I know 99% of the Zone hate Lynch but this is worth reading RE:oFfense (UPDATED)

Originally posted by luis1985:
What about our D? No one seemed prepared and ready for the Falcons. No adjustments or anything, they did to us what ever they wanted. IMO our D coach is a bit overrated, but he still young and learning so I'm not mad at him as I am with our O coach.

Can I say 8th Offensive Cord. in 8 years? Loos more like it everyday. Raye just ain't cutting it.

The D had a bad day is an understatement. This was one of those "shootout" games, where we came to a gunfight with a can of hairspray. Even in the 80's we had to outscore opponents who knew how to score on us, and came out on top. We cant do that here. Down by 21, we lose. Put the blame on our smashmouth philosophy.

[ Edited by TheCatch on Oct 13, 2009 at 07:53:20 ]

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by pd24:

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:

Originally posted by Schulzy:
this explains why Vernon and Shaun were not in sync all day. VD should have been turning around to look for the ball. He is the hot receiver when the Falcons brought a blitz.

It depends on where the blitz comes from, that determines the hot reciever hence Vernon not turning around bc he wasn't the hot reciever and Hill read it wrong.

Even if Davis did turn around all those throws would have been at his feet.

Yup. These are just more excuses, err Hillusions.

Is Hillusions copywritten? If not I would like to steal it and use it in abundance. I don't care what is said about the oline/scheme/wr's/rb's (insert other position that made Hill suck) S. Hill is NOT a starting QB and should be the #1 focus in the offseason considering the flexability that extra 1st will afford us.

Originally posted by WINiner:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by pd24:

Originally posted by nvchamp9ers:

Originally posted by Schulzy:
this explains why Vernon and Shaun were not in sync all day. VD should have been turning around to look for the ball. He is the hot receiver when the Falcons brought a blitz.

It depends on where the blitz comes from, that determines the hot reciever hence Vernon not turning around bc he wasn't the hot reciever and Hill read it wrong.

Even if Davis did turn around all those throws would have been at his feet.

Yup. These are just more excuses, err Hillusions.

Is Hillusions copywritten? If not I would like to steal it and use it in abundance. I don't care what is said about the oline/scheme/wr's/rb's (insert other position that made Hill suck) S. Hill is NOT a starting QB and should be the #1 focus in the offseason considering the flexability that extra 1st will afford us.

and this is the problem with our fellow "fans"....just read that....

look if Hill sucks like some of you LOVE to spew out....then it shouldn't matter if he does have time or his receivers catch his passes, right?.....so why would you not care.... how about laying off Hill and let these things work themselves out first (Oline, WRs) then when Hill "sucks" like some of expect, he will get benched....but one more time.....until then, to say something like this

"I don't care what is said about the oline/scheme/wr's/rb's (insert other position that made Hill suck)"



also to use another 1st round Draft pick on a QB... Ha! another 4 years of hoping and praying someone reaches their "potential".....on top of that behind this offensive line. Hillarious

[ Edited by Afrikan on Oct 13, 2009 at 09:55:41 ]

Originally posted by TheCatch:

Originally posted by luis1985:
What about our D? No one seemed prepared and ready for the Falcons. No adjustments or anything, they did to us what ever they wanted. IMO our D coach is a bit overrated, but he still young and learning so I'm not mad at him as I am with our O coach.

Can I say 8th Offensive Cord. in 8 years? Loos more like it everyday. Raye just ain't cutting it.

The D had a bad day is an understatement. This was one of those "shootout" games, where we came to a gunfight with a can of hairspray. Even in the 80's we had to outscore opponents who knew how to score on us, and came out on top. We cant do that here. Down by 21, we lose. Put the blame on our smashmouth philosophy.

Well, the 80's was the era of big hair....and big cans of hair spray.

This wasn't a shootout game, Atlanta is not a shootout team. All they did was play smart, disciplined, take advantage of opportunity presented, mistake free football. We, on the other hand, made mistake after mistake, were undisciplined (including making ridiculous penalties), failed to take advantage of opportunities... (Clements f**k up...Bly f**k up...Frankilin f**kup..Davis f**ked up routes, o-line blocking assignment f**kup's, Coffee running into the pile, Hill throwing the ball into the ground, Bruce dropping the ball and the list goes on and on.

Smashmouth football didn't have a damn thing to do with it, playing like a bunch of retarded pop warner rejects did.

Originally posted by TheCatch:

Originally posted by SybErkRimInAL:
raye was too busy sleeping to notice.

Probably was. Send this guy out to pasture. His plays make no sense at a particular times of need, like a 3 yard pass on 3rd and 15. Start a drive down by 35 with a 2 yard run up the middle. Come on! With Singletary being limited to motivation, we need a scheming younger coach in tune with todays football, that adjusts to opponents game plan. Singletary wants Raye, because no other team will grab him in the offseason. Raye needs to retire. Didnt like that hire from the time I heard about it. Martz was a little out of hand, but Singltary made him more efficient. We did move the ball, and march the field. The defense can rear back, and play aggressive with a lead.

Raye is Singltary's guy, and this keeps me from totally believeing in what Singletary is tring to do out there. If Singletary doesnt see the light, it will be his ass as well. Defense cant win it all. Yes you do need offense too. When we are down by 21, the game IS over.

A three yard pass on third and 15 is not designed to net three yards.

Just thought I would mention that.

Martz could march up and down the field all day long, but he was basically ineffective once he got to the opponents 40.

Just thought I would mention that.

When you give up 21 points in about 7 minutes of the second qtr, your defense is definitely playing like 32nd ranked s**t, and no amount of offense will save your ass in the long run. You will get your ass handed to you in the playoff's, no matter how potent your offense is, if your D plays like that. Offense's wins games, defense's win championship's. Defense's matter in the playoff's, if your defense play's bad...your going home.

Just thought I would mention that.

A 2 yard run up the middle is not designed to net 2 yards, especially on first down, outside of a goal line situation, or backed up deep in your own territory.

Just thought I would mention that.

Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

All speculation and woulda coulda shoulda. Everybody failed so back to the drawing board.

Originally posted by vermonator:
All speculation and woulda coulda shoulda. Everybody failed so back to the drawing board.

Now get back to work. DON'T let it happen again.

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by B650:

Originally posted by Jikkle49:
Am I wrong or is he implying that Hill had a bad day because he was the only one ready and everyone else wasn't?

I don't know about you, but if I'm the QB and I know something, I think I'd probably share it with my teammates.

That's the whole mistery to me. Did they tell their teamates? More important, did they tell their OC? Or did they keep the info to themselves (why would they do that)?

isnt the oc's job to tell the qb things and not the other way around?

Originally posted by vermonator:
All speculation and woulda coulda shoulda. Everybody failed so back to the drawing board.

That is the bottom line, everybody f**ked it up. Uncharacteristically f**ked it up.

At this point I would MAYBE be more concerned with a pattern that is developing of these big lows/big highs.

Minny..big low.
Rams..big high.
Atlanta..big low.

This points to a team that is in some sort of transition, some sort of middle ground with who they are, and their execution of who they are. At some point that's going to change and it's going level out. When it does they will either be steady winner's or steady something else. They need to break this Jekyl/Hyde pattern. The best, easiest way to do that is to never allow themselves to get too high or too low. They may learn that lesson now that Atlanta blew their asses out, so in the long run, the Atlanta lesson maybe a critical piece that was needed. We shall see, but either way, they need to pull their head out of their asses.

[ Edited by Blitz on Oct 13, 2009 at 11:38:46 ]

Originally posted by Blitz:


Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

Please. Everyone that attended training camp said that Hill and Smith looked awful in practice and JTO was by far the better of them.

Just thought I would mention that.

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:


Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

Please. Everyone that attended training camp said that Hill and Smith looked awful in practice and JTO was by far the better of them.

Just thought I would mention that.

Your point doesn't hold much water in the grand scheme of things. The guy was a complete f**k up and Martz didn't seem to mind one bit, whcih puts him right there as well.

Lets tell the truth about all this Martz/ JTO BS..

Martz raved about him.

Martz thought he might even be elite one day.

Martz doesn't want a game manager with a noodle arm, he wants somebody who is accurate as hell with zip, and can do it with the deeper routes.

Martz was a complete f**k up of an OC as well, ranking 22nd in points per game...absolutely pathetic. Unless of course, your into being 22nd ranked and going home in January.

When was the last f**king time Martz has done anything worth a s**t in this league? I'll tell you when...around the last time we were doing something worth a s**t as well, the Mooch years...which was a long long long time ago.

Just thought I would mention that.





[ Edited by Blitz on Oct 13, 2009 at 15:59:44 ]

Originally posted by Blitz:

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:


Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

Please. Everyone that attended training camp said that Hill and Smith looked awful in practice and JTO was by far the better of them.

Just thought I would mention that.

Your point doesn't hold much water in the grand scheme of things. The guy was a complete f**k up and Martz didn't seem to mind one bit, whcih puts him right there as well.

Lets tell the truth about all this Martz/ JTO BS..

Martz raved about him.

Martz thought he might even be elite one day.

Martz doesn't want a game manager with a noodle arm, he wants somebody who is accurate as hell with zip, and can do it with the deeper routes.

Martz was a complete f**k up of an OC as well, ranking 22nd in points per game...absolutely pathetic. Unless of course, your into being 22nd ranked and going home in January.

When was the last f**king time Martz has done anything worth a s**t in this league? I'll tell you when...around the last time we were doing something worth a s**t as well, the Mooch years...which was a long long long time ago.

Just thought I would mention that.

Actually he played pretty well in the early games of the season. Heck, I could remember this board going crazy about him. Like I said, he was the better QB when the season began, by far.

And like I pointed out, 22nd in points was the best we had in years. But obviously, there's only much you can do with little talent.

And MArtz made that game manager with a noodle arm look like the real thing. With only one year of experience in a VERY complicated offense.

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:


Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

Please. Everyone that attended training camp said that Hill and Smith looked awful in practice and JTO was by far the better of them.

Just thought I would mention that.

Your point doesn't hold much water in the grand scheme of things. The guy was a complete f**k up and Martz didn't seem to mind one bit, whcih puts him right there as well.

Lets tell the truth about all this Martz/ JTO BS..

Martz raved about him.

Martz thought he might even be elite one day.

Martz doesn't want a game manager with a noodle arm, he wants somebody who is accurate as hell with zip, and can do it with the deeper routes.

Martz was a complete f**k up of an OC as well, ranking 22nd in points per game...absolutely pathetic. Unless of course, your into being 22nd ranked and going home in January.

When was the last f**king time Martz has done anything worth a s**t in this league? I'll tell you when...around the last time we were doing something worth a s**t as well, the Mooch years...which was a long long long time ago.

Just thought I would mention that.

Actually he played pretty well in the early games of the season. Heck, I could remember this board going crazy about him. Like I said, he was the better QB when the season began, by far.

And like I pointed out, 22nd in points was the best we had in years. But obviously, there's only much you can do with little talent.

And MArtz made that game manager with a noodle arm look like the real thing. With only one year of experience in a VERY complicated offense.

If he had him looking so good, how come he had to beg Singletary not to bench his ass?

Lets tell the truth:

The truth is, Hill did just enough and very little more. That's been the general consensus ever since he's had his shot. Hence, he wasn't even named the 2009 starter at the end of the season, and the drafting of Nate Davis.

Doing just enough is a LONG way from "looking like the real thing".

Originally posted by Blitz:

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:


Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

Please. Everyone that attended training camp said that Hill and Smith looked awful in practice and JTO was by far the better of them.

Just thought I would mention that.

Your point doesn't hold much water in the grand scheme of things. The guy was a complete f**k up and Martz didn't seem to mind one bit, whcih puts him right there as well.

Lets tell the truth about all this Martz/ JTO BS..

Martz raved about him.

Martz thought he might even be elite one day.

Martz doesn't want a game manager with a noodle arm, he wants somebody who is accurate as hell with zip, and can do it with the deeper routes.

Martz was a complete f**k up of an OC as well, ranking 22nd in points per game...absolutely pathetic. Unless of course, your into being 22nd ranked and going home in January.

When was the last f**king time Martz has done anything worth a s**t in this league? I'll tell you when...around the last time we were doing something worth a s**t as well, the Mooch years...which was a long long long time ago.

Just thought I would mention that.

Actually he played pretty well in the early games of the season. Heck, I could remember this board going crazy about him. Like I said, he was the better QB when the season began, by far.

And like I pointed out, 22nd in points was the best we had in years. But obviously, there's only much you can do with little talent.

And MArtz made that game manager with a noodle arm look like the real thing. With only one year of experience in a VERY complicated offense.

If he had him looking so good, how come he had to beg Singletary not to bench his ass?

Lets tell the truth:

The truth is, Hill did just enough and very little more. That's been the general consensus ever since he's had his shot. Hence, he wasn't even named the 2009 starter at the end of the season, and the drafting of Nate Davis.

Doing just enough is a LONG way from "looking like the real thing".

I said he "looked like the real thing", never said he was the "real thing", especially since I don't believe he is. Heck, if our offensive line were not so crappy I would actually be in favor of drafting a QB with one of our 1st round picks. Still, remember that Hill won a extension based on what he did last year.

And as for JTO, like I sadi, he started remarkably well. His game against Seattle (the first one obviously) was excellent. Then, he went downhill in October, which forced Singletary to make the change. However, t's not too hard to understand why Martz didn't want to do that: Hill is known for being a poor practice player, and given it was his first year in a new offense (and a very complicated one), it's easy to deduce he was stinking up in practice. But Singletary knew that that was his pattern.

Just to sum up my position:

I think our talent on O is very poor. We desperately need an answer at QB and some positions at OL. But I also think that we yhave a excellent D, and if we had an OC capable of at least fielding a servicable O (like Martz or Turner), that could earn us some estra Ws.

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:

Originally posted by Brazilian49er:

Originally posted by Blitz:


Martz was completely out of hand. He started a QB who essentially lost any hope for us winning several games due to his bad decision making, and Martz appeared to have ZERO inclination to bench him. Read: "We are not a f**king charity." It appeared Martz was happy to keep his boy in there, even at the expense of us becoming a charity. Side note: Singletary didn't put up with that s**t for even half a game.

Just thought I would mention that.

Please. Everyone that attended training camp said that Hill and Smith looked awful in practice and JTO was by far the better of them.

Just thought I would mention that.

Your point doesn't hold much water in the grand scheme of things. The guy was a complete f**k up and Martz didn't seem to mind one bit, whcih puts him right there as well.

Lets tell the truth about all this Martz/ JTO BS..

Martz raved about him.

Martz thought he might even be elite one day.

Martz doesn't want a game manager with a noodle arm, he wants somebody who is accurate as hell with zip, and can do it with the deeper routes.

Martz was a complete f**k up of an OC as well, ranking 22nd in points per game...absolutely pathetic. Unless of course, your into being 22nd ranked and going home in January.

When was the last f**king time Martz has done anything worth a s**t in this league? I'll tell you when...around the last time we were doing something worth a s**t as well, the Mooch years...which was a long long long time ago.

Just thought I would mention that.

Actually he played pretty well in the early games of the season. Heck, I could remember this board going crazy about him. Like I said, he was the better QB when the season began, by far.

And like I pointed out, 22nd in points was the best we had in years. But obviously, there's only much you can do with little talent.

And MArtz made that game manager with a noodle arm look like the real thing. With only one year of experience in a VERY complicated offense.

If he had him looking so good, how come he had to beg Singletary not to bench his ass?

Lets tell the truth:

The truth is, Hill did just enough and very little more. That's been the general consensus ever since he's had his shot. Hence, he wasn't even named the 2009 starter at the end of the season, and the drafting of Nate Davis.

Doing just enough is a LONG way from "looking like the real thing".

I said he "looked like the real thing", never said he was the "real thing", especially since I don't believe he is. Heck, if our offensive line were not so crappy I would actually be in favor of drafting a QB with one of our 1st round picks. Still, remember that Hill won a extension based on what he did last year.

And as for JTO, like I sadi, he started remarkably well. His game against Seattle (the first one obviously) was excellent. Then, he went downhill in October, which forced Singletary to make the change. However, t's not too hard to understand why Martz didn't want to do that: Hill is known for being a poor practice player, and given it was his first year in a new offense (and a very complicated one), it's easy to deduce he was stinking up in practice. But Singletary knew that that was his pattern.

Just to sum up my position:

I think our talent on O is very poor. We desperately need an answer at QB and some positions at OL. But I also think that we yhave a excellent D, and if we had an OC capable of at least fielding a servicable O (like Martz or Turner), that could earn us some estra Ws.

JTO did not have an excellent game in Seattle. He had 321 yards and a TD. He also had a fumble at a critical time (he recovered it thankfully) and he also took eight sacks. As we all became aware of as time progressed, JTO was part of the problem with the sacks, he held onto the ball way too long and was indifferent to the approaching pressure. In hindsight, he was doing in the Seattle game as well. As it was, we scraped by for the win on a field goal. Note: 321 passing yards and one passing TD. Once again, I repeat.... Martz offense was unstoppable from our 20 to their 40, and they sucked ass royally from there.

I am with you on your summation of your position, I have the same except:

I still don't know where you are getting this thing about our offense being serviceable under Martz. He simply did not score enough points to say that he was guiding a serviceable offense, and that was because his offense sucked ass inside the opponents 40. I really don't see how Mart'z is an improvement over Raye, I just don't see it. Maybe it just looks prettier? And, I do believe, Norv is stinking it up pretty bad down there in SD, which says a lot because the talent level on that O is WAY higher than what we have here. He has River's, he has Sproles, he has LT, he has Gates...much more talent than here..... and he is still stinking it up big time. And you think he can somehow do more with less, here? I just don't see it.