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Keep the points or take the first down?

At the time I didnt have a problem with the call, but looking since we lost I would get the first down now.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by SunDevilNiner79:
It was clearly the wrong decision.

If you ever have a chance to get a 1st down near the red zone, you always take it. It was a joke that he declined the penalty. Romo may be turnover prone, but the guy can move the ball pretty well and I had no doubt he was going to move the ball.

You guys supporting the decision, you really thought our D was going to hold up at the end of the game? What team have you been watching the past couple of years?

Our secondary is our biggest weakness and we make it a tradition to fold against good passing QBs.

I just don't understand it. Let me be on the 37 yard line and the Opposing coach comes up to me and says this:

"Hey, I will give you 3 points right now or you can have the ball at the 22 and a first down."

No coach in their right mind would take the points.

Agree 100%.

Bascially, our HC had to think "if we get it on the 22nd, I'm very sure that we will turn it over or lose over 10+ yards in 3 downs"

If he was that worried, just do 3 run plays and see if Frank can do anything and would at least have a chance at the TD or get an easy FG with no or little wind going on.

It was the biggest vote of no-confidence a coach could ever give to an offense.
I really didn't have a problem with the call, but I definitely wanted to go for the TD.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Otter:
Tell that to BYU - The moment the penalty came down Saturday my mind was transported to a beautiful autumn day on the Palouse in 1974, when Joe Danelo kicked a late field goal to put the Cougars ahead of Stanford 21-20. The Card committed a penalty on the play, so head coach Jim Sweeney opted to take Danelo’s chip-shot trey off the scoreboard and go for the touchdown.
The specifics are blury now, 31 years later, but I think it was a fumble that ended the Cougs’ quest for the additional four points that day. The result was disastrous. The Cougars lost 20-18 – putting an exclamation point on a season in which they could never catch a break, losing five games that they had every right of winning.

Or statistical modeling that shows after 50 minutes of play it gives you a better than 80% chance of winning.



You don't take points off the board, if you are looking at another field goal attempt over 40 yards, if you fail to gain another yard.

Otter, how old do those stats go to? If those stats range from the last 30 years, then they are skewed as even 20 years ago, it was difficult to come back from 2 scores in the 4th quarter unless you had a great QB.

I would like to see the stats for the last 10 years on this because it seems as though teams are always coming back from 2 scores even with 4 minutes remaining. Even SEA, last week was coming back and got within 2 points but we got "lucky" with a ST touchdown.

Throw those stats out of the window. They are so obviously inapplicable to the situation.

Show me stats of where a coach takes 3 pts off the board to get the ball two yards from the red zone and a 1st down. That was the situation.

We had a chance for a kill shot, and we gave it up and played not-to-lose which almost always means you will lose if you are facing a good passing attack and have a weak secondary.
[ Edited by SunDevilNiner79 on Sep 19, 2011 at 11:52 AM ]
I still think it was the right move.
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Looking at it, there was 11 minutes still in the game. Taking 2 minutes off the clock would not have been that big of an issue. I think I would have taken the points.
Right move if there is less than 4 minutes left on the clock. But not with 10 minutes to go when you have a piss poor defense and you're going up against a competent offense.
Originally posted by nickbradley:
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
ya basically a lot of things needed to go wrong to make harbaugh look stupid for that decision..... and they did.

You know what would have made him look stupid? Accepting the penalty, running twice for 4 or 5 yards, seeing Alex get sacked (again), and missing a 44-yarder.

So youre happy that the HC played Singball and lost. We were up 10 points not 14 on a team that was tearing us up in the 2nd half. Not taking another series to eat up clock was pure Sing. JH played not to lose and lost playing soft and vanilla. If he takes that penalty the Cowboys have no time to drive for that FG. It would also show that the guy has some damn faith in his offense. Smith was throwing accurate passes and instead of dialing in to Smiths passing. He sticks with running vs a stacked box. JH is gonna flame out quicker than Obama if he keeps this soft ass vanilla approach.
imo take the first and milk the clock.
Keep the points. Penalty would have helped had he missed the FG
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Originally posted by jimmy49erfan:
Originally posted by nickbradley:
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
ya basically a lot of things needed to go wrong to make harbaugh look stupid for that decision..... and they did.

You know what would have made him look stupid? Accepting the penalty, running twice for 4 or 5 yards, seeing Alex get sacked (again), and missing a 44-yarder.

So youre happy that the HC played Singball and lost. We were up 10 points not 14 on a team that was tearing us up in the 2nd half. Not taking another series to eat up clock was pure Sing. JH played not to lose and lost playing soft and vanilla. If he takes that penalty the Cowboys have no time to drive for that FG. It would also show that the guy has some damn faith in his offense. Smith was throwing accurate passes and instead of dialing in to Smiths passing. He sticks with running vs a stacked box. JH is gonna flame out quicker than Obama if he keeps this soft ass vanilla approach.

Gotta agree with jimmy here. When you play a conservative approach, you don't leave time on the board like that, especially if your in their side of the 50 yard line.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Their offense had 300 yards passing against us at that time and already tied the game once down by 2 scores. As for the bold, it would have been a 37 yard FG if we run the ball three straight times for no gain.

Ball would have been on the 25. 25 + 17 = 42.
Originally posted by Otter:
Tell that to BYU - The moment the penalty came down Saturday my mind was transported to a beautiful autumn day on the Palouse in 1974, when Joe Danelo kicked a late field goal to put the Cougars ahead of Stanford 21-20. The Card committed a penalty on the play, so head coach Jim Sweeney opted to take Danelo’s chip-shot trey off the scoreboard and go for the touchdown.
The specifics are blury now, 31 years later, but I think it was a fumble that ended the Cougs’ quest for the additional four points that day. The result was disastrous. The Cougars lost 20-18 – putting an exclamation point on a season in which they could never catch a break, losing five games that they had every right of winning.

Or statistical modeling that shows after 50 minutes of play it gives you a better than 80% chance of winning.



You don't take points off the board, if you are looking at another field goal attempt over 40 yards, if you fail to gain another yard.

+++
Agreed. I see a lot of posts saying how our defense and secondary were getting "raped" by the Dallas offense. Well, no. Take a look at the game flow up to that point in the second half:

2nd Half
49ers 1st Possession: 3-and-out (-4 Total Yards)
Cowboys 1st Possession: Kitna INTERCEPTED in endzone
49ers 2nd Possession: A. Smith INTERCEPTION
Cowboys 2nd Possession: Kitna TD-Pass to M. Austin (Quick Strike off of A. Smith INT)
49ers 3rd Possession: 3-and-out (4 Total Yards)
Cowboys 3rd Possession: Kitna INTERCEPTED
49ers 4th Possession: A. Smith TD-Pass to D. Walker (Quick Strike off of Kitna INT)
Cowboys 4th Possession: (Romo In) 3-and-out (-2 Total Yards)
49ers 5th Possession: 55-Yard Akers Field Goal (After gaining only 14 yards)

I see the point by those saying that we should have / could have simply ran the ball down the Cowboys' defense throats to milk the clock and for the possibility of making it a two-TD game. Still, up to THAT POINT in the game in the 2nd half, WE HAD NOT GAINED A SINGLE FIRST DOWN. Smith had been sacked twice and thrown an INT over 5 total possessions. Of the Cowboys 4 possessions, we had intercepted their QB TWICE and, even though Romo was back in the game, we held him to a 3-and-out on his first series. There was no reason to believe that we would advance the ball beyond another first down, nor blow a two-score game. Also, for those saying that it showed a lack of confidence in the offense, yes, but do you guys remember the elation at Akers hitting that record-setting FG??? My first thought was "Keep it!!!", although I did think, "Geez, we could milk another two minutes off the clock if we take the penalty." Still, from a motivational / inspirational perspective, spirits were high and, bottom line, the defense blew it down the stretch. Romo / Austin / Witten turned in heroic-epic performances, although our weak-ass secondary certainly made them look a LOT better than it actually was.

Shanghai'D
[ Edited by Shanghai69er on Sep 19, 2011 at 12:13 PM ]
I agree. I thought it was the correct decision given the current state of the offense.