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49ers 30 million under cap

  • Amir
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 25,062
Originally posted by Lifer:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
I believe they have a plan. Sadly I think that plan is to tank this season, and rebuild next year.

Yup.

Because of the lockout, I'm ok with that. Especially if it nets us Luck.
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by mcbaes72:
Originally posted by drake49er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy they didn't offer that much to have him stay.

Matt Barrows @
He was not happy with the 49ers front office; did not want to return to SF ... @hudd07 Can you believe we lost Lawson over 1 year deal?

He didn't want to be here...can't force people to sign.

Oh that explains it, I thought he at least showed interest in staying. Looks like he couldn't wait to leave.

But who cares. According to Maddog, you have to make them stay.



Obviously, you can't make people stay, but this front office is showing an inability to massage relationships. They seem to take a very hardline confrontational stance with players they are negotiating with. Total sign of a rookie FO.

It's one thing to disagree, but a lot of our guys seem to be leaving upset.

He got a 1 yr, 3M dollar offer. Obviously, we were not the only team in the league that did not value him. So we should have re-signed him for the sake of signing him? If he was so good, he'd have multiple teams going after him and offering him multiple year contracts.

I really get frustrated with the "every other team" arguments. Every other team passed on Deason Jackson almost twice. Every other team let Joe Montana slip to the 3rd. Every other team let Tom Brady fall to the 6th round. And the list goes on and on. Every other team thought Banta Cain was garbage, but he was a double digit sack guy in NE. Who knows why teams do what they do. But the every other team argument is faulty at best. I could just as easily say this every thing this FO has done has resulted in losing the last eigh years, so they must be making mistakes right now? The track record is in my favor, not yours.

Montana, Jackson and Brady were all rookies. Teams only had college tapes on them to judge them by. These NFL FA's have been in the league. There is tons of gametape on them against NFL talent. Please don't compare "other teams" passing on rookies to actual NFL Vets.

Every other team passed on Steve Young. Every other team thought Cedric Benson was a bum. Every other team thought Warner was washed up after he left NY and signed with the Cards as a back up to Lienart. Is that better?

For every 3 "good" examples of FA's working out, there are hundreds that don't. I can play this game too and point out countless examples of FA's that didn't do too well with their new teams.

I agree. However, the point is you can't just say, "well the rest of the league didn't want him so he must suck." I watched him play every game and I can say for certain, Lawson does not suck.
Originally posted by Lifer:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
I believe they have a plan. Sadly I think that plan is to tank this season, and rebuild next year.

Yup.

Yep, and it is Harbaugh's idea. IMO he thinks he can coach up the players to mythical levels and wants to evaluate non starters who they did not have much game tape on during the lockout. Look at this year's draft starategy, they purposely went out and drafted athletes with gold star character to change to different positions. This is starting to look like an epic fail comparable to the last 3 regimes.
  • Amir
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 25,062
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by mcbaes72:
Originally posted by drake49er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy they didn't offer that much to have him stay.

Matt Barrows @
He was not happy with the 49ers front office; did not want to return to SF ... @hudd07 Can you believe we lost Lawson over 1 year deal?

He didn't want to be here...can't force people to sign.

Oh that explains it, I thought he at least showed interest in staying. Looks like he couldn't wait to leave.

But who cares. According to Maddog, you have to make them stay.



Obviously, you can't make people stay, but this front office is showing an inability to massage relationships. They seem to take a very hardline confrontational stance with players they are negotiating with. Total sign of a rookie FO.

It's one thing to disagree, but a lot of our guys seem to be leaving upset.

He got a 1 yr, 3M dollar offer. Obviously, we were not the only team in the league that did not value him. So we should have re-signed him for the sake of signing him? If he was so good, he'd have multiple teams going after him and offering him multiple year contracts.

I really get frustrated with the "every other team" arguments. Every other team passed on Deason Jackson almost twice. Every other team let Joe Montana slip to the 3rd. Every other team let Tom Brady fall to the 6th round. And the list goes on and on. Every other team thought Banta Cain was garbage, but he was a double digit sack guy in NE. Who knows why teams do what they do. But the every other team argument is faulty at best. I could just as easily say this every thing this FO has done has resulted in losing the last eigh years, so they must be making mistakes right now? The track record is in my favor, not yours.

Montana, Jackson and Brady were all rookies. Teams only had college tapes on them to judge them by. These NFL FA's have been in the league. There is tons of gametape on them against NFL talent. Please don't compare "other teams" passing on rookies to actual NFL Vets.

Every other team passed on Steve Young. Every other team thought Cedric Benson was a bum. Every other team thought Warner was washed up after he left NY and signed with the Cards as a back up to Lienart. Is that better?

For every 3 "good" examples of FA's working out, there are hundreds that don't. I can play this game too and point out countless examples of FA's that didn't do too well with their new teams.

I agree. However, the point is you can't just say, "well the rest of the league didn't want him so he must suck." I watched him play every game and I can say for certain, Lawson does not suck.

I never said he sucked. I simply stated that he's not as good as many think on here and I used "other teams" not interested in him to back that up. Teams have multiple people that watch and break down every FA. They know much more about his game than we do. The fact is, no other team was really interested in him and that does say a lot. Not saying he won't be good in Cincy or he sucks, but that he's not that big of a loss as many may think.

[ Edited by Amir on Aug 2, 2011 at 09:00:32 ]
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy we weren't able to sign him for that salary, especially with the massive cap room.

P.S. The apologists for the owners and GM on this board are starting to make me ill. Some are stating, "nobody wants to come here". False: Arizona and Seattle are signing a ton of quality players that will upgrade their team. Umenyiora stated yesterday that he would like a move to Seattle. It is a lame-brain excuse.

Others are stating, "let's let the coach figure out who is good." Silly. Each team has tape and scouts. If you don't know who is good or not good, you should drive 16-wheel trucks instead.

It really comes down to a commitment to win. And, the team is showing this season... that they really aren't hungry to win.

Apologists should be sick to their stomachs that the franchise of Walsh, DeBartolo, Policy, Montana, Rice, and Lott is a bottom-barrell team, instead of defending management relentlessly as if they are related.

Still waiting for Jed to emerge to say that we will make the playoffs. He would be ridiculed from coast to coast.

We have become a "loser" franchise. Congrats, apologists. Now, back to supporting the great Trent Baalke and Jed York.

Right on. I voted with my feet -- gave up season tickets after 25 years.
Originally posted by VA49er:
Does anyone think that our lack of spending has anything to do with our new stadium? I mean $30 million goes a long way towards that. http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2011/06/08/price-tag-for-49ers-stadium-in-santa-clara-going-up/ The money isn't exactly flowing, naming rights aren't materializing, and even with NFL help $1Billion is a lot of scratch. I'm not trying to post conspiracies but it just seems odd that we let Clements go and didn't bring in a corner at least and that we aren't willing to strike a deal with Gore or Franklin with all this cap space. It seems that there is an opportunity for teams to save money in 11 and 12 that won't be there in 13 when the mandatory spending kicks in. What are we saving for?

Yorks could have built a stadium for a lot less 10 years ago, if they weren't so into doing it with OPM (Other Peoples' Money). They are not going to sell a lot of PSL's with a crappy team. Yorks are clueless.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy they didn't offer that much to have him stay.

Dude, you even said yourself that Manny is not suited for a 3-4. So why do you now all of a sudden want him to stay?

I never said that. I said he is best utilized in a 4-3 defense. He is still better than Haralson, Brooks, Applewhite, and Briggs. He just isn't a star in the 3-4.

However, at $3 million, he is a bargain.

The Niners obviously made it clear that he wasn't in their plans. So, was he supposed to crawl back to the great one, Trent Baalke, and beg for a contract, as some would say?

Well we don't know if we did offer him that much money. Maybe he just wanted out. Can't blame Baalke yet without knowing all the facts.

Yes, you can. You make people want to stay.

Andrew Luck. Even heard on ESPN radio today that's reason Harbaugh is no hurry to win. Sounds silly but it's actually being called Harbaugh's plan due to our lack of spending
Originally posted by LottOfDefense:
Originally posted by Lifer:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
I believe they have a plan. Sadly I think that plan is to tank this season, and rebuild next year.

Yup.

Yep, and it is Harbaugh's idea. IMO he thinks he can coach up the players to mythical levels and wants to evaluate non starters who they did not have much game tape on during the lockout. Look at this year's draft starategy, they purposely went out and drafted athletes with gold star character to change to different positions. This is starting to look like an epic fail comparable to the last 3 regimes.

Hard to believe. Harbaugh has too much NFL experience and should know you can't coach up average talent to win. I am reluctantly starting to believe that they are tanking this year to rebuild for later.
Originally posted by amir_tn80:
If they handed out a trophy for having the most cap space, the 49ers would be in middle of a dynasty right now.

We just got out of cap problems a few years ago, remember that? So we do not have a history of having tons of cap space or as you so brilliantly put it, Cap space dynasty.

Originally posted by ObePwnD:
Originally posted by amir_tn80:
If they handed out a trophy for having the most cap space, the 49ers would be in middle of a dynasty right now.

We just got out of cap problems a few years ago, remember that? So we do not have a history of having tons of cap space or as you so brilliantly put it, Cap space dynasty.


Maybe we can get $60 million under!
  • kush
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,648
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by drake49er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy they didn't offer that much to have him stay.

Matt Barrows @
He was not happy with the 49ers front office; did not want to return to SF ... @hudd07 Can you believe we lost Lawson over 1 year deal?

He didn't want to be here...can't force people to sign.

Why do you think he was not happy with the 49ers front office? He was treated like garbage this whole offseason.

Manny Lawson is garbage. He is mediocre in every aspect of the game outsideof pass coverage, which he would only be asked to do 10 pErcent of the time with us. Stupid niners must not want to give
average players Patrick Willis money...how insane!
Originally posted by Dirty9er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by Amir:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy they didn't offer that much to have him stay.

Dude, you even said yourself that Manny is not suited for a 3-4. So why do you now all of a sudden want him to stay?

I never said that. I said he is best utilized in a 4-3 defense. He is still better than Haralson, Brooks, Applewhite, and Briggs. He just isn't a star in the 3-4.

However, at $3 million, he is a bargain.

The Niners obviously made it clear that he wasn't in their plans. So, was he supposed to crawl back to the great one, Trent Baalke, and beg for a contract, as some would say?

Well we don't know if we did offer him that much money. Maybe he just wanted out. Can't blame Baalke yet without knowing all the facts.

Yes, you can. You make people want to stay.

Maddog, you are right on! It's amazing how people "NEED" rah rah as opposed to the truth! I am tired of this losing trend and I am tired of excuses and the supposed master plan! I am also tired of apologist - the kinds of people who take critical thinking as some sort of insult... I know I spit venom from time to time but it's out of love for what this team was. Thanks for always putting up good info...

Dirty

You've all but asked him on a date, LOL. I'm sure the ego stroking was greatly appreciated.
Originally posted by Dirty9er:
Originally posted by Otter:
Originally posted by NeeJ49er:
Originally posted by mcbaes72:
Originally posted by NeeJ49er:
This better not be a Dennis Erickson type of season, at least during that season we knew we didnt have the cap space to bring in any help ...but choosing to lose with a gang of cash at the teams disposal will not win over any fans

I think it's pretty safe to say that Harbaugh will be a better HC than Erickson ever was. Same as Baalke will be better than Donahue...but that's not saying much because 99% of the WZ members could've been better GMs than him (i.e. see Wilfork and R. Woods).

As for the $$$$ issue, I'd have to agree with you there.


Thank you , I am getting frustrated with the lack of production from our F.O, we should at least be shelling out some 1 year contracts to veterans to strengthen the D-Line and secondary if the big plan is to build through the draft, we cant be relying on unproven players for depth and hoping they pan out for us...we need solid players to compete, but it appears the F.O believes we will get better by subtraction

So we should just throw money at anyone because you don't want them to appear cheap? Or should we try and find the right players?

Most vets don't want 1 year contracts, they want stability just like everyone else. And there appears to be indications that Franklin will sign with us, so with him and Ray Mac resigning our D-Line seems to be set.

We still do not have a pass rush, our best CB is gone, our QB situation is as bad as it has been if not worse, we lack for any verteran presence and our OL is weak and in flux. I would never advocate "just throwing money around" but hoarding money while continuity just walks out of the door doesn't seem right either...

Dirty

This is what we need to address, and I sure the hell dont mean just sign ANYONE and throw money around, but proven players we know we will contribute, my frustration is growing because we are watching all the top free agent find homes while we sign players that are backups at best ...Applewhite and Williams ???? ...we might as well bring back Mike Adams and Tully Banta-Cain if this is the approach the F.O is taking
Originally posted by rapid4:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Be patient. They have a "plan"...to not spend any money.

Lawson was only $3 million. Crazy we weren't able to sign him for that salary, especially with the massive cap room.

P.S. The apologists for the owners and GM on this board are starting to make me ill. Some are stating, "nobody wants to come here". False: Arizona and Seattle are signing a ton of quality players that will upgrade their team. Umenyiora stated yesterday that he would like a move to Seattle. It is a lame-brain excuse.

Others are stating, "let's let the coach figure out who is good." Silly. Each team has tape and scouts. If you don't know who is good or not good, you should drive 16-wheel trucks instead.

It really comes down to a commitment to win. And, the team is showing this season... that they really aren't hungry to win.

Apologists should be sick to their stomachs that the franchise of Walsh, DeBartolo, Policy, Montana, Rice, and Lott is a bottom-barrell team, instead of defending management relentlessly as if they are related.

Still waiting for Jed to emerge to say that we will make the playoffs. He would be ridiculed from coast to coast.

We have become a "loser" franchise. Congrats, apologists. Now, back to supporting the great Trent Baalke and Jed York.

Right on. I voted with my feet -- gave up season tickets after 25 years.

I gave mine up as soon as the Yorks thought they could sell a crappy product and put lipstick on a Pig. Nice post and if we keep this support the team no matter what BS, Lucky Sperm can keep selling this crap.
Funny how when last season ended we all agreed that this team needed an overhaul. And now that we're finally getting it, everyone is complaining that we're not signing a bunch of mediocre free agents to replace the mediocre players we just cut.

I seriously do not get you guys.
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