49ers select Alfred Collins-DT-Texas with the 43rd pick in the 2025 NFL Draft

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

Overblown to you but I guarantee you the coaches believe otherwise. Yes beating your guy 1 v 1 is what you want to see however guys play within the scheme. Sometimes staying in your gap is more beneficial for the play than beating your guy and playing yourself out of where you need to be.

In some way it's not much different to Martin flying around. Speed is great and getting to the ball carrier is the #1 goal of the linebacker...but you gotta tackle too.

The less thinking a player has to do in a scheme the better they can concentrate on the other things like beating their guys. One of the things Alfred struggled with is his reaction. The more thinking creates slower reaction times. Once he gets the defense down it wouldn't shock me to see him speed things up and improve his ability to beat his matchups doing it.

But of course we have to see it on film first. Let's see how he does vs starters and surrounded by starters. That will be a better evaluation than preseason.

Originally posted by 49ers808:
Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

I understand the barebones of it regarding scheme. He was more read and react, hold his spot and fill in the gaps. This scheme is more about getting upfield and stopping the run on your way to the QB.

But things like pad level and explosiveness matter regardless of what scheme you're in.

Originally posted by genus49:
Overblown to you but I guarantee you the coaches believe otherwise. Yes beating your guy 1 v 1 is what you want to see however guys play within the scheme. Sometimes staying in your gap is more beneficial for the play than beating your guy and playing yourself out of where you need to be.

In some way it's not much different to Martin flying around. Speed is great and getting to the ball carrier is the #1 goal of the linebacker...but you gotta tackle too.

The less thinking a player has to do in a scheme the better they can concentrate on the other things like beating their guys. One of the things Alfred struggled with is his reaction. The more thinking creates slower reaction times. Once he gets the defense down it wouldn't shock me to see him speed things up and improve his ability to beat his matchups doing it.

But of course we have to see it on film first. Let's see how he does vs starters and surrounded by starters. That will be a better evaluation than preseason.

He doesn't get the luxury to learn and develop behind a good vet for a yr. He SHOULD be our best run stuffing DT day 1 based off SF thinking he was the 43rd best player in this past draft. That's part of the problem….Also some of the stuff he's not doing well is pad level and get off. That's not scheme dependent.

We all talk about him being an elite run defender. Let me ask you this, what happens if that's all he's good at and never develops as a pass rusher? Is that worth the 43rd overall pick? Sebastian Joseph-Day was the 7th overall run defender last yr and was an underwhelming pass rusher. Would you be happy with that?

I really hope he turns into a top end 3T because we desperately need it. I'm just not super confident about that

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

Overblown to you but I guarantee you the coaches believe otherwise. Yes beating your guy 1 v 1 is what you want to see however guys play within the scheme. Sometimes staying in your gap is more beneficial for the play than beating your guy and playing yourself out of where you need to be.

In some way it's not much different to Martin flying around. Speed is great and getting to the ball carrier is the #1 goal of the linebacker...but you gotta tackle too.

The less thinking a player has to do in a scheme the better they can concentrate on the other things like beating their guys. One of the things Alfred struggled with is his reaction. The more thinking creates slower reaction times. Once he gets the defense down it wouldn't shock me to see him speed things up and improve his ability to beat his matchups doing it.

But of course we have to see it on film first. Let's see how he does vs starters and surrounded by starters. That will be a better evaluation than preseason.

You can talk about this all you want, but the production both in practice and in games thus far hasn't been good for Alfred Collins. He's certainly not turning heads. Will he improve? The 49ers sure hope so. Also worth pointing out the guys like Kenneth Grant and Derrick Harmon, two guys the 9ers were looking at, have impressed thus far. Martin, Stout, and Robinson have shown to be a possible positive contributors this season. The heavy capital they've invested in the defensive line looks disappointing so far. Who knows, maybe they have been saving Mykel Williams and he'll be unleashed week 1. Good news is they could improve as the season goes along.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

No, they had a 3rd on Kittle and HOPED they could get him in the 5th. There have been a number of times in the past where "the experts" say a player would have been available 2 rounds later but we later learn at least one team was going to take the player with their next pick. The fact that they try to project where a player is going to be picked doesn't mean they are correct.

I can support the Collins pick as reasonable at the time, and so far it hasn't worked as well as they hoped.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

Overblown to you but I guarantee you the coaches believe otherwise. Yes beating your guy 1 v 1 is what you want to see however guys play within the scheme. Sometimes staying in your gap is more beneficial for the play than beating your guy and playing yourself out of where you need to be.

In some way it's not much different to Martin flying around. Speed is great and getting to the ball carrier is the #1 goal of the linebacker...but you gotta tackle too.

The less thinking a player has to do in a scheme the better they can concentrate on the other things like beating their guys. One of the things Alfred struggled with is his reaction. The more thinking creates slower reaction times. Once he gets the defense down it wouldn't shock me to see him speed things up and improve his ability to beat his matchups doing it.

But of course we have to see it on film first. Let's see how he does vs starters and surrounded by starters. That will be a better evaluation than preseason.

Seriously? You guarantee me that the coaches believe that him adjusting to the scheme is the reason for his struggles? I wholeheartedly disagree with that and think it's very naive to believe that's what the coaches are thinking.

You ALWAYS want to beat the man in front of you; even when maintaining gap discipline. You shed the block (beat the man) and go for the ball carrier when the time comes; period. You don't settle with continuing being blocked out of the play because you did the job of filling a gap. If that's the case; NYs point is even more valid, you don't spend the 43rd overall pick on guys to do that.

Originally posted by 49ers808:
Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

He is mentally and physically behind ... nobody is saying otherwise. But if you are mentally behind it's not just beat the man in front of you. If you beat the man in front of you and you are supposed to be steering or anchoring on that play then you've screwed up the play. If you are supposed to shade the guard and you go face up on them then you've screwed up the play. If you are supposed to shoot and you turn them then you've screwed up the play. All of that stuff is based on the play called and what each defensive lineman reads pre-snap, and if you mis-read the pre-snap read then you've screwed up the play. If your read is slow then your first step is going to be slow and you are FAR more likely to be controlled by the OL rather than controlling the OL.

DT is a very complex position as well as being very physical. It takes time for the vast majority of large DTs to start showing what they can be.

All that said, Collins is not showing much positive yet.

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

Overblown to you but I guarantee you the coaches believe otherwise. Yes beating your guy 1 v 1 is what you want to see however guys play within the scheme. Sometimes staying in your gap is more beneficial for the play than beating your guy and playing yourself out of where you need to be.

In some way it's not much different to Martin flying around. Speed is great and getting to the ball carrier is the #1 goal of the linebacker...but you gotta tackle too.

The less thinking a player has to do in a scheme the better they can concentrate on the other things like beating their guys. One of the things Alfred struggled with is his reaction. The more thinking creates slower reaction times. Once he gets the defense down it wouldn't shock me to see him speed things up and improve his ability to beat his matchups doing it.

But of course we have to see it on film first. Let's see how he does vs starters and surrounded by starters. That will be a better evaluation than preseason.

Seriously? You guarantee me that the coaches believe that him adjusting to the scheme is the reason for his struggles? I wholeheartedly disagree with that and think it's very naive to believe that's what the coaches are thinking.

You ALWAYS want to beat the man in front of you; even when maintaining gap discipline. You shed the block (beat the man) and go for the ball carrier when the time comes; period. You don't settle with continuing being blocked out of the play because you did the job of filling a gap. If that's the case; NYs point is even more valid, you don't spend the 43rd overall pick on guys to do that.

No...I guarantee that the coaches want him playing within the scheme. Not simply looking to beat his man all else be damned.

And to NY's point. Obviously if that's all they get from Collins they will be and should be disappointed. But that's the thing...right now he's not a finished product so my point has always been...wait and see.

This is no different than the pages of pages of us arguing Purdy's contract details or worst case scenarios with it before it actually happened. I understand the offseason doesn't leave a lot of stuff to talk about but people on here have a history of overreactions either way early on.

Obviously you want to see guys look great out of the gate and keep it going so Collins' so far has been disappointing. But lucky for him and us, his career isn't over yet. Let's see how he does during the season.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He doesn't get the luxury to learn and develop behind a good vet for a yr. He SHOULD be our best run stuffing DT day 1 based off SF thinking he was the 43rd best player in this past draft. That's part of the problem….Also some of the stuff he's not doing well is pad level and get off. That's not scheme dependent.

We all talk about him being an elite run defender. Let me ask you this, what happens if that's all he's good at and never develops as a pass rusher? Is that worth the 43rd overall pick? Sebastian Joseph-Day was the 7th overall run defender last yr and was an underwhelming pass rusher. Would you be happy with that?

I really hope he turns into a top end 3T because we desperately need it. I'm just not super confident about that

I don't agree that taking a player at 43 means they have to start from day 1 let alone being good from day 1 for the pick to be a good pick. Calais Campbell was the 50th pick in the draft and didn't start a single game until his 2nd year, didn't make a pro-bowl until his 7th year, and now may end up making the hall of fame.

It often takes time for really big DLinemen to show what they can do.

Originally posted by Scoots:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

No, they had a 3rd on Kittle and HOPED they could get him in the 5th. There have been a number of times in the past where "the experts" say a player would have been available 2 rounds later but we later learn at least one team was going to take the player with their next pick. The fact that they try to project where a player is going to be picked doesn't mean they are correct.

I can support the Collins pick as reasonable at the time, and so far it hasn't worked as well as they hoped.

Again overdrafting has yielded next to nothing, so stop doing it. we all talk about how amazing we are at finding talent on day 3, well at that point they're not reaching for guys… like I said hopefully Martin and Stout buck the trend.

also, let's stop acting like they haven't invested hours and hours into draft projections and when so and so probably goes. Read the damn room a little and let's stop being so arrogant to think we're so much better than everyone else with draft evaluation.

The ravens crush drafts and let the top players come to them. It's not reaching solely because of need. They're near the bottom in reaching and have a great roster. Same with Philly.

Originally posted by Scoots:
He is mentally and physically behind ... nobody is saying otherwise. But if you are mentally behind it's not just beat the man in front of you. If you beat the man in front of you and you are supposed to be steering or anchoring on that play then you've screwed up the play. If you are supposed to shade the guard and you go face up on them then you've screwed up the play. If you are supposed to shoot and you turn them then you've screwed up the play. All of that stuff is based on the play called and what each defensive lineman reads pre-snap, and if you mis-read the pre-snap read then you've screwed up the play. If your read is slow then your first step is going to be slow and you are FAR more likely to be controlled by the OL rather than controlling the OL.

DT is a very complex position as well as being very physical. It takes time for the vast majority of large DTs to start showing what they can be.

All that said, Collins is not showing much positive yet.

This scheme takes a lot of the mental out of it, most of it is getting upfield. It's not just anchoring and read and reacting. It's causing havoc and getting upfield quickly. Yes they have stunts and stuff…but it's not as mentally complex as other places.

Bro is just not super explosive off the LOS and doesn't play with great leverage. Maybe that improves but sometimes it's hard to be great there when you're that tall and big.

West is back on the practice field today. I think having him out there will help Collins too.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

Agree with everything.

And people might get mad at me for saying this; especially DL guys (sorry Hero) but all this scheme stuff is getting overblown IMO. Such a freaking cop out man. Beat the man in front of you. That applies to any DLinemen in any scheme; and Collins is struggling with that in 1 V 1, forget even talking double teams.

Overblown to you but I guarantee you the coaches believe otherwise. Yes beating your guy 1 v 1 is what you want to see however guys play within the scheme. Sometimes staying in your gap is more beneficial for the play than beating your guy and playing yourself out of where you need to be.

In some way it's not much different to Martin flying around. Speed is great and getting to the ball carrier is the #1 goal of the linebacker...but you gotta tackle too.

The less thinking a player has to do in a scheme the better they can concentrate on the other things like beating their guys. One of the things Alfred struggled with is his reaction. The more thinking creates slower reaction times. Once he gets the defense down it wouldn't shock me to see him speed things up and improve his ability to beat his matchups doing it.

But of course we have to see it on film first. Let's see how he does vs starters and surrounded by starters. That will be a better evaluation than preseason.

Seriously? You guarantee me that the coaches believe that him adjusting to the scheme is the reason for his struggles? I wholeheartedly disagree with that and think it's very naive to believe that's what the coaches are thinking.

You ALWAYS want to beat the man in front of you; even when maintaining gap discipline. You shed the block (beat the man) and go for the ball carrier when the time comes; period. You don't settle with continuing being blocked out of the play because you did the job of filling a gap. If that's the case; NYs point is even more valid, you don't spend the 43rd overall pick on guys to do that.

No...I guarantee that the coaches want him playing within the scheme. Not simply looking to beat his man all else be damned.

And to NY's point. Obviously if that's all they get from Collins they will be and should be disappointed. But that's the thing...right now he's not a finished product so my point has always been...wait and see.

This is no different than the pages of pages of us arguing Purdy's contract details or worst case scenarios with it before it actually happened. I understand the offseason doesn't leave a lot of stuff to talk about but people on here have a history of overreactions either way early on.

Obviously you want to see guys look great out of the gate and keep it going so Collins' so far has been disappointing. But lucky for him and us, his career isn't over yet. Let's see how he does during the season.

That's fair. But my point isn't (and I never said) beat the man all else be damned, but what I can guarantee you is that is a requirement for any DL on any team in any scheme. That should go without saying. And he's not even doing that in 1 v 1 situations vs guys that will be getting cut here soon; scheme is not the reason for that.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Scoots:
He is mentally and physically behind ... nobody is saying otherwise. But if you are mentally behind it's not just beat the man in front of you. If you beat the man in front of you and you are supposed to be steering or anchoring on that play then you've screwed up the play. If you are supposed to shade the guard and you go face up on them then you've screwed up the play. If you are supposed to shoot and you turn them then you've screwed up the play. All of that stuff is based on the play called and what each defensive lineman reads pre-snap, and if you mis-read the pre-snap read then you've screwed up the play. If your read is slow then your first step is going to be slow and you are FAR more likely to be controlled by the OL rather than controlling the OL.

DT is a very complex position as well as being very physical. It takes time for the vast majority of large DTs to start showing what they can be.

All that said, Collins is not showing much positive yet.

This scheme takes a lot of the mental out of it, most of it is getting upfield. It's not just anchoring and read and reacting. It's causing havoc and getting upfield quickly. Yes they have stunts and stuff…but it's not as mentally complex as other places.

Bro is just not super explosive off the LOS and doesn't play with great leverage. Maybe that improves but sometimes it's hard to be great there when you're that tall and big.

I was just about to respond to this but you did it for me.

All Gas No Brakes!!

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Scoots:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
He was dominant in a different scheme and not as a pass rusher. Will it take time for him to adapt to this scheme, sure. When you have nothing as a proven vet in front of him to allow him time, that's an issue. Overall he hasn't look great and I expect someone who's "dominant" vs the run to have that show up in preseason vs backup caliber talent. Regardless of scheme.

people act like they have zero clue when players are going and imo that's kinda BS. Like I mentioned before they had a 3rd on Kittle, but knew they could get him in the 5th. They have a ton of people whose job is to dissect the draft and where guys are projected to go...they talk to all the agents (who talk to all the teams). There's rough round about grades. SF overall has poo pooped that and reached consistently. Overall those players haven't panned out, hopefully some guys like Collins/martin etc can change that trend.

in a draft flush with DT talent, they dropped the ball a little imo. Hopefully he can at least do what he did in college and imo if that's his impact…it's still not with a top 43 pick.

No, they had a 3rd on Kittle and HOPED they could get him in the 5th. There have been a number of times in the past where "the experts" say a player would have been available 2 rounds later but we later learn at least one team was going to take the player with their next pick. The fact that they try to project where a player is going to be picked doesn't mean they are correct.

I can support the Collins pick as reasonable at the time, and so far it hasn't worked as well as they hoped.

Again overdrafting has yielded next to nothing, so stop doing it. we all talk about how amazing we are at finding talent on day 3, well at that point they're not reaching for guys… like I said hopefully Martin and Stout buck the trend.

also, let's stop acting like they haven't invested hours and hours into draft projections and when so and so probably goes. Read the damn room a little and let's stop being so arrogant to think we're so much better than everyone else with draft evaluation.

The ravens crush drafts and let the top players come to them. It's not reaching solely because of need. They're near the bottom in reaching and have a great roster. Same with Philly.

The Niners are not great at their early picks. I don't think anyone has argued that. If there is some way of being sure to stop picking players who don't work out that would be great.

My contention, as you are well aware, is that you don't know what you seem to think you know when it comes to "overdrafting". The consensus is wrong all the time too. Shadeur Sanders went in the first half of the first round right? He's a day 1 starter right? And you talk like Collins was a crazy reach ... the consensus has him as a 2nd round pick.