Will the offensive line hold back the 49ers offense this season?

Originally posted by reno911:
I think as the season rolls along the offensive line will improve.I think the key to our offence will be all about the play calling.If we can avoid long 3rd down situations we will be ok.

We sure hope you are right!

Really glad you brought this up. Ppl highlighted our 1 for 13 3rd down % in the NFCCG but the Giants were just as bad. The REAL issue was that we were horrendous on 1st downs making us even more predictable on 2nd and 3rd downs. I know Alex has recently highlighted this issue as well. We need at least some modest positive yards on 1st downs. Some of that is on the OL here too...

everything starts with the OL but its not the only issue.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by reno911:
I think as the season rolls along the offensive line will improve.I think the key to our offence will be all about the play calling.If we can avoid long 3rd down situations we will be ok.

We sure hope you are right!

Really glad you brought this up. Ppl highlighted our 1 for 13 3rd down % in the NFCCG but the Giants were just as bad. The REAL issue was that we were horrendous on 1st downs making us even more predictable on 2nd and 3rd downs. I know Alex has recently highlighted this issue as well. We need at least some modest positive yards on 1st downs. Some of that is on the OL here too...

everything starts with the OL but its not the only issue.

The default play call last year was jumbo, run up the gut. It wears down the D and keeps the QB from harms way. I did not like it at all but with the limited TC and new scheme it was likely the right call.

Someone mentioned Snyder allowing sacks in Arizona, and that makes me sad because he was so useful to the niners for years. But, I'm so glad he is in Arizona and not here! Still worry about the lack of experience on the line but at least they are trying to improve it. So far, Boone has seemed to be better at maintaining his area, the breakdowns have been less obvious.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by reno911:
I think as the season rolls along the offensive line will improve.I think the key to our offence will be all about the play calling.If we can avoid long 3rd down situations we will be ok.

We sure hope you are right!

Really glad you brought this up. Ppl highlighted our 1 for 13 3rd down % in the NFCCG but the Giants were just as bad. The REAL issue was that we were horrendous on 1st downs making us even more predictable on 2nd and 3rd downs. I know Alex has recently highlighted this issue as well. We need at least some modest positive yards on 1st downs. Some of that is on the OL here too...

everything starts with the OL but its not the only issue.

The default play call last year was jumbo, run up the gut. It wears down the D and keeps the QB from harms way. I did not like it at all but with the limited TC and new scheme it was likely the right call.

Someone mentioned Snyder allowing sacks in Arizona, and that makes me sad because he was so useful to the niners for years. But, I'm so glad he is in Arizona and not here! Still worry about the lack of experience on the line but at least they are trying to improve it. So far, Boone has seemed to be better at maintaining his area, the breakdowns have been less obvious.

It sure was...the running game was our bell cow while the rest of the offense was being installed. It made sense esp. with the RZ focus being addressed last. But as we got towards the end of the season, I started to wonder why we didn't take that next step in the passing game...as we learned more about Harbaugh/Roman's offense at Stanford, it made more sense. They'll take their shots but it's a ball security offense that sets you up with the running game (its efficient); not a traditional WCO that sets up the run (especially for the 2nd half of games) up with the short passing game that is very flexible/innovative in the passing game.

So the question to ask is how much of our issues were/will be related to the OL? B/c like Oscar pointed out, if the line still can't give it's QB at least 3 seconds, all the new toys won't matter. We'll see more jumbo packages and poor production on 1st/3rd downs, short yardage and RZ production.

No issues yesterday? We look good? If not, it's Alex's fault and/or it's just a pre season game? No concerns...we're good?

Originally posted by NCommand:
No issues yesterday? We look good? If not, it's Alex's fault and/or it's just a pre season game? No concerns...we're good?

god NC,, anyone who says we have no issues with the line and we are good is really really whistling past the end zone not to mention the graveyard.There is no way in gods green earth you can just say,, well the poor line play is the fault of alex so we are ok

Can you guys point out specific plays so I can take a look at who messed up? I watched at a bar so hard for me to tell but I didn't see big issues with the line yesterday.

Originally posted by natrone06:
Can you guys point out specific plays so I can take a look at who messed up? I watched at a bar so hard for me to tell but I didn't see big issues with the line yesterday.

Of course! The following covers the Texans game and once whomeam completes his video, the rest can view the Broncos game. I'm sure myself and oldman9er will also break down the 1st team OL as well. I'll just focus on pass protection but old is more comprehensive. His analysis is usually in this separate thread listed below. But feel free (anyone) to break down your own analysis as well especially since it was a nationally televised game and everyone could have recorded/reviewed it (objectively).

Post #964

http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/125790-offensive-line-play-most-important/page65/

Originally posted by cciowa:

Originally posted by NCommand:
No issues yesterday? We look good? If not, it's Alex's fault and/or it's just a pre season game? No concerns...we're good?

god NC,, anyone who says we have no issues with the line and we are good is really really whistling past the end zone not to mention the graveyard.There is no way in gods green earth you can just say,, well the poor line play is the fault of alex so we are ok

Amen to that! It will be fun (or depressing) to, "watch the tape!" But I'll let the tape do the talking...

Watching SC right now and the talk is of how Tom Brady has been getting hammered b/c of his OL this pre season and the fans are questioning if they have done enough to protect their franchise QB.

And what does Brady say? - "People make way of the offensive line but really, it's the QB's fault. From a quarterback's standpoint, we've got plenty of time to throw the ball and find the right guy and you know, we have to do a better job of doing our job."

C - Donald Thomas on Brady's comments, "Its kind of like, the sticking up for us, so to speak but you know, we're grown men and we take the blame for when it's our fault."

HC - "You never want to see your QB get hit but it's a function of a lot of things..."

This from the QB who has lost two Superbowls facing defenses that buried him on his back.

BTW: Isn't it interesting that the Patriots OL only has one returning starter from last year and now Brady is getting pounded and looking pedestrian? Odd concept? I think not...if we don't get this OL up to championship form, f*getaboutit!

On the Von Miller sack, Staley was cutting an outside speed rusher, not really part of most pass blocking schemes, that had to be a miscommunication. It will get better, but I don't think this bunch will ever be an elite pass blocking team. These guys were all drafted to run block in the Nolan, Singletary era, and JH...well he likes the run game to, so buckle up Alex!

Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
On the Von Miller sack, Staley was cutting an outside speed rusher, not really part of most pass blocking schemes, that had to be a miscommunication. It will get better, but I don't think this bunch will ever be an elite pass blocking team. These guys were all drafted to run block in the Nolan, Singletary era, and JH...well he likes the run game to, so buckle up Alex!

You may be spot on! 2.5 second pass or scramble/eat it.

Originally posted by GolittaCamper:

On the Von Miller sack, Staley was cutting an outside speed rusher, not really part of most pass blocking schemes, that had to be a miscommunication. It will get better, but I don't think this bunch will ever be an elite pass blocking team. These guys were all drafted to run block in the Nolan, Singletary era, and JH...well he likes the run game to, so buckle up Alex!

Not a miscommunication at all. A pretty common technique on quick passing plays to open up passing lanes. Dummerville made a good play and stayed on his feet but the ball has to Come out sooner then that.

Just rewatching game now. Any other plays I should look at?

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
On the Von Miller sack, Staley was cutting an outside speed rusher, not really part of most pass blocking schemes, that had to be a miscommunication. It will get better, but I don't think this bunch will ever be an elite pass blocking team. These guys were all drafted to run block in the Nolan, Singletary era, and JH...well he likes the run game to, so buckle up Alex!

You may be spot on! 2.5 second pass or scramble/eat it.

Ding, ding, ding...


PS--NC, you just have to retire and spend more time on you analysis!

Broncos game analysis:

I'm continuing to note a huge issue on 1st downs (carried over from last year) that is either negative or no gain instantly putting us behind the eight ball on 2nd and 3rd downs. Here they are in this game:
Play 1: 5 yard loss by Gore over LT side. Miller misses his block on Von Miller but Von also had two (really, 5) other defenders 5 yards deep with him in the backfield. Why even run Gore off tackle here; no speed or lateral quickness and that is Staley's weakness (sealing the edge). Miller was so bad though he even took out Staley & Iuptai by himself! LMAO
Play 2: No gain by Gore on run up the middle.
Play 3: Fumble, loss of possession. Regarding the snap, "It never looked like it even came up." Fault on the C most likely. Gore has butter hands, fingers, toes, etc...had two shots at it clean.
Play 4: Pass to VD for TD at 4 seconds. What a difference another second makes!
Play 5: Run over RG for 2 by Dixon.
Play 6: Incomplete deep ball to Moss. No gain.

Analysis: Aside from the 1st down throw/TD to VD, our pathetic trend continues on first downs.

I'll just highlight the 1st series of pass plays:
Play 1: (No shot gun). Pass at 3 seconds to Crabtree underneath for 9 - Crabtree fell down and kept his composure. OL held a nice pocket for Alex and I think Crabtree got lost in all the multiple shifts pre snap (4 of them). No joke.
Play 2: (Shot gun). Alex sacked at 3 seconds. 3 WR set. Alex looks to either of the two WR's to the R. May have had a shot at Williams but he ran 3 yards short of the 1st down marker out to the sidelines. Staley whiffed on block and Iupati was late and Alex forced to scramble and gets hit by 2 guys. Gore stoned the middle LB though. Punt on 3rd down.
Play 3: (No shot gun). One pre snap shift. 4 WR set, quick 2.5 second pass to Crabtree for 9. Good pocket save for Boone/A.Davis who got blown up; LDE slipped right through them. If Alex threw at 3 seconds, it would have been another hit/sack.
Play 4: (Shot gun). 4 WR set. Alex looks left, both receivers instantly covered, scrambles deep at 3 second mark, buys time, throws against body just as Crabtree came back along sideline. 15 yard pass for a 3 yard gain for a 1st down. Alex jump passes and takes a crushing hit by the LB.
Play 5: (No shot gun). Bomb to VD for TD. Great job by the OL creating a pocket and sustaining them!
Play 6: (No shot gun). Throw away. Wow, 3 TE's start from a jumbo package but all 3 release with 1 WR split out and not a single open receiver. Great job by the OL...holds for 5 seconds. This one is on the receivers (Dobbs, VD, Reuland & Crabtree). FG good.
Play 7: (No shot gun). 8:48 mark in the 2Q. 2 pre snap shifts, looks like jumbo package. Only 2 WR's release (Ginn & Moss). Great job by the OL blocking. Throw at 4 seconds to Moss deep in triple coverage. Looks like Alex was going there from the beginning as Ginn came across wide open as he was throwing it. This one is probably on Alex as he overthrew him by 5 yards.
Play 8: (No shot gun). False start on Iupati after a delay of game penalty coming out of a TO. WTF? It was 3rd and 1. Sloppy is right. Subsequent play results in a penalty is then a hold - also on Iupati (off-setting penalties). Pathetic.
Play 9: (Shot gun). 3rd and 18. 3 WR's, 2 back set. Throw at 3 seconds to Boobie for 3 yards. 1st team done for the day.

Analysis: Not sure what more Alex could do with these plays (esp. when you're behind the 8-ball from the start). He'd like to have one back. He seemed to call a lot of audibles (the TD being one of them per Harbaugh). The OL did better forming a pocket and sustaining blocks esp. with max protection plays. It looks like Roman was getting very creative with his pre snap formations/shifts. He did a lot with multiple TE & WR sets. I saw a lot more issues with the receivers getting no separation than I did with the OL today although I saw a lot of the same 'ol same 'ol (Staley, Boone/Davis issues, big hits, sacks, false starts, etc.). But they did a little better than the Texans game.

But fellas/ladies...we've got issues and some scary trends.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Ding, ding, ding...


PS--NC, you just have to retire and spend more time on you analysis!

I think I just did. LOL