's the same qb he always is only he was put in a place he rarely gets put in.

Down 2 scores against a great defense. Asked to make plays. Just made too many mistakes in that situation Sunday.

no, wrong

taking chance means throwing a ball up to a receiver that's one on one with a cb. It means gunning one into a tight window. it means throwing a receiver open (kinda like the back shoulder one to Williams, that was nice).

His picks in this game were retarded. He said himself he was pressing. I don't know how much better he'd play if given another chance. His arm talent isn't up there with the best of them, and only the top tier QB's can come from behind against a good defense. Such qb's and their teams have the greatest shot of winning the SB in today's league.


I hate how so many Niner fans think we need to just get back to our formula and everythign will be alright. So ignorant/naive/arrogant. Our formula dismantled by the Vikings and then used against us by the Giants.

Last season was somewhat of a fluke even though I hate that word. Thinking our defens will carry us so just feed the ball to Gore to take pressure of Alex and we'll be right back at the NFCCG is foolish.
Let 'em loose!! It's so simple... cut the reins on Alex Smith and let him play ball. Why get him all these offensive toys if your not going to let him shoot em. The niners need to throw the ball deep and more often to make the opposing team respect our passing game and set us up for more play action plays and long runs. Its ok that we can manage the clock but what happens when your down like this weekend and need to get down the field and score fast. Team are coming to expect the niners to creep down field and not use Randy... why waste the mans time when he could be putting up numbers elsewhere? Stop putting so much pressure on the defense and lite the field up!! Go back to the niners hay days of Montana and Young and shred the secondary up n cause confusion cause you have so many weapons. Can play safe ball all the time ...
I dont know what the f*ck happened on sunday ...clearly we have the talent to win in this league, but on sunday, we looked lost, unprepared, and lacked any sort of fire to fight back.

now I hope we stick with what works, run the ball and control the clock, get a W before the team loses focus and faith , maybe it's time to lay off the CK packages until the base offense weapons get comfortable first , it seemed Harbaugh was a little cocky and wanted those CK plays to work so bad, that he ignored the fact the team did not get into any kind of rhythm first , we were close to establishing the run game, then everything blew up in the coaching staffs face, and clearly Alex was not prepared to play catchup football.

but I still have faith in this team, always will