we gave up 44 sacks

Combination of poor pass protection from RG, RT, C, Laughable footwork and pocket awareness from the QB, and at times getting outschemed.

Take away the nine sacks from the ravens game, then there is only 35 sacks. 35 isn't great, but is a respectable number. Factor in the times Alex ate the ball instead of throwing a costly interception. Our offensive line is a smaller part of the problem. The bigger part is quicker decision making by our qb and better separation from our wr the two go hand in hand. Upgrading the right guard and wr positions will drop this number drastically.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Jakemall:
Pretty sure I read something about them taking hot routes out. I think Davis and some of the other receivers were having problems with the reads.

Yeah and not sure if that is on the QB either. Alex has the ability to change the play (see 9 crowding the box and changes the call from a run to a pass) but I believe the Center calls the blitz pickups (e.g. makes the line calls) and the receivers have the responsibility to break off routes if they suspect a blitz. Not positive and each offense is different.

I seem to remember Smith hitting VD in the back with some quick tosses when Raye was OC. They weren't on the same page when blitzed and that is why the quick reads were taken out. The QB should not have to audible when a blitz occurs, the TE should read it the same as the QB and just cut the route short, behind the blitzer. The problem with this is the Ds have become much more clevor in disguising and a DLman may jump back into the short area. But still, VD was horrible at reading these situations. His difficulty with the Harbaugh offense last year shows a learning curve though and they may be able to use these next year. All he has to do is turn his head a bit to look for the blitz when the ball is snapped and cut off the route if he sees an opening.

Play design is important as well to have someone coming over the middle every play to force D's to back out of the blitz packages.

Edit: Irish--the line is a big part of the problem when LBs and DL are coming through untouched. That is not a "small" part of the problem at all but a very big problem that must be fixed if the offense is to improve.

alex smith 14-1.....in 2012 thaws rite b***hes 14AND UNO PLUS SB CHAMPS KISS MY ASSS I MEAN 14 AND DOS!!!!

Originally posted by fastforward:

Originally posted by 49er4life:
I agree with most of what you are saying, but think you are dead wrong about the play calling.

The #1 way to improve the sack stat is to work with Alex on spotting the blitz pre-snap and then switching the WR and/or TE's to their hot routs along with calling the protection (o-line, TE, and rb's) to the correct location.

Now I am not blaming this all on Alex, I think the short off season last year really effected what the coaching staff could work with the team on. Also, it is partially on the WR/TE to be aware of the blitz and to look for the hot rout call, and then to get separation.

That might have been too complicated for the 49ers WR corps last season!

That's only half of it. A big part is the centers communication with the rest of the line.
Goodwin's first year with the team coupled with a new system the numbers shouldn't be a surprise.

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by fastforward:

Originally posted by 49er4life:

I agree with most of what you are saying, but think you are dead wrong about the play calling.

The #1 way to improve the sack stat is to work with Alex on spotting the blitz pre-snap and then switching the WR and/or TE's to their hot routs along with calling the protection (o-line, TE, and rb's) to the correct location.

Now I am not blaming this all on Alex, I think the short off season last year really effected what the coaching staff could work with the team on. Also, it is partially on the WR/TE to be aware of the blitz and to look for the hot rout call, and then to get separation.

That might have been too complicated for the 49ers WR corps last season!

That's only half of it. A big part is the centers communication with the rest of the line.
Goodwin's first year with the team coupled with a new system the numbers shouldn't be a surprise.

Baas was in the same situation in NY and they had injuries at Center. What is the next excuse?

Originally posted by Joecool:
Baas was in the same situation in NY and they had injuries at Center. What is the next excuse?

Hey...what's your deal?

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by fastforward:

Originally posted by 49er4life:
I agree with most of what you are saying, but think you are dead wrong about the play calling.

The #1 way to improve the sack stat is to work with Alex on spotting the blitz pre-snap and then switching the WR and/or TE's to their hot routs along with calling the protection (o-line, TE, and rb's) to the correct location.

Now I am not blaming this all on Alex, I think the short off season last year really effected what the coaching staff could work with the team on. Also, it is partially on the WR/TE to be aware of the blitz and to look for the hot rout call, and then to get separation.

That might have been too complicated for the 49ers WR corps last season!

That's only half of it. A big part is the centers communication with the rest of the line.
Goodwin's first year with the team coupled with a new system the numbers shouldn't be a surprise.

Baas was in the same situation in NY and they had injuries at Center. What is the next excuse?

It's not an excuse it's a fact of the game.

NY didn't have the best o line they were just good, they did give up the most sacks and qb hits in the playoffs.
If I'm not mistaken the QB and other 4 lineman in NY have been in the same system for quite some time.

It's like some people don't understand the game at all. You need all 11 players on the same page to make a single play run as designed.
It's a lot easier to screw up a play than to get one right.

Maybe the center missed a call, or the guard didn't hear him, or the tackle went the wrong way, or the running back missed a call, or the qb didn't pick up the blitz, or the tight end lined up wrong, or everyone did something wrong.

I'd rather Smith take 10 more sacks a year than throw 10 more picks.

Originally posted by LasVegasWally:

GETR oiver it - Alex is here to stay.

As is evidenced by the super long-term offer from the team that would undoubtedly make him a career 49er.

Oh wait... they refuse to offer anything longer than 3-years. My bad.

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by fastforward:

Originally posted by 49er4life:
I agree with most of what you are saying, but think you are dead wrong about the play calling.

The #1 way to improve the sack stat is to work with Alex on spotting the blitz pre-snap and then switching the WR and/or TE's to their hot routs along with calling the protection (o-line, TE, and rb's) to the correct location.

Now I am not blaming this all on Alex, I think the short off season last year really effected what the coaching staff could work with the team on. Also, it is partially on the WR/TE to be aware of the blitz and to look for the hot rout call, and then to get separation.

That might have been too complicated for the 49ers WR corps last season!

That's only half of it. A big part is the centers communication with the rest of the line.
Goodwin's first year with the team coupled with a new system the numbers shouldn't be a surprise.

Baas was in the same situation in NY and they had injuries at Center. What is the next excuse?

It's not an excuse it's a fact of the game.

NY didn't have the best o line they were just good, they did give up the most sacks and qb hits in the playoffs.
If I'm not mistaken the QB and other 4 lineman in NY have been in the same system for quite some time.

It's like some people don't understand the game at all. You need all 11 players on the same page to make a single play run as designed.
It's a lot easier to screw up a play than to get one right.

Maybe the center missed a call, or the guard didn't hear him, or the tackle went the wrong way, or the running back missed a call, or the qb didn't pick up the blitz, or the tight end lined up wrong, or everyone did something wrong.

I'd rather Smith take 10 more sacks a year than throw 10 more picks.

Every QB deals with these circumstances. We act as if Alex is under more difficult situations than any other QB in the league. Wow, just imagine if Goodwin got hurt and our backup Center played 5 games during the season. This place would be clamoring for OL depth and another year for Alex to be in ideal situations before we know what he can "really" do as if he's done it all on a consistent basis before. Eli Manning's starting Center was our 5 games. The same starting Center we all felt was subpar when he was on this team.

At some point, Alex will need to overcome non ideal circumstances on a consistent basis. It may be the OL's fault, it may be a receivers fault, it may be the TE's fault, but Alex needs to overcome that more often than crumble due to it because here's a news flash...nothing is going to be perfect for him.

Originally posted by posayshoohaa:
get a QB who makes quicker decisions .. or hope the one we have can get better .. either way in an offense where supposedly every play has a built in blitz buster there is no way we should be giving up that many sacks.

Not sure it's that easy ... The niners were near tops in the league for "short sacks" of <2.5 seconds.

It's kind of cheap to dump on Smith for "not making quick decisions" when he doesn't even have time to finish a drop before the DE's are in the pocket.

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by fastforward:

Originally posted by 49er4life:
I agree with most of what you are saying, but think you are dead wrong about the play calling.

The #1 way to improve the sack stat is to work with Alex on spotting the blitz pre-snap and then switching the WR and/or TE's to their hot routs along with calling the protection (o-line, TE, and rb's) to the correct location.

Now I am not blaming this all on Alex, I think the short off season last year really effected what the coaching staff could work with the team on. Also, it is partially on the WR/TE to be aware of the blitz and to look for the hot rout call, and then to get separation.

That might have been too complicated for the 49ers WR corps last season!

That's only half of it. A big part is the centers communication with the rest of the line.
Goodwin's first year with the team coupled with a new system the numbers shouldn't be a surprise.

Baas was in the same situation in NY and they had injuries at Center. What is the next excuse?

It's not an excuse it's a fact of the game.

NY didn't have the best o line they were just good, they did give up the most sacks and qb hits in the playoffs.
If I'm not mistaken the QB and other 4 lineman in NY have been in the same system for quite some time.

It's like some people don't understand the game at all. You need all 11 players on the same page to make a single play run as designed.
It's a lot easier to screw up a play than to get one right.

Maybe the center missed a call, or the guard didn't hear him, or the tackle went the wrong way, or the running back missed a call, or the qb didn't pick up the blitz, or the tight end lined up wrong, or everyone did something wrong.

I'd rather Smith take 10 more sacks a year than throw 10 more picks.

Every QB deals with these circumstances. We act as if Alex is under more difficult situations than any other QB in the league. Wow, just imagine if Goodwin got hurt and our backup Center played 5 games during the season. This place would be clamoring for OL depth and another year for Alex to be in ideal situations before we know what he can "really" do as if he's done it all on a consistent basis before. Eli Manning's starting Center was our 5 games. The same starting Center we all felt was subpar when he was on this team.

At some point, Alex will need to overcome non ideal circumstances on a consistent basis. It may be the OL's fault, it may be a receivers fault, it may be the TE's fault, but Alex needs to overcome that more often than crumble due to it because here's a news flash...nothing is going to be perfect for him.

"we" are talking about how the 9ers gave up 44 sacks this year.

Like I said rather the team have 44 sacks and 5 picks than 29 sacks and 15 picks

Maybe you would like to break down how Green Bay gave up 41 sacks and Rodgers only had 6 picks

Originally posted by toeshawn:
Our offensive line gave up 44 sacks.
The rams gave up the most (55), the Bills gave up the least (23)

How can the team improve from that? Will another year in the same scheme make a difference or does someone need to be upgraded?

I think half of the 44 sacks were allowed in 3 games (Dallas, Cincy, Baltimore) where Rachal played. For the lion's share of the season with Snyder, they played well.

Originally posted by NinerGM:

Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't get this blaming the OL. It seems as though if we don't have a probowler at every position, then that position is the reason why our offense isn't excelling, but completely dismiss the level of play of our QB in the last 7 years. NO TEAM has a high level OL at every spot. If there is are teams, then there are VERY few and one of them is NOT the Giants who acquire Baas and dealt with injuries at Center. We have a lot of talent on the OL.

Let us just completely ignore that our QB not only doesn't see open receivers as do most QB's here and there, our QB actually stares at open receivers and decides not to throw the damn ball. Now, those are probably a handful of occasions but imagine what else is taking him longer than normal NFL QB to make some throws. Our QB is to blame for taking sacks more than anyone considering the talent on the OL is above average compared to most teams in the league.

It is even more funny to blame the WR's. The WR has no factor in Alex throwing the ball purposely to incomplete it in order to avoid the sack. Fact is, he looks and then throws or doesn't throw at all more often than not.

Joe, this totally an absolute argument and not true at all bud. You don't need a probowler at every position for this offense to improve. Example? When Rachal starts what's the result? When Snyder starts, what's the result? You don't need exceptional talent at every position but you do need functional talent. Rachal isn't functional. Snyder is barely functional. You can't expect good play from one player who simply can't play and then another player who should be a bench guy (Snyder). Is Smith the greatest QB ever? No. You could take your same argument and say "why do the 49ers need a top 5 QB to succeed?" They don't

Teams are all build differently and what's important is that you don't invest all your talent into on place, but rather create a system regardless of player. The system is successful, maximizing strengths of that player, but at the same time not dysfunctional without that player. Peyton Manning in Indy anyone? Smith is good enough to get us with a great D a couple plays from getting to the Super Bowl. You can't say that about a number of QBs that are in the league right now..

This isn't a vociferous defense of AS. I think Harbaugh is building a system. However, given the available options today, I think Smith is the better option for this offense. The OL on the right side has been dysfunctional for a while. WR has been dysfunctional for a while. If you're going to criticize the effectiveness of the offense, you have to start with that right side and then ask yourself why our WRs can't either catch when they need to or get open. I do remember the ball hitting Crabtree in the hands a couple of time in a money situation - playoffs? You're talking playoffs???

To me, the right side has been solid and on par when Snyder played.

As for the bold, I agree with the WR's but I also don't think Alex Smith is clean in this aspect. I actually think he deserves just as much blame as do the WR's. Remember, we do have one of the league's best TE's and a WR who is capable of getting 1000 and was near it with subpar number of times thrown to.

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by 9erfan4life:

Originally posted by fastforward:

Originally posted by 49er4life:
I agree with most of what you are saying, but think you are dead wrong about the play calling.

The #1 way to improve the sack stat is to work with Alex on spotting the blitz pre-snap and then switching the WR and/or TE's to their hot routs along with calling the protection (o-line, TE, and rb's) to the correct location.

Now I am not blaming this all on Alex, I think the short off season last year really effected what the coaching staff could work with the team on. Also, it is partially on the WR/TE to be aware of the blitz and to look for the hot rout call, and then to get separation.

That might have been too complicated for the 49ers WR corps last season!

That's only half of it. A big part is the centers communication with the rest of the line.
Goodwin's first year with the team coupled with a new system the numbers shouldn't be a surprise.

Baas was in the same situation in NY and they had injuries at Center. What is the next excuse?

It's not an excuse it's a fact of the game.

NY didn't have the best o line they were just good, they did give up the most sacks and qb hits in the playoffs.
If I'm not mistaken the QB and other 4 lineman in NY have been in the same system for quite some time.

It's like some people don't understand the game at all. You need all 11 players on the same page to make a single play run as designed.
It's a lot easier to screw up a play than to get one right.

Maybe the center missed a call, or the guard didn't hear him, or the tackle went the wrong way, or the running back missed a call, or the qb didn't pick up the blitz, or the tight end lined up wrong, or everyone did something wrong.

I'd rather Smith take 10 more sacks a year than throw 10 more picks.

Every QB deals with these circumstances. We act as if Alex is under more difficult situations than any other QB in the league. Wow, just imagine if Goodwin got hurt and our backup Center played 5 games during the season. This place would be clamoring for OL depth and another year for Alex to be in ideal situations before we know what he can "really" do as if he's done it all on a consistent basis before. Eli Manning's starting Center was our 5 games. The same starting Center we all felt was subpar when he was on this team.

At some point, Alex will need to overcome non ideal circumstances on a consistent basis. It may be the OL's fault, it may be a receivers fault, it may be the TE's fault, but Alex needs to overcome that more often than crumble due to it because here's a news flash...nothing is going to be perfect for him.

"we" are talking about how the 9ers gave up 44 sacks this year.

Like I said rather the team have 44 sacks and 5 picks than 29 sacks and 15 picks

Maybe you would like to break down how Green Bay gave up 41 sacks and Rodgers only had 6 picks

Let's open that to the other side of the argument, if Alex is only capable of throwing picks that normal QB's complete, then his ceiling is not very high and we won't break open the offense under him. I would rather prefer 29 sacks and 15 more TD's rather than staring at a wide open target and not throwing the ball.

Honestly, I don't know of any QB in the league that literally sees a wide open WR and decides not to throw it no matter who that WR is.