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OLB's in the 3-4/Sack Stats

Why don't you post the sacks from 3-4 Defensive Linemen?
Originally posted by Brazilian49er:
Sacks are overrated. Our pass-rush pwas very god against ARI and MIN, not so much agaisnt SEA.

I wouldn't say sacks are over rated. They are big momentum killers and drive stoppers. Sacks can take you out of field goal range and in our case on Sunday could have helped us kill more time off the clock on Minnesota's game winning drive.

If you have an elusive QB who knows how to use his feet in the pocket then completions will still be made.
Originally posted by FourNine49:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by FourNine49:
If you think about it, Lawons and Harralson are doing more than producing sacks. All of the hits, hurries, and ass. sacks are also helping us.

As long as were in the + in turnover ratio, that's fine with me. Not to mention that our D is getting respect as one of the tougher football teams

I'm sure you could say the same thing for ALL of the OLB's in the 3-4 but most are still getting sacks too. I did notice that many of the other LB's also have comparble tackles/assist but more INT's, FF's & passes defended. The difference = low sacks.

Yeah you're right . But given the fact that we had no personnel changes in the front 7 from last year, and we're seeing considerably better results, I'll take it. That just goes to show you that the coaching and mentality of this team is better off. GO NINERS!

Good point and I agree. We've got good depth along the line which has really helped too and so far, no injuries.

But I am worried b/c we only have one sack from our OLB's and they are going to wear down/injuries. We need a better rotation in there with Brooks/Harris.
Originally posted by teeohh:
we'll get a lot of sacks this weekend
Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:
Originally posted by Brazilian49er:
Sacks are overrated. Our pass-rush pwas very god against ARI and MIN, not so much agaisnt SEA.

I wouldn't say sacks are over rated. They are big momentum killers and drive stoppers. Sacks can take you out of field goal range and in our case on Sunday could have helped us kill more time off the clock on Minnesota's game winning drive.

If you have an elusive QB who knows how to use his feet in the pocket then completions will still be made.


I don't think he meant sacks are overrated in and of itself. I think it becomes a problem when you SIMPLY measure a 3-4 OLB's productivity on sacks alone. A sack is only one play out of 20-70 plays (depending on how many snaps the defender takes). To simply judge someone on something that happens 5% or less of the time isn't a true measure of their productivity.

When you factor in hits, hurries, pressures, passes deflected, etc, then you get a true measure of how that defender is effecting the QB. While it would be nice if our OLB's have better numbers, they have been solid overall. It was a known fact that we needed pash rush help entering this season. To think that either Manny or Parys were both going to put up 10 + sacks is unrealistic.

Again, we have to realize it is only week 3, so by week 8, we should be middle of the pack.
Originally posted by Schulzy:
Why don't you post the sacks from 3-4 Defensive Linemen?

Go for it! My focus was on our weakness, not our strength right now. Besides that, many 3-4 defense use a solid rotation of d-linemen so unless you include the whole rotation along with the starters, it wouldn't be an accurate account. With OLB's, they typically play every snap and only a couple teams have had injuries (Merriman) or use a rotation (Patriots).
Did they take into consideration the sacks that weren't counted for Harolson?
Originally posted by backontop:
Did they take into consideration the sacks that weren't counted for Harolson?

NFL.com. These are their "official" stats. But again, every team can say the same thing, "So and so should have been credited with the sack, not so and so." In the end, it tends to even out some. Tackle/assist stats are the worst though in terms of accuracy. Sacks are pretty easy to determine across the board.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by backontop:
Did they take into consideration the sacks that weren't counted for Harolson?

NFL.com. These are their "official" stats. But again, every team can say the same thing, "So and so should have been credited with the sack, not so and so." In the end, it tends to even out some. Tackle/assist stats are the worst though in terms of accuracy. Sacks are pretty easy to determine across the board.

Harolson and Smith were both not credited for all of their sacks. Smith and Harolson should have both had 2 against the Cards. But both were only credited with 1
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by FourNine49:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by FourNine49:
If you think about it, Lawons and Harralson are doing more than producing sacks. All of the hits, hurries, and ass. sacks are also helping us.

As long as were in the + in turnover ratio, that's fine with me. Not to mention that our D is getting respect as one of the tougher football teams

I'm sure you could say the same thing for ALL of the OLB's in the 3-4 but most are still getting sacks too. I did notice that many of the other LB's also have comparble tackles/assist but more INT's, FF's & passes defended. The difference = low sacks.

Yeah you're right . But given the fact that we had no personnel changes in the front 7 from last year, and we're seeing considerably better results, I'll take it. That just goes to show you that the coaching and mentality of this team is better off. GO NINERS!

Good point and I agree. We've got good depth along the line which has really helped too and so far, no injuries.

But I am worried b/c we only have one sack from our OLB's and they are going to wear down/injuries. We need a better rotation in there with Brooks/Harris.

wearing down and injuries... I prefer not to worry about that until it comes up (hopefully it won't). Too much worrying about the future isn't good for you anyway.

Oh and on a play or two, I thought Brooks showed some promise, especially with him having his first game back from injury. I think Sing is doing a great job with letting everyone know that they are no back ups, but merely #2s. These opportunites with Gore and some of the linemen going down give us a chance to see those #2s and truly see if they believe in what Sing has been saying.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by lamontb:
In short the Niners just don't have a pass rusher on this team point blank. Besides from Haralson who is putting in a lot of effort I just don't see it from any LB on this roster. The d line3 has been playing lights out, but yet still no real outside rush. This is the week tha i expect to finally see Manny beat somebody one on one and make a play. But once again i'm probably expecting something from Manny that he just isn't able to do.

Yup! manusky has also been switching Manny/Haralson a lot too but neither have been effective in this regards. This is why I want them to start working Brooks in more b/c he seems to be a better fit for the 3-4 in terms of his skill-set. Having just one guy in there who can rush opens up opportunities for other guys as well. Both Sopoaga & Smith have played fantstasic so far opening things up for them both but the only ones who've cashed in are the d-linemen and in particular, McDonald who leads the team with 2 sacks in limited snaps.

PS: Screw Nolan and his #1 ranked defense!!!

Yea it's like i can't believe it Soap, and Franklin are playing like beasts. But the OLB's can't take advantage of that. And Nolan having a number 1 ranked defense is a clear indication of what this team is missing. A certified pass rusher. Dumervil's ability to beat tackles and create havoc makes the rest of there roster look 10 times better. While Manny can't even beat a TE. Just having that reputation around the league gives you a slight advantage,and gives opponents something to game plan for. Colts defense has horrible players But they look decent b/c Freeney and Mathis stay on the qb's ass. While folks always say it's easily the coach and his scheme it comes down to players. And I've been hard on your boy Brooks but it's time to get him in there more often and see what happens. I remember him making one nice tackle in the backfield and that was it though. Gotta eat against the Rams this week. Put the DB's in one on one coverage and attack Bulger/Boller all day long.

Brooks? I believe he was in on one series where he diagnosed a play beautifully, blew up the field and made an 8 yard tackle for a loss, then he knocked down a pass in coverage and I believe had a good pressure/edge contained well and then they sat him down for the rest of the game.

But in terms of his overall game, he hustles his ass off, has an EXPLOSION (2nd gear when he sees the QB, RB, TE or RB), is bigger, stronger then Manny, not as tall, better center of gravity, plays the edge very well while containing RB's and is better in coverage then most think. He also has the ability to bull rush and speed rush around OT's and does a better job of disengaging blockers. He's got the skill-set, the talent, the hustle and motivation this year...now he just needs to be worked into the lineup on a regular basis. In 3 snaps he did more then most of our entire individual defensive players did.

That tackle for a loss that Brooks made, was one of the most explosive plays I have ever seen from a linebacker. That was unbelievable.

It looked like he was out of the play and the running back (was it Peterson?!) would easily take the edge, but he exploded five yards upfield for the tackle.

Now I know why people have talked about his potential for so long.


But don't forget, Manny made some terrific plays as well throughout the game.
He blew up a running play on the left, and he got pressure on Favre early (I thought for sure he would get the sack).

I think Manny is one of the best run stuffing outside linebackers in the league.

I agree though, we should continue to work Brooks into the rotation.
[ Edited by BrianGO on Sep 29, 2009 at 1:15 PM ]
What about hurries and QB pressures? They both seem to be riding the qb while not necessarily getting the sack
Originally posted by SJniner7:
What about hurries and QB pressures? They both seem to be riding the qb while not necessarily getting the sack

Again, we could say the same thing about all of the 3-4 OLB's in the league. Pressures can be just effective esp. if they lead to other's getting sacks or turnovers.
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by backontop:
Did they take into consideration the sacks that weren't counted for Harolson?

NFL.com. These are their "official" stats. But again, every team can say the same thing, "So and so should have been credited with the sack, not so and so." In the end, it tends to even out some. Tackle/assist stats are the worst though in terms of accuracy. Sacks are pretty easy to determine across the board.

Harolson and Smith were both not credited for all of their sacks. Smith and Harolson should have both had 2 against the Cards. But both were only credited with 1

I have issues with their "official stats" too. This is why you have these official stats and teams keep their OWN stats as well. NFL.com used to credit D.Smith with tackles even though he'd be 10 feet from the play.
Good post. I would bet that Parys is among the top in QB pressures though. Just from the AZ game alone.