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Finally Time to Blame HARBAUGH !

I think Fangio got exposed... He has called very few blitzes in the first 3 weeks and it is killing our D backs. No team can cover the receivers/TE/RB for 5+ seconds down field.
I got my eye on you mella aka packer fan
Ponder won the game for them. If stayed in the pocket we would have won even though we played flat. But he scrambled and kept drives alive and tired our Dline out.

JH & staff were out-coached in this game - No question about it.

My only complaint about him is not burying teams when we can. Both the Packers & Lions games should never have been that close.

Hopefully he and his staff learn from it.
Finally! I was waiting for a week when we could blame JH!

  • dj43
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 20,155
Originally posted by Joecool:
Give credit where it's due. MIN finally took advantage of our main weekness on D and that was the short flats. They also had a good player to throw to there in Harvin. Combine that with Ponder extending plays and making plays off his feet and our Defense got stretched.
Now include the fact that our QB doesn't have some of the intagibles their QB displayed along with MiN not turning it over and thy Ninered us but had better QB play than we normally do.

You have most of the facts correct but your anti-Alex filter led you to a wrong conclusion in the end.

Yes, Harvin made a difference but it wasn't the QB that made the difference. Harvin is a game breaker at all levels. The threat of him going deep, along with the speed of Michael Jenkins, forced the safeties to stay deep. That, plus the lack of a pass rush, opened up a lot of things for the Vikings.

Contrast that with the 49ers who have no deep threat receivers, and you have the difference in QB play. A lot of people, including NFL announcers, talk about the deep threat of Randy Moss. I don't see it. He is NOT a deep threat any longer, at least not in the way Harbaugh/Roman are using him. True, CBs are giving him a free release off the line but he clearly did not scare Minne at all.

To make matters worse, Manningham has NEVER been a deep threat and neither is Crabtree. Davis can beat any LB and many safeties but he was held in to help pass protection yesterday so his threat is eliminated. Jenkins can't seem to get on the field, so who does Alex have to throw to deep?

I couldn't tell for sure on the TV screen but I did not see any evidence of the 49ers even calling any deep routes yesterday. Of course that makes sense if you know you have no receivers who can get open deep but it does make the offense much more predictable.

In short, the biggest culprit in the loss was the play selection of Roman. At some point you MUST send someone long to keep the defense honest. He didn't do that that I could see. If Moss no longer has deep speed (which is what I suspect) then get Jenkins on the field.

It does no good to have all these "new weapons" if you are not going to use them. So far, all we have seen is a much improved Michael Crabtree. Manningham and Moss have done very little. The 49ers have three possession receivers and a TE that can go deep but is often forced to stay in and block. That isn't going to get the job done. We say what the threat of Harvin did, and we also saw how that worked in the Ravens game with Jones and Smith. Time for Harbaugh to open things up.
  • dj43
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 20,155
Originally posted by 49er4life:
I think Fangio got exposed... He has called very few blitzes in the first 3 weeks and it is killing our D backs. No team can cover the receivers/TE/RB for 5+ seconds down field.

I was excited when Fangio was named DC. I am a big fan of Dom Capers' style blitzes. Fangio, having worked with Capers, was a big hope for me that he would bring some of that. Unfortunately, it looks like he thinks the front 5 can provide the pressure. Time has now shown that they cannot against a good line...and Minne has a very good OL.

Time for both the defense AND the offense to open things up and get more aggressive.
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Usually I can understand how we should just chalk this up as a bad performance and move on....but its the way that we lost that should cause some worry.

They beat us EXACTLY like how our other loses have usually been. Play mistake free football for most of the game...stay patient on offense and convert 3rd downs....always move forward...no penalties.....and on defense, dare our offense to throw it deep. Seemed like they were playing the run most of the game...so we passed more or maybe checked out of runs for passes.

The Jets can play a similar type of game... as long as Rex drills that into the head of JTOSanchez.

this is one reason I think we'll see some Tebow on offense against us...because I think they will play the low scoring game with us, and try to convert tough close 1st downs.

interesting to see how we'll adjust....if we want to, that is.

Don't underestimate the Viking's luck. Goldson's dropped pick 6 would turn this game completely around. Also Peterson's fumble actually being a really positive play for them; how does that happen? Simply put the 49ers had a day where everything goes wrong, and the Vikes had the exact opposite. They literary could do no wrong. Ponder could've closed his eyes before a pass and he still would've found Harvin.
[ Edited by SFTifoso on Sep 24, 2012 at 10:59 AM ]
Whitner would have scored if he had held onto the ball.....it just wasnt our day fellas....
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Give credit where it's due. MIN finally took advantage of our main weekness on D and that was the short flats. They also had a good player to throw to there in Harvin. Combine that with Ponder extending plays and making plays off his feet and our Defense got stretched.
Now include the fact that our QB doesn't have some of the intagibles their QB displayed along with MiN not turning it over and thy Ninered us but had better QB play than we normally do.

You have most of the facts correct but your anti-Alex filter led you to a wrong conclusion in the end.

Yes, Harvin made a difference but it wasn't the QB that made the difference. Harvin is a game breaker at all levels. The threat of him going deep, along with the speed of Michael Jenkins, forced the safeties to stay deep. That, plus the lack of a pass rush, opened up a lot of things for the Vikings.

Contrast that with the 49ers who have no deep threat receivers, and you have the difference in QB play. A lot of people, including NFL announcers, talk about the deep threat of Randy Moss. I don't see it. He is NOT a deep threat any longer, at least not in the way Harbaugh/Roman are using him. True, CBs are giving him a free release off the line but he clearly did not scare Minne at all.

To make matters worse, Manningham has NEVER been a deep threat and neither is Crabtree. Davis can beat any LB and many safeties but he was held in to help pass protection yesterday so his threat is eliminated. Jenkins can't seem to get on the field, so who does Alex have to throw to deep?

I couldn't tell for sure on the TV screen but I did not see any evidence of the 49ers even calling any deep routes yesterday. Of course that makes sense if you know you have no receivers who can get open deep but it does make the offense much more predictable.

In short, the biggest culprit in the loss was the play selection of Roman. At some point you MUST send someone long to keep the defense honest. He didn't do that that I could see. If Moss no longer has deep speed (which is what I suspect) then get Jenkins on the field.

It does no good to have all these "new weapons" if you are not going to use them. So far, all we have seen is a much improved Michael Crabtree. Manningham and Moss have done very little. The 49ers have three possession receivers and a TE that can go deep but is often forced to stay in and block. That isn't going to get the job done. We say what the threat of Harvin did, and we also saw how that worked in the Ravens game with Jones and Smith. Time for Harbaugh to open things up.

Just a few observations Id like to add to that after rewatching the game. I disagree with the 'no deep route call' notion. After watching the first half, I came to a conclusion that Harbaugh did exactly what a lot of people were asking him to do. He decided to "unleash" Alex, and the plan backfired. The majority of plays were pass, and MIN defended it beautifully. Alex threw the ball to a receiver (quite a few times) before receivers had even adjusted their route. Yes, there were times where Alex was rushed bc of poor blocking and he had no choice. But there were plays where he either (a) didnt let the receivers go deep bc he threw it too quick, or (b) checked down early. Other times the receivers were defended well or as I said the pass rush was too quick.

I think it was a failed misiion, and Harbaugh (realizing this) tried to adjust the gameplan back to conserva-mode as much as he could, but at that point he was fighting the clock and apparently Christian Ponder (still dont get how he lit us).

I expect Harbaugh to bring Alex right back underneath his shell, and we're gonna play it "safe" from now on out.
Originally posted by SFTifoso:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Usually I can understand how we should just chalk this up as a bad performance and move on....but its the way that we lost that should cause some worry.

They beat us EXACTLY like how our other loses have usually been. Play mistake free football for most of the game...stay patient on offense and convert 3rd downs....always move forward...no penalties.....and on defense, dare our offense to throw it deep. Seemed like they were playing the run most of the game...so we passed more or maybe checked out of runs for passes.

The Jets can play a similar type of game... as long as Rex drills that into the head of JTOSanchez.

this is one reason I think we'll see some Tebow on offense against us...because I think they will play the low scoring game with us, and try to convert tough close 1st downs.

interesting to see how we'll adjust....if we want to, that is.

Don't underestimate the Viking's luck. Goldson's dropped pick 6 would turn this game completely around. Also Peterson's fumble actually being a really positive play for them; how does that happen? Simply put the 49ers had a day where everything goes wrong, and the Vikes had the exact opposite. They literary could do no wrong. Ponder could've closed his eyes before a pass and he still would've found Harvin.
last year breaks went our way....we can't rely on that to win games.....when breaks don't go our way, and teams play smart and patient...and if their QB outplays ours....we are going to most likely lose.

that is the formula to beat us....play just like us on offense...and commit to stopping our running game. Its tough to do for most teams who are used to attacking teams with their offense. But if they see that it works, I'm sure eventually more teams will adjust.

we've always played on the edge...how often do some of yall remember where we put teams away late in games? We always let teams stick around, EVEN THOUGH they turn the ball over.

again...we just have to see how long until we choose to adjust....if we want to. We might not have a choice and be forced to stick with the same formula if the coaching staff feels our personal on offense can't do certain things, unless changes are made depth chart wise.
  • Axl49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,354
Originally posted by 80849er4life:
Whitner would have scored if he had held onto the ball.....it just wasnt our day fellas....

This. Nothing went our way. And 3 chances at fumble which were recoverable on one drive like come on. Just wasnt our day. Learn, Improve and get ready for Jets.
Its not harbaughs fault we can't complete a pass farther than 15 yards in the air
I don't know, im not even sure on how to explain it. but i think there's a fine line between staying true to the game plan and realizing ya just stepped into a problem and then trying to turn the tables.

I think our coaches may be kinda hard headed.

They go through all the motions establishing tempo; creating diversity of plays w/ in the plan; trying to expose/create mismatches and god darn it, the plan is going to work. No need to press the panic button. Hell, they probably don't even have one.

I think they need an "ohh ish" button though.

It's ok to go into a no huddle O in the first quarter just to see how an opponent reacts or to try to steal some momentum back. It's ok to try to call some deep routes more then once a game, a weapon never used regardless of success or failure is no threat at all.

It's great that the D is able to do the things it does. Stop the run with 6-7, pressure the pocket with just four, keeping the play in front of them. Sometimes that's just fine with the other guy too and that's not cool. It's ok to get creative early in the game when the situation isn't looking desperate. Ya might might fool somebody
As a whole they looked outta step and slow.

Sunday will be better GO NINERS!!!!!!
Originally posted by Baldie:
Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
everyone on the team except for kyle williams had a s**tty day. i wouldn't get all emotional and compare harbaugh to singletary LOL

Imagine if Kyle won the game for us on 2 TD returns....LoL. I think that would all but makeup for last season for most of the fans.

Lol not even close.
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by 49er4life:
I think Fangio got exposed... He has called very few blitzes in the first 3 weeks and it is killing our D backs. No team can cover the receivers/TE/RB for 5+ seconds down field.

I was excited when Fangio was named DC. I am a big fan of Dom Capers' style blitzes. Fangio, having worked with Capers, was a big hope for me that he would bring some of that. Unfortunately, it looks like he thinks the front 5 can provide the pressure. Time has now shown that they cannot against a good line...and Minne has a very good OL.

Time for both the defense AND the offense to open things up and get more aggressive.

All of this.