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we gave up 44 sacks

Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
his offense has been in the same system for what 14 years?
obviously they will be minor tweaks but at 14 years you will be able to know where you rWR are at all times hence quicker realeases

people thinking that manning will come here and do same thing and have that quick release are being unrelaistic

Yep, I'd have to agree. Although, young guys like Garcon stepped in and did well I heard Manning command a lot from them. He expects a lot out of them and like I said we have a problem with chemistry. Guys like Harrison and Wayne... you will watch plays were Manning would throw the ball to a spot before the WRs even made their cuts and it would be right in their hands. I'm not just talking about little curls... this is with deep in's 30 yards down the field. With our guys it's probably an int because they don't make it to the spot. And I am turning this into a Manning thread... :( I would welcome the guy if Alex is unreasonable in contract demands... it's just that there is a lot of unknowns with Peyton where we know what we get in Alex. Normally Manning you know what you get but by the time he plays a game it will be almost 2 years..... 4 neck surgeries (that says one bad hit and his career is done), our average OL, lack of WR's and timing/chemistry, etc...
[ Edited by Gore_21 on Mar 9, 2012 at 12:39 PM ]
I still don't get this blaming the OL. It seems as though if we don't have a probowler at every position, then that position is the reason why our offense isn't excelling, but completely dismiss the level of play of our QB in the last 7 years. NO TEAM has a high level OL at every spot. If there is are teams, then there are VERY few and one of them is NOT the Giants who acquire Baas and dealt with injuries at Center. We have a lot of talent on the OL.

Let us just completely ignore that our QB not only doesn't see open receivers as do most QB's here and there, our QB actually stares at open receivers and decides not to throw the damn ball. Now, those are probably a handful of occasions but imagine what else is taking him longer than normal NFL QB to make some throws. Our QB is to blame for taking sacks more than anyone considering the talent on the OL is above average compared to most teams in the league.

It is even more funny to blame the WR's. The WR has no factor in Alex throwing the ball purposely to incomplete it in order to avoid the sack. Fact is, he looks and then throws or doesn't throw at all more often than not.
Originally posted by jdt84_2:
^^to difficult to quote on my phone.

Pretty spot on it is a share of blame that dates back to nolan. But the reason you won't see smith supporters give any ground is, just like politics, there is no middle ground.

Common sense ain't so common unforutnately.
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't get this blaming the OL. It seems as though if we don't have a probowler at every position, then that position is the reason why our offense isn't excelling, but completely dismiss the level of play of our QB in the last 7 years. NO TEAM has a high level OL at every spot. If there is are teams, then there are VERY few and one of them is NOT the Giants who acquire Baas and dealt with injuries at Center. We have a lot of talent on the OL.

Let us just completely ignore that our QB not only doesn't see open receivers as do most QB's here and there, our QB actually stares at open receivers and decides not to throw the damn ball. Now, those are probably a handful of occasions but imagine what else is taking him longer than normal NFL QB to make some throws. Our QB is to blame for taking sacks more than anyone considering the talent on the OL is above average compared to most teams in the league.

It is even more funny to blame the WR's. The WR has no factor in Alex throwing the ball purposely to incomplete it in order to avoid the sack. Fact is, he looks and then throws or doesn't throw at all more often than not.

As I say to the AS butt kissers, I will say to the AS haters, there is blame to go around for all. If we can cut down each one of those mistakes by each group by 50% we can improve greatly on O. Of course having a QB that has a quick release, doesn't hang onto the ball to long and isn't afraid to pull the trigger is hard to come by in FA w/o losing an arm of leg. Though I wouldn't mind PM, we will lose an arm and a leg. Same token if we had a megatron, he would make Alex and the line and the coaches look better. However, they don't come by so easily
Originally posted by WildBill:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't get this blaming the OL. It seems as though if we don't have a probowler at every position, then that position is the reason why our offense isn't excelling, but completely dismiss the level of play of our QB in the last 7 years. NO TEAM has a high level OL at every spot. If there is are teams, then there are VERY few and one of them is NOT the Giants who acquire Baas and dealt with injuries at Center. We have a lot of talent on the OL.

Let us just completely ignore that our QB not only doesn't see open receivers as do most QB's here and there, our QB actually stares at open receivers and decides not to throw the damn ball. Now, those are probably a handful of occasions but imagine what else is taking him longer than normal NFL QB to make some throws. Our QB is to blame for taking sacks more than anyone considering the talent on the OL is above average compared to most teams in the league.

It is even more funny to blame the WR's. The WR has no factor in Alex throwing the ball purposely to incomplete it in order to avoid the sack. Fact is, he looks and then throws or doesn't throw at all more often than not.

As I say to the AS butt kissers, I will say to the AS haters, there is blame to go around for all. If we can cut down each one of those mistakes by each group by 50% we can improve greatly on O. Of course having a QB that has a quick release, doesn't hang onto the ball to long and isn't afraid to pull the trigger is hard to come by in FA w/o losing an arm of leg. Though I wouldn't mind PM, we will lose an arm and a leg. Same token if we had a megatron, he would make Alex and the line and the coaches look better. However, they don't come by so easily

Indeed.
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't get this blaming the OL. It seems as though if we don't have a probowler at every position, then that position is the reason why our offense isn't excelling, but completely dismiss the level of play of our QB in the last 7 years. NO TEAM has a high level OL at every spot. If there is are teams, then there are VERY few and one of them is NOT the Giants who acquire Baas and dealt with injuries at Center. We have a lot of talent on the OL.

Let us just completely ignore that our QB not only doesn't see open receivers as do most QB's here and there, our QB actually stares at open receivers and decides not to throw the damn ball. Now, those are probably a handful of occasions but imagine what else is taking him longer than normal NFL QB to make some throws. Our QB is to blame for taking sacks more than anyone considering the talent on the OL is above average compared to most teams in the league.

It is even more funny to blame the WR's. The WR has no factor in Alex throwing the ball purposely to incomplete it in order to avoid the sack. Fact is, he looks and then throws or doesn't throw at all more often than not.


This makes zero sense.

This is just another example of blaming Alex instead of looking at a crucial problem with our team. Can we try and make critical judgments about the Oline without turning it into another Alex problem. We get that you don't like Alex but this is a team sport.

We've all stated our thoughts on Alex. How about you take a critical look at the oline. You actually trying to make the argument that our oline is solid against the blitz. If so, you have no credability IMO.

I for one think they got better as the season went on but still need major improvement. Too many missed assignments on blitz pickups. I expect they will be a solid unit this year with more time in the WCO and with an offseason.

I also think, Kilgore is gonna push for playing time at RG.
Originally posted by rk1642:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't get this blaming the OL. It seems as though if we don't have a probowler at every position, then that position is the reason why our offense isn't excelling, but completely dismiss the level of play of our QB in the last 7 years. NO TEAM has a high level OL at every spot. If there is are teams, then there are VERY few and one of them is NOT the Giants who acquire Baas and dealt with injuries at Center. We have a lot of talent on the OL.

Let us just completely ignore that our QB not only doesn't see open receivers as do most QB's here and there, our QB actually stares at open receivers and decides not to throw the damn ball. Now, those are probably a handful of occasions but imagine what else is taking him longer than normal NFL QB to make some throws. Our QB is to blame for taking sacks more than anyone considering the talent on the OL is above average compared to most teams in the league.

It is even more funny to blame the WR's. The WR has no factor in Alex throwing the ball purposely to incomplete it in order to avoid the sack. Fact is, he looks and then throws or doesn't throw at all more often than not.


This makes zero sense.

This is just another example of blaming Alex instead of looking at a crucial problem with our team. Can we try and make critical judgments about the Oline without turning it into another Alex problem. We get that you don't like Alex but this is a team sport.

We've all stated our thoughts on Alex. How about you take a critical look at the oline. You actually trying to make the argument that our oline is solid against the blitz. If so, you have no credability IMO.

I for one think they got better as the season went on but still need major improvement. Too many missed assignments on blitz pickups. I expect they will be a solid unit this year with more time in the WCO and with an offseason.

I also think, Kilgore is gonna push for playing time at RG.

No OL is great against a blitz because a blitz by definition is sending more than can be blocked be it a flood on one side or overall numbers. I am not even talking about blitzing. Alex takes more sacks in general even when there isn't a blitz and that is primarily because he doesn't pull the trigger or doesnt see a second read quick enough. It has been a pattern for a while now.
Originally posted by Joecool:
OL has improved since 2005. Give you a good guess to what hasnt.

Lol troll post is trolling
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
OL has improved since 2005. Give you a good guess to what hasnt.

Lol troll post is trolling

Inciting? So does this mean I am allowed to retaliate and get his thread completely off topic. God job inc....no, I won't go there.

Point is that everything else can be blamed for so long to the point where we need to blame the key cog for once. I will take into account that maybe JH did cut off half the field for Alex since it was his first year in he system but most veterans don't need this baby treatment so I will also assume Alex doesn't either.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
OL has improved since 2005. Give you a good guess to what hasnt.

Lol troll post is trolling

Inciting? So does this mean I am allowed to retaliate and get his thread completely off topic. God job inc....no, I won't go there.

Point is that everything else can be blamed for so long to the point where we need to blame the key cog for once. I will take into account that maybe JH did cut off half the field for Alex since it was his first year in he system but most veterans don't need this baby treatment so I will also assume Alex doesn't either.

Did you watch any games this year?
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
OL has improved since 2005. Give you a good guess to what hasnt.

Lol troll post is trolling

Inciting? So does this mean I am allowed to retaliate and get his thread completely off topic. God job inc....no, I won't go there.

Point is that everything else can be blamed for so long to the point where we need to blame the key cog for once. I will take into account that maybe JH did cut off half the field for Alex since it was his first year in he system but most veterans don't need this baby treatment so I will also assume Alex doesn't either.

Did you watch any games this year?

Yes and there see some when JH said Alex was responsible for sacks.
We're getting pretty much the same oline this year as we did last year. If anyone thinks that a full training camp and another season won't improve this oline is just dumb. I'm sorry if people were insulted but it's the truth. We only had a few weeks to implement the offense and blocking schemes. We did significantly better blocking the playoffs comparatively to the first half of the regular season.

The only change I can see is RG, which I honestly see Snyder coming back. If he doesn't come back in a starter capacity, he will be the first backup to the G and C positions.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
OL has improved since 2005. Give you a good guess to what hasnt.

Lol troll post is trolling

Inciting? So does this mean I am allowed to retaliate and get his thread completely off topic. God job inc....no, I won't go there.

Point is that everything else can be blamed for so long to the point where we need to blame the key cog for once. I will take into account that maybe JH did cut off half the field for Alex since it was his first year in he system but most veterans don't need this baby treatment so I will also assume Alex doesn't either.

Did you watch any games this year?

Yes and there see some when JH said Alex was responsible for sacks.

Yes and I would definetly agree with that! All 44, no. Half, no. Maybe a 4th are solely on him. But O-line, receivers, play calling, etc are definetly at fault for A LOT of the sacks.

Also there were times where Alex escaped pressure in which I don't think many other QBs would have had the brains/physical ability to avoid such things.
  • mike
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Originally posted by Youngb:
We're getting pretty much the same oline this year as we did last year. If anyone thinks that a full training camp and another season won't improve this oline is just dumb. I'm sorry if people were insulted but it's the truth. We only had a few weeks to implement the offense and blocking schemes. We did significantly better blocking the playoffs comparatively to the first half of the regular season.

The only change I can see is RG, which I honestly see Snyder coming back. If he doesn't come back in a starter capacity, he will be the first backup to the G and C positions.
Agreed, and it's fair to say Alex improves with a full offseason and better/healthy receivers as well. The offensive line is very much about chemistry between players, and so is the WR/QB connection. With such a short offseason it's easy to see why we struggled so badly at times. I remember Iupati and Staley, who had decent chemistry in iupati's first season, really struggled at the beginning of the year. Snyder and Davis were only together like half of the season so they could get better.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
Originally posted by Joecool:
OL has improved since 2005. Give you a good guess to what hasnt.

Lol troll post is trolling

Inciting? So does this mean I am allowed to retaliate and get his thread completely off topic. God job inc....no, I won't go there.

Point is that everything else can be blamed for so long to the point where we need to blame the key cog for once. I will take into account that maybe JH did cut off half the field for Alex since it was his first year in he system but most veterans don't need this baby treatment so I will also assume Alex doesn't either.

Did you watch any games this year?

Yes and there see some when JH said Alex was responsible for sacks.

all qbs are responsible for some sacks....there was also talk during the season that on some plays harbaugh would rather his qb take a sack than risk an interception