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Tackle Play - Offensive Line

Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.

Damn Joe, you know better than that dumb s**t. When a QB leads the league in hurries, you look no further than the oline. That was just ignorant to try and blame that on the QB.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.

sometimes you can blame the qb but not in this case in many of the plays its not like alex is just sitting there staring into space he usually has less than 3 seconds before he is forced to move out of the pocket
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

Didn't you get the memo? Gore doesn't like to run out of the shotgun because he doesn't get his lead blocker. And because Sing has the single biggest man crush known to the human species on Gore, if the game plan doesn't involve Gore, we wont run it. Even if that means total offensive failure. In Sings life there is God/Gore then family. In fact, it might be Gore, God then family...

[ Edited by Oakland-Niner on Oct 18, 2010 at 12:36:28 ]
Yesterday was one of the worst I've seen Staley have...two key holding penalties I saw. 2nd one brought back Dixon's excellent TD run, but fortunately Alex and Vernon hooked up anyway. I'm willing to give both Iupati and AD their entire rookie seasons to get it together. Even that's asking a lot...most OL drafted don't blossom 'til their 3rd year or so. I think some of you are expecting too much, too soon. Solari's an excellent coach, but neither he nor Ray Brown are miracle workers. I did see Rachal throw a couple of nice blocks, including on Gore's 64 yd scamper. I still think Snyder's better at the position, though.
I seriously think running more off tackle will solve this problem. We did that more in the second half and the pressure from the outside decreased.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.
That is not the way the league measures a hurry. The league assumes a certain amount of time as judged by a league observer that reviews each play of the game. I don't know the specifics but I have heard the job of the league statistician described for such things. If the QB holds the ball for longer than would normally be considered enough time to throw the ball, then it is not a "hurry."

Also to be considered is the role of the TE and WRs. In the case of VD, he is often held in to to block initially and then go out. In that case, if there is quick pressure, Davis is not yet into the pattern. That is an issue with play design, not QB efficiency.

Also, regarding Davis, he is well known for not being particularly adept at reading defenses and making the correct hot reads. Last week Collinsworth pointed this out on one play where Smith was under pressure and had raised the ball while looking at Davis for a quick release but VD had turned to look. On that play, Smith was "hurried" and had to roll out and threw the ball away. That is a "hurry" on Davis.

Finally, opponents have found SF wide outs to be easy to control with man press coverage. The 49er receivers have not learned how to beat the coverage quickly in rhythm with the play and "hurries" result.

So, no, it isn't just an OL issue but it isn't just the OL and the QB. It is, like all of football, a team issue.
Originally posted by Joecool:
I seriously think running more off tackle will solve this problem. We did that more in the second half and the pressure from the outside decreased.

Being predictable and unimaginative has a lot to do with why our team is 1-5 right now, Smith isn't playing well, and the O-line is looking worse with each passing game. Singletary is a complete idiot and needs to be fired. It is a joke that this hasn't been done already.
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.
That is not the way the league measures a hurry. The league assumes a certain amount of time as judged by a league observer that reviews each play of the game. I don't know the specifics but I have heard the job of the league statistician described for such things. If the QB holds the ball for longer than would normally be considered enough time to throw the ball, then it is not a "hurry."

Also to be considered is the role of the TE and WRs. In the case of VD, he is often held in to to block initially and then go out. In that case, if there is quick pressure, Davis is not yet into the pattern. That is an issue with play design, not QB efficiency.

Also, regarding Davis, he is well known for not being particularly adept at reading defenses and making the correct hot reads. Last week Collinsworth pointed this out on one play where Smith was under pressure and had raised the ball while looking at Davis for a quick release but VD had turned to look. On that play, Smith was "hurried" and had to roll out and threw the ball away. That is a "hurry" on Davis.

Finally, opponents have found SF wide outs to be easy to control with man press coverage. The 49er receivers have not learned how to beat the coverage quickly in rhythm with the play and "hurries" result.

So, no, it isn't just an OL issue but it isn't just the OL and the QB. It is, like all of football, a team issue.

The bold is extremely subjective as Collinsworth also pointed out quite a few open receivers.

I understand hurries are dependent on time allowed for QB to throw first but QB around the league are hurried less than Alex but still make more plays than Alex. It seems like he expect the blocking to be textbook and doesn't prepare for the pocket to collapse. Other QBs (the better ones) move right away when they sense this and make a play. Alex still needs to work on his use of the pocket and ability to sense the pressure.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.
That is not the way the league measures a hurry. The league assumes a certain amount of time as judged by a league observer that reviews each play of the game. I don't know the specifics but I have heard the job of the league statistician described for such things. If the QB holds the ball for longer than would normally be considered enough time to throw the ball, then it is not a "hurry."

Also to be considered is the role of the TE and WRs. In the case of VD, he is often held in to to block initially and then go out. In that case, if there is quick pressure, Davis is not yet into the pattern. That is an issue with play design, not QB efficiency.

Also, regarding Davis, he is well known for not being particularly adept at reading defenses and making the correct hot reads. Last week Collinsworth pointed this out on one play where Smith was under pressure and had raised the ball while looking at Davis for a quick release but VD had turned to look. On that play, Smith was "hurried" and had to roll out and threw the ball away. That is a "hurry" on Davis.

Finally, opponents have found SF wide outs to be easy to control with man press coverage. The 49er receivers have not learned how to beat the coverage quickly in rhythm with the play and "hurries" result.

So, no, it isn't just an OL issue but it isn't just the OL and the QB. It is, like all of football, a team issue.

The bold is extremely subjective as Collinsworth also pointed out quite a few open receivers.

I understand hurries are dependent on time allowed for QB to throw first but QB around the league are hurried less than Alex but still make more plays than Alex. It seems like he expect the blocking to be textbook and doesn't prepare for the pocket to collapse. Other QBs (the better ones) move right away when they sense this and make a play. Alex still needs to work on his use of the pocket and ability to sense the pressure.

Alex Smith hardly knows the guys playing the positions they're at on the OL. I haven't seen a worse line yet this season than what Smith plays behind. Get real!
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.
That is not the way the league measures a hurry. The league assumes a certain amount of time as judged by a league observer that reviews each play of the game. I don't know the specifics but I have heard the job of the league statistician described for such things. If the QB holds the ball for longer than would normally be considered enough time to throw the ball, then it is not a "hurry."

Also to be considered is the role of the TE and WRs. In the case of VD, he is often held in to to block initially and then go out. In that case, if there is quick pressure, Davis is not yet into the pattern. That is an issue with play design, not QB efficiency.

Also, regarding Davis, he is well known for not being particularly adept at reading defenses and making the correct hot reads. Last week Collinsworth pointed this out on one play where Smith was under pressure and had raised the ball while looking at Davis for a quick release but VD had turned to look. On that play, Smith was "hurried" and had to roll out and threw the ball away. That is a "hurry" on Davis.

Finally, opponents have found SF wide outs to be easy to control with man press coverage. The 49er receivers have not learned how to beat the coverage quickly in rhythm with the play and "hurries" result.

So, no, it isn't just an OL issue but it isn't just the OL and the QB. It is, like all of football, a team issue.

The bold is extremely subjective as Collinsworth also pointed out quite a few open receivers.

I understand hurries are dependent on time allowed for QB to throw first but QB around the league are hurried less than Alex but still make more plays than Alex. It seems like he expect the blocking to be textbook and doesn't prepare for the pocket to collapse. Other QBs (the better ones) move right away when they sense this and make a play. Alex still needs to work on his use of the pocket and ability to sense the pressure.
The league observer takes all of your points into consideration in assigning a "hurry."
Our oline sucks


Rewatch the game and you'll see A.Smith running for his life every other play

No qb could survive that.
Originally posted by TonyStarks:
Our oline sucks


Rewatch the game and you'll see A.Smith running for his life every other play

No qb could survive that.

ALEX SMITH SURVIVED IT!
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.
That is not the way the league measures a hurry. The league assumes a certain amount of time as judged by a league observer that reviews each play of the game. I don't know the specifics but I have heard the job of the league statistician described for such things. If the QB holds the ball for longer than would normally be considered enough time to throw the ball, then it is not a "hurry."

Also to be considered is the role of the TE and WRs. In the case of VD, he is often held in to to block initially and then go out. In that case, if there is quick pressure, Davis is not yet into the pattern. That is an issue with play design, not QB efficiency.

Also, regarding Davis, he is well known for not being particularly adept at reading defenses and making the correct hot reads. Last week Collinsworth pointed this out on one play where Smith was under pressure and had raised the ball while looking at Davis for a quick release but VD had turned to look. On that play, Smith was "hurried" and had to roll out and threw the ball away. That is a "hurry" on Davis.

Finally, opponents have found SF wide outs to be easy to control with man press coverage. The 49er receivers have not learned how to beat the coverage quickly in rhythm with the play and "hurries" result.

So, no, it isn't just an OL issue but it isn't just the OL and the QB. It is, like all of football, a team issue.

The bold is extremely subjective as Collinsworth also pointed out quite a few open receivers.

I understand hurries are dependent on time allowed for QB to throw first but QB around the league are hurried less than Alex but still make more plays than Alex. It seems like he expect the blocking to be textbook and doesn't prepare for the pocket to collapse. Other QBs (the better ones) move right away when they sense this and make a play. Alex still needs to work on his use of the pocket and ability to sense the pressure.
The league observer takes all of your points into consideration in assigning a "hurry."

I'm not pointing out how it's measured. I'm pointing out the results the QB provides after a hurry. Alex does not do well when hurried if anything at all.
Why don't we run more split backs? Won't that help better with the Tackles?
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by binary2nd:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I look forward to watching more closely this week, but yes, our OL is not playing well. We all see this. I really thought Solari would be an upgrade to Foerster, but it's not happening. Really thought Alex was gonna get broken during this game.

Right now, I just don't have a solution for the OL. What did impress me was their ability to come out of their stance quickly in pass pro... but that's not helping them protect as it should. Sorry for this worthless, unhelpful post... just rambling.

Big smiles for our first W though.

There was an article earlier this week on how Smith passes under duress more then any QB in the game. Today? It must have been around 75% of the time!
The announcers last week said Smith led the league in "hurries." He had 40 going into that game. Just guessing, but I would say he added another 10 to that total yesterday. There was hardly a time where he had a well-formed pocket of protection. It is hard for Smith and the offense to develop a rhythm when the OL can't provide basic protection.

Teams practice pass plays to happen at a certain time, say a 2.5 15 yard curl route. However, if the OL only provides 2 seconds of protection, the play will fail. That happened too much yesterday.

So why not put Smith in the shotgun so he gets an extra .5 seconds to read the Defense, why not call some quick pass plays, or even some that utilize misdirection to keep the D honest?

When a QB leads the league in hurries or sacks, you can't just look at the OL. I think both are playing a role in this. Go back and look at the game because I noticed a lot of times when the pressure was confronted but was still coming yet Alex didn't seem to sense it until it was too late. These were plays where there were open pockets that he could have shifted to.
That is not the way the league measures a hurry. The league assumes a certain amount of time as judged by a league observer that reviews each play of the game. I don't know the specifics but I have heard the job of the league statistician described for such things. If the QB holds the ball for longer than would normally be considered enough time to throw the ball, then it is not a "hurry."

Also to be considered is the role of the TE and WRs. In the case of VD, he is often held in to to block initially and then go out. In that case, if there is quick pressure, Davis is not yet into the pattern. That is an issue with play design, not QB efficiency.

Also, regarding Davis, he is well known for not being particularly adept at reading defenses and making the correct hot reads. Last week Collinsworth pointed this out on one play where Smith was under pressure and had raised the ball while looking at Davis for a quick release but VD had turned to look. On that play, Smith was "hurried" and had to roll out and threw the ball away. That is a "hurry" on Davis.

Finally, opponents have found SF wide outs to be easy to control with man press coverage. The 49er receivers have not learned how to beat the coverage quickly in rhythm with the play and "hurries" result.

So, no, it isn't just an OL issue but it isn't just the OL and the QB. It is, like all of football, a team issue.

The bold is extremely subjective as Collinsworth also pointed out quite a few open receivers.

I understand hurries are dependent on time allowed for QB to throw first but QB around the league are hurried less than Alex but still make more plays than Alex. It seems like he expect the blocking to be textbook and doesn't prepare for the pocket to collapse. Other QBs (the better ones) move right away when they sense this and make a play. Alex still needs to work on his use of the pocket and ability to sense the pressure.
The league observer takes all of your points into consideration in assigning a "hurry."

I'm not pointing out how it's measured. I'm pointing out the results the QB provides after a hurry. Alex does not do well when hurried if anything at all.
Very few QBs do.
...