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49er myths examined

It's Friday, and I feel like writing. Here are the biggest complaints that I'm seeing around the forums thus far. I just wanted to inject a little reality into the argument:

1) We don't have enough speed on this team.

I wanted to address this first because it's by far the most ludicrous.

Concerning the defense, if there's one thing we do have on that side of the ball, it's definitely speed. They were plenty fast enough to stop Adrian Peterson, Fitz, Boldin, and Steven Jackson. And the big plays we gave up to Atlanta weren't due to lack of speed, it was due to lack of proper technique.

On Roddy White's 90 yard touchdown Nate was in position, he just tried to break on the ball instead of making the tackle. I will concede that Roman got torched, but it's been fact for awhile now he isn't exactly a burner. Going back and looking at Michael Turner's big runs, more often than not someone got a hand on him early.

They just failed (miserably) to wrap him up.

Offensively, I can agree that we do need faster players in certain positions, but it's not as bad as people are making it out to be. On Josh Morgan's 70 yard reception, he only got caught because he started jogging at around the 10. On the Bly interception, same deal. He started showboating and assumed that no one was behind him.

So what we saw in that game pretty much boils down to lack of focus. Mental mistakes that Atlanta made us pay dearly for.

2) I don't like the way that Coach Sing uses timeouts.

Again, the responses to this are more reactionary than logical. Case in point:

The decision to call time out towards the end of the Arizona game to "rally the troops" was lauded because we went on to WIN. The only reason people are complaining now is because Atlanta pretty much continued to hand our asses to us-- timeouts be damned.

Our performance (or lack thereof) can hardly be blamed on one timeout. And Delanie's fumble on the ensuing kickoff is irrelevant. Had Delanie properly secured the ball we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

3) Benching Shaun Hill is the answer to our offensive problems.

In short, no it isn't. Benching Hill won't help anything. Starting Smith, Davis, or trading for Peyton Manning won't help anything either. Until we fix the O-line, it doesn't matter who's back there if we can't protect him. Yes, I am aware that even when he's has time Hill's throws aren't always perfect.

Still, that doesn't detract from the root issue.

It isn't Hill's fault that as soon as he drops back there's a defender in his face. It isn't Hill's fault that no one respects the run game because our line can't open holes. Defenses are getting pressure on us EVEN when we have Vernon, and Morgan helping to block. And they're doing it with only 4 or 5 rushers.

IMO, this is a scheming issue. Hopefully, our coaching staff will correct this. I know some of you say it's due to lack of talent on the line, so I'll let you guys debate that one.

Thoughts?
1) We are the slowest team in the NFL on offense and actually a little slow on defense too at certain positions. Yes our speed or lack of it is terrible.

2) Coach Sing's timeouts for PEP RALLY's and clock management / game management would rank him #32 in the league right now.

3) Hill is a huge problem. He can only throw a 7 - 8 yard pass. Anything 10 + is out of the question. The D. stacks the box within a 10 yard area becuase he is no threat beyond that. Anything beyond that and the ball will come down "like a punt" and be uncatchable.

Yes the O Line is the bigger problem. But that still doesn't fix the weakness that is Shaun Hill.
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
1) We are the slowest team in the NFL on offense and actually a little slow on defense too at certain positions. Yes our speed or lack of it is terrible.

2) Coach Sing's timeouts for PEP RALLY's and clock management / game management would rank him #32 in the league right now.

3) Hill is a huge problem. He can only throw a 7 - 8 yard pass. Anything 10 + is out of the question. The D. stacks the box within a 10 yard area becuase he is no threat beyond that. Anything beyond that and the ball will come down "like a punt" and be uncatchable.

Yes the O Line is the bigger problem. But that still doesn't fix the weakness that is Shaun Hill.

1) I'm not so sure if I agree. Looking at St. Louis and Oakland as examples, they have pretty speedy receivers but it doesn't matter because none of their QB's can get them the ball. And that's because their O-Line is terrible.

2) Sing has called a timeout twice to rally the players. One time it worked, the other it didn't. Either way I don't think it's at a level where we can say it's a problem (or beneficial). I mean if you go back and watch the horror that was the Atlanta game, do you really think that one timeout would've made all the difference?

I don't.

3) Hill definitely isn't the long term answer at QB, but I do think he's the best that we have right now. It's not all about arm strength. Were that the case, JaMarcus Russell would be having a Pro Bowl year right now. I hate to keep picking on Oakland but it's true.

Also, there's numerous examples of QB's that are successful in the league and don't have big arms. Pennington, Brady, Collins, Orton, and Hassellbeck come to mind. Now what they all do have is an outstanding line blocking for them (well, maybe not Hassellbeck these days but you follow me). It all starts there.

And perhaps just as important , they all have an offense that suits their strengths.

[ Edited by baltien on Oct 16, 2009 at 06:42:04 ]
  • GORO
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,817
A) We were not prepared! Sing wants to run the ball, he doesnot want to admit that we are not a good running team. Gore will be back and this will help some.

B) Jimmy Raye is a rookie Offensive coordinator, he is stubborn and doesnot try to exploit opponents weaknesses, he wants to run and take low risk pass plays. We have 7 recievers on this team, yet we only put 3 on the field at one time.

C) Offensive Line is playing poorly on pass protection, are we using the right blocking scheme that is suited for our OL. Should we become more of a Denver type running team to take advantage of our OL talent. I believe that we are trying to be a physical running team. Tony Wragge has been steady when he has played, but Rachal is talented and may be better in a zone blocking scheme as well as Adam Snyder.

D) Why did we cut Rossum, when we got behind against the falcons I thought we could use a big return to get started, yet we are just triying to keep Battle and Spurlock on this team. Jason Hill has yet to be given a shot to make a play on passing downs.
Originally posted by GORO:
A) We were not prepared! Sing wants to run the ball, he doesnot want to admit that we are not a good running team. Gore will be back and this will help some.

B) Jimmy Raye is a rookie Offensive coordinator, he is stubborn and doesnot try to exploit opponents weaknesses, he wants to run and take low risk pass plays. We have 7 recievers on this team, yet we only put 3 on the field at one time.

C) Offensive Line is playing poorly on pass protection, are we using the right blocking scheme that is suited for our OL. Should we become more of a Denver type running team to take advantage of our OL talent. I believe that we are trying to be a physical running team. Tony Wragge has been steady when he has played, but Rachal is talented and may be better in a zone blocking scheme as well as Adam Snyder.

D) Why did we cut Rossum, when we got behind against the falcons I thought we could use a big return to get started, yet we are just triying to keep Battle and Spurlock on this team. Jason Hill has yet to be given a shot to make a play on passing downs.

Agreed on most counts. I think that Sing and Raye need to take a long look at our offense and make some changes. The reason why I find it hard to believe that our line is lacking talent is because we weren't nearly as bad last year. Or the year before. So you have to look at what changed.

And that would be the scheme.
Originally posted by GORO:
A) We were not prepared! Sing wants to run the ball, he doesnot want to admit that we are not a good running team. Gore will be back and this will help some.

B) Jimmy Raye is a rookie Offensive coordinator, he is stubborn and doesnot try to exploit opponents weaknesses, he wants to run and take low risk pass plays. We have 7 recievers on this team, yet we only put 3 on the field at one time.

C) Offensive Line is playing poorly on pass protection, are we using the right blocking scheme that is suited for our OL. Should we become more of a Denver type running team to take advantage of our OL talent. I believe that we are trying to be a physical running team. Tony Wragge has been steady when he has played, but Rachal is talented and may be better in a zone blocking scheme as well as Adam Snyder.

D) Why did we cut Rossum, when we got behind against the falcons I thought we could use a big return to get started, yet we are just triying to keep Battle and Spurlock on this team. Jason Hill has yet to be given a shot to make a play on passing downs.
a. we were not prepared, ti seems as if we didnt gameplan at all for atl.
b. raaye sucks at playcalling, and has no faith in the qb, so when he calls a pass play it sucks also.
c. Our run blocking is retarded, we have players who can barely block 1 guy, that are trying to get out front and block as they pull around to a different spot? yeah.. like that is going to work.
d. rossum sucked, bro he was getting like 12 yards per return, and looks like he lost 3 steps from last season. Spurlock and battle need to go, and if bruce keeps dropping s**t, cut him also. we need to stay young and move forward, not just keep players because they are coach favorites.
Originally posted by baltien:
It's Friday, and I feel like writing. Here are the biggest complaints that I'm seeing around the forums thus far. I just wanted to inject a little reality into the argument:

1) We don't have enough speed on this team.

I wanted to address this first because it's by far the most ludicrous.

Concerning the defense, if there's one thing we do have on that side of the ball, it's definitely speed. They were plenty fast enough to stop Adrian Peterson, Fitz, Boldin, and Steven Jackson. And the big plays we gave up to Atlanta weren't due to lack of speed, it was due to lack of proper technique.

On Roddy White's 90 yard touchdown Nate was in position, he just tried to break on the ball instead of making the tackle. I will concede that Roman got torched, but it's been fact for awhile now he isn't exactly a burner. Going back and looking at Michael Turner's big runs, more often than not someone got a hand on him early.

They just failed (miserably) to wrap him up.

Offensively, I can agree that we do need faster players in certain positions, but it's not as bad as people are making it out to be. On Josh Morgan's 70 yard reception, he only got caught because he started jogging at around the 10. On the Bly interception, same deal. He started showboating and assumed that no one was behind him.

So what we saw in that game pretty much boils down to lack of focus. Mental mistakes that Atlanta made us pay dearly for.

2) I don't like the way that Coach Sing uses timeouts.

Again, the responses to this are more reactionary than logical. Case in point:

The decision to call time out towards the end of the Arizona game to "rally the troops" was lauded because we went on to WIN. The only reason people are complaining now is because Atlanta pretty much continued to hand our asses to us-- timeouts be damned.

Our performance (or lack thereof) can hardly be blamed on one timeout. And Delanie's fumble on the ensuing kickoff is irrelevant. Had Delanie properly secured the ball we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

3) Benching Shaun Hill is the answer to our offensive problems.

In short, no it isn't. Benching Hill won't help anything. Starting Smith, Davis, or trading for Peyton Manning won't help anything either. Until we fix the O-line, it doesn't matter who's back there if we can't protect him. Yes, I am aware that even when he's has time Hill's throws aren't always perfect.

Still, that doesn't detract from the root issue.

It isn't Hill's fault that as soon as he drops back there's a defender in his face. It isn't Hill's fault that no one respects the run game because our line can't open holes. Defenses are getting pressure on us EVEN when we have Vernon, and Morgan helping to block. And they're doing it with only 4 or 5 rushers.

IMO, this is a scheming issue. Hopefully, our coaching staff will correct this. I know some of you say it's due to lack of talent on the line, so I'll let you guys debate that one.

Thoughts?

I agree, bad tackling was the reason turner got loose.
i agree that using time outs like its basketball is s**tty.
I disagree though, I do think shaun hill is a major problem, he sucks plain and simple... People think he is doing better than Alex would, I beg to differ.
Alex will never do better than Hill excepted and move on !
Originally posted by baltien:
It's Friday, and I feel like writing. Here are the biggest complaints that I'm seeing around the forums thus far. I just wanted to inject a little reality into the argument:

1) We don't have enough speed on this team.

I wanted to address this first because it's by far the most ludicrous.

Concerning the defense, if there's one thing we do have on that side of the ball, it's definitely speed. They were plenty fast enough to stop Adrian Peterson, Fitz, Boldin, and Steven Jackson. And the big plays we gave up to Atlanta weren't due to lack of speed, it was due to lack of proper technique.

On Roddy White's 90 yard touchdown Nate was in position, he just tried to break on the ball instead of making the tackle. I will concede that Roman got torched, but it's been fact for awhile now he isn't exactly a burner. Going back and looking at Michael Turner's big runs, more often than not someone got a hand on him early.

They just failed (miserably) to wrap him up.

Offensively, I can agree that we do need faster players in certain positions, but it's not as bad as people are making it out to be. On Josh Morgan's 70 yard reception, he only got caught because he started jogging at around the 10. On the Bly interception, same deal. He started showboating and assumed that no one was behind him.

So what we saw in that game pretty much boils down to lack of focus. Mental mistakes that Atlanta made us pay dearly for.

2) I don't like the way that Coach Sing uses timeouts.

Again, the responses to this are more reactionary than logical. Case in point:

The decision to call time out towards the end of the Arizona game to "rally the troops" was lauded because we went on to WIN. The only reason people are complaining now is because Atlanta pretty much continued to hand our asses to us-- timeouts be damned.

Our performance (or lack thereof) can hardly be blamed on one timeout. And Delanie's fumble on the ensuing kickoff is irrelevant. Had Delanie properly secured the ball we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

3) Benching Shaun Hill is the answer to our offensive problems.

In short, no it isn't. Benching Hill won't help anything. Starting Smith, Davis, or trading for Peyton Manning won't help anything either. Until we fix the O-line, it doesn't matter who's back there if we can't protect him. Yes, I am aware that even when he's has time Hill's throws aren't always perfect.

Still, that doesn't detract from the root issue.

It isn't Hill's fault that as soon as he drops back there's a defender in his face. It isn't Hill's fault that no one respects the run game because our line can't open holes. Defenses are getting pressure on us EVEN when we have Vernon, and Morgan helping to block. And they're doing it with only 4 or 5 rushers.

IMO, this is a scheming issue. Hopefully, our coaching staff will correct this. I know some of you say it's due to lack of talent on the line, so I'll let you guys debate that one.

Thoughts?

Agree on most counts. Although, I do think trading for Peyton Manning would help our offense.
Originally posted by jb49ers80:
Originally posted by baltien:
It's Friday, and I feel like writing. Here are the biggest complaints that I'm seeing around the forums thus far. I just wanted to inject a little reality into the argument:

1) We don't have enough speed on this team.

I wanted to address this first because it's by far the most ludicrous.

Concerning the defense, if there's one thing we do have on that side of the ball, it's definitely speed. They were plenty fast enough to stop Adrian Peterson, Fitz, Boldin, and Steven Jackson. And the big plays we gave up to Atlanta weren't due to lack of speed, it was due to lack of proper technique.

On Roddy White's 90 yard touchdown Nate was in position, he just tried to break on the ball instead of making the tackle. I will concede that Roman got torched, but it's been fact for awhile now he isn't exactly a burner. Going back and looking at Michael Turner's big runs, more often than not someone got a hand on him early.

They just failed (miserably) to wrap him up.

Offensively, I can agree that we do need faster players in certain positions, but it's not as bad as people are making it out to be. On Josh Morgan's 70 yard reception, he only got caught because he started jogging at around the 10. On the Bly interception, same deal. He started showboating and assumed that no one was behind him.

So what we saw in that game pretty much boils down to lack of focus. Mental mistakes that Atlanta made us pay dearly for.

2) I don't like the way that Coach Sing uses timeouts.

Again, the responses to this are more reactionary than logical. Case in point:

The decision to call time out towards the end of the Arizona game to "rally the troops" was lauded because we went on to WIN. The only reason people are complaining now is because Atlanta pretty much continued to hand our asses to us-- timeouts be damned.

Our performance (or lack thereof) can hardly be blamed on one timeout. And Delanie's fumble on the ensuing kickoff is irrelevant. Had Delanie properly secured the ball we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

3) Benching Shaun Hill is the answer to our offensive problems.

In short, no it isn't. Benching Hill won't help anything. Starting Smith, Davis, or trading for Peyton Manning won't help anything either. Until we fix the O-line, it doesn't matter who's back there if we can't protect him. Yes, I am aware that even when he's has time Hill's throws aren't always perfect.

Still, that doesn't detract from the root issue.

It isn't Hill's fault that as soon as he drops back there's a defender in his face. It isn't Hill's fault that no one respects the run game because our line can't open holes. Defenses are getting pressure on us EVEN when we have Vernon, and Morgan helping to block. And they're doing it with only 4 or 5 rushers.

IMO, this is a scheming issue. Hopefully, our coaching staff will correct this. I know some of you say it's due to lack of talent on the line, so I'll let you guys debate that one.

Thoughts?

Agree on most counts. Although, I do think trading for Peyton Manning would help our offense.

Manning and his coaching staff would improve the offense....
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
1) We are the slowest team in the NFL on offense and actually a little slow on defense too at certain positions. Yes our speed or lack of it is terrible.

2) Coach Sing's timeouts for PEP RALLY's and clock management / game management would rank him #32 in the league right now.

3) Hill is a huge problem. He can only throw a 7 - 8 yard pass. Anything 10 + is out of the question. The D. stacks the box within a 10 yard area becuase he is no threat beyond that. Anything beyond that and the ball will come down "like a punt" and be uncatchable.

Yes the O Line is the bigger problem. But that still doesn't fix the weakness that is Shaun Hill.

Arizona is slower on offense than us, and they seem to do just fine. Baltimore's speed is similar.
Myths:
1. Smashmout works
2. Motivation is more important than schemes
3. 5 guys can block 8 motivated big fast guys
4. Hill or Smith can succeed in this offense
5. The QB isn't important
6. Having a fast running back that can go outside isn't important
7. Catch phrases and a stern demeanor are good coaching attributes
8. If you run a screen pass 100 times, it will eventually go the distance
9. If you run at the middle of the line 100 times the defense will give up
10. This is Chicago or Baltimore
11. You want this to be Chicago or Baltimore
12. This is all a better idea than Martz' scheme
13. It will be possible to come up with the best OL in NFL history
14. The stands are full of happy True Believers
15. Ownership will have the guts to end this and get real.
16. Purple Kool-Aide is good for you.
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
1) We are the slowest team in the NFL on offense and actually a little slow on defense too at certain positions. Yes our speed or lack of it is terrible.

2) Coach Sing's timeouts for PEP RALLY's and clock management / game management would rank him #32 in the league right now.

3) Hill is a huge problem. He can only throw a 7 - 8 yard pass. Anything 10 + is out of the question. The D. stacks the box within a 10 yard area becuase he is no threat beyond that. Anything beyond that and the ball will come down "like a punt" and be uncatchable.

Yes the O Line is the bigger problem. But that still doesn't fix the weakness that is Shaun Hill.

You HAVE to be kidding with this hyperbole.
If Singletary's rah rah stuff was working(all offseason, training camp and in practices) he wouldn't need to call timeouts during games for a pep talk.

His game management blows. It better improve in a hurry.
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
1) We are the slowest team in the NFL on offense and actually a little slow on defense too at certain positions. Yes our speed or lack of it is terrible.

2) Coach Sing's timeouts for PEP RALLY's and clock management / game management would rank him #32 in the league right now.

3) Hill is a huge problem. He can only throw a 7 - 8 yard pass. Anything 10 + is out of the question. The D. stacks the box within a 10 yard area becuase he is no threat beyond that. Anything beyond that and the ball will come down "like a punt" and be uncatchable.

Yes the O Line is the bigger problem. But that still doesn't fix the weakness that is Shaun Hill.

I half agree with #1. #2 to is based on personal feelings and not actual statistics so I'll ignore it all together. #3 is exaggerated (7-8yrds) but the truth is, he can't make alot of the NFL throws.

This is where me and my 13yr old has the biggest disagreements. I think Hill should be sat down and he thinks the O-line is the source of Hill's problems. Don't get me wrong, our O-line sucks but I'm not sold on Hill making those throws even with protection.

I'm one of the Zoners in favor of getting a QB next FA or Draft and then pushing either Hill or Smith the way of the Huard-Dodo bird, RIP.
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
1) We are the slowest team in the NFL on offense and actually a little slow on defense too at certain positions. Yes our speed or lack of it is terrible.

2) Coach Sing's timeouts for PEP RALLY's and clock management / game management would rank him #32 in the league right now.

3) Hill is a huge problem. He can only throw a 7 - 8 yard pass. Anything 10 + is out of the question. The D. stacks the box within a 10 yard area becuase he is no threat beyond that. Anything beyond that and the ball will come down "like a punt" and be uncatchable.

Yes the O Line is the bigger problem. But that still doesn't fix the weakness that is Shaun Hill.


Hi troll,

I'm glad you have the 40 times of every player on offense and defense and can say that we are the slowest team in the NFL, even if it's not about 40 time, I'm sure you have watched EVERY NFL team this season at least 3 games, and thus came to this conclusion.

Once again how do you come to the conclusion that Sing's time management would rank 32 in the league??? He's called good time outs and made good challenges.

Really...he can only throw 7 yards...so what you are telling me that he has the arm strength of a 2nd grader. The throw the Bruce, the TD passes to VD?

It's obvious, that once again you are talking out of your ASS.