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49ers 30 million under cap

Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Umm, not all of us agreed we needed an overhaul. Sure, there were/are areas to improve - like better coaching and QB play, a better pass rush, a decent CB - but it looks and feels like we've taken a step backwards and started another rebuilding process. We were 1-game out of a playoff spot last year. Feels like we're 6 games out and the season hasn't even started.

And now we have a better coach. One that actually knows offense. Yet most here don't trust his judgement when it comes to his players. I've yet to hear a solid explanation of how we regressed. The players we jettisoned were nothing special, as evidenced by the lack of attention they've received as free agents.

Here's an explanation of how we regressed so far:

Bass > Snyder
Spikes > Bowman
Franklin > Soap
Clements > Brown
Lawson = Smith
Goldson = Williams
Nedney = Akers

Of course, there's still a lot of FA to go.

[ Edited by cwilson830 on Aug 2, 2011 at 09:47:33 ]
Originally posted by Otter:
Originally posted by NeeJ49er:
Originally posted by mcbaes72:
Originally posted by NeeJ49er:
This better not be a Dennis Erickson type of season, at least during that season we knew we didnt have the cap space to bring in any help ...but choosing to lose with a gang of cash at the teams disposal will not win over any fans

I think it's pretty safe to say that Harbaugh will be a better HC than Erickson ever was. Same as Baalke will be better than Donahue...but that's not saying much because 99% of the WZ members could've been better GMs than him (i.e. see Wilfork and R. Woods).

As for the $$$$ issue, I'd have to agree with you there.


Thank you , I am getting frustrated with the lack of production from our F.O, we should at least be shelling out some 1 year contracts to veterans to strengthen the D-Line and secondary if the big plan is to build through the draft, we cant be relying on unproven players for depth and hoping they pan out for us...we need solid players to compete, but it appears the F.O believes we will get better by subtraction

So we should just throw money at anyone because you don't want them to appear cheap? Or should we try and find the right players?

Most vets don't want 1 year contracts, they want stability just like everyone else. And there appears to be indications that Franklin will sign with us, so with him and Ray Mac resigning our D-Line seems to be set.

Fine as that may sound this is the same front 7 (with the exception of the Rookie Aldon Smith replacing Lawson) that failed to generate any consistent QB pressure and exposed an extremely under talented secondary (24th in the league vs the pass). Now we have less in the secondary than last year so if we still fail to generate QB pressure (with virtually the same personnel as last year) it will be an UGLY season.
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Venting about something... anything... is a stress reliever for all the frustrations and failings in life?


... just a theory.

True. Been saying this for a long time on NT. It's very amusing sometimes however, there are times when I get tired of seeing people's man-ginas bleed through my computer screen.

Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

This team doesn't need an overhaul. It needs few simple upgrades over last year and we're in the playoffs.

But what everyone is ignoring is there are not many clear upgrades to be had in free agency. Asomugha and J. Joseph are the only ones that come to mind. Beyond them, nobody is really better than what we already have. Which leaves us with trading for players, but that's a risky proposition as well that could hurt us down the road.

Even if that is true (and many ppl here will argue that there are a lot of easy upgrades), just maintaining the status quo would have given us a great shot at the playoffs.

My point is we didn't lose much (if anything). The status quo for us is currently a sub .500 team. So again, nobody we lost is irreplaceable.

Your'e right, no one lost is irreplaceable. So how about we replace them?
Originally posted by ObePwnD:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Venting about something... anything... is a stress reliever for all the frustrations and failings in life?


... just a theory.

True. Been saying this for a long time on NT. It's very amusing sometimes however, there are times when I get tired of seeing people's man-ginas bleed through my computer screen.


Right there with you. Painful, embarrassing, and amusing all wrapped into one.
  • Otter
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 22,936
Originally posted by Mookster:
Originally posted by Otter:
Originally posted by NeeJ49er:
Originally posted by mcbaes72:
Originally posted by NeeJ49er:
This better not be a Dennis Erickson type of season, at least during that season we knew we didnt have the cap space to bring in any help ...but choosing to lose with a gang of cash at the teams disposal will not win over any fans

I think it's pretty safe to say that Harbaugh will be a better HC than Erickson ever was. Same as Baalke will be better than Donahue...but that's not saying much because 99% of the WZ members could've been better GMs than him (i.e. see Wilfork and R. Woods).

As for the $$$$ issue, I'd have to agree with you there.


Thank you , I am getting frustrated with the lack of production from our F.O, we should at least be shelling out some 1 year contracts to veterans to strengthen the D-Line and secondary if the big plan is to build through the draft, we cant be relying on unproven players for depth and hoping they pan out for us...we need solid players to compete, but it appears the F.O believes we will get better by subtraction

So we should just throw money at anyone because you don't want them to appear cheap? Or should we try and find the right players?

Most vets don't want 1 year contracts, they want stability just like everyone else. And there appears to be indications that Franklin will sign with us, so with him and Ray Mac resigning our D-Line seems to be set.

Fine as that may sound this is the same front 7 (with the exception of the Rookie Aldon Smith replacing Lawson) that failed to generate any consistent QB pressure and exposed an extremely under talented secondary (24th in the league vs the pass). Now we have less in the secondary than last year so if we still fail to generate QB pressure (with virtually the same personnel as last year) it will be an UGLY season.

Which is why I find it amusing that people are upset that any of these guys are not retained. If they couldn't do anything, why the outrage that we hope to replace them.
Originally posted by valrod33:
Niners $30 million below cap ... but not really

The 49ers are a little less than $30 million below the salary cap, according to information from the NFL Players Association. However, that cap number - about $91 million - takes into account recently released players like Nate Clements but not new contracts to free agents like Alex Smith, Ray McDonald and David Akers.

Those contracts will go into effect Thursday with the start of the new league year. The 49ers still promise to be well below the cap limit on Thursday, but the discrepancy between the listed and actual cap numbers are partly the reason for a lull in free agency.

Some of the teams around the league are scrambling this week to restructure contracts so that they are under the cap by Thursday. Agents, meanwhile, are hesitant to commit to deals until they see what actual market looks like. Adding to that landscape is the fact that newly-signed free agents can't practice with their teams until Thursday at the earliest anyway. That is, there is no real impetus to complete deals until later in the week.

A number of 49ers free agents are finding the market softer than anticipated. There was a flurry of activity and big signings early in free agency. But due to the 2010 free-agency rules that required players to have six years of service instead of the normal four before becoming unrestricted free agents, there is a glut of free agents this year. That, combined with the return of a salary cap, has weakened the market.

Three of the 49ers' own free agents, Manny Lawson, Dashon Goldson and Aubrayo Franklin, all expected to be hot commodities this season. Lawson only was able to get a one-year deal in Cincinnati. Goldson and Franklin are still available, and both of them could return to the 49ers.

Read more: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2011/08/niners-30-million-below-cap-but-not-really.html#ixzz1TtEgameg
reading through some of these threads makes me wish the lockout was still going on.
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Umm, not all of us agreed we needed an overhaul. Sure, there were/are areas to improve - like better coaching and QB play, a better pass rush, a decent CB - but it looks and feels like we've taken a step backwards and started another rebuilding process. We were 1-game out of a playoff spot last year. Feels like we're 6 games out and the season hasn't even started.

And now we have a better coach. One that actually knows offense. Yet most here don't trust his judgement when it comes to his players. I've yet to hear a solid explanation of how we regressed. The players we jettisoned were nothing special, as evidenced by the lack of attention they've received as free agents.

Here's an explanation of how we regressed so far:

Bass > Snyder
Spikes > Bowman
Franklin > Soap
Clements > Brown
Goldson = Williams
Nedney = Akers

Of course, there's still a lot of FA to go.

Baas wasn't worth top five CENTER money, especially considering he hasn't played the position a full season yet. I agree with the decision to let him go. Spikes is better than Bowman, but I suspect the move was made for reasons of his age. No point in giving him long term contract. Also, ILB's aren't all that difficult to replace (especially when they're playing next to the best linebacker in the league).

Franklin may return, so I'll reserve judgement until I see what happens with him. Still, it was his own decision to test the market (and he's now seeing that there isn't much of one for him). That isn't the FO's fault. Clements, I wished we would have kept, but since he didn't want to restructure it had to be done.

Again, another player that overestimated his worth.

I'm sorry, but Goldson is terrible. Neither him or Williams are anything to write home about. However, Williams likely won't be starting, which is probably a good thing.

Nedney failed his physical. Nothing we could do there.
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Umm, not all of us agreed we needed an overhaul. Sure, there were/are areas to improve - like better coaching and QB play, a better pass rush, a decent CB - but it looks and feels like we've taken a step backwards and started another rebuilding process. We were 1-game out of a playoff spot last year. Feels like we're 6 games out and the season hasn't even started.

And now we have a better coach. One that actually knows offense. Yet most here don't trust his judgement when it comes to his players. I've yet to hear a solid explanation of how we regressed. The players we jettisoned were nothing special, as evidenced by the lack of attention they've received as free agents.

Let me ask this - do you feel that Nate was our best CB last year? Do you feel that Dashon was our best FS? I'm not asking if you think they are worth what they are asking for, just if you think they were the best at their positions last year?

The reason I ask is this. If you think they are the best and they are no longer on the team, and there aren't suitable options on the roster to replace them, then I consider us regressed.

Again, I'm not saying Nate or Dashon were fantastic last year. But - as of right now - we don't have a suitable replacement at CB, which has been my biggest issue with the front office.
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by cwilson830:
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Umm, not all of us agreed we needed an overhaul. Sure, there were/are areas to improve - like better coaching and QB play, a better pass rush, a decent CB - but it looks and feels like we've taken a step backwards and started another rebuilding process. We were 1-game out of a playoff spot last year. Feels like we're 6 games out and the season hasn't even started.

And now we have a better coach. One that actually knows offense. Yet most here don't trust his judgement when it comes to his players. I've yet to hear a solid explanation of how we regressed. The players we jettisoned were nothing special, as evidenced by the lack of attention they've received as free agents.

Here's an explanation of how we regressed so far:

Bass > Snyder
Spikes > Bowman
Franklin > Soap
Clements > Brown
Goldson = Williams
Nedney = Akers

Of course, there's still a lot of FA to go.

Baas wasn't worth top five CENTER money, especially considering he hasn't played the position a full season yet. I agree with the decision to let him go. Spikes is better than Bowman, but I suspect the move was made for reasons of his age. No point in giving him long term contract. Also, ILB's aren't all that difficult to replace (especially when they're playing next to the best linebacker in the league).

Franklin may return, so I'll reserve judgement until I see what happens with him. Still, it was his own decision to test the market (and he's now seeing that there isn't much of one for him). That isn't the FO's fault. Clements, I wished we would have kept, but since he didn't want to restructure it had to be done.

Again, another player that overestimated his worth.

I'm sorry, but Goldson is terrible. Neither him or Williams are anything to write home about. However, Williams likely won't be starting, which is probably a good thing.

Nedney failed his physical. Nothing we could do there.

Most people don't have a problem with us letting any of those guys go under the circumstances. The problem is they haven't been replaced. Yet.
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Umm, not all of us agreed we needed an overhaul. Sure, there were/are areas to improve - like better coaching and QB play, a better pass rush, a decent CB - but it looks and feels like we've taken a step backwards and started another rebuilding process. We were 1-game out of a playoff spot last year. Feels like we're 6 games out and the season hasn't even started.

And now we have a better coach. One that actually knows offense. Yet most here don't trust his judgement when it comes to his players. I've yet to hear a solid explanation of how we regressed. The players we jettisoned were nothing special, as evidenced by the lack of attention they've received as free agents.

Let me ask this - do you feel that Nate was our best CB last year? Do you feel that Dashon was our best FS? I'm not asking if you think they are worth what they are asking for, just if you think they were the best at their positions last year?

The reason I ask is this. If you think they are the best and they are no longer on the team, and there aren't suitable options on the roster to replace them, then I consider us regressed.

Again, I'm not saying Nate or Dashon were fantastic last year. But - as of right now - we don't have a suitable replacement at CB, which has been my biggest issue with the front office.

Nate Clements was not the best CB last year, or he was horribly misused. Either way, there wasn't much difference between him and Spencer, aside from Clements pulling another Dre gon be Dre.

As for Dashon, we won't know until this season starts if he was the best FS on the team at the time. You realize only one FS plays on the field at a time. He earned his starting spot for his play the year before, not based on last year's play.
Originally posted by valrod33:
Originally posted by susweel:
So how much more do we have to spend to get to the minimum.

minimum doesnt go into effect until 2013


Then the York's are loving it.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy we weren't able to sign him for that salary, especially with the massive cap room.

P.S. The apologists for the owners and GM on this board are starting to make me ill. Some are stating, "nobody wants to come here". False: Arizona and Seattle are signing a ton of quality players that will upgrade their team. Umenyiora stated yesterday that he would like a move to Seattle. It is a lame-brain excuse.

Others are stating, "let's let the coach figure out who is good." Silly. Each team has tape and scouts. If you don't know who is good or not good, you should drive 16-wheel trucks instead.

It really comes down to a commitment to win. And, the team is showing this season... that they really aren't hungry to win.

Apologists should be sick to their stomachs that the franchise of Walsh, DeBartolo, Policy, Montana, Rice, and Lott is a bottom-barrell team, instead of defending management relentlessly as if they are related.

Still waiting for Jed to emerge to say that we will make the playoffs. He would be ridiculed from coast to coast.

We have become a "loser" franchise. Congrats, apologists. Now, back to supporting the great Trent Baalke and Jed York.

Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by baltien:
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.

Umm, not all of us agreed we needed an overhaul. Sure, there were/are areas to improve - like better coaching and QB play, a better pass rush, a decent CB - but it looks and feels like we've taken a step backwards and started another rebuilding process. We were 1-game out of a playoff spot last year. Feels like we're 6 games out and the season hasn't even started.

And now we have a better coach. One that actually knows offense. Yet most here don't trust his judgement when it comes to his players. I've yet to hear a solid explanation of how we regressed. The players we jettisoned were nothing special, as evidenced by the lack of attention they've received as free agents.

Let me ask this - do you feel that Nate was our best CB last year? Do you feel that Dashon was our best FS? I'm not asking if you think they are worth what they are asking for, just if you think they were the best at their positions last year?

The reason I ask is this. If you think they are the best and they are no longer on the team, and there aren't suitable options on the roster to replace them, then I consider us regressed.

Again, I'm not saying Nate or Dashon were fantastic last year. But - as of right now - we don't have a suitable replacement at CB, which has been my biggest issue with the front office.

Nate Clements was not the best CB last year, or he was horribly misused. Either way, there wasn't much difference between him and Spencer, aside from Clements pulling another Dre gon be Dre.

As for Dashon, we won't know until this season starts if he was the best FS on the team at the time. You realize only one FS plays on the field at a time. He earned his starting spot for his play the year before, not based on last year's play.

I know Singletary and his staff were pretty slow, but even they wouldn't play a guy if they thought someone else on the staff was better. Why play Goldson at FS if you thought Smith, Mays, or Taylor were better? Why keep him in the starting lineup unless he was the best out of your options.

And Nate - god I hate trying to defend him - was the best CB in a bad group; nothing much to brag about. But I was answering the question on if we regressed. We do not have a replacement for him that is an upgrade, unless you're already counting Culliver - which I'm not. So to answer the question, that's regression to me, until the guys we have play better or we getter a better player.

[ Edited by olapac on Aug 2, 2011 at 10:16:20 ]