Lets not reach for a qb in this draft

Originally posted by matt49er:

Originally posted by BigBug415:

Originally posted by LionHeartofGold:
Agreed. I get so annoyed when fans mention the niners should or will pick a QB in the first round. All of the QBs suggested to be our 1st pick are reaches. Historically, this organization has gone with the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE, which clearly belongs to either a CB like Amukamara or a DE. If Peterson falls to us, it will be God sent, but I doubt it will happen. You guys gotta get off the nuts of Mallet, Locker, Newton, and Gabbert? C'mon now...Gabbert??? We're talkn bout Gabbert? I mean...Gabbert?? The team needs a veteran QB. We must win now while the competition in the NFC West is still pathetic. Any QB we take in the draft will be either in the 2nd or third, most likely third since we will probably use our 2nd on a trade. GABBERT??!!!!

Exactly.

co-signed

Co-Co signed

So many more promising QBs in the day or even day 3 range it's rediculous.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by rk1642:
First off, I know we need a qb with Alex leaving in FA but this years class of qb's is a huge question mark in my opinion. Nobody is a clear cut #1 guy and we can't afford to waste another 1st round pick on a qb.

We need to pick up a couple of FA guys that Jim can coach up and play within the WCO system.

This draft has some very good db's and DE/OLB that we can get in the 1st and 2nd rounds. These are huge needs for us and can help push our D into the top 5-10 in the NFL which can keep us in all of our games.

Let Jim pick a guy in the 3rd and let him sit and learn for a year and coach him up. I don't want a project guy drafted in the 1st and then thrown out there before he's ready.

Better yet, wait till next year when supposedly there are more solid qb's coming out. Spend 2 1st rounders on a targeted guy if need be. By then our team will be pretty set with talent that knows the systems and can help out a rookie qb.

It's a QB driven league. You can scheme on defense. Look at last year's winner the Saints. They would not have won it all without Brees. The defense was nothing special but they had a great defensive coordinator in Gregg Williams who had an aggressive blitz heavy scheme that worked well with their so-so personnel. It's time we take the QB position seriously. There are 7 rounds in the draft, it's not like the defense will be neglected totally if we take a first round QB.

Yea but you forget to mention that Drew Brees was a QB castoff and is only 6-0/6-1 and is not your prototypical passer. He was a late bloomer and if you watch Saints game film you will see that they teach the guards and center to pull to the opposite side of the #1 read so Brees can get a clear passing lane. The saints thrive on timing routes and screens and just have WRs capable of making deep plays.

EDIT: How is the Saints defense not special? Jonathon Vilma is equal to Patrick Willis and Darren Sharper played like his old self year and the DL played out of their minds last year.

If you want to be PC and say a particular player influenced the Saints run last year it was either Sharper or Bush. Bush is in no way a true RB or WR and without his YAC from the screens that Brees throws so often or Sharper's pass coverage the saints wouldn't have been in the playoffs. Case and point: This season, Bush misses 8 weeks and Sharper's play falls off the map and the squeak into the playoffs only to get beat by Seattle.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
I don't see how next years QB's are any better than this year other than Luck. And he too can fall. He can get injured. He doesn't have Harbaugh anymore. There might be slight changes in the system. Some personnel will be different. It will be hard even for Luck to duplicate that year for a variety of reasons. Look at Jake Locker. He was all world Super Man last year. #1 pick for sure. He fell. It can happen to Luck too.

I see no definitive reason 2012 is a better QB year than now. We have a huge QB need. We can't keep waiting forever. We can do this year after year. And keep saying next year. But at some point we need one and we need to coach him up. I think Harbaugh can do that. As long as the player is Harbaugh approved and he coaches the guy up I will be fine with it.

Great post, San Diego. There is no reason to wait when the need is so acute.

Originally posted by sfout:

Originally posted by matt49er:

Originally posted by BigBug415:

Originally posted by LionHeartofGold:
Agreed. I get so annoyed when fans mention the niners should or will pick a QB in the first round. All of the QBs suggested to be our 1st pick are reaches. Historically, this organization has gone with the BEST PLAYER AVAILABLE, which clearly belongs to either a CB like Amukamara or a DE. If Peterson falls to us, it will be God sent, but I doubt it will happen. You guys gotta get off the nuts of Mallet, Locker, Newton, and Gabbert? C'mon now...Gabbert??? We're talkn bout Gabbert? I mean...Gabbert?? The team needs a veteran QB. We must win now while the competition in the NFC West is still pathetic. Any QB we take in the draft will be either in the 2nd or third, most likely third since we will probably use our 2nd on a trade. GABBERT??!!!!

Exactly.

co-signed

Co-Co signed

So many more promising QBs in the day or even day 3 range it's rediculous.

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by rk1642:
First off, I know we need a qb with Alex leaving in FA but this years class of qb's is a huge question mark in my opinion. Nobody is a clear cut #1 guy and we can't afford to waste another 1st round pick on a qb.

We need to pick up a couple of FA guys that Jim can coach up and play within the WCO system.

This draft has some very good db's and DE/OLB that we can get in the 1st and 2nd rounds. These are huge needs for us and can help push our D into the top 5-10 in the NFL which can keep us in all of our games.

Let Jim pick a guy in the 3rd and let him sit and learn for a year and coach him up. I don't want a project guy drafted in the 1st and then thrown out there before he's ready.

Better yet, wait till next year when supposedly there are more solid qb's coming out. Spend 2 1st rounders on a targeted guy if need be. By then our team will be pretty set with talent that knows the systems and can help out a rookie qb.

It's a QB driven league. You can scheme on defense. Look at last year's winner the Saints. They would not have won it all without Brees. The defense was nothing special but they had a great defensive coordinator in Gregg Williams who had an aggressive blitz heavy scheme that worked well with their so-so personnel. It's time we take the QB position seriously. There are 7 rounds in the draft, it's not like the defense will be neglected totally if we take a first round QB.

Yea but you forget to mention that Drew Brees was a QB castoff and is only 6-0/6-1 and is not your prototypical passer. He was a late bloomer and if you watch Saints game film you will see that they teach the guards and center to pull to the opposite side of the #1 read so Brees can get a clear passing lane. The saints thrive on timing routes and screens and just have WRs capable of making deep plays.

EDIT: How is the Saints defense not special? Jonathon Vilma is equal to Patrick Willis and Darren Sharper played like his old self year and the DL played out of their minds last year.

If you want to be PC and say a particular player influenced the Saints run last year it was either Sharper or Bush. Bush is in no way a true RB or WR and without his YAC from the screens that Brees throws so often or Sharper's pass coverage the saints wouldn't have been in the playoffs. Case and point: This season, Bush misses 8 weeks and Sharper's play falls off the map and the squeak into the playoffs only to get beat by Seattle.

Some replies...

1. I didn't mention Brees was a 'castoff' because he wasn't. He was drafted just outside the first round and signed with New Orleans for $60 million.

2. I said the Saints D was nothing special during their Super Bowl run because they weren't. They ranked 20th in points allowed and 25th in yards allowed. To compare, I wouldn't say the '09 Saint defense was any better than the '10 49er defense. They were exceptional at forcing turnovers (often while playing with a lead) but gave up yards and points. Their offense was 1st in the NFL in points and yards. Sure, Bush and Sharper are fine players, but don't kid yourself into thinking they were more integral to the Saints Super Bowl run than Brees.

3. I would laugh if the Saints offered Vilma straight up in trade for Patrick Willis. Sorry, they are not on the same level.

But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

I trust Harbaugh's eye for talent at the QB position more than the WZ GMs

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
I don't see how next years QB's are any better than this year other than Luck. And he too can fall. He can get injured. He doesn't have Harbaugh anymore. There might be slight changes in the system. Some personnel will be different. It will be hard even for Luck to duplicate that year for a variety of reasons. Look at Jake Locker. He was all world Super Man last year. #1 pick for sure. He fell. It can happen to Luck too.

I see no definitive reason 2012 is a better QB year than now. We have a huge QB need. We can't keep waiting forever. We can do this year after year. And keep saying next year. But at some point we need one and we need to coach him up. I think Harbaugh can do that. As long as the player is Harbaugh approved and he coaches the guy up I will be fine with it.

There seems to be quite a few teams needy in the QB department right now. 2010 was the year a lot of veterans fell off and not many young guys stepped forward. I think a lot of QBs will get drafted earlier than they should. Cam Newton will be a good example, the guy will be a project, in a normal year he would probably go in the 3rd or later. Watch someone grab him much earlier. Guy is a great athlete, but pulls it down and runs too quick, guy could end up being a bust.

Originally posted by SF69ers:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

I trust Harbaugh's eye for talent at the QB position more than the WZ GMs

Originally posted by BobS:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
I don't see how next years QB's are any better than this year other than Luck. And he too can fall. He can get injured. He doesn't have Harbaugh anymore. There might be slight changes in the system. Some personnel will be different. It will be hard even for Luck to duplicate that year for a variety of reasons. Look at Jake Locker. He was all world Super Man last year. #1 pick for sure. He fell. It can happen to Luck too.

I see no definitive reason 2012 is a better QB year than now. We have a huge QB need. We can't keep waiting forever. We can do this year after year. And keep saying next year. But at some point we need one and we need to coach him up. I think Harbaugh can do that. As long as the player is Harbaugh approved and he coaches the guy up I will be fine with it.

There seems to be quite a few teams needy in the QB department right now. 2010 was the year a lot of veterans fell off and not many young guys stepped forward. I think a lot of QBs will get drafted earlier than they should. Cam Newton will be a good example, the guy will be a project, in a normal year he would probably go in the 3rd or later. Watch someone grab him much earlier. Guy is a great athlete, but pulls it down and runs too quick, guy could end up being a bust.

I keep saying this, and it keeps getting ignored, but I'm going to say it again.

Every QB in this draft is going to get drafted higher than they should.

It's annoying, but that's reality. There probably won't be a CBA before the draft, and so the only option teams will have for upgrading their QB position is through the draft. That means that every team that has QB needs is going to be reaching for QBs.

So forget about your draft grades. Any QB that 'could' go in the first round will. All those 'mid round' QBs will go in the second round.

If you're saying we should buck the trend and just not worry about drafting a QB in the first few rounds then fine. But all we will be left with at that point are guys that are late round talent, and probably for a reason.

And every year for last few years everyone on this board has said, 'next year's QB class is way better.' Well maybe it's true this year, but you can't keep waiting for the ideal situation to fix the most important position on the team.

We need to come away from this draft with a real QB prospect. And ALL of those guys are going to be drafted in the first two rounds this year.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

If he takes a qb in the first round I'll be confident that he could make it work out.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

Still trying to sell people on Locker huh. I don't think at seven any of them are worth it. Although I hope those in front of us are so that other picks fall to the team.

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

Still trying to sell people on Locker huh. I don't think at seven any of them are worth it. Although I hope those in front of us are so that other picks fall to the team.

You got the wrong guy, Bill. I thought Locker regressed a lot this year and personally don't care for him. IMO, he's fools gold...but my point was, if JH likes him, who am I to disagree?

Let's just wait until next year for this guy:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

Still trying to sell people on Locker huh. I don't think at seven any of them are worth it. Although I hope those in front of us are so that other picks fall to the team.

Perhaps, but the point is, this year we have a guy who is more talented at evaluating the QB position than any of us as arm-chair GMs. If Harbaugh feels Locker, Gabbert, Mallet, Newton Stanzi or whoever is someone he can mold into a start QB, I'm with him all the way. Not only will he have spent hundreds of hours going over all the QBs before the draft, but he will see them in person, interview them and have a better feel for their ability than we will be able to in front of a computer screen looking at youtube highlights and stats on espn.

Bottom line for me at least: I'm not really worried about when they take a QB with Luck out of the picture, so long as Harbaugh feels that that's his guy. Whether we take him in the first round or 7th round is irrelevant to me as long as the coach trusts in him for the future. However, QB is about the only position where I feel this way, uniquely due to Harbaugh.

Originally posted by Niners23:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
But what if Harbaugh tells Baalke, "hey, I can work with Jake Locker and eventually turn him into a NFL starting QB?" Or Mallett, or even Cam for that matter? Is that still a "reach?"

Still trying to sell people on Locker huh. I don't think at seven any of them are worth it. Although I hope those in front of us are so that other picks fall to the team.

Perhaps, but the point is, this year we have a guy who is more talented at evaluating the QB position than any of us as arm-chair GMs. If Harbaugh feels Locker, Gabbert, Mallet, Newton Stanzi or whoever is someone he can mold into a start QB, I'm with him all the way. Not only will he have spent hundreds of hours going over all the QBs before the draft, but he will see them in person, interview them and have a better feel for their ability than we will be able to in front of a computer screen looking at youtube highlights and stats on espn.

Bottom line for me at least: I'm not really worried about when they take a QB with Luck out of the picture, so long as Harbaugh feels that that's his guy. Whether we take him in the first round or 7th round is irrelevant to me as long as the coach trusts in him for the future. However, QB is about the only position where I feel this way, uniquely due to Harbaugh.

Post of the day.

Originally posted by TalkinBoutWILLIS:
unless we trade down i think drafting any qb at pick number 7 is a reach regardless of assessments or not

Agreed.

I would be fine with someone like Christian Ponder in the second round.