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MD was right

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by LasVegasWally:
Aldon, Kap, Hunter, Culliver, Miller - so far a damn good draft.

I guess much better than the C- that MD gave it.

I can't wait to see what a B looks like.
  • buck
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Originally posted by WINiner:
Maddog is one of my least liked posters, and I disagree with him often, but when it comes to Watt and Smith he is 100% correct. Our team would be better with JJ Watt than we are with Aldon Smith.

JJ Watt is going to be a HoF type player, while Aldon is going to be real good, but not the level of Watt. Barring injury of course.

Gotta give credit where it's due.


Maybe it is almost time to reconsider your call on this.
Quickest player to 30 career sacks.

Aldon Smith - 27 career games
Reggie White - 28 career games

just saying.


(also FWIW.... Merriman got to 30 sacks in 31 games)
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by WINiner:
Maddog is one of my least liked posters, and I disagree with him often, but when it comes to Watt and Smith he is 100% correct. Our team would be better with JJ Watt than we are with Aldon Smith.

JJ Watt is going to be a HoF type player, while Aldon is going to be real good, but not the level of Watt. Barring injury of course.

Gotta give credit where it's due.


Maybe it is almost time to reconsider your call on this.


yeah Aldon Smith is leading the NFL in sacks
Originally posted by Frisco69ers:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by WINiner:
Maddog is one of my least liked posters, and I disagree with him often, but when it comes to Watt and Smith he is 100% correct. Our team would be better with JJ Watt than we are with Aldon Smith.

JJ Watt is going to be a HoF type player, while Aldon is going to be real good, but not the level of Watt. Barring injury of course.

Gotta give credit where it's due.


Maybe it is almost time to reconsider your call on this.


yeah Aldon Smith is leading the NFL in sacks

Watt is only 2 behind him, and from the DE position. Not to mention all the swats (13).

Aldon is a stud, no doubt. I am a huge fan and LOVE having Aldon on our team. Alldone, Cowboy and Pdub are my favorites on defense.

I just think what Watt is doing early in his career is more difficult. He is putting up 4-3 de sack numbers as a 3-4 end and that's friken impressive.


Imagine what Brooks would do next to Watt. A front 7 of Watt, Soap, Cowboy, Brooks, Willis, Bowman, Alldone

Obviously not possible, but it's fun to imagine.
[ Edited by WINiner on Nov 27, 2012 at 9:44 AM ]
  • buck
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Originally posted by WINiner:
Watt is only 2 behind him, and from the DE position. Not to mention all the swats (13).

Aldon is a stud, no doubt. I am a huge fan and LOVE having Aldon on our team. Alldone, Cowboy and Pdub are my favorites on defense.

I just think what Watt is doing early in his career is more difficult. He is putting up 4-3 de sack numbers as a 3-4 end and that's friken impressive.


Imagine what Brooks would do next to Watt. A front 7 of Watt, Soap, Cowboy, Brooks, Willis, Bowman, Alldone

Obviously not possible, but it's fun to imagine.


The quality play of JJ Watt is indisputable.

But, your stated that Maddog was 100% correct when it comes to Watt and Smith.

Maddog was right about JJ Watt, but he was clearly wrong about Aldon Smith. In my estimation, that is not 100% correct.

[ Edited by buck on Nov 27, 2012 at 9:53 AM ]
Originally posted by buck:
The quality play of JJ Watt is indisputable.

But, your stated that Maddog was 100% correct when it comes to Watt and Smith.

Maddog was right about JJ Watt, but he was clearly wrong about Aldon Smith. In my estimation, that is not 100% correct.


My call was that Watt was the better selection, and I have always held that position. As for A. Smith, he has exceeded expectations, but he was still the number one OLB on my board at the time, so I didn't think he was a future bust. Just thought the selection of Watt would have been superior. Happy Smith is on the roster, but imagine Watt playing LDE opposite Justin Smith. That front four on passing downs would be unstoppable. Either J. Smith or Watt would be singled on every passing down, and that would be disasterous for any OL.

Watt is already tied for Bruce Smith for most pass deflections ever by a DL in a single season (13), and is sixth overall in the NFL this year in that catagory (only topped by corners). The next DL in pass defensed is Brian Robison of the Vikings at 7.

Watt is number one in the NFL in tackles for DL (54). He is also number two in the NFL in tackles for loss for all defenders (one behind Von Miller).

His grade of 67+ this year from Pro Football Focus is astronomically better than any DL in the game, and while I don't have the website in front of me right now, I believe is still the number one graded player in the NFL for 2012. While Aldon Smith has two more sacks than Watt, the big guy is putting up ungodly numbers for a 3-4 DE, rivaled only by Bruce Smith in the history of 3-4 DE's.

While Miller and Aldon Smith can argue who is the better OLB in the game, there is no doubt who is the best DL in the game, and right now, it is not even close. And, that is why Watt will win the DPOY award, and maybe even the NFL MVP, if the current trend continues.

All of this being said, Aldon Smith's greatest improvement this year is in run defense. He is becoming more of a complete player daily.
[ Edited by MadDog49er on Nov 27, 2012 at 1:19 PM ]
  • buck
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Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by buck:
The quality play of JJ Watt is indisputable.

But, your stated that Maddog was 100% correct when it comes to Watt and Smith.

Maddog was right about JJ Watt, but he was clearly wrong about Aldon Smith. In my estimation, that is not 100% correct.


My call was that Watt was the better selection, and I have always held that position. As for A. Smith, he has exceeded expectations, but he was still the number one OLB on my board at the time, so I didn't think he was a future bust. Just thought the selection of Watt would have been superior. Happy Smith is on the roster, but imagine Watt playing LDE opposite Justin Smith. That front four on passing downs would be unstoppable. Either J. Smith or Watt would be singled on every passing down, and that would be disasterous for any OL.

Watt is already tied for Bruce Smith for most pass deflections ever by a DL in a single season (13), and is sixth overall in the NFL this year in that catagory (only topped by corners). The next DL in pass defensed is Brian Robison of the Vikings at 7.

Watt is number one in the NFL in tackles for DL (54). He is also number two in the NFL in tackles for loss for all defenders (one behind Von Miller).

His grade of 67+ this year from Pro Football Focus is astronomically better than any DL in the game, and while I don't have the website in front of me right now, I believe is still the number one graded player in the NFL for 2012. While Aldon Smith has two more sacks than Watt, the big guy is putting up ungodly numbers for a 3-4 DE, rivaled only by Bruce Smith in the history of 3-4 DE's.

While Miller and Aldon Smith can argue who is the better OLB in the game, there is no doubt who is the best DL in the game, and right now, it is not even close. And, that is why Watt will win the DPOY award, and maybe even the NFL MVP, if the current trend continues.

All of this being said, Aldon Smith's greatest improvement this year is in run defense. He is becoming more of a complete player daily.


As I said, your call on Watt becoming a great player was indisputable.

The point I raised, and I raising again, is that your call on Aldon Smith was wrong.

Here is your commentary on the drafting of Aldon.

First Round- Aldon Smith- C grade Smith was the best OLB left on the board when the Niners selected. He does present a need for the team. However, the team intended on selecting a QB along the way, and missed on grabbing the best one in the draft, Blaine Gabbert. Instead, the team selected Colin Kaepernick, who may not be the best fit for the WCO. As for Smith, he is a good straight ahead rush backer. At the same time, he is not an elite athlete, which is what you want from a guy this high on the board. Smith's shuttle numbers at the combine, which show change of direction skills, was amongst the worst for the DE class. He only pressed the bar 20 times, which is not horrible for a guy with a long wingspan, but still mediocre. Smith's long jump, which measures explosiveness, was average, and his cone time was poor. So, while he posted good numbers at Missouri, and certainly has a big upside, the current Smith is not an elite Smith, and to me, too risky for the 7th overall. Can he be great? Maybe. But, once again, the team is not drafting in the 15th, or 20th, or 25th spot. This is the 7th overall. Just not good value.

By the way, you argued that drafting Aldon we lost the chance to draft Blaine Gabbert in the first. You did not argue that we should have drafted JJ Watt.

It would be nice to see you in a simple straight forward fashion just acknowledge that your call on the drafting of Aldon Smith was incorrect.
Aldon Smith may be better. Still think Watt is an absolutely great player.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
My call was that Watt was the better selection, and I have always held that position. As for A. Smith, he has exceeded expectations, but he was still the number one OLB on my board at the time, so I didn't think he was a future bust. Just thought the selection of Watt would have been superior. Happy Smith is on the roster, but imagine Watt playing LDE opposite Justin Smith. That front four on passing downs would be unstoppable. Either J. Smith or Watt would be singled on every passing down, and that would be disasterous for any OL.

Watt is already tied for Bruce Smith for most pass deflections ever by a DL in a single season (13), and is sixth overall in the NFL this year in that catagory (only topped by corners). The next DL in pass defensed is Brian Robison of the Vikings at 7.

Watt is number one in the NFL in tackles for DL (54). He is also number two in the NFL in tackles for loss for all defenders (one behind Von Miller).

His grade of 67+ this year from Pro Football Focus is astronomically better than any DL in the game, and while I don't have the website in front of me right now, I believe is still the number one graded player in the NFL for 2012. While Aldon Smith has two more sacks than Watt, the big guy is putting up ungodly numbers for a 3-4 DE, rivaled only by Bruce Smith in the history of 3-4 DE's.

While Miller and Aldon Smith can argue who is the better OLB in the game, there is no doubt who is the best DL in the game, and right now, it is not even close. And, that is why Watt will win the DPOY award, and maybe even the NFL MVP, if the current trend continues.

All of this being said, Aldon Smith's greatest improvement this year is in run defense. He is becoming the most dominant OLB in the league.

Fixed for you.
Originally posted by WINiner:
Maddog is one of my least liked posters, and I disagree with him often, but when it comes to Watt and Smith he is 100% correct. Our team would be better with JJ Watt than we are with Aldon Smith.

JJ Watt is going to be a HoF type player, while Aldon is going to be real good, but not the level of Watt. Barring injury of course.

Gotta give credit where it's due.

Credit Deez....


BTW, WROOOOOOOONG
If you draft a guy capable of 20 sacks in the 1st round, c- grade looks rediculous
http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft2011/index

with all due respect to Von Miller, AJ Green, JJ Watt...... There's no one else taken in the 1st 2011 that i'd rather have over Aldon Smith.


--signed, someone that was upset over the Aldon Smith pick and thought we should have traded down.
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
Quickest player to 30 career sacks.

Aldon Smith - 27 career games
Reggie White - 28 career games

just saying.


(also FWIW.... Merriman got to 30 sacks in 31 games)

Merriman was the best pass-rusher I've ever seen in his first few seasons. That Chargers team was LOADED!
  • buck
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Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Aldon Smith may be better. Still think Watt is an absolutely great player.

From my point of view, this thread simply is not about who is the better player.

I would say that remains to be seen and even then that debate, interesting as it may be, might not have a clear answer.

Maddog graded Aldon's pick as a C. Clearly, evaluations that had Aldon pick rated higher than a C are more realistic.
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