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3 Types of Football in the NFL

Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
I'm not creating a post to talk about what our team is doing wrong. There has been too much of that all week thus far. I'M OFF TODAY, I had time to write a long post, so here it goes....

What I'm attempting to do is wake up some of you ESPN followers. Wishing your team was like this or like that, or whoever ESPN is selling. If this doesn't apply to you, then don't be offended. Only the offended will respond in defense.

In today's NFL, there are 3 types of football. There is the Smash-Mouth type. It's designed to run to open up the play action pass or deep pass. Which you need big powerful physical o-lineman, a mobile Qb that can sell the play action, MORE than 1 HB on your team that REALLY contributes, a TE that we have, and at least one real big speedster WR that catches everything(which what we don't have) along with Wr's that can catch, block, and run great routes to run this type. Low Risk, Low Reward. BUT has a GREAT Defense!

Then there is the Spread. These expensive intelligent lineman have quick feet, but they are a smaller type o-line, but their quickness allows the QB to have up to 5 seconds to throw the ball and allow them to run the draw effectively. You need 'a great decision maker type' QB that will stay in the pocket and throw the very accurate pass. The HB doesn't need to be the top 5 in rushing, but can be a threat out the backfield. The Wr's(plural) all need to be vary similar in their abilities. The TE needs to be a better pass catcher than a blocker. High Risk, High Reward. this team has small, but fast Defense, that you can run on, but difficult to pass against because usually their offense is usually up 14 pts. So they know your trying to pass.

Then there is the 'West Coast', which is based on a accurate, 'the ability to buy time type' Qb, both HB and FB are good runners and great pass catcher's, the with the TE and WR's being great route runners. BUT THE O-LINE ARE 'Tweeners'(Lineman that have quick feet, are a little over 300lbs, but play physical like they are 330lbs). They are hard to come by. They are usually very intelligent, and physical. Medium Risk, Medium Reward. This defense is usually balanced. When they have 3 elite players(1 d-lineman, 1 linebacker, 1 corner) on Defense with serviceable players surrounding them, then they play very well.

NOW, with all that said, a defense has to compliment the offense. What wins playoff games, AND Championships consistently? Defense.

In the playoffs and super bowl, you need to be able to run the ball when you want and need to, pass the ball when you need to, and stop the run with a stout Defense...ask the Colts how many times they have been to the playoffs vs. rings. Oh and NOLA will not win another ring for a long time.

The 49ers direction of a complete 'Smash-Mouth' football team is in the making. A.Simth in THIS offensive personnel, with our type of lineman, with our very good HB's, with our very good TE's, with our Wr's(missing that true #1 WR), and with our very good Defense, he is better served at the play-action than the spread when throwing the ball. A.Smith is making the adjustments. BUT no way in hell do we start all over with the depth of this team. NOW in our 12 formation, we do create mismatches when we spread the formation, but our WR's are not the traditional fast, and quick route runners for the spread.

When the o-line gels completely before the bye-week, we hope to see AS sidestep rushers, step up into the pocket, and throw the ball. That's the kind of QB I want, not a QB who can ONLY thrive in the spread offense.

Is that what you want? Many of you have been pleading for the 'Spread offense' and do not understand we don't have the personnel for that. We didn't spend 50% our of salary on our QB and O-line. Did you see the one preseason game where Indy's 2nd string Qb played? Do you want that?

JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

Good post..I'm interested in what you think of our game planning on both sides of the ball, the play calling and in game adjustments?

Our focus on defense, to me is not get beat by the screens and our defense has to put be very physical on Brees. I mean really try to abuse Brees. Manusky is very excited about getting his defense to perform like they did last year vs. Minn and Indy...more like Indy. I'm telling you this, you will see our db's be more physical at the line of scrimmage, most likely when nobody is in the back field blocking for Brees. We will create turnovers from hits more than ints, unless they are tip balls. We will not jump routes, you watch. About adjustments, when they see our coverage playing to the screens, then they will run those crossing and corner routes. Hopefully by then we've rattled Brees and he's off by then. No body is superman. You watch P.Willis to have 3 sacks on Brees from running up the gut, just like in the preseason.

On offense, we will see all that talk in TC about the down field plays Alex was throwing. You'll see a balance and more creative runs for Gore with the Big Mike pulling. We have to remember, Bass is basically a rookie playing center this year. Heitmann getting hurt, hurt us so far. But we will have more creative formations shown and Alex will get the ball to them, because he will be excited about the "explosive plays". NOLA is not as great as everybody thinks. They can get scored on, and they can get ran on by a great running team. All 3 of our backs will see the field, and not do to injury. NOLA won't know what hit them. They will just know that got hit in the mouth!!!!! lol...

But foreal, NOLA is not as great as projected. They've been licking their chops all week too, but we have since training camp, and we just beat ourselves last week.

The ball will spread around our offense to guys like Zeig and Walker, and Morgan which will do well. Crabs has a lot to prove. He's getting talked about nationally, and his daddy Primetime don't like that. Our o-line just has to protect AS, because they are coming after him, like they do all qb's(high risk, high reward). When NOLA lines around the line of scrimmage on 2nd and 8 and their standing, I hope that's when we run and we are in the 12 formation. The game has to be won with our o-line playing above their ability. TEAMS only play like that on MNF. What does NOLA have to prove...

All this sounds well and good if you were the head coach and you could implement these schemes. However, while manusky is capable, sing and raye have yet to show they are able to scheme an offensive game plan to attack any specific teams weaknesses. They continue to do what they want to do and when that doesn't work they go into a panic 12. The times we've seen Alex look good have always been when the original game plan got broken down.

But today teams know our m.o. Try to run early, and then throw it everywhere when that doesn't work. If Alex was able to run a single back set from under center effectively, then we could go to a primary spread offense, but he can't. He has to be in shotgun. Or maybe Raye can't run and teach an entire set like that. Either way, we are worse off today then in hostlers smash coast offense.

Offensively we are so predictable that entire sportsbars all over the bay area predict our every play.

Your notion of going vertical against the Saints, is highly unlikely, considering our receivers who suck (including Crabtree who will have an under acheiving career unless he gets his head out of his ass) against what you said was a defense set to stop the pass.

You talk a good game but its wishful thinking. The only way we take this is if nola gets trapped by thinking they got this. We do play harder at home and on Monday night no doubt. But this is a coaching staff who takes half a season and 4 preseason games + 1 regular season embarassment, to make a simple adjustment such as an armband. And people here expect half time adjustments.

Our secondary is doomed to be exposed this season, and will have a hard time with Brees. We have to manufacture sacks. Not something u want to do against Brees. I do agree with you about Willis getting his.

As far as our runs go, its hard to tire teams out when you consistently go 3 for 16 on third downs. Third down for us may as well be 4th.

All that said, we usually play up to the teams we play, great against great teams, and mediocre against mediocre teams which is why niner talk has such an identity crisis.

Personally, I expect a close entertaining game where the defense does enough to keep us in the game and the offense actually moves the ball, but ends up imploding. It's what happens when we are the trap game.

Penalties, fumbles, and clock mismanagement will cost us the game. Well, after reading that sentence its not like I'm really sticking my neck out there on that prediction.
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
I'm not creating a post to talk about what our team is doing wrong. There has been too much of that all week thus far. I'M OFF TODAY, I had time to write a long post, so here it goes....

What I'm attempting to do is wake up some of you ESPN followers. Wishing your team was like this or like that, or whoever ESPN is selling. If this doesn't apply to you, then don't be offended. Only the offended will respond in defense.

In today's NFL, there are 3 types of football. There is the Smash-Mouth type. It's designed to run to open up the play action pass or deep pass. Which you need big powerful physical o-lineman, a mobile Qb that can sell the play action, MORE than 1 HB on your team that REALLY contributes, a TE that we have, and at least one real big speedster WR that catches everything(which what we don't have) along with Wr's that can catch, block, and run great routes to run this type. Low Risk, Low Reward. BUT has a GREAT Defense!

Then there is the Spread. These expensive intelligent lineman have quick feet, but they are a smaller type o-line, but their quickness allows the QB to have up to 5 seconds to throw the ball and allow them to run the draw effectively. You need 'a great decision maker type' QB that will stay in the pocket and throw the very accurate pass. The HB doesn't need to be the top 5 in rushing, but can be a threat out the backfield. The Wr's(plural) all need to be vary similar in their abilities. The TE needs to be a better pass catcher than a blocker. High Risk, High Reward. this team has small, but fast Defense, that you can run on, but difficult to pass against because usually their offense is usually up 14 pts. So they know your trying to pass.

Then there is the 'West Coast', which is based on a accurate, 'the ability to buy time type' Qb, both HB and FB are good runners and great pass catcher's, the with the TE and WR's being great route runners. BUT THE O-LINE ARE 'Tweeners'(Lineman that have quick feet, are a little over 300lbs, but play physical like they are 330lbs). They are hard to come by. They are usually very intelligent, and physical. Medium Risk, Medium Reward. This defense is usually balanced. When they have 3 elite players(1 d-lineman, 1 linebacker, 1 corner) on Defense with serviceable players surrounding them, then they play very well.

NOW, with all that said, a defense has to compliment the offense. What wins playoff games, AND Championships consistently? Defense.

In the playoffs and super bowl, you need to be able to run the ball when you want and need to, pass the ball when you need to, and stop the run with a stout Defense...ask the Colts how many times they have been to the playoffs vs. rings. Oh and NOLA will not win another ring for a long time.

The 49ers direction of a complete 'Smash-Mouth' football team is in the making. A.Simth in THIS offensive personnel, with our type of lineman, with our very good HB's, with our very good TE's, with our Wr's(missing that true #1 WR), and with our very good Defense, he is better served at the play-action than the spread when throwing the ball. A.Smith is making the adjustments. BUT no way in hell do we start all over with the depth of this team. NOW in our 12 formation, we do create mismatches when we spread the formation, but our WR's are not the traditional fast, and quick route runners for the spread.

When the o-line gels completely before the bye-week, we hope to see AS sidestep rushers, step up into the pocket, and throw the ball. That's the kind of QB I want, not a QB who can ONLY thrive in the spread offense.

Is that what you want? Many of you have been pleading for the 'Spread offense' and do not understand we don't have the personnel for that. We didn't spend 50% our of salary on our QB and O-line. Did you see the one preseason game where Indy's 2nd string Qb played? Do you want that?

JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

Good post..I'm interested in what you think of our game planning on both sides of the ball, the play calling and in game adjustments?

Our focus on defense, to me is not get beat by the screens and our defense has to put be very physical on Brees. I mean really try to abuse Brees. Manusky is very excited about getting his defense to perform like they did last year vs. Minn and Indy...more like Indy. I'm telling you this, you will see our db's be more physical at the line of scrimmage, most likely when nobody is in the back field blocking for Brees. We will create turnovers from hits more than ints, unless they are tip balls. We will not jump routes, you watch. About adjustments, when they see our coverage playing to the screens, then they will run those crossing and corner routes. Hopefully by then we've rattled Brees and he's off by then. No body is superman. You watch P.Willis to have 3 sacks on Brees from running up the gut, just like in the preseason.

On offense, we will see all that talk in TC about the down field plays Alex was throwing. You'll see a balance and more creative runs for Gore with the Big Mike pulling. We have to remember, Bass is basically a rookie playing center this year. Heitmann getting hurt, hurt us so far. But we will have more creative formations shown and Alex will get the ball to them, because he will be excited about the "explosive plays". NOLA is not as great as everybody thinks. They can get scored on, and they can get ran on by a great running team. All 3 of our backs will see the field, and not do to injury. NOLA won't know what hit them. They will just know that got hit in the mouth!!!!! lol...

But foreal, NOLA is not as great as projected. They've been licking their chops all week too, but we have since training camp, and we just beat ourselves last week.

The ball will spread around our offense to guys like Zeig and Walker, and Morgan which will do well. Crabs has a lot to prove. He's getting talked about nationally, and his daddy Primetime don't like that. Our o-line just has to protect AS, because they are coming after him, like they do all qb's(high risk, high reward). When NOLA lines around the line of scrimmage on 2nd and 8 and their standing, I hope that's when we run and we are in the 12 formation. The game has to be won with our o-line playing above their ability. TEAMS only play like that on MNF. What does NOLA have to prove...

I agree with what you're saying. I still feel it'll boil down to this...

Offensive Game planning : Raye vs Sean Payton = advantage Saints.
Defensive Game planning : Manusky vs G. Williams = tie.

The jury is still out on the 49ers special teams. That might be the deciding factor.

I'd agree with all you said. But wouldn't it be Raye vs. SP and Manusky vs GW, then any given Sunday, I mean MNF!
Originally posted by bigmike55:
I miss the WCO.
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by kray28:
The offense in its' general makeup in terms of personnel has no real identity.

As far as whether or not they are suited to the spread....they are. Smith was a Spread QB under Meyer in Utah, and was most successful operating out of a shotgun. Crabtree as a receiver played two years at TT in a spread, and again was highly productive. Morgan started as receiver in an option/spread type offense it VT. The list goes on.

They are wannabe "smash-mouth"....but they lack the balls, talent and the brute strength to execute that consistently.

So they do better in spread situations.

And both WRs you mentioned are slower than...Jason Hill, who was in a spread offense and we released/ then resigned him. College vs NFL is also 2 different things. ASimth didn't play vs. the SEC. If he did and was successful in that, than I'd say i'm with you 100%...let's run that system all the time. Plus we'd have to revamp the entire offensive line. Our guys are run blockers first, pass blockers second. You wanna wait 5 more years?
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
I'm not creating a post to talk about what our team is doing wrong. There has been too much of that all week thus far. I'M OFF TODAY, I had time to write a long post, so here it goes....

What I'm attempting to do is wake up some of you ESPN followers. Wishing your team was like this or like that, or whoever ESPN is selling. If this doesn't apply to you, then don't be offended. Only the offended will respond in defense.

In today's NFL, there are 3 types of football. There is the Smash-Mouth type. It's designed to run to open up the play action pass or deep pass. Which you need big powerful physical o-lineman, a mobile Qb that can sell the play action, MORE than 1 HB on your team that REALLY contributes, a TE that we have, and at least one real big speedster WR that catches everything(which what we don't have) along with Wr's that can catch, block, and run great routes to run this type. Low Risk, Low Reward. BUT has a GREAT Defense!

Then there is the Spread. These expensive intelligent lineman have quick feet, but they are a smaller type o-line, but their quickness allows the QB to have up to 5 seconds to throw the ball and allow them to run the draw effectively. You need 'a great decision maker type' QB that will stay in the pocket and throw the very accurate pass. The HB doesn't need to be the top 5 in rushing, but can be a threat out the backfield. The Wr's(plural) all need to be vary similar in their abilities. The TE needs to be a better pass catcher than a blocker. High Risk, High Reward. this team has small, but fast Defense, that you can run on, but difficult to pass against because usually their offense is usually up 14 pts. So they know your trying to pass.

Then there is the 'West Coast', which is based on a accurate, 'the ability to buy time type' Qb, both HB and FB are good runners and great pass catcher's, the with the TE and WR's being great route runners. BUT THE O-LINE ARE 'Tweeners'(Lineman that have quick feet, are a little over 300lbs, but play physical like they are 330lbs). They are hard to come by. They are usually very intelligent, and physical. Medium Risk, Medium Reward. This defense is usually balanced. When they have 3 elite players(1 d-lineman, 1 linebacker, 1 corner) on Defense with serviceable players surrounding them, then they play very well.

NOW, with all that said, a defense has to compliment the offense. What wins playoff games, AND Championships consistently? Defense.

In the playoffs and super bowl, you need to be able to run the ball when you want and need to, pass the ball when you need to, and stop the run with a stout Defense...ask the Colts how many times they have been to the playoffs vs. rings. Oh and NOLA will not win another ring for a long time.

The 49ers direction of a complete 'Smash-Mouth' football team is in the making. A.Simth in THIS offensive personnel, with our type of lineman, with our very good HB's, with our very good TE's, with our Wr's(missing that true #1 WR), and with our very good Defense, he is better served at the play-action than the spread when throwing the ball. A.Smith is making the adjustments. BUT no way in hell do we start all over with the depth of this team. NOW in our 12 formation, we do create mismatches when we spread the formation, but our WR's are not the traditional fast, and quick route runners for the spread.

When the o-line gels completely before the bye-week, we hope to see AS sidestep rushers, step up into the pocket, and throw the ball. That's the kind of QB I want, not a QB who can ONLY thrive in the spread offense.

Is that what you want? Many of you have been pleading for the 'Spread offense' and do not understand we don't have the personnel for that. We didn't spend 50% our of salary on our QB and O-line. Did you see the one preseason game where Indy's 2nd string Qb played? Do you want that?

JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

Good post..I'm interested in what you think of our game planning on both sides of the ball, the play calling and in game adjustments?

Our focus on defense, to me is not get beat by the screens and our defense has to put be very physical on Brees. I mean really try to abuse Brees. Manusky is very excited about getting his defense to perform like they did last year vs. Minn and Indy...more like Indy. I'm telling you this, you will see our db's be more physical at the line of scrimmage, most likely when nobody is in the back field blocking for Brees. We will create turnovers from hits more than ints, unless they are tip balls. We will not jump routes, you watch. About adjustments, when they see our coverage playing to the screens, then they will run those crossing and corner routes. Hopefully by then we've rattled Brees and he's off by then. No body is superman. You watch P.Willis to have 3 sacks on Brees from running up the gut, just like in the preseason.

On offense, we will see all that talk in TC about the down field plays Alex was throwing. You'll see a balance and more creative runs for Gore with the Big Mike pulling. We have to remember, Bass is basically a rookie playing center this year. Heitmann getting hurt, hurt us so far. But we will have more creative formations shown and Alex will get the ball to them, because he will be excited about the "explosive plays". NOLA is not as great as everybody thinks. They can get scored on, and they can get ran on by a great running team. All 3 of our backs will see the field, and not do to injury. NOLA won't know what hit them. They will just know that got hit in the mouth!!!!! lol...

But foreal, NOLA is not as great as projected. They've been licking their chops all week too, but we have since training camp, and we just beat ourselves last week.

The ball will spread around our offense to guys like Zeig and Walker, and Morgan which will do well. Crabs has a lot to prove. He's getting talked about nationally, and his daddy Primetime don't like that. Our o-line just has to protect AS, because they are coming after him, like they do all qb's(high risk, high reward). When NOLA lines around the line of scrimmage on 2nd and 8 and their standing, I hope that's when we run and we are in the 12 formation. The game has to be won with our o-line playing above their ability. TEAMS only play like that on MNF. What does NOLA have to prove...

Gotta hope our CB's jam at the LOS that will help our D-line out a bit for sure and disrupt any timing patterns. Bree's and his receiving core are masters in that area...Plus we need our Safeties to come up big both in the run support and in helping out the CB's....As long as Manusky adapts to the game and keeps the D playing in front of them I feel our D can handle the Saints..not gonna b easy tho but nothing in the NFL is....
Now our O,that's a different story...GAME-PLAN GAME-PLAN GAME-PLAN...not just run up the middle. They need to create mis-matches mis-directions, put players in motion, UTILIZE our offense weapons to the fullest and to their STRENGTHS. Game time adjustments that benefit our team .Last Sunday we stopped using walker...don't no why???? There's a bunch more that can be added, bottom line we need to play smart football anything less and the Saints will eat us up!!!
I know we can beat the Saints...I have no doubts...Stay faithful!!!

True. About DWalker, we stopped using him, because again, why give NOLA game tape of our success?
  • BobS
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,805
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by znk916:
Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Actually a good post.

you read?

Tell me where I'm wrong? Please, educate me...

You lost us on JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

You are making the incorrect assumption that the head coach knows what he is doing.
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by geturembedder:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
I'm not creating a post to talk about what our team is doing wrong. There has been too much of that all week thus far. I'M OFF TODAY, I had time to write a long post, so here it goes....

What I'm attempting to do is wake up some of you ESPN followers. Wishing your team was like this or like that, or whoever ESPN is selling. If this doesn't apply to you, then don't be offended. Only the offended will respond in defense.

In today's NFL, there are 3 types of football. There is the Smash-Mouth type. It's designed to run to open up the play action pass or deep pass. Which you need big powerful physical o-lineman, a mobile Qb that can sell the play action, MORE than 1 HB on your team that REALLY contributes, a TE that we have, and at least one real big speedster WR that catches everything(which what we don't have) along with Wr's that can catch, block, and run great routes to run this type. Low Risk, Low Reward. BUT has a GREAT Defense!

Then there is the Spread. These expensive intelligent lineman have quick feet, but they are a smaller type o-line, but their quickness allows the QB to have up to 5 seconds to throw the ball and allow them to run the draw effectively. You need 'a great decision maker type' QB that will stay in the pocket and throw the very accurate pass. The HB doesn't need to be the top 5 in rushing, but can be a threat out the backfield. The Wr's(plural) all need to be vary similar in their abilities. The TE needs to be a better pass catcher than a blocker. High Risk, High Reward. this team has small, but fast Defense, that you can run on, but difficult to pass against because usually their offense is usually up 14 pts. So they know your trying to pass.

Then there is the 'West Coast', which is based on a accurate, 'the ability to buy time type' Qb, both HB and FB are good runners and great pass catcher's, the with the TE and WR's being great route runners. BUT THE O-LINE ARE 'Tweeners'(Lineman that have quick feet, are a little over 300lbs, but play physical like they are 330lbs). They are hard to come by. They are usually very intelligent, and physical. Medium Risk, Medium Reward. This defense is usually balanced. When they have 3 elite players(1 d-lineman, 1 linebacker, 1 corner) on Defense with serviceable players surrounding them, then they play very well.

NOW, with all that said, a defense has to compliment the offense. What wins playoff games, AND Championships consistently? Defense.

In the playoffs and super bowl, you need to be able to run the ball when you want and need to, pass the ball when you need to, and stop the run with a stout Defense...ask the Colts how many times they have been to the playoffs vs. rings. Oh and NOLA will not win another ring for a long time.

The 49ers direction of a complete 'Smash-Mouth' football team is in the making. A.Simth in THIS offensive personnel, with our type of lineman, with our very good HB's, with our very good TE's, with our Wr's(missing that true #1 WR), and with our very good Defense, he is better served at the play-action than the spread when throwing the ball. A.Smith is making the adjustments. BUT no way in hell do we start all over with the depth of this team. NOW in our 12 formation, we do create mismatches when we spread the formation, but our WR's are not the traditional fast, and quick route runners for the spread.

When the o-line gels completely before the bye-week, we hope to see AS sidestep rushers, step up into the pocket, and throw the ball. That's the kind of QB I want, not a QB who can ONLY thrive in the spread offense.

Is that what you want? Many of you have been pleading for the 'Spread offense' and do not understand we don't have the personnel for that. We didn't spend 50% our of salary on our QB and O-line. Did you see the one preseason game where Indy's 2nd string Qb played? Do you want that?

JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

Good post..I'm interested in what you think of our game planning on both sides of the ball, the play calling and in game adjustments?

Our focus on defense, to me is not get beat by the screens and our defense has to put be very physical on Brees. I mean really try to abuse Brees. Manusky is very excited about getting his defense to perform like they did last year vs. Minn and Indy...more like Indy. I'm telling you this, you will see our db's be more physical at the line of scrimmage, most likely when nobody is in the back field blocking for Brees. We will create turnovers from hits more than ints, unless they are tip balls. We will not jump routes, you watch. About adjustments, when they see our coverage playing to the screens, then they will run those crossing and corner routes. Hopefully by then we've rattled Brees and he's off by then. No body is superman. You watch P.Willis to have 3 sacks on Brees from running up the gut, just like in the preseason.

On offense, we will see all that talk in TC about the down field plays Alex was throwing. You'll see a balance and more creative runs for Gore with the Big Mike pulling. We have to remember, Bass is basically a rookie playing center this year. Heitmann getting hurt, hurt us so far. But we will have more creative formations shown and Alex will get the ball to them, because he will be excited about the "explosive plays". NOLA is not as great as everybody thinks. They can get scored on, and they can get ran on by a great running team. All 3 of our backs will see the field, and not do to injury. NOLA won't know what hit them. They will just know that got hit in the mouth!!!!! lol...

But foreal, NOLA is not as great as projected. They've been licking their chops all week too, but we have since training camp, and we just beat ourselves last week.

The ball will spread around our offense to guys like Zeig and Walker, and Morgan which will do well. Crabs has a lot to prove. He's getting talked about nationally, and his daddy Primetime don't like that. Our o-line just has to protect AS, because they are coming after him, like they do all qb's(high risk, high reward). When NOLA lines around the line of scrimmage on 2nd and 8 and their standing, I hope that's when we run and we are in the 12 formation. The game has to be won with our o-line playing above their ability. TEAMS only play like that on MNF. What does NOLA have to prove...

All this sounds well and good if you were the head coach and you could implement these schemes. However, while manusky is capable, sing and raye have yet to show they are able to scheme an offensive game plan to attack any specific teams weaknesses. They continue to do what they want to do and when that doesn't work they go into a panic 12. The times we've seen Alex look good have always been when the original game plan got broken down.

But today teams know our m.o. Try to run early, and then throw it everywhere when that doesn't work. If Alex was able to run a single back set from under center effectively, then we could go to a primary spread offense, but he can't. He has to be in shotgun. Or maybe Raye can't run and teach an entire set like that. Either way, we are worse off today then in hostlers smash coast offense.

Offensively we are so predictable that entire sportsbars all over the bay area predict our every play.

Your notion of going vertical against the Saints, is highly unlikely, considering our receivers who suck (including Crabtree who will have an under acheiving career unless he gets his head out of his ass) against what you said was a defense set to stop the pass.

You talk a good game but its wishful thinking. The only way we take this is if nola gets trapped by thinking they got this. We do play harder at home and on Monday night no doubt. But this is a coaching staff who takes half a season and 4 preseason games + 1 regular season embarassment, to make a simple adjustment such as an armband. And people here expect half time adjustments.

Our secondary is doomed to be exposed this season, and will have a hard time with Brees. We have to manufacture sacks. Not something u want to do against Brees. I do agree with you about Willis getting his.

As far as our runs go, its hard to tire teams out when you consistently go 3 for 16 on third downs. Third down for us may as well be 4th.

All that said, we usually play up to the teams we play, great against great teams, and mediocre against mediocre teams which is why niner talk has such an identity crisis.

Personally, I expect a close entertaining game where the defense does enough to keep us in the game and the offense actually moves the ball, but ends up imploding. It's what happens when we are the trap game.

Penalties, fumbles, and clock mismanagement will cost us the game. Well, after reading that sentence its not like I'm really sticking my neck out there on that prediction.

Good points. It will be a close game.

Smash-Mouth football is not rocket science. So of course its predictable. But I will say in TC, it was reported that ASmith made many downfield throws. The only problem is will he have those over throws, we're they'd have a db beat, and the ball goes over the WR.

Also a lot of those throws were to Ginn in spring ball and OTA's. I think Zigs and Morgan are athletic and fast enough to challenge Nola's corners in the play action passes.
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by BobS:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by znk916:
Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Actually a good post.

you read?

Tell me where I'm wrong? Please, educate me...

You lost us on JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

You are making the incorrect assumption that the head coach knows what he is doing.

My question about that, about Sing. Who else was available that would coach for the Yorks(They are not selling the team, so just don't even think in that direction)? Can anybody tell me?
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
I'm not creating a post to talk about what our team is doing wrong. There has been too much of that all week thus far. I'M OFF TODAY, I had time to write a long post, so here it goes....

What I'm attempting to do is wake up some of you ESPN followers. Wishing your team was like this or like that, or whoever ESPN is selling. If this doesn't apply to you, then don't be offended. Only the offended will respond in defense.

In today's NFL, there are 3 types of football. There is the Smash-Mouth type. It's designed to run to open up the play action pass or deep pass. Which you need big powerful physical o-lineman, a mobile Qb that can sell the play action, MORE than 1 HB on your team that REALLY contributes, a TE that we have, and at least one real big speedster WR that catches everything(which what we don't have) along with Wr's that can catch, block, and run great routes to run this type. Low Risk, Low Reward. BUT has a GREAT Defense!

Then there is the Spread. These expensive intelligent lineman have quick feet, but they are a smaller type o-line, but their quickness allows the QB to have up to 5 seconds to throw the ball and allow them to run the draw effectively. You need 'a great decision maker type' QB that will stay in the pocket and throw the very accurate pass. The HB doesn't need to be the top 5 in rushing, but can be a threat out the backfield. The Wr's(plural) all need to be vary similar in their abilities. The TE needs to be a better pass catcher than a blocker. High Risk, High Reward. this team has small, but fast Defense, that you can run on, but difficult to pass against because usually their offense is usually up 14 pts. So they know your trying to pass.

Then there is the 'West Coast', which is based on a accurate, 'the ability to buy time type' Qb, both HB and FB are good runners and great pass catcher's, the with the TE and WR's being great route runners. BUT THE O-LINE ARE 'Tweeners'(Lineman that have quick feet, are a little over 300lbs, but play physical like they are 330lbs). They are hard to come by. They are usually very intelligent, and physical. Medium Risk, Medium Reward. This defense is usually balanced. When they have 3 elite players(1 d-lineman, 1 linebacker, 1 corner) on Defense with serviceable players surrounding them, then they play very well.

NOW, with all that said, a defense has to compliment the offense. What wins playoff games, AND Championships consistently? Defense.

In the playoffs and super bowl, you need to be able to run the ball when you want and need to, pass the ball when you need to, and stop the run with a stout Defense...ask the Colts how many times they have been to the playoffs vs. rings. Oh and NOLA will not win another ring for a long time.

The 49ers direction of a complete 'Smash-Mouth' football team is in the making. A.Simth in THIS offensive personnel, with our type of lineman, with our very good HB's, with our very good TE's, with our Wr's(missing that true #1 WR), and with our very good Defense, he is better served at the play-action than the spread when throwing the ball. A.Smith is making the adjustments. BUT no way in hell do we start all over with the depth of this team. NOW in our 12 formation, we do create mismatches when we spread the formation, but our WR's are not the traditional fast, and quick route runners for the spread.

When the o-line gels completely before the bye-week, we hope to see AS sidestep rushers, step up into the pocket, and throw the ball. That's the kind of QB I want, not a QB who can ONLY thrive in the spread offense.

Is that what you want? Many of you have been pleading for the 'Spread offense' and do not understand we don't have the personnel for that. We didn't spend 50% our of salary on our QB and O-line. Did you see the one preseason game where Indy's 2nd string Qb played? Do you want that?

JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

Good post..I'm interested in what you think of our game planning on both sides of the ball, the play calling and in game adjustments?

Our focus on defense, to me is not get beat by the screens and our defense has to put be very physical on Brees. I mean really try to abuse Brees. Manusky is very excited about getting his defense to perform like they did last year vs. Minn and Indy...more like Indy. I'm telling you this, you will see our db's be more physical at the line of scrimmage, most likely when nobody is in the back field blocking for Brees. We will create turnovers from hits more than ints, unless they are tip balls. We will not jump routes, you watch. About adjustments, when they see our coverage playing to the screens, then they will run those crossing and corner routes. Hopefully by then we've rattled Brees and he's off by then. No body is superman. You watch P.Willis to have 3 sacks on Brees from running up the gut, just like in the preseason.

On offense, we will see all that talk in TC about the down field plays Alex was throwing. You'll see a balance and more creative runs for Gore with the Big Mike pulling. We have to remember, Bass is basically a rookie playing center this year. Heitmann getting hurt, hurt us so far. But we will have more creative formations shown and Alex will get the ball to them, because he will be excited about the "explosive plays". NOLA is not as great as everybody thinks. They can get scored on, and they can get ran on by a great running team. All 3 of our backs will see the field, and not do to injury. NOLA won't know what hit them. They will just know that got hit in the mouth!!!!! lol...

But foreal, NOLA is not as great as projected. They've been licking their chops all week too, but we have since training camp, and we just beat ourselves last week.

The ball will spread around our offense to guys like Zeig and Walker, and Morgan which will do well. Crabs has a lot to prove. He's getting talked about nationally, and his daddy Primetime don't like that. Our o-line just has to protect AS, because they are coming after him, like they do all qb's(high risk, high reward). When NOLA lines around the line of scrimmage on 2nd and 8 and their standing, I hope that's when we run and we are in the 12 formation. The game has to be won with our o-line playing above their ability. TEAMS only play like that on MNF. What does NOLA have to prove...

Gotta hope our CB's jam at the LOS that will help our D-line out a bit for sure and disrupt any timing patterns. Bree's and his receiving core are masters in that area...Plus we need our Safeties to come up big both in the run support and in helping out the CB's....As long as Manusky adapts to the game and keeps the D playing in front of them I feel our D can handle the Saints..not gonna b easy tho but nothing in the NFL is....
Now our O,that's a different story...GAME-PLAN GAME-PLAN GAME-PLAN...not just run up the middle. They need to create mis-matches mis-directions, put players in motion, UTILIZE our offense weapons to the fullest and to their STRENGTHS. Game time adjustments that benefit our team .Last Sunday we stopped using walker...don't no why???? There's a bunch more that can be added, bottom line we need to play smart football anything less and the Saints will eat us up!!!
I know we can beat the Saints...I have no doubts...Stay faithful!!!

True. About DWalker, we stopped using him, because again, why give NOLA game tape of our success?

hahaha I really hope that wasn't the reason....
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by verb1der:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by dugo:
Originally posted by TFSP:
I'm not creating a post to talk about what our team is doing wrong. There has been too much of that all week thus far. I'M OFF TODAY, I had time to write a long post, so here it goes....

What I'm attempting to do is wake up some of you ESPN followers. Wishing your team was like this or like that, or whoever ESPN is selling. If this doesn't apply to you, then don't be offended. Only the offended will respond in defense.

In today's NFL, there are 3 types of football. There is the Smash-Mouth type. It's designed to run to open up the play action pass or deep pass. Which you need big powerful physical o-lineman, a mobile Qb that can sell the play action, MORE than 1 HB on your team that REALLY contributes, a TE that we have, and at least one real big speedster WR that catches everything(which what we don't have) along with Wr's that can catch, block, and run great routes to run this type. Low Risk, Low Reward. BUT has a GREAT Defense!

Then there is the Spread. These expensive intelligent lineman have quick feet, but they are a smaller type o-line, but their quickness allows the QB to have up to 5 seconds to throw the ball and allow them to run the draw effectively. You need 'a great decision maker type' QB that will stay in the pocket and throw the very accurate pass. The HB doesn't need to be the top 5 in rushing, but can be a threat out the backfield. The Wr's(plural) all need to be vary similar in their abilities. The TE needs to be a better pass catcher than a blocker. High Risk, High Reward. this team has small, but fast Defense, that you can run on, but difficult to pass against because usually their offense is usually up 14 pts. So they know your trying to pass.

Then there is the 'West Coast', which is based on a accurate, 'the ability to buy time type' Qb, both HB and FB are good runners and great pass catcher's, the with the TE and WR's being great route runners. BUT THE O-LINE ARE 'Tweeners'(Lineman that have quick feet, are a little over 300lbs, but play physical like they are 330lbs). They are hard to come by. They are usually very intelligent, and physical. Medium Risk, Medium Reward. This defense is usually balanced. When they have 3 elite players(1 d-lineman, 1 linebacker, 1 corner) on Defense with serviceable players surrounding them, then they play very well.

NOW, with all that said, a defense has to compliment the offense. What wins playoff games, AND Championships consistently? Defense.

In the playoffs and super bowl, you need to be able to run the ball when you want and need to, pass the ball when you need to, and stop the run with a stout Defense...ask the Colts how many times they have been to the playoffs vs. rings. Oh and NOLA will not win another ring for a long time.

The 49ers direction of a complete 'Smash-Mouth' football team is in the making. A.Simth in THIS offensive personnel, with our type of lineman, with our very good HB's, with our very good TE's, with our Wr's(missing that true #1 WR), and with our very good Defense, he is better served at the play-action than the spread when throwing the ball. A.Smith is making the adjustments. BUT no way in hell do we start all over with the depth of this team. NOW in our 12 formation, we do create mismatches when we spread the formation, but our WR's are not the traditional fast, and quick route runners for the spread.

When the o-line gels completely before the bye-week, we hope to see AS sidestep rushers, step up into the pocket, and throw the ball. That's the kind of QB I want, not a QB who can ONLY thrive in the spread offense.

Is that what you want? Many of you have been pleading for the 'Spread offense' and do not understand we don't have the personnel for that. We didn't spend 50% our of salary on our QB and O-line. Did you see the one preseason game where Indy's 2nd string Qb played? Do you want that?

JUST BE PATIENT FANS.

Good post..I'm interested in what you think of our game planning on both sides of the ball, the play calling and in game adjustments?

Our focus on defense, to me is not get beat by the screens and our defense has to put be very physical on Brees. I mean really try to abuse Brees. Manusky is very excited about getting his defense to perform like they did last year vs. Minn and Indy...more like Indy. I'm telling you this, you will see our db's be more physical at the line of scrimmage, most likely when nobody is in the back field blocking for Brees. We will create turnovers from hits more than ints, unless they are tip balls. We will not jump routes, you watch. About adjustments, when they see our coverage playing to the screens, then they will run those crossing and corner routes. Hopefully by then we've rattled Brees and he's off by then. No body is superman. You watch P.Willis to have 3 sacks on Brees from running up the gut, just like in the preseason.

On offense, we will see all that talk in TC about the down field plays Alex was throwing. You'll see a balance and more creative runs for Gore with the Big Mike pulling. We have to remember, Bass is basically a rookie playing center this year. Heitmann getting hurt, hurt us so far. But we will have more creative formations shown and Alex will get the ball to them, because he will be excited about the "explosive plays". NOLA is not as great as everybody thinks. They can get scored on, and they can get ran on by a great running team. All 3 of our backs will see the field, and not do to injury. NOLA won't know what hit them. They will just know that got hit in the mouth!!!!! lol...

But foreal, NOLA is not as great as projected. They've been licking their chops all week too, but we have since training camp, and we just beat ourselves last week.

The ball will spread around our offense to guys like Zeig and Walker, and Morgan which will do well. Crabs has a lot to prove. He's getting talked about nationally, and his daddy Primetime don't like that. Our o-line just has to protect AS, because they are coming after him, like they do all qb's(high risk, high reward). When NOLA lines around the line of scrimmage on 2nd and 8 and their standing, I hope that's when we run and we are in the 12 formation. The game has to be won with our o-line playing above their ability. TEAMS only play like that on MNF. What does NOLA have to prove...

I agree with what you're saying. I still feel it'll boil down to this...

Offensive Game planning : Raye vs Sean Payton = advantage Saints.
Defensive Game planning : Manusky vs G. Williams = tie.

The jury is still out on the 49ers special teams. That might be the deciding factor.

I'd agree with all you said. But wouldn't it be Raye vs. SP and Manusky vs GW, then any given Sunday, I mean MNF!

yes ur right, technically it's OC vs DC, I should've said who is greater specifically at "game planning".

Any given Monday though! Especially at the Stick! =D
  • krizay
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 14,925
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by znk916:
Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Actually a good post.

you read?

Tell me where I'm wrong? Please, educate me...

After the 6th sentence!

Just because you look to ESPN as your sports bible....and don't know how to read 'in between the lines' like a bible(lol) that's your blindenss.....

noooooo because when people see an 8ish paragraph thread they/we tend to disregard it and at best wait for a few poor souls who actually did read it to give us the jist of the post.

Idiots don't read.

So that explains why you didn't understand what Znk meant by
Quote:
you read?
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by znk916:
Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Actually a good post.

you read?

Tell me where I'm wrong? Please, educate me...

After the 6th sentence!

Just because you look to ESPN as your sports bible....and don't know how to read 'in between the lines' like a bible(lol) that's your blindenss.....

noooooo because when people see an 8ish paragraph thread they/we tend to disregard it and at best wait for a few poor souls who actually did read it to give us the jist of the post.

Idiots don't read.

So that explains why you didn't understand what Znk meant by
Quote:
you read?

Judging a book by its cover?

By the way, how is that most so-called "post" veterans(lol) tally so many post? They look to talk sh*t to people they don't know, or may not agree with the post being talked about at the time? I mean really most of you veterans have more negative sh*t to say. It amazes me that you call yourself a REAL fan. Oh maybe your not? Or maybe your a fan of sh*t talking...? Have you ever heard if you can't say nothing positive, than STFU!

Your a REAL fan when we win, then you talk sh*t when we lose. If you can't change the problem STFU.

Since it's so many of yall, why don't you write a letter to the organization(power is in the people, remember), or go picket at the front office if you want change.

Go be a fan a team that's riding high at the time(you ESPN following imbeciles) I'd rather hear from the opposing teams fan about our team, than my team's fanbase, whose worst than them.

Mods, you all not tired of this?

WE SHOULD VOTE THAT THERE SHOULD BE A PARTICULAR FORUM FOR THE SH*T TALKERS. CAN WE VOTE ON THIS MODS....OR WILL THIS GET LOCKED TOO?
We'll start 0-2 and then go on a tear, that O-Line needs a couple weeks to get the bugs out and start to gel, I still think we'll be fine
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by bigmike55:
I miss the WCO.

I do too, I miss the days of hitting receivers with quick hitting passes and allowing the playmakers to do some damage, but then again almost every team has an element of the WCO in their playbook, and a lot of DC's can better prepare for it.

What I think I miss the most is the creative aspect of the WCO, and at this point in time creativity is not a strong point of the 49ers, we basically told the entire league we're going to run a smashmouth offense and run the ball with authority, but we cant even do that right now ...so for the time being it's going to be a predictable offense with us running the ball on 1st and 2nd down and having to throw on 3rd down

and if that dont work it's strictly a shotgun/spread offense we're forced to use out of desperation, JRaye needs to find some balance and taking the predictability out of the offense would be a good start
  • TFSP
  • Member
  • Posts: 315
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by krizay:
Originally posted by TFSP:
Originally posted by znk916:
Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Actually a good post.

you read?

Tell me where I'm wrong? Please, educate me...

After the 6th sentence!

Just because you look to ESPN as your sports bible....and don't know how to read 'in between the lines' like a bible(lol) that's your blindenss.....

noooooo because when people see an 8ish paragraph thread they/we tend to disregard it and at best wait for a few poor souls who actually did read it to give us the jist of the post.

Idiots don't read.

So that explains why you didn't understand what Znk meant by
Quote:
you read?

Judging a book by its cover?

By the way, how is that most so-called "post" veterans(lol) tally so many post? They look to talk sh*t to people they don't know, or may not agree with the post being talked about at the time? I mean really most of you veterans have more negative sh*t to say. It amazes me that you call yourself a REAL fan. Oh maybe your not? Or maybe your a fan of sh*t talking...? Have you ever heard if you can't say nothing positive, than STFU!

Your a REAL fan when we win, then you talk sh*t when we lose. If you can't change the problem STFU.

Since it's so many of yall, why don't you write a letter to the organization(power is in the people, remember), or go picket at the front office if you want change.

Go be a fan a team that's riding high at the time(you ESPN following imbeciles) I'd rather hear from the opposing teams fan about our team, than my team's fanbase, whose worst than them.

Mods, you all not tired of this?

WE SHOULD VOTE THAT THERE SHOULD BE A PARTICULAR FORUM FOR THE SH*T TALKERS. CAN WE VOTE ON THIS MODS....OR WILL THIS GET LOCKED TOO?

hahahahahahahahHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHhahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaahah...this post increased my warning level. I better stop talking about how I feel and jump on the band wagon and complain about everything....

Although I can always talk bad about how old our OC is, and, and that's why he can't call plays fast enough, and that we have a dumb HC, because he has no experience, and, and our QB super sucks because he was put into a bad situation to groom in the first place, and how our secondary is trash, and we don't have a pass rush, and .......the owners need to sell the team, and it's friday, and, and I haven't ate lunch yet and...I mean come on. MODs are you serious....? Just because I said 'STFU' to whoever complains so dayummmm much. They should get warnings to for bringing down the fan-base HOPE! That's way more important.....