Arguments for Alex Smith and Shaun Hill to Start | Page 30

MadDog49er · 2009-06-25T06:03:44-07:00

The most difficult decision of the Mike Singletary administration will soon have to be made: Who to start at QB. In an attempt to be fair to both parties, I present arguments for both Alex Smith and Shaun Hill. According to Matt Barrows, Alex Smith has looked healthier, stronger, more accurate this past month than in the previous two years. He was the unquestioned starting quarterback two years ago before his shoulder injury, and was a player who seemed to have a strong upside to his game. Did his shoulder injury two years ago affect his ability to play at a high level? Surely. The question is: How much? Smith presents the best long-term QB answer for the Niners, when stacked against Hill. Alex is four years younger, possesses a stronger arm, and has greater mobility in and out of the pocket. Supporters of Smith will state that the Niners' OL has never given Alex the chance to develop his game, as he has been running for his life the moment he stood behind the center. Critics will say that: He simply doesn't get it; although intelligent, he simply has not been able to transition from the shotgun to playing under the center; that he lacks the characteristic of being a strong leader. Critics will argue that he slumps his head too much, isn't a guy who can rally the team effectively, doesn't inspire confidence. All of these statements would be true to some degree. Even the most strident Smith fans would have to admit that these are specific areas of improvement that must happen for Smith to have a starting role in this league. Shaun Hill has been the super-sub the previous two seasons. His high winning percentage, and strong QB rating in 2008, point to a guy as a winner. He is a terrific leader, and even though he doesn't have a dynamic arm, he gets the ball in most places at most times (although it surely isn't pretty). He is consistent, and does a solid job at limiting turnovers in most games. Hill is a solid game manager. Players rally behind him, more so than Smith. Hill has the necessary confidence that Smith has lacked at times. Finally, while Smith has struggled to adjust to four OC's in four years (as predicted last season, the 2009 season would make for a fifth OC), Hill seems to assimilate each offense with greater ease. Critics will state that he has limited upside to his game due to sub-standard arm strength, that he cannot make a number of throws on the field, that he doesn't have the ability to stretch the field. They will state that while Hill must be a game manager to win, Smith can post points on the board, that the offense can be more dynamic. The Niners have a tough call. Outside of the first month of his rookie season, Smith has never come off the bench in his career, and this could be a good thing or bad thing. In one sense, it might take the pressure off of him to produce right away. However, it might also hurt his confidence to be a backup to a NFL journeyman QB. The momentum this spring has been with Smith. How would he react to not getting the starting role? On the flip side, Hill has been outstanding in a backup role. The team would have tremendous confidence in Hill if Smith went down with an injury in a game, or simply was not producing. However, he has never gone into a season as the starter, and the expectations for greater offensive production may not match his skill set. Entering the season as a starter is a far different animal than coming off the bench. And yet, when Hill plays, the Niners win. Would that change if he started the season at QB, instead of a relief pitcher? In the end, the Niners will have to answer the question: Which QB gives us a better chance to win? And the answer could be based upon their thoughts on the offensive line and defense. If the Niners have confidence that they will be able to run the ball efffectively, limit the QB to 20-25 throws a game, and have a studly defense, Shaun Hill would appear to be the better option. However, if the Niners really want to open up the offense in 2009, and feel like the defense will not be strong enough to carry the team this season, Smith may be the better option. There will certainly be more than 1,000 Smith-Hill/Hill-Smith threads once training camp emerges, and the daily drama will surely stoke fires. Ultimately, the team needs to strongly endorse one guy as the starter, or else risk a tough year. Teams with training camp battles at QB, and uncertainty entering the season, struggle to win games, and generally have sub-500 seasons. The goal should be to announce the QB as soon as possible so that everyone is on the same page. Bold 2010 Prediction: There will not be a QB controversy for the Niners in 2010. Either Hill will show that he is a starter in this league, or not. Smith will show that he is a stable franchise QB to build a team around. Or, the Niners will target a QB in free agency or the draft, to start right away. Cheers. [ Edited by MadDog49er on Jun 25, 2009 at 09:30:42 ]

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:11 PM

#436

GoreGoreGore
10HourChicken
Posts: 61,525

Originally posted by B650:
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by jeepzilla:
Originally posted by ninersrule4:
Originally posted by cNiner:
talking about Alex

I know you haven't seen him play in two years, but is there where Alex Smith, because of his arm strength and the better physical tools, might be the better option at quarterback?
Cosell: "Well, I don't think Alex Smith has particularly good physical tools. Certainly, we know Shaun Hill has an average to below-average NFL arm. You're right, we haven't seen Alex Smith throw in two years, but the last time we did see him throw and even when he came out (of college), I'd say Alex Smith's arm strength was slightly better than average - nothing more. I'm always leery - I know he's a smart kid - but I don't know how much he's learned. I'm not there. When you play in the Urban Meyer offense, and I can tell you for a fact, that when Alex Smith went through his board work for teams coming out of the draft that he had zero clue about NFL route combinations, which is not surprising. Because in Urban Meyer's offense, nobody does. I'm not a big Alex Smith guy. I think he has limited skills and I think he's got limited understanding."

http://blog.pressdemocrat.com/49ers/2009/10/filmophile-breaks-down-49ers.html

the whole article !

hes an idiot

Who's an idiot? I admit AS was thrown into the fire, but, he hasn't progressed at all even in the preseason games this year.
Why don't people just sit back and let AS go. If he came out strong in preseason and made an impact, I would say keep riding the horse, however, he still has shown nothing.

06 showed us improvement and was 2-1 (losss to steelers) b4 getting injured

he should've been MVP of the league

since when did improvement mean best in the world i said he showed promise to be a good Qb before he was injured even with our mediocore team

Just a typical response thrown out there by someone without a legitimate rebuttal to a fact. Just shows how limited his depth of knowledge on the subject is.

Sorry I'm not a Smith homer and I've come to accept the fact that this guy is a bust and moved on.

Your depth of knowledge on this must be great, I mean you spend your time in practice working with Smith everyday, so I'm sure your insight on this matter is held in high regards.

Let's face it guys, he didn't have a great WR, a good oline, and a stable OC...there are few QB's in the league that have this, and most of them have out performed Smith.

For anybody to say that Smith can come win, and play better than Hill, is just comedy...he had his chance in TC & Preseason to win the job, he couldn't beat out a undrafted QB with a noodle arm, that says enough.

And if it wasn't for Nate Davis being a rookie, Alex would've been 3rd on the depth chart.

Hill isn't the answer, but neither is Alex, but for now Hill gives us a better chance to win. Until this last game the Alex fans were in the closet hiding, now that we have a bad game (the whole team all round) they sprout right out...typical.

Does Hill really give us a better chance to win? What is it about him that makes that so? He's averaging a TD and 180 yards per game. You telling me Smith can't do better than that? I say he can, and he can also change the way the defense plays us because they have to play differently with him out there. With Hill, there are blind spots all over the field that the defense doesn't even have to worry about. I don't see how Hill gives us a better chance to win. Really, I don't. I could've agreed with you if this was last year, but it isn't. It's a new year with a new OC, and I think Alex fits better now.

I don't believe we would've had the same ball security with Smith, I also don't believe that Smith could've kept his composure like Hill has done and lead us down the field for a score.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:24 PM

#437

backontop
Veteran
Posts: 14,346

Will this dumb ass fued between fans ever end? Does it really matter who is under center? No it doesn't, as long as they can manage the game and win the game when needed. This means in a situation like the Falcons game, when we are behind and we need the QB to make the throws down the field to get points on the board to get back into the game.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:30 PM

#438

Kolohe
Hall of Fame
Posts: 66,812

Originally posted by backontop:
Will this dumb ass fued between fans ever end? Does it really matter who is under center? No it doesn't, as long as they can manage the game and win the game when needed. This means in a situation like the Falcons game, when we are behind and we need the QB to make the throws down the field to get points on the board to get back into the game.

Would love to see a QB in this league comeback from a 35-10 deficit, especially when the defense was getting schooled that day.

And to answer the fued question, if you guys like I can lock every Smith vs. Hill thread that comes up??

Of course no one would be happy about that, since QB's are the scapegoats on our beloved team.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:31 PM

#439

GoreGoreGore
10HourChicken
Posts: 61,525

Originally posted by backontop:
Will this dumb ass fued between fans ever end? Does it really matter who is under center? No it doesn't, as long as they can manage the game and win the game when needed. This means in a situation like the Falcons game, when we are behind and we need the QB to make the throws down the field to get points on the board to get back into the game.

It won't. Way to many people still have a boner for Smith.

IF at the beginning of the season, Smith would've been named the starter, I would've jumped on board, and cheered him on, as much as any other fan. But he didn't, Hill won, but people can't put that aside, and it doesn't matter what Hill does, people just want Smith to play.

As long as Smith is a 49er, we will always be divided, and if he was the starter, you would have the Smith haters calling in for Hill or Davis. It's a no win.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:33 PM

#440

dirtysouthniner
Veteran
Posts: 960

Originally posted by backontop:
Will this dumb ass fued between fans ever end? Does it really matter who is under center? No it doesn't, as long as they can manage the game and win the game when needed. This means in a situation like the Falcons game, when we are behind and we need the QB to make the throws down the field to get points on the board to get back into the game.

It is just a dumb arguement between the fans. Which of our two QB is worst? The bottom line is the 49ers know who there QB is. It's Hill. There hasn't been any talk or rumors about Alex taking over. Hill will continue to be the starter unless he becomes the reason why we lose. Now I know a bunch of Hill haters or Smith backers will piggy back off this statement and give reasons why Hill is the reason we struggle. But Singletary has made it clear that the offensive line is the main reason. I'm sorry but I find him to be a more reliable source than any of you.

[ Edited by dirtysouthniner on Oct 18, 2009 at 12:35 PM ]

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:37 PM

#441

backontop
Veteran
Posts: 14,346

Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by backontop:
Will this dumb ass fued between fans ever end? Does it really matter who is under center? No it doesn't, as long as they can manage the game and win the game when needed. This means in a situation like the Falcons game, when we are behind and we need the QB to make the throws down the field to get points on the board to get back into the game.

It won't. Way to many people still have a boner for Smith.

IF at the beginning of the season, Smith would've been named the starter, I would've jumped on board, and cheered him on, as much as any other fan. But he didn't, Hill won, but people can't put that aside, and it doesn't matter what Hill does, people just want Smith to play.

As long as Smith is a 49er, we will always be divided, and if he was the starter, you would have the Smith haters calling in for Hill or Davis. It's a no win.

The same can be said about Hill. The facts are Hill didn't win the "competition" Singletary went with the safer option. He stated that he knew what he had in Hill. He had a game manager. Hill won't lose you any games, but he won't win you many either. Singletary didn't know what he had in Smith as he hasn't started a game in 2 years. I agree with Singletary's decision 100%. But with the way that Hill has been playing thus far this season, something needs to change. If Smith had started and was performing the same way that Hill has been thus far, I would be still be saying that something needs to change. I don't care who is behind center as long as the damn team wins. I am a 49er fan before I am a fan of a player. I just don't see why so many 49er fans have such hatred for Smith. They act like he raped their mother then whiped his d1ck on their sister. The guy was drafted #1 overall. Yea we get that, did he draft himself? No the team drafted him so if you want to aim your hatred at something at least point it in the right direction. Hate the 49ers and find a new team. One that has a 100% draft pick success rating.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:40 PM

#442

Kolohe
Hall of Fame
Posts: 66,812

Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:41 PM

#443

GoreGoreGore
10HourChicken
Posts: 61,525

Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by backontop:
Will this dumb ass fued between fans ever end? Does it really matter who is under center? No it doesn't, as long as they can manage the game and win the game when needed. This means in a situation like the Falcons game, when we are behind and we need the QB to make the throws down the field to get points on the board to get back into the game.

It won't. Way to many people still have a boner for Smith.

IF at the beginning of the season, Smith would've been named the starter, I would've jumped on board, and cheered him on, as much as any other fan. But he didn't, Hill won, but people can't put that aside, and it doesn't matter what Hill does, people just want Smith to play.

As long as Smith is a 49er, we will always be divided, and if he was the starter, you would have the Smith haters calling in for Hill or Davis. It's a no win.

The same can be said about Hill. The facts are Hill didn't win the "competition" Singletary went with the safer option. He stated that he knew what he had in Hill. He had a game manager. Hill won't lose you any games, but he won't win you many either. Singletary didn't know what he had in Smith as he hasn't started a game in 2 years. I agree with Singletary's decision 100%. But with the way that Hill has been playing thus far this season, something needs to change. If Smith had started and was performing the same way that Hill has been thus far, I would be still be saying that something needs to change. I don't care who is behind center as long as the damn team wins. I am a 49er fan before I am a fan of a player. I just don't see why so many 49er fans have such hatred for Smith. They act like he raped their mother then whiped his d1ck on their sister. The guy was drafted #1 overall. Yea we get that, did he draft himself? No the team drafted him so if you want to aim your hatred at something at least point it in the right direction. Hate the 49ers and find a new team. One that has a 100% draft pick success rating.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:43 PM

#444

backontop
Veteran
Posts: 14,346

Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:45 PM

#445

GoreGoreGore
10HourChicken
Posts: 61,525

Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Well that's not that good of comparison, but what he's trying to point out, is that it's not always on the QB, and even great QB's have a bad game once in a while.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:46 PM

#446

Kolohe
Hall of Fame
Posts: 66,812

Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Nope, you watching the game right now, no protection, accuracy sucks, has a hard time hitting a receiver downfield, running game stuffed. NO defense is killing NYG right now. Would love to see Manning comeback from 41-17.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:46 PM

#447

backontop
Veteran
Posts: 14,346

Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Well that's not that good of comparison, but what he's trying to point out, is that it's not always on the QB, and even great QB's have a bad game once in a while.

I understand the point he is trying to make. But at least compare QB's that are equal in talent.

Oct 18, 2009 at 12:50 PM

#448

Kolohe
Hall of Fame
Posts: 66,812

Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Well that's not that good of comparison, but what he's trying to point out, is that it's not always on the QB, and even great QB's have a bad game once in a while.

I understand the point he is trying to make. But at least compare QB's that are equal in talent.

Why, talent right now, doesn't have no factor, Mannings O-line is getting schooled, defense and out-coached. Manning is out of sync right now with his receivers and hasn't been able to get comfortable.

"Every QB is the same under pressure" - Tom Jackson

Oct 18, 2009 at 1:10 PM

#449

backontop
Veteran
Posts: 14,346

Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Well that's not that good of comparison, but what he's trying to point out, is that it's not always on the QB, and even great QB's have a bad game once in a while.

I understand the point he is trying to make. But at least compare QB's that are equal in talent.

Why, talent right now, doesn't have no factor, Mannings O-line is getting schooled, defense and out-coached. Manning is out of sync right now with his receivers and hasn't been able to get comfortable.

"Every QB is the same under pressure" - Tom Jackson

Look at the distribution of the passes from Manning compared to Hill. Manning is completing passes to his WR's. Hill was completing passes to his RB's and TE's.

Oct 18, 2009 at 1:17 PM

#450

Kolohe
Hall of Fame
Posts: 66,812

Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Hmmph check out Eli Manning down 41-17 with only 100 yards passing.....that guy sucks right.

Again team effort.

The difference betweein Hill and Manning is that Manning has the ability to get the ball to his WR's.

Well that's not that good of comparison, but what he's trying to point out, is that it's not always on the QB, and even great QB's have a bad game once in a while.

I understand the point he is trying to make. But at least compare QB's that are equal in talent.

Why, talent right now, doesn't have no factor, Mannings O-line is getting schooled, defense and out-coached. Manning is out of sync right now with his receivers and hasn't been able to get comfortable.

"Every QB is the same under pressure" - Tom Jackson

Look at the distribution of the passes from Manning compared to Hill. Manning is completing passes to his WR's. Hill was completing passes to his RB's and TE's.

C'mon are you serious??

And you ask why won't this dumbass fued end between fans, but yet you continue to blame Hill for this past loss and can't even agree that it was a team loss and not solely on one player.

Point is to NYG's loss or losing:

Running game stuffed
Defense being owned
O-line beat up

48-20 and you wanna compare talent vs. Hill. In no way am I comparing Hill and Manning, only the comparison in which the teams are poorly operating. Again I would love to see Manning comeback down by this much, since Hill is incapable of doing it.