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Talking Cornerbacks: What would you do?

Talking Cornerbacks: What would you do?

  • sfout
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Originally posted by Gore_21:
Originally posted by sfout:
Aaron Ross would be the most expensive we would go in terms of FA CBs IMHO. The media buzz is that we wouldn't do that though, they say we would go after a veteran to push Brock for the #3 role but who if he stuck on the roster would be comfortable as the #4 CB and contribute on ST as well. Guys that come to mind for this mold to name a few would be Chris Carr from the Ravens(was cut last week, played as their #3 or 4 guy behind Jimmy Smith and Cary Williams, fairly skilled KR as well), Anthony Madison(from Pitt, he's a very solid ST guy) to name a few.

Yeah, I can agree with that. I see more of a vet presence #3 guy (maybe starts at 2 but Culliver replaces). Leaves Brock for #4 and ST. I see Carr and Finnegan getting big money from Dallas or St Louis (who will have to make some cuts/restructures). Tracy Porter is probably out of the picture as well.

Richard Marshall from Arizona might not be a bad #3 either. Carr would definitely be an option... maybe Jason Allen of Houston... Aaron Ross...

Out of everyone you just listed I'd go in this order
Jason Allen - He's actually a pretty good CB, definitely be worth the investment if we wanted another starter to let Cully develop more
Aaron Ross - I'd want him as a starter simply because him and T. Brown would have chemistry almost instantly, I think he would do well in our system
Richard Marshall - played surprisingly well once AZ's D started geling and he even played FS for Kerry Rhodes at some points.
Originally posted by sfout:
Out of everyone you just listed I'd go in this order
Jason Allen - He's actually a pretty good CB, definitely be worth the investment if we wanted another starter to let Cully develop more
Aaron Ross - I'd want him as a starter simply because him and T. Brown would have chemistry almost instantly, I think he would do well in our system
Richard Marshall - played surprisingly well once AZ's D started geling and he even played FS for Kerry Rhodes at some points.

I would be happy with any of those guys but I think Rogers would be tops on the list. Either way I would take any of those 3 or Rogers over any CB in the draft. Not too big on the CB class. IMO it drops off after the 1st two and the 3rd one (Jenkins) is just asking to be bit in the ass. He is boom or bust majorly... even if he booms be prepared for off the field problems, paying his child support, etc After that I mean the guys are ok to solid but nobody really worth pick 30 IMO.
The best value pick at CB/KR is Laron Scott form Georgia Southern University. He will give you the best value for your money. Watch the tape vs the Alabama Game and you will see for yourself! Laron Scott, Georgia Southern, KR/DB, Pocket sized Ball of Fire by Damond Talbot on Mar 3, 2012 11:43 PM EST in 2012 NFL Draft5 comments Email Print More photos »">Mike Zarrilli - Getty ImagesMore photos »Laron Scott, DB/KR, burned the sidelines up against Alabama this year, and is often forgotten, but why is he always being looked over? Is it his height? Laron Scott, made a major impression this year in the Southern Conference of the FCS. Laron Scott sits at just about 5'9 and 179 pounds, but he is often forgot about. Laron Scott is not just a defensive back, he is one of the most explosive kick returners in the NCAA, this year, averaging 31 yards a return. Laron Scott exploded for 2 touchdowns on kick returns and his biggest one came when he did it against Alabama this year. Laron Scott 95 Yard Kickoff Return for a TD (via redkees5)I was able to watch several games this year on Laron Scott, but what impresses me the most about Laron Scott is not just his return ability. Everyone is talking about guys in the SoCon division like Ryan Steed of Furman and Corey White of Samford, but why not talk about Laron Scott of Georgia Southern especially as a defensive back? Let's break them down and see the differences, between the three of them, to see who can bring more to your team, stats wise, we all know that Ryan Steed is a freak of an athlete, and Corey White did a great job at the Combine, but let's just compare the three to see what they have differently over last year.Corey White - Samford - Had 5 Pass Break Ups, 4 Interceptions, 58 tackles and 2 forced fumbles, 1 TDRyan Steed - Furman - Had 4 Pass Break Ups, 4 Interceptions, 46 tackles Laron Scott - Had 18 Pass Break Ups, 3 Interceptions, 53 tackles, and 1040 Kick Return Yards with 2 touchdownsI understand that Laron Scott, is smaller, and might have better production, but what does that mean? I will tell you what it means, he is much better at coverage then what people are giving him credit for. He is a dual threat, and is not being talked about the way he should. You should check out more on this kid, because he has had more production then any Kick Returner in NCAA, over the past couple years, and is one of the main reason that Georgia Southern made it to the Championship this year and won it.
  • sfout
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Originally posted by Gore_21:
Originally posted by sfout:
Out of everyone you just listed I'd go in this order
Jason Allen - He's actually a pretty good CB, definitely be worth the investment if we wanted another starter to let Cully develop more
Aaron Ross - I'd want him as a starter simply because him and T. Brown would have chemistry almost instantly, I think he would do well in our system
Richard Marshall - played surprisingly well once AZ's D started geling and he even played FS for Kerry Rhodes at some points.

I would be happy with any of those guys but I think Rogers would be tops on the list. Either way I would take any of those 3 or Rogers over any CB in the draft. Not too big on the CB class. IMO it drops off after the 1st two and the 3rd one (Jenkins) is just asking to be bit in the ass. He is boom or bust majorly... even if he booms be prepared for off the field problems, paying his child support, etc After that I mean the guys are ok to solid but nobody really worth pick 30 IMO.

I'd have to disagree, Gilmore, Trumaine Johnson, Casey Hayward, and Josh Robinson are well worth a 1st or 2nd round choice as well. After that I wouldn't really want a CB unless it was a developmental project like Omar Bolden.
  • KID9R
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Why the hell would we draft an OL or TE in the first?
  • sfout
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  • Posts: 6,251
Originally posted by KID9R:
Why the hell would we draft an OL or TE in the first?

TE because more then likely Nate Byham will "take over" Moran Norris' roster spot and be listed either as a 4th TE or the Backup FB even though he will see the field very frequently. We don't need 2 FBs but we need as many TEs as Harbaugh can have in order to run his full offense.

In almost every package that we used DTs as FBs or extra OL JH would rather use TEs, he said in college he would use the DL guys to simply get them more playing time and work on their football skills as a whole. So it makes perfect sense for him to simply fill the roster spot currently being held by an aging 30 year old FB with a young TE.

No way we go guard or center early IMHO.
[ Edited by sfout on Mar 6, 2012 at 6:46 PM ]
Originally posted by KID9R:
Why the hell would we draft an OL or TE in the first?

Did you watch the games this year? We gave up 44 sacks which is like 25th or something like that in the league. Goodwin gave up 6 sacks and his previous high was 1.5... we have him for 2 more years but no doubt he will have to be replaced soon (maybe after next year, maybe now). Also, Snyder is a free agent and behind him we have a 5th round pick in Daniel Kilgore and a 7th round pick in Mike Person. Not saying they can't develop but we are too close to a SB appearance and IMO we need guys who can step in day one and do well. Some people like Snyder and I would say he is playing his best ball yet but that doesn't mean he is top notch. He is average IMO and upgrading the RG spot would make Anthony Davis and Jonathan Goodwin instantly better.

As for TE here is a post I made a while back explaining that..

I expect teams to start using more 2 TE sets and do what the Pats do. They really only had Welker and because of their two TEs they had a good passing game. Here's a good example of the "WR" thing.... remember in 06 when we were desperate for WRs we ended up taking a TE by the name of Vernon Davis. Yeah, he wasn't a WR BUT he was a target... we thought he was the best "receiver" in the draft because the WR crop was poor so we went with a TE who we thought was again "the best receiver" in the draft. It took awhile, some people turned on him... but it worked out. One thing to consider is Fleener probably won't take the time VD did to emerge. He's NFL ready, VD was just raw plutonium.

P.S. To clear things up most don't think Fleener is the best receiver in the draft like we did with VD but it's a similar situation in that a lot of us think the crop at 30 is really sketchy. There are a lot of guys but all have huge flaws. I'd take Wright or Blackmon over Fleener as better receivers but they will be long gone. Summing that up I think getting Fleener would be we got the best receiver at pick 30. Again, we are close... we aren't a 2-14 team that can sit and develop players for years. We need guys who can contribute right away and Fleener can step in day 1 and get TDs, convert 3rd downs and give this offense much needed help. Not saying we still won't go after a WR because we will but we need playmakers.
[ Edited by Gore_21 on Mar 7, 2012 at 2:01 AM ]
ITIB
Originally posted by sfout:
I'd have to disagree, Gilmore, Trumaine Johnson, Casey Hayward, and Josh Robinson are well worth a 1st or 2nd round choice as well. After that I wouldn't really want a CB unless it was a developmental project like Omar Bolden.

You think they can step in day one as a #3 CB? Our pass defense was our week spot... we need instant help so that's why I like a vet better. These guys might be better than those vets long term but we are in super bowl mode... it's not like the past 8 years where we were just looking to go above .500. Just playing devil's advocate... I would be fine with picking some of those guys in the 2nd I just think a vet guy would fit us better.
  • sfout
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Yea I think all of them would be capable of pushing Brock for the #3 from day 1. They all played amazing in college, I'm particular confident in Hayward, I've got a bit of personal pride in him because I've staked my claim that if we take a CB I want it to be him but I've watched Vanderbilt for 2 years now and Hayward was consistently impressive, IMO he would thrive as #3 CB because of the passing down situations our defensive scheme would allow him to play shallow and jump routes (one of his strongest traits I noticed was his ability to get around WRs for the PD or INT). After that I would probably go with Trumaine Johnson because of his versatility and athleticism, then Gilmore because of his size and speed combination I think he would be able to adjust to the speed of the game fairly quickly. Then even though I'm super high on Josh Robinson I dont think he would be worth it unless we needed a KR guy, the latest talking head/"expert" chatter from Maycok, Kiper and those people is that he's honestly moved into the 1st round because of his combine, it made people go back and look at his tape and reconsider his grade, making him a top 45 pick. At that point I'm a little weary of him but I wouldn't mind snagging a CB with 4.3 speed who could recover and adjust to receivers as well as he has.

IMHO rather then draft a cb we sign Chris Carr as our 4th db and have him compete with Curtis Holcomb for active duty. Carr can always push Brock for the #3 role and even contribute on special teams as gunner or KR. We've already got 3 guys that the coaches think could be long term CB group in Brown, Cully, and Brock so they will just look for a veteran presence because Brock might be a 5 year vet but he's only started 1 season. The coaches are probably hoping Holcomb shows enough that we can move into the 2013 season with Brown / Cully / Brock / Holcomb as our active CBs on game day.
Thanks, good stuff sfout... although Brock has 2 years in... undrafted out of Belhaven but it' wouldn't hurt getting some vet presence.
http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/gamelog/_/id/13681/tramaine-brock

Here is one of his two ints last year...
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d8225bb58/Brock-interception-return

Love that play, watch Marty B (80 of dallas) get abused on that play. He gets thrown down like 4 times and then justin shoves him like 5 yards.

I like Brock more than most though... only recall two bad plays out of him all year but they were big ones so they made it worse.
http://sportshl.com/football/Cowboys_vs_49ers_highlights/1108363
1 minute into the video
We would have went up 14-0 at halftime but that made it 14-7 right before halftime because he fell.

Other was the 3rd and 15 TD given up to manningham... he was right there...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrFJussi9Zg&feature=related
  • sfout
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 6,251
Originally posted by Gore_21:
Thanks, good stuff sfout... although Brock has 2 years in... undrafted out of Belhaven but it' wouldn't hurt getting some vet presence.
http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/gamelog/_/id/13681/tramaine-brock

Here is one of his two ints last year...
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d8225bb58/Brock-interception-return

Love that play, watch Marty B (80 of dallas) get abused on that play. He gets thrown down like 4 times and then justin shoves him like 5 yards.

I like Brock more than most though... only recall two bad plays out of him all year but they were big ones so they made it worse.
http://sportshl.com/football/Cowboys_vs_49ers_highlights/1108363
1 minute into the video
We would have went up 14-0 at halftime but that made it 14-7 right before halftime because he fell.

Other was the 3rd and 15 TD given up to manningham... he was right there...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrFJussi9Zg&feature=related

Thanks mang. Yea I am also one of the few stanch supporters of Brock, I think he has the skills to be a #3 back and would much rather we didn't draft CB at all but if we did I would want it to be one of those people I talked about. The TD to Manningham is a bit of a bad example because our secondary was still trying to adjust and make the call, you can see that they hadn't communicated the play to Brock right up until the snap so he had to just react to Manningham's movements on his own. IMHO if they had had time to set the coverage better he would've done an even better job on that play.

If I could have things a perfect way I would want us to not re-sign Rogers, sign Carr as the #4 back and move Holomb up to the #5 spot and keep him on the active roster to develop him.
Not many thoughts besides sfout and myself. I'm assuming most haven't really looked at the CB spots. Like I figured everyone is really digging into the WRs. To be honest I haven't much either...
FA
Originally posted by SFATeflonDon:
FA

Who do you like?